World of Warships

[steve58]

Just a heads up that the new Wargame Center client is giving some people a major headache by apparently uninstalling WoWS along with any replays, screen shots etc.  I've not installed the new client/launcher so did not have any issues updating today, but I suggest checking out the forums before updating to 0.6.6, especially if you've gone over to the new client/launcher.

[Nefaro]

Just a heads up that the new Wargame Center client is giving some people a major headache by apparently uninstalling WoWS along with any replays, screen shots etc.  I've not installed the new launcher, but I suggest checking out the forums before updating to 0.6.6, especially if you've gone over to the new client/launcher.

:pullhair:

[Nefaro]

Hey JP-

Have you got past Tier 4 ships yet?

You're gonna have to come join us in the Sky Syphilis section soon.  <:-)

[JasonPratt]

Alas, no, haven't played in a few months, still on T4.

[Nefaro]

Alas, no, haven't played in a few months, still on T4.

Yah, mule! Yah!




hrmm..

Then again, I think some of the funnest times are to be had around Tier 4 & 5 anyway.  Although they don't give you as many credit rewards as the higher stuff.

[Destraex]

Nefaro. Sent this link to the a mate in my clan. His response, just for a bit of colour:

"I read the article, think some of his comments are ok, but he seems to miss the point about Dds sitting there lobbing torps at you that dont indicate where he is and dont expose his sorry ass. He is of the opinion that DDs should be able to mix it with Bbs, they couldnt do it historically and shouldnt be able to do it here. I think he is dead wrong about there effectiveness now, the top WOWS player is a Gearing, I see better than 50% of matches were DDs are the top scorers, just finished one where top scorer on both teams was a DD."

[Nefaro]

Nefaro. Sent this link to the a mate in my clan. His response, just for a bit of colour:

"I read the article, think some of his comments are ok, but he seems to miss the point about Dds sitting there lobbing torps at you that dont indicate where he is and dont expose his sorry ass. He is of the opinion that DDs should be able to mix it with Bbs, they couldnt do it historically and shouldnt be able to do it here. I think he is dead wrong about there effectiveness now, the top WOWS player is a Gearing, I see better than 50% of matches were DDs are the top scorers, just finished one where top scorer on both teams was a DD."

When I checked late last year, the top average damage scorers in Tier 9 & 10 were carriers.  Unsurprisingly.  A good & experienced individual player can reach the top of the list in anything.  A better gauge of balance would be total average performance across all players.  I'm not sure which stat he considers best to use for "top player", but that sample size is abysmal. 

Destroyers can still mix it up, despite the proliferation of aircraft all over the map spotting them, and notably their torpedoes.  Mainly because they've begun to hang back and play more passively, "spamming" torpedoes from long range.  Which is where the whole meta has been going, and the main reason for the criticism - the continual trend towards passive play.

World Of Warships isn't a historical simulator.  Far from it.  It is, first and foremost, a competitive match-based game.  I don't know why anyone would use the historical excuse to make their argument when the developers outright state that they prioritize balance & competitive play over historical accuracy.  The game mechanics and meta-game aren't historically accurate, nor were they meant to be.  This game has cap zones and a single hit point pool for each ship, fer chrissakes!  ;D

I don't expect destroyers or cruisers to slug it out with battleships in a gunfight and survive.  Far from it.  But I do expect their own individual strengths to keep them competitive regarding outcomes.  No matter what number & type of enemy ships are present on the opposite side.  For example, when I'm running a destroyer, and I get into a high-tier match with an enemy carrier, I know that I will be hounded throughout the match.  His fighters keeping me spotted, and often my torpedoes too.  Both of which are a destroyer's main advantage,eliminated from the other side of the map, and there is little to be done about it.  Due to current trends, they can hover their fighters nearby, taking little damage from puny destoyer AA while the rest of the team take them out.  Can't smoke up and wait it out because any smart player will shoot torpedoes into the smoke, and the planes will still be there when each of the limited-use smokes are over.

Battleships are just easier to run and succeed in.  They have both excellent survivability and great damage output potential.  Manually-dropped torpedoes by a CV player is an annoyance, but that goes for everyone.  At least BBs have good AA to keep them from hovering overhead and taking their time doing it.  If I want Easy Leisure Mode, I switch over to playing Battleships.  Because they are, in comparison to destroyers and cruisers.  They rack up in-game results and rewards more reliably, and without as much hassle. 

I can still have some effective games in my high tier destroyers, but they're not nearly as easy or reliable.  Mainly due to all the aircraft and radar.   And they're regularly adding more radar, which was the reason for my original rant. 




If we want to talk ship stats, let's look at the Top Average Damage caused per match - of the whole player base.  In this case, I sorted by the NA server and over "All Time":

Tier X :  Hakuryu, Midway, Yamato, Grosser Kurfurst, Henri IV.   (CV, CV, BB, BB, CA)  - zero DDs in Top 10


Tier IX:  Taiho, Essex, Missouri, St Louis, Friedrich der Grosse.  (CV, CV, BB, CA, BB)  - one DD in the Top 10, and it is a Premium one (Black).


