Author Topic: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?  (Read 3111 times)

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Offline JasonPratt

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Can we talk a little non-specifically about the post-credit teaser a minute?

Right, so a lot of people (myself included) were surprised at how unimportant the post-credit teaser was. It's a funny joke (I won't spoil it here for those who haven't seen it yet), but it's only funny to a very select group of fans and has no imaginable connection to anything else that's going to be happening in the Marvel films -- unless the special cameo character shows up in Guardians 2 which, though that movie is now being made, seems a tad unlikely. But even if true doesn't really mean anything.

MovieBob over at the Escapist, when discussing it in his "Escape to the Movies" entry this week, made a guess that the director, James Gunn, was just having some random fun according to the previous tone of the film -- which sounds plausible enough in itself -- and that Marvel Studios went along with it because why not? Or because this was their way of triumphantly boasting that, damn they could make a great movie out of any property EVEN THAT TURKEY! {hint}

But that didn't sit well with me. Marvel handed over one of the precious Thor 2 post-credit slots to James Gunn himself in order to film a teaser for Guardians; and this is the final movie of Phase 2 before Age of Ultron next May. It seems insane that Marvel Studios would risk trolling their own loyal audience for no better sake than for boasting, and a boast that the average moviegoer wouldn't even understand.

Then I read an article over at Badass Digest: http://badassdigest.com/2014/08/03/who-is-star-lords-father

They don't spoil the Guardians post-credit scene by the way; they do talk about a canon-shakeup mystery that intrigued me, too: Peter Quill (aka Star Lord) has for a long time in comics canon (possibly longer than I've been alive!) been a purely human man whose father, though technically alien, is also human. The Marvel Studio writers torpedo that origin and very explicitly make Quill instead the son of some kind of ancient alien unknown even to the Nova Corps (yet -- and they're the Marvel Universe version of the Green Lantern Corps, sort of, though much less powerful, at least in this film).

When asked about this, Gunn confirmed that Quill's father's identity is a mystery (i.e. not J'Son of Spartax), and then said something even more curious: the only four real-life people who know the identity are himself, producer Kevin Feige -- both of whom make sense -- and then also Michael Rooker and Sean Gunn.

Who?

Michael Rooker played Yondu the space pirate with the whistly arrow (and minus his usual glorious red mohawk); Sean Gunn played Yondu's second in command, Kraglin, a man with almost as few lines onscreen as Groot.

Now, that's ultra-weird.

Yondu and Kraglin, as characters in-story, know his father because at the end of the movie (a very minor spoiler here, but I assume anyone reading this far has either seen the movie or doesn't care about small spoilers) they share a laugh about how they're glad they didn't bring Quill back to his father like they were hired to do -- which is okay because the father is a "jerk" anyway.

But there is no reason why the actors playing Yondu and Kraglin would know who the father is, unless Gunn told Gunn (Sean is his brother, and also mo-cap'd Rocket Racoon!) and then Gunn told Rooker while puttering around between shots after which the writer and director put the fear of the Almighty Tri-Judge or something into them about spilling the beans further.

That's a possible scenario. But it seems sloppy.

A more elegant scenario would also explain the weird post-credit sequence: originally that wasn't the scene! The scene involved Yondu and Kraglin being visited by Quill's father at last. But though written (if not filmed) and practiced by the actors, it was deemed far too spoilery or else locked in Marvel's options too much, and so was scrapped for something that could be thrown together at the last minute.

What makes this theory even more appealing to me, is that Yondu had no interest in the treasure everyone was looking for other than monetary value; and so was certainly looking for someone to sell it back to (before discovering he had been tricked, again slight spoiler). The most obvious choice would be the last person who had had the treasure, The Collector -- who is one of the two characters in the post-credit scene, and who despite his appearance is actually (in comics canon at least) an ancient super-alien, something like a hard-energy being in the comics, nearly on par with cosmic powers like Galactus, basically one of the Adam figures of the Marvel Universe grieving over his lost wife (who committed suicide billions of years ago which she tired of her immortal existence) and trying to distract himself from his grief by becoming a collector of rare items. He might also be trying to get certain treasures together in order to fulfill the comic-version character's greatest wish, to bring back his wife -- which could segue nicely into the upcoming Thanos plot (especially since one of his key characteristics is an infatuation with the Marvel Universe's living expression of Death. Thus also explaining his wry grin at the end of the first Avengers movie on hearing that whoever fights Earth "courts death".) The Collector is a direct enemy of Thanos in the comics; and the reason he and a few remaining Elders (originally sentient beings) are specially immortal is because Death vowed after the suicide of the Collector's wife that no more Elders would ever die.

