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Digital Gaming => Computer Gaming => Topic started by: MengJiao on August 04, 2020, 05:46:40 PM

Title: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 04, 2020, 05:46:40 PM

   This might be fun.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1049440/IL2_Sturmovik_Desert_Wings__Tobruk/
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: JasonPratt on August 04, 2020, 08:03:03 PM
We do need a separate thread for this; most of the discussion is over at the IL-2 BoX / Great Battles thread.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Destraex on August 05, 2020, 03:02:52 AM
A great theatre and I wish them well. Clod was almost the most amazing air combat system ever. This could make it realise it's potential.
My only caveat is that now I have "tank crew" for il2 BOS I am guessing we will never get a western desert tank module because of the two different engines.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 05, 2020, 04:49:21 AM
We do need a separate thread for this; most of the discussion is over at the IL-2 BoX / Great Battles thread.

  This is a different game completely.  Probably BoX discussions would be more focused without CLOD included.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: JasonPratt on August 05, 2020, 01:57:37 PM
I would have said the other way around! -- more focused discussion on CLOD BlitzDW without all the other BoX game discussion. ;)
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 05, 2020, 02:11:55 PM
I would have said the other way around! -- more focused discussion on CLOD BlitzDW without all the other BoX game discussion. ;)

I think the interest in CLOD DLCs is likely to be pretty low, so I thought I'd let the BoX-ians (including me ...I think I have most of the BoX stuff) do their things and keep CLOD in its own niche-ian-kind of place.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Silent Disapproval Robot on August 05, 2020, 05:21:57 PM
Is the AI still brain-dead?
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 05, 2020, 08:04:52 PM
Is the AI still brain-dead?

   I've always written my own single-player missions and apparently the AI works better in editor-built missions than in the "Quick Missions"...some of the tradition of brain-deadness in the AI might be based on Quick Missions (which I have never flown)...I do recall some odd behavior when bombing with Blenheim IVs years ago, so the AI might still have some problems.  One thing about my approach to CLOD is that the editor is pretty much the same as the original Il-2 editor which was pretty good.  So I've been used to getting the AI to behave for quite some time in the IL-2 to CLOD lineage.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Silent Disapproval Robot on August 05, 2020, 08:58:07 PM
I think I'll pass then. 
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 06, 2020, 09:04:07 PM
  So I've been used to getting the AI to behave for quite some time in the IL-2 to CLOD lineage.

   Desert Heinkel 111 H6:

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Jarhead0331 on August 06, 2020, 09:11:32 PM
How are your initial impressions? I got it, but Iím away on vacation and away from my rig.

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Philippe on August 06, 2020, 10:45:30 PM
I bought CLOD a while back. 

I really love the subject so I was inclined to be fairly forgiving. 

But the game ran so badly compared to Il2 BOS that I gave up in disgust and put in for a refund.

That experience has made me reluctant to try another one of this group's products.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 07, 2020, 10:31:37 AM
How are your initial impressions? I got it, but Iím away on vacation and away from my rig.

   I think it is okay.  I've played CLOD BLITZ for a while and before that all sorts of IL-2 stuff that uses the same editor (BoX seems to be a pretty
different editor and engine) so it works as an extension.  The upgrade (5.0) Downloads for vanilla BLITZ are 6 gig and Tobruk is 4 gig so most of the work
is going into adjusting the existing engine.  Here is a Tomahawk closing in on the Fort Maddelena complex that I'm using as a stand-in for some Palmyra scenarios:

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 07, 2020, 10:35:51 AM
I bought CLOD a while back. 

I really love the subject so I was inclined to be fairly forgiving. 

But the game ran so badly compared to Il2 BOS that I gave up in disgust and put in for a refund.

That experience has made me reluctant to try another one of this group's products.

  Load up the latest CLOD BLITZ 5.0 and see if it works better.  It's hard for me to know how this compares to BoX because I have BoX and I've adjusted
my expectations and settings so that they both seem to run okay to me.  My problem with BoX is the editor and its subject matter, not the engine and as I say, I'm at home with whatever the CLOD problems are to the point that it just looks like a much improved version of the original IL-2.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 07, 2020, 10:37:29 AM
A great theatre and I wish them well. Clod was almost the most amazing air combat system ever. This could make it realise it's potential.
My only caveat is that now I have "tank crew" for il2 BOS I am guessing we will never get a western desert tank module because of the two different engines.

