Dark Souls

[DV8]

Has anyone played this game?  If so, what are your thoughts on it.

[Grimnirsson]

Well, since I had a discussion with W8taminute about this game recently and he decided to buy it, there's also the idea of having a thread here to see who else is playing this game and perhaps to have a place where we can exchange some tips etc.. I see that a DS thread was already started so no need to start a new one, although it doesn't seem that lively ;)

I will make things easier for me by just copy/paste here what I told W8taminute, since that also answers the initial question in this old thread. So perhaps others want to chime in and tell us their experiences and opinions :)

Has anyone played this game?  If so, what are your thoughts on it.

It's different to all RPGs out there and it's better than good - it's a mind invading experience. That may sound a bit over the top, but you will dream about your experiences in the realm of Lordran. I bought it and was hooked and I'm now 130h+ into the game and I'm not finished with it. Recommended it to Hiimori and my best friend - both said that this is a game like no other and they couldn't stop playing (actually both are still playing the game) and both said that the game sneaked into their dreams as well

Dark Souls is an action RPG, that means you have real time combat. There's no story and there are no quests. Lordran, the kingdom where the game takes place has a background and that may be called the story here, but it's not like in other RPGs where you are a certain character and the game tells you a fleshed out novel like story while you act within that story as the main character, doing quests a la "bring me this, go there, come back and you get some EXP."

Dark Souls is more a scenery to live out your very own adventure, you create your character, your class, that's like in other RPGs (although there are no fixed classes, a class is defined by the various stats of the character and this can be changed later in the game) and then you are thrown into the world. You are an undead, a hollow and you are part of a dark realm without knowing why you are there. The world is huge and there are no loading times, what you see is what you can reach and early in the game someone will tell you just one thing...there are two bells in Lordran. That's it...you don't come closer to a "quest" in DS, you know there are two bells and you are in the world where it's hard to survive. The rest is your very own story

The enemies in DS are dangerous, every one of them is able to kill you and if you don't pay attention and get sloppy, they will. But although DS is often called the most difficult game out there, I wouldn't say so. It's difficult in the way that it is absolutely unforgiving, so if you are making mistakes, if you don't pay attention to what's going on around you, you'll often see the 'You Died' message. However it's the most 'unfrustrating' game I ever played because you have absolute control of your character and the combat is 100% precise. If you die in combat it's not so much because the odds are against you or that the enemy is so much tougher (although there are areas that are too dangerous for you at the beginning, or certain bosses might be hard to defeat at first, but this is fairly obvious then), it's because you either had the wrong equipment or you lost your concentration or both. When you die you are not out of the world. As I said you start as a hollow, an undead and there's humanity to be found in the world. You can use humanity for different things, one of them is bringing back your own humanity, so you are no longer hollow, but human. If you die as a hollow, you lose your soul bag (killed enemies leave souls you collect to level up, to buy stuff, to repair, to modify equipment etc.) and you get a chance to get it back, because it will lay where you died. If you die a second time on your way to the soul bag before reaching it, it's gone. If you are human and die you are back into the undead form but your stored humanity will be part of the soul bag and you can get it back.

So you are wandering through this dark and twisted land looking for treasures, souls, trying to stay alive, and searching fog walls. Behind such fog walls there are bosses, often amazingly designed ones. If you can beat such a boss you get great equipment, a huge amount of souls (or you use the soul of the boss to create amazing weapons, so the choice is yours. Do I use the boss soul to get 20.000 normal souls and buy me 3 level ups at once or do I keep it to bring it to a forge where I can get a great weapon?) and after you have beaten the boss the fog wall will be gone - opening the way to a different part of the world and often to shortcuts back to places you already know.

The dark atmosphere and the music and sound that will creep under your skin suck you in and sooner rather than later you will be in your own story and the game is not just one generic story you play through, it's yours. That of course also means players who always need a guide in form of quests and maps will have a hard time, since there's no explanation of how things work or what to do next - this is all about exploring and trying out.

