Author Topic: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot  (Read 7778 times)

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Offline Bison

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #45 on: November 12, 2015, 12:57:52 PM »
Nope.  I accept the reality that New York is not the center of the universe. 

Offline Marty Ward

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #46 on: November 12, 2015, 01:04:35 PM »
At least the Yankees and Mets play in NY unlike the Giants and Jets :)
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Offline MetalDog

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #47 on: November 12, 2015, 01:07:14 PM »
Nope.  I accept the reality that New York is not the center of the universe.

I agree with that statement.  Now, let's agree that the hate for New York is that of the haters for the successful.
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Offline Marty Ward

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #48 on: November 12, 2015, 01:11:14 PM »
Nope.  I accept the reality that New York is not the center of the universe.

I agree with that statement.  Now, let's agree that the hate for New York is that of the haters for the successful.

Depends on what you call successful.
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Offline Bison

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #49 on: November 12, 2015, 01:12:52 PM »
Nope.  I accept the reality that New York is not the center of the universe.

I agree with that statement.  Now, let's agree that the hate for New York is that of the haters for the successful.

Depends on what you call successful.

Exactly. 

Offline bayonetbrant

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #50 on: November 12, 2015, 01:33:56 PM »
How good was Schilling those years he was pitching for Philly when they got to the World Series?
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Offline Marty Ward

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #51 on: November 12, 2015, 01:41:33 PM »
How good was Schilling those years he was pitching for Philly when they got to the World Series?

He had a few really great years but he also had a lot of average years. He played for 20 years. He won 20 or more 3 times and 15 or more 5 times. He was really good in the playoffs. He also went 2-8, 9-10, 8-9, 5-6. He was definitely above average overall but I'm not sure he was HOF level.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/schilcu01.shtml
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Offline MetalDog

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #52 on: November 12, 2015, 02:02:27 PM »
Nope.  I accept the reality that New York is not the center of the universe.

I agree with that statement.  Now, let's agree that the hate for New York is that of the haters for the successful.

Depends on what you call successful.

Exactly.

Well let's see...add up all the championships the Kansas City Royals have together with the team that Marty pulls for and I guarantee, between the two of them, they won't have as many as the Yankees have.  Or, measure the jealousy and bitter feelings the other 29 franchises fans have that manifests as, "What do you call successful?"  Either way, it's just haters hating success.  :P
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Offline Marty Ward

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #53 on: November 12, 2015, 02:54:56 PM »


Well let's see...add up all the championships the Kansas City Royals have together with the team that Marty pulls for and I guarantee, between the two of them, they won't have as many as the Yankees have.  Or, measure the jealousy and bitter feelings the other 29 franchises fans have that manifests as, "What do you call successful?"  Either way, it's just haters hating success.  :P

Sure the Yankees had some dynasties in the past and won a lot of W.S.

More recently, since the beginning of the playoff system at least, they haven't exactly set the world on fire. From 1969 through 1995 the Yankees made the playoffs a grand total of 5 times. The stinking Orioles went to the World Series 5 times during that period. Once the playoffs were expanded then Yankees made it more regularly, along with a lot of other teams.

I wouldn't call spending ~650 million to play in 1 playoff game in the past 3 years a success either, would you?

So success depends on how you define it. They have been anything but successful these past few years.
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Offline MetalDog

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #54 on: November 12, 2015, 03:29:56 PM »
First off, the Yankees success was, and is, within the rules of the game as it was played.  When there were no playoffs, they won.  And that was the rule at the time.  Did you want them to have to win twice as many games because they were the Yankees in order to get to the World Series?  You wouldn't ask any other team to do that, so why New York? 

When the playoffs came in to being, they again played by the rules.  Win as many games as it took to get to the playoffs.  Then win or go home.  Like it was before and is now.  Any further stipulation on how the Yankees get there would be wrong.  So, why does winning that much have anything to do with when they did it?

Every team has periods of suckitude.  Just ask the Red Sox.  Or the Cubs.  Or Cleveland.  Or The A's.  It was inevitable that New York would, too.  And for those who hate, it was a great time.  The giant is slain!  But, I named four teams whose futility is legend in the game.  Why?  Why don't they have a winning legacy?  Were their players worse?  What about ownership?  Did they give it their all to field a winning team?  New York's did. 

And finally, the buying of championships.  The crutch all losers lean on to explain why their team is at a disadvantage and doesn't win.  Boo hoo.  Cry me a river.  As Marty pointed out, the Yankees sucked for thirty years.  While I wasn't alive to see them all, I saw most of them and there were too many times George opened his checkbook and fell flat on his face.  It's a travesty that Don Mattingly, an all time great in pinstripes, was unable to take advantage of the Yankee legacy and win a World Series.  And even when money brought us to the precipice, there were STILL times the Yankees lost. 

I've rooted for the Buccaneers and Saints since 1980.  I picked them on purpose because I figured all the good teams didn't need one more fan among legion.  I watched the Bucs take a beating in the NFC Central year after year after year after year.  I hated Barry Sanders cuz he always beat us while I marvelled at his skill.  Brett Favre stuck so many daggers in my heart that I could set off a metal detector a mile away.  And don't get me started on how many times Montana and the Niners ruined my day after the Saints went into the fourth quarter close or ahead.  Only to lose every time.

It sucks to root for a loser.  And the only narrative that gives you hope is, well, the future has to be better.  It can't get any worse.  And when it does, it feels like the mountain top!  And it's GOOD to crow about how great you are!!  "Top o' the world, Ma!"  But, downing other teams, especially successful ones, no matter how they get there, is just a crappy way to be a fan.  And certainly not befitting of either of you fine gentlemen.
And the One Song to Rule Them All is Gimme Shelter - Rolling Stones


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Offline Bison

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #55 on: November 12, 2015, 04:12:23 PM »
All I know is who's the champ this year? 

Offline MetalDog

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #56 on: November 12, 2015, 04:16:10 PM »
-smh-  I gave props to the winners and you.  Look in the 2015 Baseball thread.
And the One Song to Rule Them All is Gimme Shelter - Rolling Stones


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Offline Bison

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #57 on: November 12, 2015, 04:53:08 PM »
I'm not really a Yankees hater.   I just don't cheer for them.  Ever, really.  That has more to do with the arrogance of the average New York fan and not the team per say.  Trust me.  My in-laws are Yankees fans.  My father-in-law is a huge Yankees fan.  Conversations go like this "Should be a good year of baseball.  The Royals look good on paper, as do the Cardinals, Orioles, ect..."  "Yankees blah blah blah"  "I'd don't think Mattiingly will make it through the season as the Dodgers manager." "Yankees blah blah blah Jeter blah blah blah"  Every conversation and I mean every conversation is somehow related to the Yankees.  It's like that with all the New York fans I'm forced to interact with out there.  That's why I say New York fans refuse to admit baseball exists west of the Hudson.

Offline Bison

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #58 on: November 12, 2015, 04:55:02 PM »
Boston fans are about the freaking same.  Worst thing that happened was Boston winning a couple of series.  Now it doesn't stop.  Cubs fans are only tolerable because the Cubs find a way to lose every year.  The humility keeps their arrogance in check.

Offline MetalDog

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Re: 2016 Baseball HoF Ballot
« Reply #59 on: November 12, 2015, 05:02:39 PM »
I usually only flash my Yankee love when people poke at them.  Most times, I've played fantasy sports for so long, I am more interested in individual players rather than teams.  I feel your pain on the in-laws, too.  My ex's family are all Cardinal fans.
And the One Song to Rule Them All is Gimme Shelter - Rolling Stones


"If its a Balrog, I don't think you get an option to not consent......." - bob