GrogHeads Forum

Tabletop Gaming, Models, and Minis => Modelling and Miniatures => Topic started by: acctingman on September 11, 2017, 07:42:49 AM

Title: For JD
Post by: acctingman on September 11, 2017, 07:42:49 AM
Hey Judge

So, when you build armor kits do you ever use oils? I'm on my third armor kit, a 1/35 Tamiya PzII and it looks like dogshit. Now, I'm my own worst critique, but I also know it's going to take a long long time before I get better at this.

The assembly, airbrushing primer and base coats is easy, but where I stumble is the weathering process. I've done tons of youtube watching but I'm at a point where I just can't watch anymore videos  :pullhair:

Do you do pin washes? Do you use oils, enamels or acrylics? Do you do a  glossy, matte or varnish coats before your washes? I get a little confused when to do chips, filters, streaking....I mean, I understand what they are and how to do them, but never know WHEN to do them.

So, how do you do your weathering sequence? I'm wanting to learn all this using oils. The kits I've seen done using oils look so much better than kits without.

Anyone else here who builds armor kits, please, feel free to chime in.

Thanks folks
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: JudgeDredd on September 11, 2017, 11:47:48 AM
Hi acctingman

I'm afraid I don't go all that way into weathering. I know what you're talking about - I've likely seen the same videos. But I've only made a couple of armoured products and 1 aircraft model where I've weathered them.

For my Challenger, all I did was coat it with Johnsons Klear and then wash it with Florry Models Dark Dirt wash and when it was dry, wiped it off with some damp kitchen roll. I then used some Florry Models Rust and dabbed it on a few areas and again, wiped it off - for the most part.

That was pretty much it.

For my Leopard 1A4, I washed the model with Florry Models Concrete wash and wiped most of it off. I did the same thing for my Su-27 Flanker.

So I'm no expert at it. Generally, I'm just going for "messing up" the finish. I've seen the videos where people go hell for leather - and they get great results...but I'm just starting out on it myself. I might get more adventurous later on...who knows.

Make sure your model is covered in a coat of finish. As I said I used Johnsons Klear but I've since moved to Alcalad. I'm not sure if there's any difference in using matte or gloss except for the finish obviously...but for applying weathering solutions, I wouldn't imagine there's any difference. Some people cover their model in another coat of their favourite finish - weather that's matte, sating or gloss is down to individual taste on the finish. But I haven't done that as yet.

Good luck and remember to post your finished products here for praise and scrutineering   O0 O0
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on September 11, 2017, 12:23:55 PM
Nothing made is worth posting!  :P

Did a Stug IV that looks ok for my first build. I used hairspray to do my chipping and while it really adds a random effect, it was too much. I think for white washes, hairspray is the way to go, but for normal random chipping it's brush all the way. Everything else looks  :tickedoff:

Next kits was a M3 Stuart. I tried adding mud effects using a Vallejo product and some pigments. It looks better than the Stug IV build, but still very very rough. Also, I forgot to leave the drive sprocket off so I couldn't get the tracks on. Using this as a test model.

My Pz II looks crappy. Applied my oils on a non-coated surface and I got lots of what look like water marks.

Currently building a Panther A. I'm trying my first camo scheme. I know it's not going to turn out, but it's a learning process and I will get better at it.

Thanks for the info.

Title: Re: For JD
Post by: JudgeDredd on September 11, 2017, 03:40:24 PM
It is indeed a learning process.

Just keep it simple. Work on one technique at a time...adding layers of complexity as you get better and more adventurous

I've seen the hairspray method and I would say it was for winter camo. I see alot of modellers using HB pencils for light chipping
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: GDS_Starfury on September 15, 2017, 11:04:27 PM
missing-lynx.com will answer your questions.
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: JudgeDredd on September 24, 2017, 12:45:32 PM
...
Did a Stug IV that looks ok for my first build
...
Next kits was a M3 Stuart
...
My Pz II looks crappy
...
Currently building a Panther A
...
Pictures or they never happened  O0
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 08, 2017, 03:54:51 PM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 08, 2017, 03:55:21 PM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 08, 2017, 04:08:14 PM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Staggerwing on October 08, 2017, 04:23:08 PM
HOLY HELL

how do I shrink these images? (from imgur)

think I figured it out  :P

put 'width=xxx' (no quotes) inside the the first img tag right after the actual 'img' (leaving a space between) using whatever size in place of the 'xxx'. 600 is a good place to start.

Here is your Panther pic with 300 for size (note that it is clickable to see the full size version):

(https://i.imgur.com/B9wWcCX.jpg?1)
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 08, 2017, 04:37:22 PM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: JudgeDredd on October 09, 2017, 02:12:32 AM
Those are cool. I don't use oils personally...in fact I don't do much with weathering at all really.

The Stug looks great. What scale are these?
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 09, 2017, 07:31:36 AM
Those are cool. I don't use oils personally...in fact I don't do much with weathering at all really.

