...just noticed it on my PC. Apparently it is legit and is/will be popping up on your PC too soon, if not already. It's Microsoft starting to prompt users to reserve their copy of Windows 10.
http://www.windowscentral.com/microsoft-wants-you-reserve-your-free-upgrade-windows-10
http://www.idigitaltimes.com/windows-10-update-icon-real-how-can-i-remove-it-cautious-users-worry-theyve-been-445716
updated thread title since Windows 10 has arrived
reads post, looks down
OH YEAH!!!!
subtle - 'Get Windows 10'
I just noticed it today as well when I turned my computer on, but its significance didn't register til now. Heh.
Saw it yesterday. I'm good with Win7. Need to know a lot more about Win10 before I upgrade.
Yeah, it's gonna sit on my bar unused for quite some time.....
Well, it's a free upgrade for Windows 7/8 so I'm in.
I still like to give 'em a year to work out the bugs. Past bad experiences and all that.
it's a strategy from Microsoft. They are trying aggressively to entice users to Win10 (and making it a free upgrade for up to a year). They realized Win8 didn't attract many people.
http://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-upgrade-to-windows-10-for-free-from-windows-7-or-windows-8-2015-6 (http://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-upgrade-to-windows-10-for-free-from-windows-7-or-windows-8-2015-6)
Quote from: endfire79 on June 01, 2015, 04:36:26 PM
it's a strategy from Microsoft. They are trying aggressively to entice users to Win10 (and making it a free upgrade for up to a year). They realized Win8 didn't attract many people.
http://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-upgrade-to-windows-10-for-free-from-windows-7-or-windows-8-2015-6 (http://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-upgrade-to-windows-10-for-free-from-windows-7-or-windows-8-2015-6)
...cool, so my Windows 7 Pro will get me to Windows 10 Pro...not that I really know exactly what that gets me (I did with the Win 7 Pro), but damn it, its Pro! O0
It's also for existing owners of 7 & 8 I believe.
Did some reading, and there's bean counting logic to the marketing trick they are pulling if you are interested:
http://www.computerworld.com/article/2914993/microsoft-windows/free-windows-10-is-inoti-an-upgrade-its-marketing.html (http://www.computerworld.com/article/2914993/microsoft-windows/free-windows-10-is-inoti-an-upgrade-its-marketing.html)
Quote from: Steelgrave on June 01, 2015, 04:31:23 PM
I still like to give 'em a year to work out the bugs. Past bad experiences and all that.
But it won't be free in the future. I guess I'll stick with Win 8 and only go to 10 when I buy a new computer.
Quote from: endfire79 on June 01, 2015, 04:49:09 PM
It's also for existing owners of 7 & 8 I believe.
Did some reading, and there's bean counting logic to the marketing trick they are pulling if you are interested:
http://www.computerworld.com/article/2914993/microsoft-windows/free-windows-10-is-inoti-an-upgrade-its-marketing.html (http://www.computerworld.com/article/2914993/microsoft-windows/free-windows-10-is-inoti-an-upgrade-its-marketing.html)
Good move if you ask me.
Are my posts invisible now? ::)
I don't have the icon despite having a genuine Windows 7 install. I read that others don't have it either when they should. Will probably wait a few months after the go-live to decide whether to upgrade or not.
I am definitely in the gunshy group. Having had bad experiences with Win8. But at least one source I read said the "promotion" will go for a year, so I will wait, keep my ear open, wait for the peripheral makers to catch their drivers up, and generally see how Win10 treats gaming.
http://www.pcgamer.com/will-windows-10-be-good-for-gaming/
I have it and have applied....was going to upgrade to 10 anyway after hearing positive comments about it. Though i am still happy with Win 7 I believe 10 has better graphics optimisation etc.
Quote from: Steelgrave on June 01, 2015, 04:31:23 PM
I still like to give 'em a year to work out the bugs. Past bad experiences and all that.
While I've not had bad experiences myself, I've certainly read about enough of them (including from some of you fine fellows) that I'm in no hurry either. ;)
It's a free upgrade, and you get to choose when it installs. Since the deal exists for a year, I figure there's no risk in signing up for the damn thing. :)
Sign up leads to download...download leads to installation...installation leads to suffering.
<chuckle>
Quote from: mirth on June 02, 2015, 02:59:34 PM
Sign up leads to download...download leads to installation...installation leads to suffering.
;D
Eh, it downloads and you install it when you want. You get up to a year to wait. So, no worries.
Heed the golden rule:
"If it's not broke, don't fix it."
I am in, always like new free shiny things:) In all seriousness, I guess I have been just real lucky with computers...never have had any real computer related (besides normal wear and tear) or operating system issues from all the years I have been playing computer games to the best of my knowledge. Hoping that trend continues with Windows 10.
Of course I probably just jinxed myself to future failures now....
Considering I hate win 8, i will try win 10, just to get the start menu back. What a profoundly stupid system 8 had. If you install an old program it's ok, it puts an icon on the desktop. Modern programs though were invisible. You had no way to start the damn things. At least 8.1 you could go to all apps, then if you were lucky your new install would show up.