There's an intense feeling of solitude, you are the Wanderer in the Waste but you are not really alone. You can see other players in your world as phantoms, as ghost-like figures and then you know at the very same time another player is at the same spot as you, facing the same challenges as you do. You can see what they do, fighting, searching or running by, but you can't clearly see what kind of character they are, because of their fading ghostly nature. At the same time you will be seen as such a ghost in their world, you can greet them and wave for example, before they vanish. This way you get a wonderful feeling of being connected with others while you are playing your own game. If you come to a bonfire, fire places all over Lordran you can sit down and this will be the bonfire you will respawn after being killed. Sort of a saving point if you will. You can repair stuff at the bonfire, you can level up etc. all important things regarding your character are done while sitting at a bonfire. And near a bonfire you will be able to see other human players much more clearly. In the area lit by the fire you can see their faces, their equipment etc..

It's a fascinating situation when you made it through a really dangerous part of the world and you don't know where the next bonfire is. If you get killed now with all these souls you will lose them in this new area of Lordran that you don't know and where you will have to come back - and you will have to make it from the last bonfire you were sitting at...and then you come around the next corner, shield and weapon up, ready for an ambush, sweaty hands...and you see a cave with a fire! You come nearer and you see three players sitting at this fire, starring silently into the flames and you know you are safe for now! And these other players had probably the same relief as you when finding the cave. You come nearer and see another player standing at the fire, he bows to you, you raise your hand to greet him back before they are all fading away and you are alone again...you will remember such times!

Players can write messages in fire-letters on the ground to warn other players in their own world about ambushes, traps or give them hints where to find a treasure chest, a large amount of souls, a weapon. Sometimes a message was written by a nasty player...'Here! Treasure...Jump'...what do you do? There's a cliff and you think one can stand on it, but you are not sure, can the message be trusted? Do you jump down to find the treasure? Or do you think someone is trying to lure you into a fall to death? Your decision. Will you give good or bad advice to other players?

There's also the possibility to write a summon sign on the ground that other players next to your dimension (on the same server) will see. They can touch the sign and summon you as a glowing spirit into their world so you might help them to beat a boss or just to wander with them through the dark forest because they don't want to be alone anymore....at least for some time. You can also be invaded by Dark Spirits, players who belong to a certain covenant (there are many of these and one can decide to be part of such a special brotherhood) that seeks to grief others. Such players will appear as red phantoms and try to ambush you. When you see the message on your screen 'Dark Spirit soandso has invaded' you'll get a pumping heart.

You are on your way to the next bonfire, you don't know how strong the invader is, where is he? Will he be a fighter with honor waiting for you on the top of the Undead Burg giving a fair fight? Or will he hide in one of the rooms of the castle and wait for you to come by...and use a poison knife to kill you? Sometimes he can't find you...sometimes it's better to hide yourself and wait...and he will return to his own world...and you leave your hiding and walk on. These invasions can be over quickly because you get killed fast or you kill the invader fast but there are times when such player vs player combat is a thrill. Tactical combat at it's best...two warriors slowly walking around each other, shields up, trying to poke at the enemy to see how he will react....waiting for the opening...only one will stay alive. This is intense stuff I can tell you.
Or you are part of a covenant that is dedicated to guarding a certain area of the realm. I'm a member of the Darkmoon Blades and when I wear my covenants ring I can be summoned by Gwyndolin to punish the sinners in Dark Anor Londor. I will be a blue phantom of vengeance and if a sinner is there more than one Blade can be summoned...but of course the sinner might not be alone himself and when you arrive you see the sinner and two companions and you are there with only one brother of your covenant...but then there's no time left to think about the odds, you have to concentrate on the fight...both Darkmoon Blades standing together, shields up and facing their three enemies...you don't know the other blue phantom but at this moment you both will win or lose together, you both fight for your covenant. With a bit of luck another Blade will join the fight...

