Sneaky Release of Nobunaga's Ambition

Started by Jarhead0331, August 27, 2014, 06:25:59 PM

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tgb


I started a game as Oda in the Battle of Somethingorother scenario and immediately got in over my head by overspending.  It's important to remember that things like policies and diplomacy are very expensive every turn and can quickly drive you into the red.

I still don't have my head completely around officer management.  What to do about a disloyal retainer, for example.  I also know that there is a connection between the tenets your officers follow, that number next to the yellow starburst (progress or something like that) and the policies you can enact, but don't quite know what it is.

Time to RTFM.

jomni

#61
Each officer has an ideology and if your policies align with what they want, the it will be better. I haven't really paid attention on this when playing the Chinese version because I don't understand.

Diplomacy is really expensive.  Even if he is your ally, you have to plead and spend "diplomatic points" to have him send an army to help you out.  The alliance status and friendliness level, marriage, officers assigned to build relationships how fast these diplomatic points with each faction accrue.

tgb

I think I get it now.  The tenets of your officers (progressive, neutral, or conservative0, combined with the improvements you build, set the innovation level (the number next to the starburst) for your clan.  Policies require a minimum innovation level in order to be enacted.

jomni

Quote from: tgb on September 01, 2015, 11:30:51 PM
I think I get it now.  The tenets of your officers (progressive, neutral, or conservative0, combined with the improvements you build, set the innovation level (the number next to the starburst) for your clan.  Policies require a minimum innovation level in order to be enacted.

Thanks for the explanation.


Nefaro

Quote from: tgb on September 01, 2015, 11:30:51 PM
I think I get it now.  The tenets of your officers (progressive, neutral, or conservative0, combined with the improvements you build, set the innovation level (the number next to the starburst) for your clan.  Policies require a minimum innovation level in order to be enacted.

Actually the policies require a specific range of Innovation rating.  The "conservative" types are at the low end of the spectrum, and "progressives" at the high end.  Different strokes for different heart patients.  :)

Gonna take awhile to get a feel for all the little details, but much of the style will be familiar to those with past experiences with these Koei games.  Unfortunately, the pdf manual isn't much help.  Have to use the in-game Help topics for a general overview and just learn by doing (which can be fun as long as the mechanics are logical).

BTW.. which clan did you guys start with?

tgb

Quote from: Nefaro on September 02, 2015, 09:28:48 AM
Quote from: tgb on September 01, 2015, 11:30:51 PM
I think I get it now.  The tenets of your officers (progressive, neutral, or conservative0, combined with the improvements you build, set the innovation level (the number next to the starburst) for your clan.  Policies require a minimum innovation level in order to be enacted.

Actually the policies require a specific range of Innovation rating.  The "conservative" types are at the low end of the spectrum, and "progressives" at the high end.  Different strokes for different heart patients.  :)

Gonna take awhile to get a feel for all the little details, but much of the style will be familiar to those with past experiences with these Koei games.  Unfortunately, the pdf manual isn't much help.  Have to use the in-game Help topics for a general overview and just learn by doing (which can be fun as long as the mechanics are logical).

BTW.. which clan did you guys start with?

I started with the Oda in the Battle of Somethingorother campaign, but drove my economy into the ground by trying to do too much too quickly.  I can see that, like Paradox, this is going to be a marathon, not a sprint.

Nefaro

Quote from: tgb on September 02, 2015, 09:43:52 AM


I started with the Oda in the Battle of Somethingorother campaign, but drove my economy into the ground by trying to do too much too quickly.  I can see that, like Paradox, this is going to be a marathon, not a sprint.

I began with Mori in the earliest campaign start date, at Regular difficulty. 

Figured I'd punish myself a bit extra and see how easy it is to escape vassalage while learning.  May be too masochistic and have to start over before long, but at least I'll start off with a smaller more manageable clan while having a larger one to help protect it. 

Also curious about how the historical quests go in that situation.

mikeck

So, is this game's strategic building and diplomacy deeper and more involved than EU IV?
"A government large enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have."--Thomas Jefferson

tgb

Quote from: mikeck on September 02, 2015, 01:02:19 PM
So, is this game's strategic building and diplomacy deeper and more involved than EU IV?

I would say the building is a little deeper.  The diplomacy is very "gamey", and the only thing  I dislike.

mikeck

Hmmm. What do you mean by gamey? I'm trying to find a game with some true diplomacy and intrigue. eU series and ck is about as close as I can get
"A government large enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have."--Thomas Jefferson

Nefaro

Quote from: mikeck on September 02, 2015, 01:46:34 PM
Hmmm. What do you mean by gamey? I'm trying to find a game with some true diplomacy and intrigue. eU series and ck is about as close as I can get

This one just does it by a hard point value.  You can gain up to 100 diplo points with another faction, and then you spend a set amount for a specific action.

For example, a 1-year alliance costs something like 50 or 60 points.  Your Diplomacy time & money investments are pretty much a different kind of currency. 

Although EU4 & CK2 both have systems based on points, it's more of a soft factor that slowly waxes & wanes, with many variables affecting it.  Plus there are other situational considerations having an effect on the ultimate diplo responses you will receive from the AI.  Nobunaga's has some extra factor(s) but I don't get the impression that it's much past your proximity and perceived strength.

The real strength of NA:SoI looks to be what it's always been with these Koei series; commanding & managing your Lieutenants and land improvements.  The combat side is rather thin and unengaging (for me) but the managerial aspect is fun.  I haven't played a Nobunaga game since the mid-90s, on a console, so this has been a nice surprise.

tgb

The other problem with the diplomatic system is that it's very expensive. In order to generate diplomatic currency (called "favor", I think) you have to park one of your generals in the capitol of the faction your are negotiating with and wait until your favor level rises to the desired amount.

Thing of it is, it costs 600 gp a month to have that guy sit there, and within the game world that's a lot of sushi. In my first two "let's poke around and figure this thing out" games, I bankrupted myself almost immediately because I tried to do too much diplomatically.

jomni

Quote from: tgb on September 02, 2015, 03:06:33 PM
The other problem with the diplomatic system is that it's very expensive. In order to generate diplomatic currency (called "favor", I think) you have to park one of your generals in the capitol of the faction your are negotiating with and wait until your favor level rises to the desired amount.

Thing of it is, it costs 600 gp a month to have that guy sit there, and within the game world that's a lot of sushi. In my first two "let's poke around and figure this thing out" games, I bankrupted myself almost immediately because I tried to do too much diplomatically.

It makes diplomatic decisions and their timing more crucial (and difficult). But that's what deep strategy games are all about.  Thinking forward.
If you have a daughter and manage to pull off a marriage (which also costs a lot of points), you won't need to keep sending an envoy to build up those points. 


W8taminute

I read on another forum that Steam forgot to include a game manual with the game.  Can anyone here who owns the game verify this?  I was leaning towards picking up the PC version but if there is no game manual I'll get the PS4 version.
"You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend."

Romulan Commander to Kirk