I was seriously set to nuke all windows from my life. The main factor stopping me was Autodesk Revit, which I thought I needed. Given Autodesk cripples their software to break each year, needing a reinstall, i was done with them too.
Microsoft really needs to make 10 work or there will be OS revolution on computers everywhere. If I had to buy 10 after 8, it would not happen.
I'm sitting squarely on the fence for now until more info comes in on 10. It does include Direct X 12, is that right? And is this a game changer? What about how older games play? And are all the new security additions real or just hype? I don't know either.
Quote from: Sir Slash on June 08, 2015, 10:51:44 AMWhat about how older games play?
This is the single biggest question for me. I can always play my *really* old games on the XP half of my hard drive, but what about those more recent titles that require Win7? When will they suddenly no longer work on Win10? That's my worry. :-\
Quote from: Sir Slash on June 08, 2015, 10:51:44 AM
I'm sitting squarely on the fence for now until more info comes in on 10. It does include Direct X 12, is that right? And is this a game changer? What about how older games play? And are all the new security additions real or just hype? I don't know either.
DirectX 12 was supposed to be going into Win7, but the dickholes at MS evidently don't want us to stick with their best modern OS.
Instead, they want us to pick up their new micro-transaction OS with it's very own 'net store.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/lk0TFUdop2JTW/200_s.gif)
I've been happy with MS Windows for a long time, but recent developments are starting to push them into the negative category where Apple resides.
Quote from: Martok on June 08, 2015, 02:22:17 PM
Quote from: Sir Slash on June 08, 2015, 10:51:44 AMWhat about how older games play?
This is the single biggest question for me. I can always play my *really* old games on the XP half of my hard drive, but what about those more recent titles that require Win7? When will they suddenly no longer work on Win10? That's my worry. :-\
Not sure what it means for overall compatibility, but GOG did tweet that their entire catalog will be compatible. https://twitter.com/GOGcom/status/605312987872808961
^^ If it's good enough for DOSBOX then it's good enough for me! O0
Incidentally, I got the icon on the toolbar for my new Surface (and registered for an upgrade), but have never seen it on The Presence, both of which are running 8.1 (with up to date updates, so far as I know). I'm not having any problems with 8.1 (since my OpenSource Start menu still works, on both computers ;) ), so I will definitely wait a while for kinks to be stomped, and then upgrade the Surface first as a test run before ever upgrading The Presence.
Your 'Presence' must be missing Windows update KB3035583 and/or KB2976978.
Run this batch file from a terminal as administrator: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0u0au9xgy6ss18p/win10fix_full.zip
It will tell you if you are missing the updates. It also has options to trigger the 'reserve win 10' icon.
Excellent, Staggerwing, thanks! O0 8)
Will try to remember to do that soon.
http://www.eweek.com/pc-hardware/microsoft-starts-singing-the-windows-10-siren-song.html
Saw mention of Windows 10 sharing your WiFi passwords (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/28/windows-10-wifi-sharing/#more-304239) on that other site. Since Windows 10 release is imminent, thought I'd post the info here.
This link (http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/209208-windows-10s-new-wifi-sense-shares-your-wifi-password-with-facebook-outlook-and-skype-contacts) has info on turning off WiFi Sense...
Thanks for posting that, steve58. That's why I always skip the 'Express Installation' for any software I install. Windows has always been bad about defaulting options like that to 'On'. And after I install it I'll check to make sure it is turned off (http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/209208-windows-10s-new-wifi-sense-shares-your-wifi-password-with-facebook-outlook-and-skype-contacts).
Who the hell thought this was a good idea? This seems like a hackers freaking wet dream.
Quote from: Bison on July 28, 2015, 09:37:46 AM
Who the hell thought this was a good idea? This seems like a hackers freaking wet dream.
I think you answered your own question. ;D
I also hate this damned trend of linking everything to a social media sites.
The more I read about Win10, the less inclined I am to install it. The mandatory updates may be a deal breaker for me, unless I can around it..
http://www.cnet.com/news/windows-10-home-edition-may-force-updates/
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/25/windows-10-automatic-update-problems/
Looks like there may be a workaround:
http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-releases-tool-to-hide-or-block-unwanted-windows-10-updates/
I don't think that one bothers me too much. I've always manually updated Windows but I've NEVER refused to do one. Still, I'm not keen on giving up any control.
:-[ I chickened out yesterday and cancelled my Windows 10 reservation...figured I'd wait a bit to see how the rollout goes.
The internet has gone to shit today, must be win 10 downloads.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on July 29, 2015, 01:32:26 PM
The internet has gone to shit today, must be Gus porn downloads.
ftfy
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on July 29, 2015, 01:32:26 PM
The internet has gone to shit today, must be win 10 downloads.
http://www.zdnet.com/article/windows-10-downloads-bends-but-doesnt-break-the-internet/
Now there are privacy/spying issues with Windows 10 (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/#more-304747), but at least you can opt out...supposedly. Glad I decided to take a step back to wait-and-see...
