What are we reading?

Started by Martok, March 05, 2012, 01:13:59 PM

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al_infierno

#5310
On the topic of those infamous "difficult" books, I'm working my way through The Sound and the Fury by Faulkner.  Finished the POV section of Benjy the mentally handicapped son, which takes up about 1/5 of the text.  I enjoyed it, but found it very difficult to follow.  Compared to someone like Joyce the language is very simple and understandable, but what makes the text difficult is the abruptly nonlinear narrative.  It jumps around between Benjy's childhood, teenage years, and adulthood in a stream-of-consciousness manner that is easy to understand in individual pieces, but difficult to connect into a coherent bigger picture.  Even in my confusion though I did find this works in rendering a mentally handicapped character's POV.

I got 80% of the way through Benjy's section before getting utterly frustrated by the character Quentin seemingly switching genders depending on whether it's Benjy's early years or later years... only to look up the Wikipedia article and learn there are two characters named Quentin.  I skimmed the synopsis (including a character list with some spoilers) before finishing Benjy's section and then re-reading the first few pages, and felt like everything came together in a way that is satisfying and logical.  It just takes a long time to get there if you're not using a secondary source like Wikipedia for reference.

I'm onto Quentin (male)'s POV section which I've heard is even more difficult to follow, as it tries to render the thought process of a highly intelligent and gifted individual in this family.  Once I'm through that, my understanding is that Jason and Dilsey's chapters are much more digestible and everything comes together in a more coherent way.
A War of a Madman's Making - a text-based war planning and political survival RPG

It makes no difference what men think of war, said the judge.  War endures.  As well ask men what they think of stone.  War was always here.  Before man was, war waited for him.  The ultimate trade awaiting its ultimate practitioner.  That is the way it was and will be.  That way and not some other way.
- Cormac McCarthy, Blood Meridian


If they made nothing but WWII games, I'd be perfectly content.  Hypothetical matchups from alternate history 1980s, asymmetrical US-bashes-some-3rd world guerillas, or minor wars between Upper Bumblescum and outer Kaboomistan hold no appeal for me.
- Silent Disapproval Robot


I guess it's sort of nice that the word "tactical" seems to refer to some kind of seriousness during your moments of mental clarity.
- MengJiao

Jarhead0331

I was browsing around my local B&N and saw, "Sid Meier's Memoir!".  I had no idea he wrote a book about his career developing games. It was 50% off so I grabbed it. Looks really good.

I met him a couple times at Comic Cons back in the wargamer.com days. Really nice guy.

https://www.amazon.com/Sid-Meiers-Memoir-Computer-Games/dp/1324005874

Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


airboy

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on January 09, 2021, 09:11:05 PM
I was browsing around my local B&N and saw, "Sid Meier's Memoir!".  I had no idea he wrote a book about his career developing games. It was 50% off so I grabbed it. Looks really good.

I met him a couple times at Comic Cons back in the wargamer.com days. Really nice guy.

https://www.amazon.com/Sid-Meiers-Memoir-Computer-Games/dp/1324005874

Wishlisted. 

Never met Sid.  Met Gary Gygax, Dave Arneson, and heard most of the old time Comic book writers at various Cons.  Steve Jackson is both nice and very interesting.

airboy

Quote from: al_infierno on January 06, 2021, 12:55:50 AM
On the topic of those infamous "difficult" books, I'm working my way through The Sound and the Fury by Faulkner.  Finished the POV section of Benjy the mentally handicapped son, which takes up about 1/5 of the text.  I enjoyed it, but found it very difficult to follow.  Compared to someone like Joyce the language is very simple and understandable, but what makes the text difficult is the abruptly nonlinear narrative.  It jumps around between Benjy's childhood, teenage years, and adulthood in a stream-of-consciousness manner that is easy to understand in individual pieces, but difficult to connect into a coherent bigger picture.  Even in my confusion though I did find this works in rendering a mentally handicapped character's POV.

I got 80% of the way through Benjy's section before getting utterly frustrated by the character Quentin seemingly switching genders depending on whether it's Benjy's early years or later years... only to look up the Wikipedia article and learn there are two characters named Quentin.  I skimmed the synopsis (including a character list with some spoilers) before finishing Benjy's section and then re-reading the first few pages, and felt like everything came together in a way that is satisfying and logical.  It just takes a long time to get there if you're not using a secondary source like Wikipedia for reference.

I'm onto Quentin (male)'s POV section which I've heard is even more difficult to follow, as it tries to render the thought process of a highly intelligent and gifted individual in this family.  Once I'm through that, my understanding is that Jason and Dilsey's chapters are much more digestible and everything comes together in a more coherent way.

Read it and hated it.  Understand why he wrote it that way, and it is gifted.  But I read a ton for work and other than that - I want clear and entertaining.

But I'm glad you enjoyed it.  I appreciated the writing, while hating it.

airboy

I've finished a half dozen books in the last 30 days.  The one of interest here is:

The Doughboys: America and the First World War by Gary Mead.

This was interesting.  The first part of the book was about Woodrow Wilson versus the pro-war faction of US Politics and the political maneuverings around the entry of the USA into the war.

The USA was making an absolute fortune supplying the Entente (and the rest of the world) as a huge manufacturing and agriculture supplier who was not absorbed in war production.  There was not a lot of public sentiment for entering WW1 (aside from some of the elites).  Yes, a handful of people volunteered from the USA and fought for the Canadians, UK or the French (almost none for Imperial Germany).  But the USA was really not interested in it.