  Yeah...I don't think there is going to be a CLOD Tobruk tank driving thing.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 07, 2020, 07:51:05 PM
A great theatre and I wish them well. Clod was almost the most amazing air combat system ever. This could make it realise it's potential.
My only caveat is that now I have "tank crew" for il2 BOS I am guessing we will never get a western desert tank module because of the two different engines.

  Yeah...I don't think there is going to be a CLOD Tobruk tank driving thing.

  But here is a Tomahawk off Bardia:

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Father Ted on August 08, 2020, 03:33:29 AM
I bought CLOD a while back. 

I really love the subject so I was inclined to be fairly forgiving. 

But the game ran so badly compared to Il2 BOS that I gave up in disgust and put in for a refund.

That experience has made me reluctant to try another one of this group's products.

Well, if you did want to try it, you'd have to re-buy CloD, because Tobruk is DLC for the base game
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 08, 2020, 03:30:46 PM

  Yeah...I don't think there is going to be a CLOD Tobruk tank driving thing.

  But the Hurricane IIc is pretty fun to fly.  4 20mm guns.  Its the only plane in the game so far that I have managed to hit anything with and the hits were impressive:  A 109 completely blew up (First time I've seen that in CLOD BLITZ) but I was far enough back to not get damaged.  Then I hit a Franco-Italian Dewitt 520 and a big piece fell off and hit my oil cooler.  I had oil all over the canopy.  I headed for the desert but the engine quit and
 I bailed out into the Mediterranean.  Here's the Dewitt after I hit it:



Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Father Ted on August 08, 2020, 04:38:15 PM

  But the Hurricane IIc is pretty fun to fly.  4 20mm guns.  Its the only plane in the game so far that I have managed to hit anything with and the hits were impressive:  A 109 completely blew up (First time I've seen that in CLOD BLITZ) but I was far enough back to not get damaged.  Then I hit a Franco-Italian Dewitt 520 and a big piece fell off and hit my oil cooler.  I had oil all over the canopy.  I headed for the desert but the engine quit and
 I bailed out into the Mediterranean.  Here's the Dewitt after I hit it:

The IIc was my ride in IL2 1946.  Something about the sight-picture and the power of those 20mm allowed me to "snipe" at EA - instead of hosing the target with tracer, I could usually (=osometimes) just tap the gun button to effect a kill.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 08, 2020, 04:50:10 PM

  But the Hurricane IIc is pretty fun to fly.  4 20mm guns.  Its the only plane in the game so far that I have managed to hit anything with and the hits were impressive:  A 109 completely blew up (First time I've seen that in CLOD BLITZ) but I was far enough back to not get damaged.  Then I hit a Franco-Italian Dewitt 520 and a big piece fell off and hit my oil cooler.  I had oil all over the canopy.  I headed for the desert but the engine quit and
 I bailed out into the Mediterranean.  Here's the Dewitt after I hit it:

The IIc was my ride in IL2 1946.  Something about the sight-picture and the power of those 20mm allowed me to "snipe" at EA - instead of hosing the target with tracer, I could usually (=osometimes) just tap the gun button to effect a kill.

  I've been trying to fly the Tomahawk, but it is so much faster (and shaky) in a dive that I have a hard time lining up the guns.  The Hurricane IIc is a surprising plane -- fighter-bomber and Intruder and (at least in CLOD Tobruk) an okay fighter plane and a deadly gun platform.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Destraex on August 09, 2020, 05:01:23 AM
Damage model was always very good in CLOD. Awesome shot!
Why the Italian and French markings? I assume you applied the skin?
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 09, 2020, 06:12:24 AM
Damage model was always very good in CLOD. Awesome shot!
Why the Italian and French markings? I assume you applied the skin?

  Oh yeah, I tried that skin while trying to get a Vichy flavor.  If you just pick "French" the plane goes to the Allied side so to skip a step (that I haven't tried) I started the Dewitt as Italian and added French markings.  On the other hand or meanwhile in reality,  while the Luftwaffe was flying through Lebanon and Syria to support the Iraqi rebellion, their planes were crudely painted (without really obscuring the German identifiers) with markings suggesting they were not Luftwaffe aircraft...so a quasi-Vichy-Dewitt with Italian markings is not so strange especially since in June 1941 in Lebanon and Syria, Allied pilots assumed they were usually dealing with Italian planes though in fact they shot down or destroyed on the ground many more French and German aircraft (especially at Palmyra, an important refueling stop for the Luftwaffe going to Iraq).
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 24, 2020, 05:45:59 PM

  I've been trying to fly the Tomahawk, but it is so much faster (and shaky) in a dive that I have a hard time lining up the guns.  The Hurricane IIc is a surprising plane -- fighter-bomber and Intruder and (at least in CLOD Tobruk) an okay fighter plane and a deadly gun platform.