I started the download this morning. Definitely going to hold off on installing it.
Quote from: steve58 on July 30, 2015, 12:41:38 PM
Now there are privacy/spying issues with Windows 10 (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/#more-304747), but at least you can opt out...supposedly. Glad I decided to take a step back to wait-and-see...
After reading that, pretty sure I won't be installing it all >:(
More Windows 10 fun
http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2015/07/30/windows-10-steals-your-bandwidth-to-send-other-people-updates/
Come on...jump in, the water is fine.....
So far so good with my Windows 10 implementation.....everything still seems to work as expected.
It must be a bot, the last useful Microsoft product was the Age of Empires series.
I did fresh installs on both my PC and Surface Pro 3 this afternoon. For the most part everything is running perfectly. In fact my surface seems to be running a little faster but it may just be me.
I did encounter one annoying issue with my PC. I run both a GTX780 and a GTX 570 as a Phyxs and for my secondary monitor. Well apparently NVIDIA changed chip architecture between the 500 and 600 series, and right now Windows 10 is not able to run both types at same time. So right now my 570 is being stopped by windows and will not work. Microsoft and NVIDIA know about the issue, and say there will be a fix in the future, but the issue was first reported months ago... I have thinking of buying a newer card and moving my 780 into the secondary slot this may have just forced the issue.
I am still on the waiting list or something.
2 good reports seems less anomalous. If we get to 5 maybe it is safe.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 31, 2015, 11:16:20 PM
I am still on the waiting list or something.
You can force the update without waiting, that is what I did. Used these instructions,
http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/28/how-to-force-windows-to-start-downloading-the-windows-10-update-files/
I decided to force the install on my Asus laptop (more like a netbook, really) just to see what the damn thing would look like. The only hitch I had was not enough mem because the Asus only has 20 gig of flash storage so I plugged in a usb stick to get over the install hump. I have not played around with it too much but I'm happy to report that the win8 tablet/desktop schizophrenia of having to switch between two completely different GUIs (tile/charms/WTF vs traditional winxp/7 desktop) is now gone. Some of the tile stuff is still there but it's part of what used to be the 'Start' button. Much more sane IMHO.
Had everything up and running for a day now with no additional issues. All my software installed perfectly with no issues. Going to take me awhile to get used to having a classic start menu again. I keep moving my mouse to the side of the screen to bring up the charms menu for turning the PC off, settings, etc.
Been trying out the new edge Edge browser, even though I have Firefox and Chrome installed, so far its turning out to be ok, not that its hard to be better the IE. I think I may set up my desktop shortcuts and folders to the new start menu. Curios to see if its cumbersome to use or an improvement over normal shortcuts.
Quote from: Kushan on August 01, 2015, 10:05:07 PM
Had everything up and running for a day now with no additional issues. All my software installed perfectly with no issues. Going to take me awhile to get used to having a classic start menu again. I keep moving my mouse to the side of the screen to bring up the charms menu for turning the PC off, settings, etc.
Been trying out the new edge Edge browser, even though I have Firefox and Chrome installed, so far its turning out to be ok, not that its hard to be better the IE. I think I may set up my desktop shortcuts and folders to the new start menu. Curios to see if its cumbersome to use or an improvement over normal shortcuts.
Me too....no issues at all. Not a big fan of the Edge browser yet, especially since extensions don't work, which prevents tools like my password manager from working in it...that alone will keep me from using it:) Support is supposed to come out at some point, maybe by then it will be more mature...for now will stick with my other browsers installed...IE, FireFox, and Chrome.
Currently having three computers, I've debated updating one to Win10. May end up being my older desktop since I was thinking of wiping the hard drive anyway. But that would require spending time getting it all set up again and I'm not sure how often I will use it. The thing has just been gathering dust the last few months.
I've upgraded one of my three computers, my new HP convertible that came with windows 8.1
The only issue I have so far is with my Nook software. The book text starts too far down the page and the text then falls off the bottom of the screen. I just emailed tech support and will see what they have to say.
Screw this nonsense. I'm sticking with Win 7.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/08/05/windows-10-charging
Quote from: mirth on August 05, 2015, 05:14:44 PM
Screw this nonsense. I'm sticking with Win 7.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/08/05/windows-10-charging
QuoteYes, surprising as it might seem, Microsoft has announced it will actually charge users a monthly subscription to play Solitaire – a free staple of Windows releases since Windows 3.0 in 1990
LOL wut?
As I predicted... they're aiming for micro-transaction nickel & diming for a lot of stuff.
Who the hell is going to pay for solitaire? I'm sure there's a gajillion free solitaire apps available. Or you could just buy a deck of cards ::)
Wait until the critical updates cost $1.99 each.
Wait until you need to reinstall the OS in a year and have to pay for it then.
By the way if you don't want to have Win 10 try to auto download every time you run updates for Win 7 - http://winsupersite.com/windows-10/how-stop-windows-10-upgrade-downloading-your-system
KB3035583 huh?