Or I can use the book of the guilty to go and try to punish the sinners on my own if they are online. Or with a special tool, a sign I write on the ground I can teleport into the world of a guilty player near me... If am victorious I get a trophy that I can offer to my covenants goddess and get a better rank and some cool weapons...

When you are at your bonfire and 'kindle' it (offering humanity to increase the flames so that you get more health potions (so called Estus flasks) from it) any player nearby at the same bonfire in his world or who recently was at the same bonfire and is now online in the game gets a health potion for free...when clerics do their blessings in their own world you will see a white ring in the air where such a blessing is done. If you are also able to do these blessings and do it where you see such a white circle, both blessings will get stronger, forming a chain of spells over many worlds...

You can see blood stains on the ground and when you touch it you see the last few moments of the player who died there...that may give you an idea what to expect around the next corner...so you can prepare yourself.

This 'this is my story' approach, the perfect combat, the great possibilities in choosing how to play, the dark and huge world, the sound, the unique Single Player merging with Coop and vs. play makes DS so completely different and so immensely satisfying that it will be part of your life and your dreams.

Interesting thing is, it's more lively than ever before. You can see how many players are around because of the phantoms and the messages and summon signs. The game came out in Oct 2011 and I see more players now than in the first half year. Some people don't like this game, some don't have the patience for its unique gameplay approach but there is the hardcore fan-base playing this game forever...some games have the level cap at 50, or 60, or 80...in Dark Souls the highest level is 719 and you need 1,704,000,000 souls to reach it :P

If you love unique games, if you want a different game, a different RPG, then this is it - it will change your life as a gamer :)

[W8taminute]

Great advice Grim, I can't believe I missed this game when it first came out.  Dark Souls is very rich, deep, and satisfying if you're into RPGs.  I'm only about 6 hours into the game and having a blast.

What I really find compelling about this game is not the story so much but the freedom to explore and do as you please.  Combat is exactly the kind of melee combat I've been looking for since Koei's 'Colosseum: Road To Freedom' for PS2.  Button mashing is going to get you killed quickly.  Instead you must observe your enemy and keep your shield up.  When he makes a move choose the right combo to counter him.  Pressing an attack button once is all you need to do.  If you button mash what you are doing is queuing up moves without taking into account that in between any of those moves the enemy could plunge a sword into your chest while your trying to execute a move.  Patience is key.  In real life you would only throw a punch at someone when you see an opening, not rapidly punch the air hoping to land a blow.  Meanwhile your opponent looks at you laughing while he flanks you and kicks your backside!

As I get more involved in the game I'll definitely share what I've learned but suffice it to say this is a good game.

EDIT:  I forgot to point out that Dark Souls is a thinking mans game so if you truly are a grog you're in for a treat.  You have to keep an open mind with this game because it's not like your bread and butter RPGs like Skyrim.  The game mechanics are totally different but the experience is no less rewarding.

[Grimnirsson]

Anor Londo is the legendary city of the gods. But the Gods are dead now...it was the throne of the Great Lord Gwyn and his brave knights...the throne is shattered though and the knights are dead...the city is now abandoned...there's no sun anymore, everything is dark...my level 90+ character is gone...after 140 hours into this incredible game my save file is no longer accepted...'New Game' is the only option for me (the 'load game' button is gone and there's only one save file for each character), my hero is dead, he is now laying there in Lordran, somewhere...if you come across a dead body with a shining soul...and you take it, a message will pop up on your screen saying 'Soul of a Brave Soldier' ...use it well and may it grant you strength on your way through this damned land of the undead and lost souls...

...you mighty warrior, rest in peace, I had fun playing the game with you, you were soooo sloooow...but you were so strong! You stood there, like a rock, no matter what happened, what killed others in a few seconds only made you smile...you could wear the armor of Smough like it was a bag of feathers and you could wield the heaviest weapons without stumbling. It was a pleasure to play the game with you - Thank you!