The Stug looks great. What scale are these?

All my kits are 1/35th Tamiya

My local shop has a nice selection of them and always has a 20% oo sale every other month so most Tamiya kits can be had for the $30 or less range. I'm tempted to try a Dragon kit, but I'm not ready to tackle a 600 piece kit  :crazy2:

I'm struggling with the weathering process, but I'm approaching it that way....it's a process. One that I will not master anytime soon. Oils look so damn amazing on a kit....if you know how to apply them properly.

Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Tuna on October 17, 2017, 01:56:57 PM
I used to paint with Acrylics for the most part. Tamiya or Polly S. I would then protect with Future Floor Polish before oil weathering. I think I did a couple coats. This both protects the paint job and makes the oil wash flow freely. Then after oil wash and powders, I would seal with Matte coat, I think I used Krylon cans. used those for primer too.
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 17, 2017, 02:27:49 PM
I used to paint with Acrylics for the most part. Tamiya or Polly S. I would then protect with Future Floor Polish before oil weathering. I think I did a couple coats. This both protects the paint job and makes the oil wash flow freely. Then after oil wash and powders, I would seal with Matte coat, I think I used Krylon cans. used those for primer too.

Thanks Tuna

Yea, I've read that too. Putting on oils over a gloss coat (aka future) but I've also heard the other side of it. Putting on oils over a matte finish. Watched some of Micheal Rinaldi's videos and it's his practice of NOT using a gloss coat.

It's all about experimenting for sure!
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Tuna on October 17, 2017, 02:40:55 PM
I just think the Future really promotes the flow!
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 17, 2017, 03:15:34 PM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Tuna on October 17, 2017, 04:28:23 PM
lol, all this modeling talk always makes me miss it a lot.. I have a pretty good stash of in-opened kits, but I haven't worked on a model since 2006! All my acrylics are all dried up!!!
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: GDS_Starfury on October 17, 2017, 05:08:43 PM
you really only need a gloss coat for airplanes with lots of decals.
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 18, 2017, 08:07:44 AM
......
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Ubercat on October 18, 2017, 08:31:02 AM
lol, all this modeling talk always makes me miss it a lot.. I have a pretty good stash of in-opened kits, but I haven't worked on a model since 2006! All my acrylics are all dried up!!!

Must be crappy acrylics. I have some from '96 that still work fine!
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: OJsDad on October 18, 2017, 08:37:04 AM
Bah....now I can't get the image right. Forget it  >:(

It looked fine to me. 
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Tuna on October 18, 2017, 08:42:05 AM
lol, all this modeling talk always makes me miss it a lot.. I have a pretty good stash of in-opened kits, but I haven't worked on a model since 2006! All my acrylics are all dried up!!!

Must be crappy acrylics. I have some from '96 that still work fine!

They looked dried up to me, I'll have to look again. I never thought of Tamiya and Polly Scale as being crappy.
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 18, 2017, 09:12:38 AM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Barthheart on October 18, 2017, 09:29:47 AM
The width+300 needs to be inside the brackets.

{img width=300} images stuff {/img}

Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 18, 2017, 09:36:46 AM
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Title: Re: For JD
Post by: mirth on October 18, 2017, 09:51:31 AM

(https://i.imgur.com/DjV6buD.jpg)

Title: Re: For JD
Post by: mirth on October 18, 2017, 09:52:40 AM
Hit quote on what I just posted and you should be able to see where I moved the width inside the img tag.
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Barthheart on October 18, 2017, 09:55:19 AM
Lord love a duck man! What part of "inside the brackets" did you not get?  ???
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: bayonetbrant on October 18, 2017, 10:01:58 AM
for clarity, I just changed "[" to "{" and "]" to "}" to show how the formatting needed to change

{img}http://width=300https://i.imgur.com/DjV6buD.jpg{/img}


first, the bold text is in the wrong place
{img width=300}http://https://i.imgur.com/DjV6buD.jpg{/img}



second, there are too many "http://" bits in the URL
{img width=300}http://https://i.imgur.com/DjV6buD.jpg{/img}



so let's see what we get now

{img width=300}https://i.imgur.com/DjV6buD.jpg{/img}


change the "{}" brackets back to the square ones

(https://i.imgur.com/DjV6buD.jpg)
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: acctingman on October 18, 2017, 08:51:53 PM
Ok, clean slate for me! Deleted my pathetic attempts at posting pics  :buck2: so, here we go.

(https://i.imgur.com/MziwRfB.jpg?3)
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Barthheart on October 18, 2017, 09:06:08 PM
Hey! It looks great.  O0
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: JudgeDredd on October 18, 2017, 11:32:27 PM
That's coming along nicely  :peace:
Title: Re: For JD
Post by: Tuna on October 19, 2017, 04:45:04 AM
Looks really good, I like the subtle chipping, and the lower hull looks like it's been through Mud hell and back!