To the cinema TWICE today...The Hobbit at 12:20 and Kajaki at 18:10

[Staggerwing]

http://www.evanpalmercomics.com/ainulindale/

... wow :o

[MetalDog]

That was pretty sweet.  Great find, Brant!

[Sir Slash]

Could never finish the Simarillion. It was just too much fantasy for me. Over my head like Pee Wee Herman at the bottom of the Grand Canyon.

[MetalDog]

The problem with the Silmarillion was the very first bit, the Ainulindale, which is what Brant's link led to.  Except in comics and text.  In a shortened form.  I always found it boring and too long.  The rest of the book was uneven.  There were some really good bits and some long, drawn out bits, too.  The best part is the history itself.  You just have to want it.

[JasonPratt]

Wow +10!

I would buy that for my nieces if I could. (I suppose technically I could put that on my phone as a pdf...)

If I were Saul Whoevermanagestherights, I'd hire that guy pronto.

[Martok]

CGP Grey (my favorite "edu-tainment" guy) does a pretty decent summary of the First Age in this short video: 

[JasonPratt]

Despite the link to his 2nd Age video, that doesn't exist yet, btw.

[Martok]

I know.  He likes to tease his followers that way (the cheeky git).   

[JasonPratt]

Watched Hobbit Threé Deaddragon Battleé Saturday night with the Bro. Not as lengthy as I was expecting. As usual with this trilogy the personable connections which make the action meaningful tended to get spaced out in too few dollops (and not always presented well even then. Though the scene with Gandalf cleaning out his pipe next to the silent Bilbo overlooking the battle toward the end was great.)

Plenty of great things; still trying too hard to back prequel callbacks to LotR. The evil Jar Jar character was constantly painful and served no purpose to the plot at all, other than making me wish whoever wrote and insisted on that part had been hospitalized those weeks. The ten seconds of Beorn must have been confusing to anyone who forgot he was in the previous movie, and annoying to those who remembered he had been built up there like he was going to be important: I understand why the writers thought his awesome climactic cameo from the book ought to be resolved a different way by different persons, but still. Hoping next year's extended edition will show more of him kicking ass at least.

Thorin is stuck with a movie's worth of being an insane asshat occasionally struggling with decency; the actor is given the thankless role of trying to sell that onscreen. The writers flailed hard trying to convey his resolution to do the right thing at last, and I can't say they succeeded in that transition. They should have toned down the insanity angle and made his greed and paranoia more realistic.

Dain Ironfoot was apparently told that since this was the final movie in six films he could be the one to cuss off humorously in Tolkien's work. Amusing but as thuddingly tone deaf as Gimli's Popeye the Sailor homage in RotK. (Admittedly awesome otherwise, though. "Wouldja be willing to do something for me? Please? SOODDDDD OFFFFFFF!")

Writing Legolas as a grumpy humorless thickhead (30 pounds heavier and older than he will be in LotR) was, frankly, always a major mis-step. That continues here. Sigh.

I feel like substantial parts of Thranduil's story were left for the extended editions or permanently cut.

I was never once sold on the elf/dwarf romance. Not even remotely. But I acknowledge the actors tried their best to sell it in the final scene. "Why does it hurt so much?" "Because it was real." Yeah, I'm as surprised as you are about that, Elfking.  ::) The idea that elves don't really know anything about what love truly is, or only in very rare circumstances, is utterly insulting to Tolkien, while I'm thinking about it.

Why does Galadriel hulk out when banishing Sauron, like she's being tempted with the One Ring when it isn't there? Is that supposed to indicate the ring was tempting her with nothing more than what was already fully inside her all the time, not even magnifying it? Because if anything she looks worse here than in FotR. The writers seemed to be trying to establish a romantic link between Gandalf and Galadriel, too (here and in Hobbit1). Nonsense.

Also nonsense: Thranduil giving Gandalf lip. You're one of the three elven rulers, dude, you aren't some ignorant human or dwarf. The woodelf king would know better than to mouth off to a minor angel of God like he's some wandering soothsayer peddling premonitions.

I did like Radagast being the one primarily involved in bringing in the eagle army (and Beorn), that made good sense.

Worms for marching the army underground. Okay, cool, I'm on board with that. And they aren't good for ruining allied formations and/or fortifications, why? And the northern orc army doesn't get them?

Giants in the army(s). Not just trolls, giants. Deformed giants, too. Pretty much loved those, Bro and I LOL'd and clapped with the dumbass battering ram giant, but waaaay too delicate and easily slain. Then again, so are the orcs: several times they ought to be smashing through the defenders like a hammer on hot butter. A problem endemic to the series, unfortunately.

Very much appreciated the extra areas outside the Lonely Mountain, up to and including Dale. The editor didn't do such a great job establishing a coherent idea of where various things were happening, though.

The clumsy attempt at tying Aragorn even distantly into the plot was asinine. So, you'll tell Legolas he's a good man who could be a great one, and that he's the son of Arathorn, but you'll only tell Legolas his nickname is Strider and that "you'll have to learn his true name yourself"? That illusion on your face must have given you brain damage, Thran.

Legolas and the Princess ride to Gundabar in order to do nothing except talk about story parts which may or may not be filmed by PJ next who knows, and to talk about the warbats like they're expected to make the slightest difference in the fighting which they don't. Then they ride back arriving only five minutes ahead of an army moving on foot. They don't even mention the most important thing about Angmar: it was ruled by the leader of the Nazgul!