   More flights in the Tomahawk II -- hit a 109 and got damaged by flying debris.  Oil on the canopy again.  But its a fun plane to fly:

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 30, 2020, 09:47:10 AM


  Fiat G50:

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Gusington on August 30, 2020, 11:14:13 AM
I love that plane. How is it to fly?
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Sir Slash on August 30, 2020, 02:21:33 PM
They had very little in the way of armament, correct?
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 30, 2020, 03:20:02 PM
They had very little in the way of armament, correct?

  Wikipedia says 2 50 cal in the nose and a 33 to one kill ratio in the Finnish Air Force (presumably in 1939-41), so not too bad.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 30, 2020, 03:44:52 PM
I love that plane. How is it to fly?

   It's pretty fun.  Very Seat-of-the-pants like all those early war manoeuver fighters.  You feel very acrobatic and then you notice (as many an early-war manoeuver pilot must have) that things are not really going so well.  The 50 cal. are shooting through interrupter gear and so are not shooting very fast and when you get onto a Hurricane's tail, it can just pull away.  And then you notice all of your fellow-Fiat Freccio (Arrows -- according to Wikipedia) are just already down (the eight 30 Brownings on a Hurricane wreck a Fiat very quickly).  On the other hand, you can do some damage to Wellingtons pretty fast yourself.  So...okay against early war bombers...not so good against serious (if primitive) fighters like the Hurricane.

One unexpected thing that CLOD Tobruk makes you do is ...you really start to think the Hurricane is a pretty reasonable fighter/ fighterbomber.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 30, 2020, 06:49:39 PM
They had very little in the way of armament, correct?

  Wikipedia says 2 50 cal in the nose and a 33 to one kill ratio in the Finnish Air Force (presumably in 1939-41), so not too bad.

  The Tomahawk II also has 2 50 cal in the nose (plus two 30 cal on each wing), but the Tomahawk seems to cause a lot more devastation with its guns:

Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: Sir Slash on August 30, 2020, 09:10:11 PM
Nice pics Meng.  O0
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 31, 2020, 04:43:26 AM
Nice pics Meng.  O0

   Thanks!  One weird thing I noticed about how the AI in a Tomahawk II attacks the AI in a JU88 is the one engine at a time approach versus the kill the rear gunner approach.  If the AI is climbing to the attack from behind, sometimes one burst totals the Ju88 spectacularly (big chunks flying off and everybody but the dead bailing out right away) without harming the engines.  You see some unexpected things when you are just trying to get pictures.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: RyanE on August 31, 2020, 05:18:39 AM
I went back and watched a bunch of gun camera footage from WW2.  Comparing it to CoD's large chunks falling off with every burst, there wasn't a huge amount of debris coming off with each burst.  Especially with smaller fighters.  It might just be the clips I happened to watch though.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 31, 2020, 08:10:24 AM
I went back and watched a bunch of gun camera footage from WW2.  Comparing it to CoD's large chunks falling off with every burst, there wasn't a huge amount of debris coming off with each burst.  Especially with smaller fighters.  It might just be the clips I happened to watch though.

  CLOD is a bit excessive, though, in reality, even 8 30 cal could cause instant complete explosions...particularly in Me 110s apparently (big gas tanks mostly empty? the "De Wilde" bullet?).  I know pilots reports a lot of collisions with debris and I've definitely been hitting chunks of stuff and/or getting oil on the canopy.  Also, I think smoke may mask some smaller chunks even in CLOD.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: RyanE on August 31, 2020, 08:35:35 AM
I might not have been clear.  IRL gun cams, not a huge amount of debris comes off a plane with each burst.  In CoD, large pieces come of with even the smallest burst.
Title: Re: IL-2 CLOD Blitz Desert Wings DLC
Post by: MengJiao on August 31, 2020, 02:30:12 PM
I might not have been clear.  IRL gun cams, not a huge amount of debris comes off a plane with each burst.  In CoD, large pieces come of with even the smallest burst.

  I'll have to watch CLOD more carefully.