{inhale}

Right now in the movie universe no normal people seem to know that The Collector is anything other than an eccentric old though oddly dangerous and powerful weirdo. (Thanos might know differently, but even he might not know the Collector's true identity yet even if he knows of the entity.) So it still makes sense that the Nova Corps wouldn't have a record yet of the Collector's true form and nature. Yondu and company would definitely just think of the Collector as a "jerk" (and he certainly behaves that way in other regards).

The structure of the Guardians' post-credit scene certainly doesn't require the cameo character to say the line that's used -- anyone could walk in and say it. My wild-ass guess, then, is that originally Yondu and Kraglin returned to the Collector bringing the treasure, and that's when they discovered the switch had been made. But that's also when the actors (one way or another) learned the Collector is Quill's father -- possibly by an offhanded remark in appreciation of the switch.

As it is, Yondu who has served as Quill's sort-of-father figure (and who despite his bluster still loves him as a son) opens the canister early despite having every good reason not to do so, and finds he's been tricked, and gives an appreciative affectionate smile while his oblivious crew is still celebrating their apparent victory. So that concept is certainly in the movie. But it comes a little out of nowhere: Yondu isn't stupid, he has seen firsthand what the treasure can do and how poisonous it can be to any organic life. While it does make sense for him to be suspicious of Quill's deal once the euphoria of his victory wears off a little, it would also make perfect sense for him to leave the damn thing alone until he can hand it off to someone he already knows can control it: the person who originally commissioned him to hunt for it (along with Quill), the Collector.


I also kind of like the Digest author's theory of Starfox being the Dad, although that doesn't fit an energy-being origin -- the movie makes it clear that Peter's mother wasn't just speaking metaphorically or ignorantly, the father really was an energy being of some kind. Note that due to some weirdness with Disqus, neither my new Win8 computer nor my older Mac at the office can read such comments anymore, so for all I know someone else may have come up with this theory; and I haven't seen it discussed elsewhere on the net yet.

Still, hundreds of millions of people on the net, so I can hardly believe I'm really the first to try this theory out.

But if I'm right, and one of the first, Grogheads will get some hits perhaps as a result.  O0
« Last Edit: August 08, 2014, 08:29:37 PM by JasonPratt »
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Offline JasonPratt

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2014, 08:08:50 PM »
Update: wait, Nicole Perlman, the film's original screenwriter, isn't in the list of those who know the secret father of Peter Quill?

/Film has an article detailing some of the concept art from the movie: http://www.slashfilm.com/guardians-of-the-galaxy-concept-art/

Along the way, the authors reveal that Nicole originally wrote Jason (or J'Son) of Spartoi as Peter's father, just like the comics, and a lot of the story took place on Spartoi originally. When James Gunn signed on as director, he rewrote a lot of the original script (which went through many drafts as usual for productions like this), and that was when the father's identity changed.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in chronological order. Lots and lots of order...

Dawn of Armageddon -- a narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse: The Hunt Begins: Insert Joke Here!

Survive Harder! In the grim darkness of the bowl there is only, um, Amazons. And tentacles and midgets. Not remotely what you're thinking! ...okay, maybe a little remotely.

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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2014, 07:36:56 AM »
If they are not following the comics, then your guess is as good as any!
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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2014, 08:07:44 AM »
Well, Quill's mom did call him her little Star Lord- so perhaps his father is her big Star Lord.  Like the King of an Empire, maybe?
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Offline JasonPratt

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2014, 08:39:15 PM »
In terms of the theory that would be her nickname for Peter based on his father being "an angel of light".

In terms of comics-reference, Jason was the official Star Lord (if I recall correctly) for his planet, and Peter was chosen as an applicant for the title but was rejected -- so he beat up the winner and stole the gear. That's where he gets the boot jets and the nifty red goggle-eyed helmet.

A big (though subtle) signal that they changed this origin for the film, is that the "Star Lord" symbol from the comics is now the symbol of Yondu's space-pirates. But Yondu's origin and character is pretty changed, too, as originally he was a main member of the first Guardians team.

Worth noting: the guy who originally created the character wanted the Peter Quill "Star Lord" character to go from an annoying immature jackass to the most cosmic being in the universe -- but then he left Marvel shortly after starting the story arc and no one ever picked it up! Having Quill now the half-human son to a super-ancient unknown alien of cosmic-level power, could be considered an attempt to get waaaaay back to the roots of the character.

(Much like having Ultron not be a creation of Hank Pym but a creation of Jarvis the Butler (though this was immediately retconned out as a deception by Ultron having taken over Jarvis' mind with his origin remaining unexplained and then accounted for by Pym), in his original Marvel canon introduction!)
« Last Edit: August 11, 2014, 08:43:40 PM by JasonPratt »
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Survive Harder! In the grim darkness of the bowl there is only, um, Amazons. And tentacles and midgets. Not remotely what you're thinking! ...okay, maybe a little remotely.