...and now I will start new! Dark Souls, no matter what you throw at me, I will fight everything again, because what your designers achieved with this game is simply...you can't compare it to any other game...it's a masterpiece...try to punish me again, try to kill me as you did a thousand times before, I'm ready and I will see the credits, I will beat you - Praise the Sun!

I AM READY...come on...I'm back into the fight you damned bitch of a game!!!!!!!

[DV8]

Sold.  Ordering when I get back home.

[W8taminute]

^You won't regret it DV8.  Just don't accidently lose your save file like poor Grimnirsson did. 

Seriously though, this game is really fun to play. 

[Grimnirsson]

Sold.  Ordering when I get back home.

LOL

I actually thought that in a year old thread with no answers to your question you must already own it or have decided not to play it.
So, welcome to Lordran DV8, the game will be the ticket to a ride you won't forget...and as W8taminute said just make sure not to do anything with the save file. Don't try to copy it (it can only be moved but some try to copy it anyway with some 'tools'), decide where to have it, on the HDD or the USB stick and then never change the storage. When I play DS now I will remove the damn stick so I don't choose it by accident - which is what  happened...

Any questions, ask away :)

[DV8]

I assume you both are playing the console version?  What's the skinny on the PC version?

[Grimnirsson]

Yes, playing the 360 version of the game so I have no info on the PC version. From what I read on the internet it's considered a 'half-assed' port of the console version so if you have the choice I would play on the console.

[W8taminute]

I'm playing the 360 version as well.  I think the controls work better on the console for this game due to the unique way control is handled in this game.  Since you don't have to button mash (in fact it is strongly discouraged) and you have to think carefully before choosing which action to take during combat you will not feel rushed.  I think a PC/Keyboard/Mouse combo would actually hurt how the game is played versus the convenience of the console controller.

[Hiimori]

I assume you both are playing the console version?  What's the skinny on the PC version?

I'm also playing on console - this is a game I want to enjoy in an armchair in front of my TV screen and with a gamepad (I only play Matrix / Slitherine / strategy stuff on the PC).

As far as I know, the PC version was a late port (published only because of a players' petition), initially it was only planned as a console game. Initially, there were massive graphical issues with low res textures and slow-downs. There is an (inofficial) fan-made patch which fixes the worst issues, but it doesn't sound very comfortable.

In addition, I think there are more players on the Xbox - and since the game has a strong multiplayer component (messages posted by other players on the floor, summoning signs of players who want to help you defeat a boss), the more players online, the better! Even on the XBox there are remote regions where you will have to wait long for a summoning sign and where you will be forced to fight alone (as long as you don't have friends with a similar level who can give you a hand). Other regions are buzzing with messages, ghosts, and summoning signs (as well as hostile PvP invasions).

Btw, I started my first game as a Sorcerer (just because I'm always a magician in any RPG, but then this isn't a normal RPG...) and quit after 25 hours (level 20+) because I had completey screwed up my skilling. Poor Lucius was dying constantly and didn't manage to do any damage. It was a tragedy!

I then decided to start all over again, this time with a hunter named Strider. I'm now Level 92 (about 100 hours playing time) with a DEX skilling, fire bow+9, specialized in ranged combat, and did many boss fights together with Grimnirsson's lost warrior (RIP!). Still not even close to finishing the game, though!  ::)

[W8taminute]

Hi guys,

Just thought I'd share with you all my adventures in Lordran so far. 

Last night I was determined to reach the Undead Parish which is a part of the world that is fairly early in the game and the story that the player must go to.  In order to get to the Undead Parish you must pass through the Undead Burg.  There is a great bridge that leads to the Parish however it is defended by a giant Bridge Wyvern.  Here is what happened to me...