Tier VIII: Bismarck, Shokaku, Amagi, Alabama, Charles Martel.  (BB, CV, BB, BB, CA) -   zero DDs in Top 10



https://na.warships.today/vehicles



Damage output isn't all that steady on Destroyers, though, so I checked XP Earned since it also encompasses some teamwork factors into the results.  Such as capturing zones, spotting, etc.  Things destroyers should be doing best.


Sorted by Average XP Per:


Tier X:   one DD in top 10  (Khabarovsk, which plays like a cruiser)

Tier IX:  Three in the Top 10   #1 is Black (is this premium DD overpowered in some way?).  Another is, again, the Soviet run & gun DD.

Tier VIII:  Two in the Top 10


Yet they're still under-represented, even in what should be their strongest category, compared to the others.


I don't think Battleship durability should be nerfed.  Nor their massive damage potential.  But the increasing power creep of easy spotting methods against DDs - more Radar, aircraft and CV planes being used to spot them and their sneak attack weapon with little recourse, even the very long-running Hydro times - has thrown the balance off lately and encourages more passive play.  Not to mention worse outcomes & rewards on average. 

It's typical MMO power creep unevenly affecting one class.  But in this case, it's changing the high tier player behaviors to something less enjoyable than in the past.


TL;DR:

Would you rather the destroyer players just sit near the back, with the Battleships, and spam long-range torpedoes?  Instead of going forward to cap zones & spot?  Because I feel that is what the high tier spotting power creep has been increasingly encouraging in Warship's DD play. 

Would you rather everyone just played Battleships, Carriers, and Cruisers?  They don't have to worry about that specific type of power creep.


Also - Destroyer results & rewards lag behind those of many others in high tier battles.  Which is both a side effect and an issue.



..

Top 10 ship class lists, for Damage Done and XP Earned at Tier X att'd ~~>

[Tuna]

What he said!...

But seriously to have a good game in a DD you have to work hard. Constantly nerfing them upsets one of the strong points of the game (balance).

I hate carriers, but I accept them for what they are, another facet to the game. You have to work as a 'team' to counter these things.

I've been enjoying cruising in BB's lately, but one thing about them, the game play itself is much easier. So the small annoyance of having to deal with DDs adds a welcome challenge to the game. Now if the situation is that your BB's are getting creamed by the DD's, then your "TEAM" is not doing a good job.

[Nefaro]

I've been enjoying cruising in BB's lately, but one thing about them, the game play itself is much easier. So the small annoyance of having to deal with DDs adds a welcome challenge to the game. Now if the situation is that your BB's are getting creamed by the DD's, then your "TEAM" is not doing a good job.

Bring your WASD hacks, along with your Torpedo Sixth Sense (aka  Sensitivity To Straight & Steady Sailing), and destroyers aren't a big deal.  ;)

Fortunately, there are still plenty battleship noobs who sail straight and steady for long periods.  Otherwise destroyer averages would be even worse.  ^-^

[Shelldrake]

Nothing great as far as ships sunk but 43 plants shot down with my Gneisenau, which was 4x what our carrier managed!

[steve58]

Nothing great as far as ships sunk but 43 plants shot down with my Gneisenau, which was 4x what our carrier managed!

You are hereby awarded the harvesting achievement ;)

p.s.  great game  O0

[Tuna]

Ranked battles are back, so if you play in one battle (win or lose) you will get a free day of premium!.. lol. at least I'm thinking that's why I got a free day of premium.

[Nefaro]

Ranked battles are back, so if you play in one battle (win or lose) you will get a free day of premium!.. lol. at least I'm thinking that's why I got a free day of premium.

Ranked battles..   :pullhair:

[Destraex]

I need to play more ranked battles. But I have lost interest in the game lately. Perhaps it's your fault Nef!!!
Been playing other things. When something else with nice shiney ships comes out I will be more inclined I guess.

Looking forward to the British and Italian lines as well as any more french stuff that comes. A bigger Dunkerque for instance. Cannot remember the historical name for that class, but it existed.
The Graf Zepplin will be a great curiosity to see brought to life in game.

[DennisS]

What he said!...

But seriously to have a good game in a DD you have to work hard. Constantly nerfing them upsets one of the strong points of the game (balance).

I hate carriers, but I accept them for what they are, another facet to the game. You have to work as a 'team' to counter these things.

I've been enjoying cruising in BB's lately, but one thing about them, the game play itself is much easier. So the small annoyance of having to deal with DDs adds a welcome challenge to the game. Now if the situation is that your BB's are getting creamed by the DD's, then your "TEAM" is not doing a good job.

I have played wows a LOT. I'm just not good enough to effectively play destroyers. If you get too close, you're dead. If you don't get to within torp range, you're useless. The very small effective range for a destroyer is a damn difficult thing to manage, especially if you wish to keep your situational awareness on the battlefield.

My favorite are the cruisers...fast enough to run away from anything that can kill them, heavy enough to do some damage to all ship classes when you need them to.