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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2014, 09:44:54 AM »
Quote
Worth noting: the guy who originally created the character wanted the Peter Quill "Star Lord" character to go from an annoying immature jackass to the most cosmic being in the universe -- but then he left Marvel shortly after starting the story arc and no one ever picked it up!

They could still portray this kind of character arc through flashbacks in Guardians 2.
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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2014, 10:15:15 AM »
Maybe, just maybe, daddy is Yondu....
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Offline bayonetbrant

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2014, 10:25:05 AM »
Maybe, just maybe, daddy is Yondu....

That would totally not jive with the comics, but the movie franchises have already departed from the comics quite a bit
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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2014, 10:43:18 AM »
Yondu kept Peter instead of delivering him to his "father", why?  Because Peter's dad is a jerk?  Or because Yondu visited young Ms. Quill himself?  :o
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Offline JasonPratt

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2014, 12:39:25 PM »
Except Yondu isn't an ancient cosmic-force alien unknown yet even to the Nova Corps.

Granted, they don't seem to know the Collector is either, but the difference is that the Collector actually is.

Also, the dialogue implies that both Yondu and his XO know who hired them to return with the boy and agree he's a jerk.

On the other hand, I admit it doesn't seem likely that they would know the Collector hired them to get Peter, and then they chose not to bring him back anyway -- the Collector has a dangerous reputation, though maybe they thought they were sparing the boy from that. At any rate, neither Yondu nor Quill realized who was actually hiring them to go after the artifact, so had Yondu reneg'd on a previous job for the Collector to keep the boy that wouldn't have prevented him from taking the job via the mediator agent. On the contrary, taking the artifact (now revealed to be X) back directly to the Collector might have been his plan to get out of the Collector's bad side.
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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2014, 07:28:36 AM »
All I am saying is that the movie writers have taken enough liberties that one really doesn't know what they will create.
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Offline JasonPratt

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2014, 04:18:43 PM »
Oh, yes, that's quite true. Sorry -- usually when I hear/see someone saying that, they're complaining about a disrespect for canon.  :buck2: Which I can understand and sympathize with.


Meanwhile, James Gunn has definitely said (in an Empire interview) that J'Son won't be Peter's dad; but also

a.) The scene with... look I assume everyone reading this thread has seen the movie now, right? Or read it on the internet. Howard the Duck. That was always planned as such, though it was only one of several ideas for stingers. In other words, it didn't get changed at the last minute from Yondu showing up to try to sell the Stone to the Collector -- although the way it was shot, they kept Howard secret from Benecio, so he didn't know who was saying the line. So that shoots down part of my theory, and though not an essential part overall it was the part which led me to theorize in the first place.

b.) Part of the secret with the Dad hinged on making sure Yondu's character was nailed down securely, thus obliquely explaining why Michael Rooke is in on the secret perhaps, though not necessarily explaining why Gunn's brother knows, too. (But that could be entirely due to the actor being James Gunn's brother.)

c.) JG was rather offhand about whether the Collector would show up again or not; like, sure he could if they have an idea for him but they aren't planning on it. This made no sense to me at all since he's heavily involved in the Infinity Stone plot, but then JG also said Guardians 2 won't necessarily involve Thanos again either.  :o I honestly have no idea what to make of that, as it seems insane G2 won't be leading into Av3 somehow, and at least two of the Guardians actively want to kill or otherwise mess with Thanos. Could be vague misdirection to keep from confirming plot details early though.

ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in chronological order. Lots and lots of order...

Dawn of Armageddon -- a narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse: The Hunt Begins: Insert Joke Here!

Survive Harder! In the grim darkness of the bowl there is only, um, Amazons. And tentacles and midgets. Not remotely what you're thinking! ...okay, maybe a little remotely.

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Offline Centurion40

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2014, 06:29:21 AM »
You'd think that Thanos would want to be killed, so he could meet his sweetie.

And WTF is up with Howard???!!  I mean really, WTF!!
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Offline Sir Slash

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2014, 08:26:52 AM »
Yeah the duck totally threw me too. Hope it's not a spin-off... Duck Lord the Avenger. :2funny:
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Offline JasonPratt

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Re: Who is Peter Quill's ancient alien father in Guardians of the Galaxy?
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2014, 05:06:07 PM »
You'd think that Thanos would want to be killed, so he could meet his sweetie.

I'm trying to recall if he ever went that route. He did give up being a supervillain for a while after losing the Gauntlet, went to go live on a farm raising corn.

Quote
And WTF is up with Howard???!!  I mean really, WTF!!

That is certainly what the intention was there.  O0
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in chronological order. Lots and lots of order...

Dawn of Armageddon -- a narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse: The Hunt Begins: Insert Joke Here!

Survive Harder! In the grim darkness of the bowl there is only, um, Amazons. And tentacles and midgets. Not remotely what you're thinking! ...okay, maybe a little remotely.

PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Season One complete; Fantasy Wars AAR, lots of screenies.