On my way to the Bridge Wyvern I ran into the Taurus Demon.  I must have died 3 or 4 times before I realized that the Taurus Demon seems to behave like the monster at the Undead Asylum.  So I figured I'll try to get in close and stay inside is hammer strike.  After dying 3 more times I finally figured out his pattern and was able to kill him.  Yes!!

Then I met Solaire of Astora and had a pleasant conversation with him.  He is a member of a covenant and the Lord of Sunlight.  After talking to Solaire I proceeded halfway across the bridge to the Wyvern encounter.  He killed me over 10 times last night.  Although of course it was frustrating I was not at the point of giving up.  Dark Souls is so rewarding that difficulties are easily forgiven.    There is always another way around a problem in this game it seems so I figured I'd try bypassing the Wyvern until I level up my character a bit and get some better weapons and armor.

I found a way to pass underneath the Wyvern and make it to the Undead Parish.  But then some big Rhinoceros animal trampled me to death!  It was 12:44 in the morning so I decided to go to bed.  Tonight I shall slay me that animal and gain entrance into the Undead Parish!!

[DV8]

My copy arrived today.  I can't wait to play it this evening.  I'll be asking more questions once I get started.  Are there any builds that are more durable initially?

[Hiimori]

I think good starting classes (with well-rounded talents) are the Knight, the Warrior or the Bandit if you are interested in a strong tank-like character with heavy armor, weapons and damage. The Bandit is probably the best Melee starting class.

I started (my second game) with the Hunter, which is also well-rounded, and put all my first level ups into DEX and END. END is very important for blocking, attacking, running and almost everything, so regardless of what you are planning, you should always put some points into END.

In my first game, I tried the Sorcerer, but I think this class needs some experience (I failed and left him for dead in level 29. Today, with my experience of 100+ hours and 94 levels, I would play him quite differently and will probably even start a new sorcerer some day). If you are interested in magic, a friend of ours made very good experiences with the Pyromancer, who is also considered to be a good starting class.

Grimnirsson re-started the game with a Cleric, so he can probably say more about how this class would be for an inexperienced player. A class you should NOT take is the deprived - it's only for experienced gamers.

You should also know that you won't stay in your class all the time - the classes are named "Starting Classes" for a reason! They only determine your initial stats and equipment, and then you are free to develop your character in whatever way you wish, and you are free to change your path whenever you want to (and can effort it). Since there are hundreds of levels, you can be quite experimental, but for the first 50 levels, you should plan wisely and stick to your plan.

So ask yourself: which is your favorite weapon type: ranged, Heavy swords, needles, clubs, magic... Which is your favorite armor: light, heavy, robes... some weapons scale with your DEX rating, some weapons scale with your STR rating, and if you turn a weapon into a magic weapon, it doesn't scale with both stats anymore. Some magic types scale with FAITH, some with INT, so it's very complex and completely overtaxing for a beginner. Especially since the game doesn't explain anything to you and leaves you alone with only some cryptic hints here and there!

For the start, just consider the general direction you want to take.

Here is a good overview over the starting classes:
http://darksoulswiki.wikispaces.com/Classes

You can also choose one starting gift. Here you should DEFINITELY go for the Master Key - it is a great help early in the game, you will find the other stuff sooner of later, and most of it is pretty worthless.

http://darksoulswiki.wikispaces.com/Gifts

Good luck in Lordran and let us know how you decided  :)

[Grimnirsson]

My copy arrived today.

Xbox or PC?

I can't wait to play it this evening.

If you belong to the Order of Dedicated Dark Soul Players which you'll find out this evening, then you will have this 'I want to play' feeling all the time. A disturbing feeling when you are at work :P

I'll be asking more questions once I get started.  Are there any builds that are more durable initially?

What Hiimori said, nothing I could add here. The good thing is you pick the starting class that fits your play style but you are not stuck with a class. You will be able to constantly adjust what doesn't feel right with your character. The bad thing is you can't respec later so every level up spent is part of this characters build - but this fits to the game, everything you do, every decision counts.