The fight against the proto-Nazgul was pretty sweet. I guess I can understand why Elrond didn't use his Ring, since the writers have ignored him having it as thoroughly as they've ignored him being half-elven (and thus having even more justification for warning his quarter-human daughter off from marrying a human, HE KNOWS IT IS NOT GOING TO END WELL). Christopher Lee smats the hell out of the Nazgul like a boss.

Smaug attack on Laketown was handled reasonably well (including the father/son black arrow teamup), although Smaug had no reason to flap around for 3 minutes first to give people time to try escaping, and no reason not to thwap the guy in the tower shooting arrows at him even though they're being harmless. Also, I'd have shot the black arrow straight down his mouth: a clearly much larger target, likely to do as much fatal damage maybe moreso. The writers hilariously though Bard should find his bow broken as an excuse not to try shooting the GIANT WROUGHT IRON POKER with it.

Despite my nits, I liked the movie. It doesn't feature Tauriel being filmed as though she's having an orgasm kneading the lower half of the dwarf, so it will always have that unbeatable advantage over Hobbit 2.  >:(  :P

(To be fair, overall I liked Hobbit 2, too. :) )

[MetalDog]

Just came back from the late show of the Hobbit.  I am sad to report that I am unimpressed.  I wanted to like it.  Smaug burning up Lake Town was pretty cool, but as soon, as that's over, it just becomes a series of scenes to me.  They don't flow in to one another.  It's not seamless.  It's like a series of random scenes that tell a cognizant story using the characters we are familiar with, but only making sense by accident.  Maybe it's just me.  Probably, it's just me.  Way too many people have shelled out for it not to be a good movie.

[JasonPratt]

Watched Hobbit 2 again the other night, now that the extended edition is out (which I was given for Christmas, yay. :) )

I was rather more tolerant of its own several problems this time; but then I like Hobbit 1 better after my first impression of it, too. Not sure the extendeds per se help with that (unlike the LotR extendeds which make some real differences in the plot), but neither do they add anything I recall being worse than pointless. I did think the few additions in Hobbit 2 helped tie a few plot points together better which seemed choppy in the theater; mainly though they feature an unnecessary comedy bit from the book about Beorn, which I appreciated and thought was played as well as could be expected (with Gandalf SCARED OUT OF HIS MIND trying not to anger the giant werebear and slowly introducing the dwarves) but which due to PJ's rewriting of the arrival at his house didn't make much damn sense. (In the book Beorn is in the fenced yard or the house, I forget which, and the dwarves are slowly cycling in from outside. In the movie, we're expected to believe Beorn after having chased the dwarves into hi own house in bear form, and patrolling the area during the night, and then working outside in the morning, doesn't have a single clue how many dwarves are in his own house with his own beloved cattle and animals which the totality of his side of the plot so far says he would want to protect especially since he doesn't much like dwarves.)

But that's PJ piddling with the plot again, trying to make the story more cinematic and burping up problems as he goes. Sometimes his renovations actually fix or add to the plot in meaningful ways, so I don't always mind them.

Anyway. Did like Hobbit 2 again and more than before or with less parallel hate than before. One thing I couldn't help but notice this time was how the Evil Jar Jar character from Hobbit 3 plays a much more nuanced and restrained character in Hobbit 2. Practically a different characterization. Did PJ lose a bet with him, and so had to find something for him to do in Hobbit 3 aside from die in Laketown, and this was his vengeance for having to write him in throughout the movie????? In H2 he makes sense and adds to the plot. In H3 he is painfully unfunny and adds nothing at all to the plot. I can't imagine the 3rd extended edition is going to fix this.

[Sir Slash]

I've liked all 3 movies more after seeing them for a second time. Which one is the Jar Jar character you're talking about? I thought the whole "Sauron Returns" plot a bit of a stretch but not un-stomachable. And I kind of missed there being no other Dwarf songs but for the first movie. I kind of pictured Dwarves as singing and drinking more that this bunch.

[bayonetbrant]

Which one is the Jar Jar character you're talking about?

the sidekick from Laketown.  Lickspittle

[Sir Slash]

At least these films had bad teeth in them. Unbroken had POW's beaten, starved, tortured, and generally filthy but with perfect teeth. Like this guy... ;D

[JasonPratt]

And I kind of missed there being no other Dwarf songs but for the first movie. I kind of pictured Dwarves as singing and drinking more that this bunch.

You have triggered perhaps my greatest peeve about the second and third movies combined. WHY DID YOU NOT POST A TRIGGER WARNING! ;)

Look. I am super annoyed about how they chopped up the lyrics to the Lonely Mountain song in the first movie, and while I'm at it they should have put the attack on Dale and the LM there instead of at the very beginning. But the music to that was boss, as was the presentation generally. They had a perfect thematic song for the quest of Thorin and Company. (Much as in the Rankin/Bass cartoon which had the good sense to keep its themes going throughout the film. And also had the good sense to tell the whole story effectively in under 90 minutes.)

And then.

And then for no clear reason other than... copyright problems? They didn't want to pay the composer to use that song again?? I don't understand the reasoning on this at all. THAT THEME DISAPPEARS IN THE SEQUELS!!!

There were So. Many. Places. where that theme could have been and should have been used in various variations. Instead we got weak-ass generic music (within the overall Lotrmovie style admittedly) whenever the dwarves were doing something awesome and/or important. Hobbit 3 at least took a swing at that ball, even though it failed to connect. Hobbit 2 didn't even try.

I my nieces haven't played far enough in the Lego Hobbit game to tell yet, but I'd bet a Coke they had enough sense to reuse that theme at the appropriate times. (And by the way, how weird was it for the Hobbit trilogy game to be released whole seasons in advance of H3?)