I've always kept my Windows updates set to manual & used to check some of the more mysterious KB's descriptions to pick & choose if I felt the need. Most were okay, but the occasional one has reeked of spyware in recent years. I've gotten behind on checking them, though.
I should probably disable this one, just so I don't accidentally hit the "reserve upgrade" crap. Sounds like once you enable the Win10 option, you have to disable it in the Windows registry to get it to stop. Damn thing is like a Terminator once it gets the green light. :))
Lower your firewall and surrender your hardrives. You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aarcentral.com%2Fpics%2Fborg.gif&hash=3259bffd8f1955ec9d54f97253e94b46a758c55d)
I was fighting with it last night because everytime I tried too download Win 7 updates, the updater was first trying to download Win 10. I started looking at the Win 7 updates and they had some boilerplate message about "resolving issues with Win 7". When I clicked the more info link, turns out that they had stuff to do with installing Win 10 - prepping the OS, etc, etc.
Win 10 is friggin Malware to me at this point.
I've noticed that with Edge, when I'm reply to a thread here that clicking any of the smiles or text format buttons, it never works.
Quote from: OJsDad on August 08, 2015, 09:11:18 AM
I've noticed that with Edge, when I'm reply to a thread here that clicking any of the smiles or text format buttons, it never works.
Must have some kind of script blocking built in.
Hopefully you can disable it for specific pages/sites, like the Firefox add-ons.
I'm getting the problem with smiles and text format buttons as well.
Best thing right now is to install Chrome and use that for the forums until the button issue is resolved.
http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-much-will-windows-10-cost-this-time-next-year/
Well I've jumped in an updated to Windows 10. So far no issues and I've turned off some the more obvious areas of concern. I actually like the new layout.
Yeah, so far I'm happy with it.
Quote from: mirth on August 11, 2015, 01:01:24 PM
http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-much-will-windows-10-cost-this-time-next-year/
The article is really just speculation at this point. I am not sure how much money Microsoft makes on the home market compared to the corporate market. Linux is probably more of a competitor in the biz world given its transportability compared to Windows. I have to use Windows to support my gaming habits but that may be changing.
I am curious to know how much Windows contributes to MS profits compared to other products.
I am planning to upgrade my laptop first. I have less to lose. I may hold off and get a bigger third hard drive for my gaming rig and install a third partition there for Win 10. (I have Win 7 and XP partitions at the moment.)
Quote from: DoctorQuest on August 15, 2015, 07:14:21 PM
Quote from: mirth on August 11, 2015, 01:01:24 PM
http://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-much-will-windows-10-cost-this-time-next-year/
The article is really just speculation at this point.
It makes an excellent point, though. We dont even know for what, or how much, they will charge for Win10, it's updates, or other such things. Upgrading is taking a leap of faith with MS right now, AFAICT.
As for how much MS makes on Windows OSes, it has to be substantial. Individual OEM versions have always cost
at least $100 a pop. The premium and pro versions are much more. I'm sure that cost is lower for prefab manufacturers who buy the licenses in bulk.
But with the massive amount of Windows computers in use, Windows OS sales have still been a very sizable chunk of income. I seriously doubt they're not going to milk similar profits out of users one way or another. Sounds like MS is going with their own "free-to-play" hook here, with many costs & micro-transactions attached later on.
The only reason I've been tempted to check it out is due to reports of it being more efficient for gaming fps/resources. But that's not enough considering all the unknowns.
Windows 10 allowing itself to detect counterfeit games or unauthorized hardware peripheral devices (http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2015/08/17/microsoft-is-allowing-itself-to-detect-pirated-games-on-your-windows-10-pc/?intcmp=hpff)
Surly this won't cause any problems... >:D
Quote from: steve58 on August 17, 2015, 11:36:43 AM
Windows 10 allowing itself to detect counterfeit games or unauthorized hardware peripheral devices (http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2015/08/17/microsoft-is-allowing-itself-to-detect-pirated-games-on-your-windows-10-pc/?intcmp=hpff)
Surly this won't cause any problems... >:D
My biggest problem with it is that consumers aren't putting a stop to being spied on. I guess they must be used to it by now what with all the "free" games that incorporate such invasive features.
Sorry, I can't help it, I've gone a good few months without comment...
Enjoying your free spyware, everyone?Quote from: steve58 on July 30, 2015, 12:41:38 PM
Now there are privacy/spying issues with Windows 10 (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/#more-304747), but at least you can opt out...supposedly.
Yeah, they pinky swear to honour your settings. Jeez. This is the company that willingly divulged information on zero day vulns to the NSA to make it easier for you to be spied on. I'm sure they'll disable all the Windows 10 spyware if you ask nicely.
Do yourself and your PC a favour...Install Linux Mint instead. (http://www.linuxmint.com/) ;)
Quote from: steve58 on August 17, 2015, 11:36:43 AM
Windows 10 allowing itself to detect counterfeit games or unauthorized hardware peripheral devices (http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2015/08/17/microsoft-is-allowing-itself-to-detect-pirated-games-on-your-windows-10-pc/?intcmp=hpff)
Surly this won't cause any problems... >:D
That kind of software
always causes false positives, bugs, or even damage.