The UK had a killer blockade on Germany, but skillfully managed to cut cable communications with Germany and prohibit almost all cabled news reports from Germany.  Thus, the US public was skillfully fed one side's view of the conflict.  The Brits were masters of Propaganda in both World Wars.  Submarine warfare was a desperate attempt by Germany to offset the amazingly effective British blockade - and their side of the story was very hard to get to America (had to go by ship, not cable).

Wilson did an about-face, and amazingly Congress voted overwhelmingly for War in 1917.  Honestly, I still don't understand it - but war weariness was not big since that last major war the USA had been involved in was half a century ago.

The USA raised an army out of largely nothing.  And had nearly nothing to equip them with.

Most of the book focuses on the political maneuvering between Pershing and the British and the French.  The Brits and the French largely wanted the USA to send infantry and machine gunners - and nothing else to France.  They wanted to put these units piecemeal into the lines under British or French command.  Pershing wanted US troops to fight under US Commanders.  The USA also lacked the merchant marine to get the AEF to Europe - and the Brits actually demanded top dollar to send the troops.  Yet another point of bickering.

US troop training was weak, in part due to a lack of weapons and officers/noncoms skilled in trench warfare.

The US military leaders were immediately sacked by Pershing if they failed to take objectives - regardless of casualties.  Almost unbelievable from today's perspective.

The US military felt screwed by the Brits for not using their merchant marine, and screwed by the French who told the USA not to send supply troops or transport - and then did not provide the logistics support (mules, horses and trucks) to feed and resupply US troops.

Having read so much about US Logistics in WW2 and how it was superior to everyone else, the utter supply debacle and the trust the US had in the Brits and the French to supply logistics was just appalling.   US troops in the field suffered from a lack of food and water because the supply situation was so amazingly screwed up.

The author makes the point that the Entente could not have won without US support - in supply at least.  He also makes the point that by 1917 the French would not advance and the Brits were about out of men.  By 1918 the USA had a third of the total troops in France, and the majority of troops that would actually engage in offensive operations (due to French war fatigue). 

I enjoyed his statistical analysis of casualties, logistics, etc.....  which drove some of the political bickering points home.

This is more of a book about politics (Wilson/Congress/US Public and Pershing/UK/French) than it is about strategy or tactics.  It has a lot about supply and training - since the USA was building an army of millions from almost nothing.

I enjoyed it.  The supply horrors for the AEF were eye opening (to me).  I tired of the endless political bickering between Pershing and top UK/French commanders and political leaders.  Wilson had no real reason for his turn to asking Congress for war.  Congress voting so strongly for war in Europe makes little sense to me in retrospect.

The book is reasonably well written.  There are some redundant parts and a few editing mistakes.  This is a real warning sign if you are considering reading this.  I usually do not notice editing problems because I "read it like it should be written, not as it is written).  That makes it harder for me to notice such things.

In sum, this is a good book for politics, large scale economics, supply and training.  Very poor for tactics.  Pretty poor for strategy.  I got it on sale at a deep discount and learned a lot about aspects of the war that I knew little about.

Gusington

^Sounds worthwhile to read, thanks for posting.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

al_infierno

Quote from: airboy on January 13, 2021, 08:51:23 AM

Read it and hated it.  Understand why he wrote it that way, and it is gifted.  But I read a ton for work and other than that - I want clear and entertaining.

But I'm glad you enjoyed it.  I appreciated the writing, while hating it.

BTW, apparently James Franco went full "Simple Jack" with this one IRL.   :2funny:





Hmmm... I feel like I saw this in Tropic Thunder...  :-"



A War of a Madman's Making - a text-based war planning and political survival RPG

It makes no difference what men think of war, said the judge.  War endures.  As well ask men what they think of stone.  War was always here.  Before man was, war waited for him.  The ultimate trade awaiting its ultimate practitioner.  That is the way it was and will be.  That way and not some other way.
- Cormac McCarthy, Blood Meridian


If they made nothing but WWII games, I'd be perfectly content.  Hypothetical matchups from alternate history 1980s, asymmetrical US-bashes-some-3rd world guerillas, or minor wars between Upper Bumblescum and outer Kaboomistan hold no appeal for me.
- Silent Disapproval Robot


I guess it's sort of nice that the word "tactical" seems to refer to some kind of seriousness during your moments of mental clarity.
- MengJiao

Gusington

Now reading The Great Bear at War - The Russian and Soviet Army 1917-Present by Chris McNab.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

Sir Slash

The Breaking Point: Sedan and the Fall of France 1940 by Robert Doughty. Very tactical.  O0
"Take a look at that". Sgt. Wilkerson-- CMBN. His last words after spotting a German tank on the other side of a hedgerow.

rustyshackleford

"Killing Crazy Horse: The Merciless Indian Wars in America" - absolutely brutal and barbaric acts from both sides.

Sir Slash

I read that one too Rusty. Great book, one of O'Reilly's best.  O0
"Take a look at that". Sgt. Wilkerson-- CMBN. His last words after spotting a German tank on the other side of a hedgerow.

Gusington

Just started The Last Panther by Wolfgang Faust.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

z1812

I am reading The Mirror and the Light. Which is the Final Book in the Wolf Hall trilogy by Hilary Mantel. The writing is excellent. Very atmospheric. I am also reading A Dangerous Fortune by Ken Follet. It chronicles the upper class life in Victorian England. Definitely a pot boiler, but pleasant and easy reading.

Gusington

Always wanted to read Wolf Hall and anything by Ken Follett. One day.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

Gusington

Just started the graphic novel series Uber by Kieron Gillen and Caanan White.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd