Dom 3 slow game (2 day turnaround)[closed]

Started by Yskonyn, March 04, 2013, 01:34:57 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

JasonPratt

Nefero should at least promptly send in his pretender to Calahan, and also use the scanner to check things himself.

Loading a pretender into a new sp game is not always helpful, as sometimes the pretender is locked, and local starting conditions may affect scales in the first region (although I suppose a new sp game could be created where each of two sides starts with a bunch of regions, so as to average out localized effects). Starting dominion, if I recall correctly, doesn't always immediately match the dominion strength of the pretender either, and if someone took no scales but only dominion (as for example I did in this game) clicking the dominion candles does not bring up the scale/dominion sheet -- only clicking a scale marker does that.

(I'm surprised this has not been fixed already, btw. It isn't a bug exactly, but it's a design oversight that ought to be simple to amend.)

So while loading up a new pretender can be helpful for double checking characteristics, the game engine doesn't make this entirely feasible. Thus my request for a scanner.

(It doesn't help that the game saves new pretenders according to a generic criteria name -- designers have to manually keep track of which pretender they're testing out after saving.)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

Nefaro

I'll check into it tomorrow. 

I believe that I still have the saved Pretender file on this computer.  Not sure if sending the file will help if the possible issue happened when I originally saved it, but I'll do whatever needs to be done.

Perhaps I just messed up and pushed the scales the opposite direction of where I wanted them, so PEBKAC certainly isn't ruled out.  I don't recall ever creating a Pretender with both Turmoil-3 and Sloth-1 (or more?)  in my short Dom3 experience, so that's why the rumors of a buggy save (in one of the Dom3 threads here) seemed a possible answer.  Could just be user error in the Pretender creator, however.

I'll run the points through and give it ye olde rundown once I can devote a good stretch of time to it, hopefully this weekend.  Sorry about the cries of "bug!!1" - I should check it out to be sure first.

Phobos

You can't alter your pretender now that the game is underway, so it's purely academic as to what happened.

There are 2 things you can do, off the top of my head.

1.  start a new single-player game and load the pretender you used for this game.  See if there is any difference.

If there are inconsistant results from multiple tests, with multiple variables (game setting variables) it is probably a bug.

2.  recreate the exact same pretender you have in this game (what you have, not what you intended), with the same scales, magic paths and base dominion, to see what the design points are.

If there is no large excess of build points remaining, it's probably not a bug.  If there is an excess, it does not mean there is a bug either, but you will have a rough idea of how much of a handicap you are running with.

If you get any weird results from testing, post a description and the attached pretender file in the bug thread on the official forum.  The game designers might get around to looking at it and addressing it in a patch at some point.

It could be a simple mistake, such as left clicking a scale instead of right clicking, which if done in a hurry, could have cost you some design points, assuming you did not spend them.

You should not feel as though your are inconveniencing anyone for talking about stuff or asking questions.  So ignore the concern trolling about making the 'dominions community' look bad.       

parone

folks, im gonna be away from sunday afternoon till wednesday a.m.  i don't have dominions on a laptop-only my home PC, so im afraid i won't get a turn in until then.

sorry for the delay

parone

and phobos, yeah, i hear you on the 'dominions community looks bad' thing.

you have to understand, though, that while callahan is pretty abrasive, he is often VERY helpfull.  that said, i think he was kinda looking to take Nef to task for a fake 'bug alert'

i commented in another thread here on Grogheads that the attitude towards dom over at dommods is very different than here.  here it is a really cool game we like to mess around with.  over there, it is bordering on religion. 

and like i said in the other thread, i think both forums are cool.  me, i'm a really laid back dom player who honestly doesn't give a sh*t if i win or not.  that doesn't fly over there, nor does any statement that is not accurate.

if you really want to be an awesome dom player, that is the place to go.  they are the best and the most knowledgable.  me, im a classic underachiever who likes to mess around with kooky builds.  i like it here.

JasonPratt

Par, did you get my diplomacy note? Is it okay for me to go after that territory, or did you want it? (It's outside both our dominions.)

To be safe, I'm sending my turn without taking the territory, so I'll be sure not to run into your troops.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

parone

thought i sent you a pm.  my pm was very cool and in character, but i don't have time to rewrite it, so the gist of it was, that territory is more in your sphere than mine, so go ahead and grab it.

incedentally, you can just make that change to your turn and send it in,  and it will overwrite your previous turn.  you'll even get a confirmation email

JasonPratt

I know; not sure why your pm didn't arrive, but that was the idea: if you gave assent I'd just resend my turn. But if the turn ran before then, no big deal, I'd pick it up next turn.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

Nefaro

#788
Well.. the points for my pretender add up okay so it must've just been some crazy decision I don't recall making.. or I loaded up a Pretender file meant for testing out.  Heh!  Not a good way to start my first mp game.  :P

So.. as far as I see, it isn't a bug.  I must be getting senile at an early age.  Sorry for the mess.

JasonPratt

Do you have multiple test pretenders for this game? -- do they still exist? Do you remember erasing them?

If you don't remember erasing them, and they don't exist, I'm inclined to think there's still a bug somewhere: it hasn't been that long since we started, so I don't know why you'd not remember erasing all the other test pretenders (except for the wrong one you thought was the right one), and I have trouble believing that you'd intentionally try something crazy and then not remember you even tried something that crazy. By definition it would be unusual and thus memorable.

If the multiple test pretenders still exist (in your new pretender file of course), you should be able to confirm one of them was the pretender you meant to send in but got confused with another test. (Which would be easy to confuse since their filenames are always generic slight variations.)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

Yskonyn

Game hosting is extended to accomodate parone.
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Nefaro

Quote from: JasonPratt on May 13, 2013, 09:03:41 AM
Do you have multiple test pretenders for this game? -- do they still exist? Do you remember erasing them?

If you don't remember erasing them, and they don't exist, I'm inclined to think there's still a bug somewhere: it hasn't been that long since we started, so I don't know why you'd not remember erasing all the other test pretenders (except for the wrong one you thought was the right one), and I have trouble believing that you'd intentionally try something crazy and then not remember you even tried something that crazy. By definition it would be unusual and thus memorable.

If the multiple test pretenders still exist (in your new pretender file of course), you should be able to confirm one of them was the pretender you meant to send in but got confused with another test. (Which would be easy to confuse since their filenames are always generic slight variations.)

I had been saving the last couple Pretenders for this nation under the same name, so they were overwriting every time I worked up a new one. 

I'll keep an eye on the Pretender creator in the future, just in case, and note down my values in future games.  As far as I can see, the numbers come out even for this one so there's no indication of a bug.

Vlam

Hello everyone!
I have seen my nation totally destroyed by someone else, and I stand no chance at all :P .
I can't even try to retard the end, it's almost finished.

So I'm turning AI this turn!
Have a nice game, that was a pleasure to play with you, gentlemen's ;)

undercovergeek

thats a shame Vlam - glad you could play and enjoyed it

Therell be a new EA game going up soon if you keep your eyes peeled

Calahan

#794
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 11, 2013, 11:18:57 AM
Quote from: Calahan on May 11, 2013, 10:41:24 AM
But please don't propergate rumours of bugs based on old and/or secondhand data, as that really isn't doing anyone any favours.

I really don't see that happening here.  If you've been lurking a while and following these threads, what you'll have seen is a few of us being puzzled at how our pretenders turned out once a game had started, and others of us suggesting that there might be a bug with pretender creation.  None of us have been able to pin down anything concrete yet, we're simply advising each other that a bug might exist, and suggesting a possible workaround.

While nobody is saying conclusively that "X is bugged", the regular suggestions that there is a bug, which is then passed on to others, with those others then saying "I have heard/been told, that X might be bugged", is what has caused so many problems over the years for Dominions. So what I am kindly asking is to please not suggest X or Y "might be bugged", and to instead seek clarification on whether X or Y is indeed a bug or not, and as opposed to pretty much just guessing amongst yourselves about bugs based on rumours, and in a thread that anyone passing can read (and pick up further rumours from).

Like I said, this really isn't doing anyone any favours, likely confuses more than it helps, and ultimately reflects badly on the image of Dominions 3 in general. There might be some unknown bugs left in the game, but I honestly don't think it's asking too much of anyone to spend a few minutes to post a question on the official forum to get a reliable answer on the issue (and instead of spending those same few minutes playing guesswork). If it is asking too much though, then I sincerely apologise, and won't bring the issue up again.


Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 11, 2013, 11:18:57 AMAlso, since you're here and you seem to be connected in some way with the game, may I ask whether Illwinter is happy to hear suggestions for Dom3?  Or has all development now ceased on the game?

I am in infrequent contact with Illwinter myself. But Edi, the main moderator on Derusa, is in contact with Illwinter fairly often. (so they are still around in case anyone was wondering). As far as myself or anyone else knows, Illwinter continue to patch Dominions3 and fix bugs now and again (when they are brought to their attention), but their limited development time (they both have real jobs and families) is currently focused on supporting their newest game CoE III.

I wouldn't say Iliwnter won't listen to suggestions for Dom3, but the chances of there being any real changes to the game 6+ years after release is almost infinitely small. But that doesn't mean people can't make suggestions, and if there are any that can be implemented easily, then it might get done even at this late stage (but simple as in add a new hotkey, and not in changing how the UI works, or casting AI works, or requesting more script slots etc etc. As anythng along these lines is almost certainly not going to happen now, even if they are the most frequently requested changes)