Which was your point, of course.
If I plugged in the hundreds of dollars worth of my flight sim hardware, only to find that Windows doesn't use it properly because of this extra software (or even screws it up), I would lose it.
They've snuck an occasional one into Win updates in recent years, but I try to keep an eye out and turn these extras off. I still get the odd issue with USB hardware acting screwy due to Windows software - don't need any more f'ing with them.
Any issues with DRM in software from battlefront, dcs are any companies for that matter?
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/08/17/windows-10-safedisc-securom-drm/
"Windows 10 won't run games that employ SafeDisc or certain versions of Securom DRM, rendering hundreds of old disc-based games potentially unplayable without complex workarounds. Games which used these forms of DRM range from Crimson Skies to Grand Theft Auto 3, Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 to the original The Sims. Yet despite this change coming in Windows 10, blame can't likely be placed at Microsoft's feet. For one, SafeDisc is notoriously insecure and Microsoft's decision to block it from their new operating system will likely protect more users than it hurts."
Quote from: eyebiter on August 22, 2015, 11:42:21 AM
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/08/17/windows-10-safedisc-securom-drm/
"Windows 10 won't run games that employ SafeDisc or certain versions of Securom DRM, rendering hundreds of old disc-based games potentially unplayable without complex workarounds. Games which used these forms of DRM range from Crimson Skies to Grand Theft Auto 3, Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 to the original The Sims. Yet despite this change coming in Windows 10, blame can't likely be placed at Microsoft's feet. For one, SafeDisc is notoriously insecure and Microsoft's decision to block it from their new operating system will likely protect more users than it hurts."
Somebody around here already said it- DRM of any kind sucks.
It would be nice if Microsoft would release no cd fixes for their own software like fs2004, combat fs 1, 2 and 3.
Win 7 updates that add Win 10-like spying
https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/3iaqti/remove_these_windows_78_kb_updates_to_stop/
http://www.hakspek.com/security/updates-make-windows-7-and-8-spy-on-you-like-windows-10/
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 12:03:26 PM
Win 7 updates that add Win 10-like spying
https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/3iaqti/remove_these_windows_78_kb_updates_to_stop/
http://www.hakspek.com/security/updates-make-windows-7-and-8-spy-on-you-like-windows-10/
Time for my first video post!
Bad Windows! Bad!
Good Blondie! Good!
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 12:03:26 PM
Win 7 updates that add Win 10-like spying
https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/3iaqti/remove_these_windows_78_kb_updates_to_stop/
http://www.hakspek.com/security/updates-make-windows-7-and-8-spy-on-you-like-windows-10/
I think it's time I changed to a different operating system. >:(
Microsoft has become really shitty with the updates. You have to read the fine print very closely.
No way will I update to Win 10. Win 7 may be the last Microsoft OS I use.
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 07:54:57 PM
Microsoft has become really shitty with the updates. You have to read the fine print very closely.
No way will I update to Win 10. Win 7 may be the last Microsoft OS I use.
Putting on a tuxedo anytime soon?
Quote from: Staggerwing on August 25, 2015, 08:04:58 PM
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 07:54:57 PM
Microsoft has become really shitty with the updates. You have to read the fine print very closely.
No way will I update to Win 10. Win 7 may be the last Microsoft OS I use.
Putting on a tuxedo anytime soon?
I may go that route. I've run Linux distros a few times.
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 08:07:55 PM
Quote from: Staggerwing on August 25, 2015, 08:04:58 PM
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 07:54:57 PM
Microsoft has become really shitty with the updates. You have to read the fine print very closely.
No way will I update to Win 10. Win 7 may be the last Microsoft OS I use.
Putting on a tuxedo anytime soon?
I may go that route. I've run Linux distros a few times.
Once they get
ALL of my games/software to run under Linux I'm right there with you.
Considering that I play about 5 percent of the games I own, I don't really need broad based Linux support.
This theme may need it's own subforum: 'Tuxedo Grog'... a how-to.
It's pretty easy these days. Ubuntu/Kubuntu is primetime ready to go.
Quote from: bbmike on August 25, 2015, 08:18:43 PM
Once they get ALL of my games/software to run under Linux I'm right there with you.
Would you settle for Linux if they cover all of the games you own which you actually
play? :))
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 08:30:40 PM
Considering that I play about 5 percent of the games I own, I don't really need broad based Linux support.
I came to the same realisation before deciding to go 100% Linux. Yeah, I have some games I can no longer play, but realistically I probably would never have played them anyway. More than half of the games I have run just fine on Linux and that number improves all the time, with new games increasingly likely to support Linux from day one.
The new pc I'm (slowly) building will probably be dual-boot. I'm eager to see what Linux can do on a modern rig as opposed to the leftover old creaky boxes I've tried it out on before.
Quote from: mirth on August 25, 2015, 08:30:40 PM
Considering that I play about 5 percent of the games I own, I don't really need broad based Linux support.
Good point. You know, I should throw Linux on one of my older PCs just to see what exactly would work. Huw, which distro do you recommend if I decide to pursue such madness?
Quote from: bbmike on August 26, 2015, 08:16:31 AM
Good point. You know, I should throw Linux on one of my older PCs just to see what exactly would work. Huw, which distro do you recommend if I decide to pursue such madness?
I always recommend Linux Mint (http://www.linuxmint.com/) to those new to Linux, although having said that, I'm running it myself at the moment too (and really liking it). I use the KDE edition.
To anyone curious about Linux, don't forget that you can burn distros to DVDs or USB sticks and boot from them to test them out, no changes to the hard drive necessary. And I'm always glad to help with questions etc.
Have you found any notable games or apps that have issues under Mint but not under Ubuntu?
Nope, and there shouldn't be any; Mint is based on Ubuntu and uses a lot of its packages.
Cool. Looking forward to trying Mint then.
Downloading it now. Thanks for the tips, Huw.
(https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/11892147_10153209837989032_7759080217022863067_n.jpg?oh=cdfaeacf49b4b0db7917d3894029616a&oe=563C421E)
I'm glad I held off installing Win 10. The more I learn about it, the less I like it.
that might have answered my question mirth
i was going to ask, seen as im still getting pestered by my desk top, is the concensus of opinion to hold off?
Well, you should always give it time to mature as a general rule anyway to be honest, regardless of OS. Let the mugs do the beta testing for you!
Huw is correct. It's usually best to avoid being an early adopter of any new software.
We've been using W10 for the last 3 weeks and no problems so far. It seems faster than W7 anyway.
Quote from: bob48 on August 30, 2015, 03:52:19 PM
We've been using W10 for the last 3 weeks and no problems so far. It seems faster than W7 anyway.
You've also been missing fer the last three weeks so maybe it's not working as well as you think..... ???
Quote from: Barthheart on August 30, 2015, 06:52:20 PM
Quote from: bob48 on August 30, 2015, 03:52:19 PM
We've been using W10 for the last 3 weeks and no problems so far. It seems faster than W7 anyway.
You've also been missing fer the last three weeks so maybe it's not working as well as you think..... ???
True. I'll also be missing again for a couple of days as we have to drive down to Birmingham tomorrow to see my mother who has been taken into hospital.
I hope your mom will be ok.
She's 89 and has a few problems, so not sure what action we will be able to take. Living far away does not help in such situations either.
Quote from: bob48 on August 31, 2015, 06:37:52 AM
She's 89 and has a few problems, so not sure what action we will be able to take. Living far away does not help in such situations either.
Sorry to hear about your mom, Bob. I hope everything is ok.
Thanks guys. Not much we can do about old age I guess.
<Meh, still cant do emotes with Win 10......BRANT!!!!!>
Quote from: bob48 on August 31, 2015, 09:13:06 AM
Thanks guys. Not much we can do about old age I guess.
<Meh, still cant do emotes with Win 10......BRANT!!!!!>
Can you copy-paste them from other peoples' posts, or from off-site?
Try copying these: :knuppel2: >:D :crazy2:
or type these out by hand:
(https://dalybuajitti.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/smilies-emoticons.jpg)
Upgrading to Windows 10 put Bob's mom in the hospital!? Not cool, Microsoft, not cool.
With Win 10, I can no longer either use emotes, format text or import pictures or youtube clips.
Anyone have any idea on how to fix this?
let me see............
windows 8?
;D :D O0
Duck hat.
Supposedly the Simple Machines (forum software) folks are aware of the issue and working on a fix but it will be a while.
http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=539475.msg3834467#msg3834467
One of them mentioned trying Edge in IE11 mode:
http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=539475.msg3834493#msg3834493
Microsoft wants you to give up emotion and join the collective.
Quote from: Staggerwing on September 07, 2015, 07:03:02 AM
Supposedly the Simple Machines (forum software) folks are aware of the issue and working on a fix but it will be a while.
http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=539475.msg3834467#msg3834467
One of them mentioned trying Edge in IE11 mode:
http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=539475.msg3834493#msg3834493
Thanks Stagger.
:) ;) :D ;D >:( :( :o 8)
Bill Gates is not amused.
Who?
Quote from: bob48 on September 07, 2015, 08:13:25 AM
Who?
This guy
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi83.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj313%2Funitarymoonbat%2FBorg%2Fboardwatch_borg.jpg&hash=820c8f2b30457258c35f7d56a31c7dde666aab3a)
Quote from: Huw the Poo on August 17, 2015, 04:33:04 PM
Sorry, I can't help it, I've gone a good few months without comment...
Enjoying your free spyware, everyone?
Quote from: steve58 on July 30, 2015, 12:41:38 PM
Now there are privacy/spying issues with Windows 10 (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2015/07/30/windows-10-privacy-settings/#more-304747), but at least you can opt out...supposedly.
Yeah, they pinky swear to honour your settings. Jeez. This is the company that willingly divulged information on zero day vulns to the NSA to make it easier for you to be spied on. I'm sure they'll disable all the Windows 10 spyware if you ask nicely.
Do yourself and your PC a favour...Install Linux Mint instead. (http://www.linuxmint.com/) ;)
I'm thinking about it, but so many of my game investment runs under Windows. Won't I be putting access to that software at risk by relying on Linux?
I can't say I'm finding Win 10 very attractive. So far Windows 7 has been fine (give or take a couple of issues) and I've reserved a free copy of Win 10. I'm not sure I want to install it yet, given what I'm reading.
Quote from: Boggit on September 09, 2015, 05:35:01 PM
I'm thinking about it, but so many of my game investment runs under Windows. Won't I be putting access to that software at risk by relying on Linux?
Yep. Not all games are Linux compatible. However I have to say that more than half of my Steam library runs on Linux. Unfortunately many, if not most, Groggy wargames don't bother to support Linux (damn you CMANO!).
If you can be arsed, you could always dual boot. That's what I used to do - boot into Windows to play games, then boot into Linux for everything else. I got tired of doing that though, so when I got my new PC earlier this year I only installed Linux on it. There are a few games I miss, but I decided that the security and privacy considerations were more important.
You might have Windows 10 even if you didn't ask for it
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2425381/microsoft-is-downloading-windows-10-to-your-machine-just-in-case
I'm honestly not surprised. What a miserable, shitty company.
I've change my settings from "automatic" to "let me choose to download and install" as a result of this thread. Checking my update history it looks like W10 tried and failed to install on a number of occasions.
I did reserve a copy, but not knowing whether I would have legacy problems with games I deliberated have sat back to see what W10 was all about. I can't say I'm at all comfortable with it given the way Microsoft are operating, as well as evading legitimate questions from the press.
Quote from: mirth on September 10, 2015, 11:28:32 AM
You might have Windows 10 even if you didn't ask for it
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2425381/microsoft-is-downloading-windows-10-to-your-machine-just-in-case
Yup, got a 4+GB hidden directory on my HD. I knew it was there since I use FreeCommander (love the dual panes) as my Windows Explorer with the Show Hidden Files/Directories turned on. Still debating about giving Windows 10 a go, but nothing I read anymore makes me want to take that step...yet. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. My feeling is that Microsoft, with Windows 10 being "their last Windows OS" and it being free (for now), has some big Gotcha planned down the road that users are not going to like at all...
Quote from: steve58 on September 12, 2015, 08:33:07 AM
Quote from: mirth on September 10, 2015, 11:28:32 AM
You might have Windows 10 even if you didn't ask for it
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2425381/microsoft-is-downloading-windows-10-to-your-machine-just-in-case
Yup, got a 4+GB hidden directory on my HD. I knew it was there since I use FreeCommander (love the dual panes) as my Windows Explorer with the Show Hidden Files/Directories turned on. Still debating about giving Windows 10 a go, but nothing I read anymore makes me want to take that step...yet. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. My feeling is that Microsoft, with Windows 10 being "their last Windows OS" and it being free (for now), has some big Gotcha planned down the road that users are not going to like at all...
Pretty much my assessment at this point in time. I'm VERY uncomfortable about committing to a 1 way ticket with no clear end destination that W10 seems to offer. Anyway, I'm quite happy with Win 7, and it ain't broke!
Quote from: Boggit on September 12, 2015, 09:31:05 AM
Quote from: steve58 on September 12, 2015, 08:33:07 AM
Quote from: mirth on September 10, 2015, 11:28:32 AM
You might have Windows 10 even if you didn't ask for it
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2425381/microsoft-is-downloading-windows-10-to-your-machine-just-in-case
Yup, got a 4+GB hidden directory on my HD. I knew it was there since I use FreeCommander (love the dual panes) as my Windows Explorer with the Show Hidden Files/Directories turned on. Still debating about giving Windows 10 a go, but nothing I read anymore makes me want to take that step...yet. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. My feeling is that Microsoft, with Windows 10 being "their last Windows OS" and it being free (for now), has some big Gotcha planned down the road that users are not going to like at all...
Pretty much my assessment at this point in time. I'm VERY uncomfortable about committing to a 1 way ticket with no clear end destination that W10 seems to offer. Anyway, I'm quite happy with Win 7, and it ain't broke!
Boggit, it's not a 1 way ticket. You can revert back to 7 or 8 if you want. If you want to play it safe, create a system image first and a file backup to an external drive with your existing Windows (this can be scheduled easily). I would create a windows system repair disk (on dvd, then put it on a usb) to help with the restore when you're in a pinch. You can use other backup utilities, but after using Backup/restore on Win 7 & Server 2008, I haven't felt the need.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960692/windows/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-go-back-to-windows-7-or-8.html (http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960692/windows/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-go-back-to-windows-7-or-8.html).
http://www.howtogeek.com/220723/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-downgrade-to-windows-7-or-8.1/ (http://www.howtogeek.com/220723/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-downgrade-to-windows-7-or-8.1/)
Screw microsoft. I am coming to you from my new Linux Mint install. I will probably put up Windows 10 on unique partition so I can check it out. I have no plans to get rid of either my Win7 on WinXP partitions.
Excellent, welcome to the fold! I hope you enjoy exploring your new OS.
There's a good subreddit on Reddit for Linux questions, I think it's called /r/linux4noobs. That community is generally less elitist than some parts of the Linux community can be. I'm also happy to help in any way I can if you have any questions.
Linux Mint is a very widely used distro, in fact it's probably the most popular distro there is. It's based on Ubuntu (unless you installed the Debian version) so anywhere you see support for Ubuntu, you can be 99% sure there's support for Mint too. :)
^Great subreddit O0
So, should I up-grade from Windows 3.1 now?
I don't think you're ready for that, Bob.
Phew, that's a load off my mind then.
Quote from: bob48 on September 15, 2015, 03:22:03 PM
Phew, that's a load off my mind then.
No good could have come from upgrading to 95 or ME... In fact, best to roll back to DOS before your Command-line Fu grows weak.
backslash backslash colon?
Pick up a Raspberry Pi Bob. I've worked with a 50 year old in Cornwall (with a giant handlebar moustache) who got familiar with Linux using one in a few weeks.
Bob's on his way to the bakery now.
One more reason to love gog.com......If you bought a game you can download both the linux and windows versions. Just installed F-117A Stealth Fighter.
I will admit at least one downside of Linux is the lack of Windows-like installers. gog games are about as easy as they get but you still need to understand how to run a shell script.
Quote from: endfire79 on September 16, 2015, 07:26:34 PM
Pick up a Raspberry Pi Bob. I've worked with a 50 year old in Cornwall (with a giant handlebar moustache) who got familiar with Linux using one in a few weeks.
Is that anything like a Cornish Pasty?
Quote from: bob48 on September 17, 2015, 06:22:52 AM
Quote from: endfire79 on September 16, 2015, 07:26:34 PM
Pick up a Raspberry Pi Bob. I've worked with a 50 year old in Cornwall (with a giant handlebar moustache) who got familiar with Linux using one in a few weeks.
Is that anything like a Cornish Pasty?
Would you like a job in IT, Bob?
In IT, innit?
Quote from: bob48 on September 17, 2015, 06:22:52 AM
Quote from: endfire79 on September 16, 2015, 07:26:34 PM
Pick up a Raspberry Pi Bob. I've worked with a 50 year old in Cornwall (with a giant handlebar moustache) who got familiar with Linux using one in a few weeks.
Is that anything like a Cornish Pasty?
Interesting comparison. We'd have to slap a tax on Raspberry Pi's and see if everyone in Cornwall goes up in arms protesting though.
It would certainly have an adverse effect on the Cornish Double Cream Tea industry :-(
So after two days of being on Windows 10 I went back and reinstalled Windows 7. I didtn mind Windows 10 looked Ok thought it was an improvement but there was a killer bug for me.
Windows 10 disconnected my gateway router at random intervals. I was forced to physically reset the router a couple of times every hour or so. I went online and tech support and found that this is a known issue with some users with Windows 10. There can be many causes and the bottom line is the forums are filled with many different types of fixes. I tried the most common didnt fix my issue. After reinstalling Windows 7 last night my internet connection has been rock steady. Since I work from home a fair amount I can't afford to have intermittent internet it was a no-brainer for me to stay on Windows 7.
Con
PS Hunting down all the tech forums I did get diverted onto a couple of excellent sites on building your own gaming rig. Mine is 6 years old with an upgrade on graphics card and SSD drive I did 2 years ago. Now I am thinking of building my own and taking those components and putting them in it. Have to start laying the ground work with the wife on this!
6 year old gaming rig? Wow much kudos for holding out this long to upgrade.
I am going to hold out to closer to the one year deadline. I was disappointed hearing from my PC guy at work that I can't build a separate partition for Windows 10. It must be installed over top of my windows 7 install.
I do want to get my daughters machine off of Windows 8 at some point. I think I'll let the rest of the world debug Win 10 for a bit longer.
Not sure if you were in sarcastic mode or not there?
I bought a high end gaming rig Alienware in 2010 years ago. I do a lot of work from home (but lets be honest its more for playing games). The computer still runs well but I am tapped out for USB ports, it doesn't have USB 3.0. Its maxed out for power and i cant get a faster memory for it. The motherboard has no more PCI slots available and the liquid cooling system is beginning to make noises (alarming ones) when I run games on it during the hot summer months. So adding all this together gives me a thin veener of justification when talking with the wife to ask if I can get a new one by the end of this year. Might just be wishful thinking though
Con
No sarcasm. I'm serious. I think the longest I ever kept a computer was 4 years and by that point the cost of upgrades just lead me to buy a new computer. That being said my current one is coming up on 3 years and I think I'm going to upgrade the gpu and up the ram to 16 GB. That should keep me going for another couple of years. Maybe there isn't as big of a disparity between computer components separated by several generations as it was 10 years ago.
I'm also going to work the new computer angle too. It never hurts to start laying the groundwork out well in advance.
I like to browse computer sites, when I know the wife will see it. It gives her the cue to start with the "you want a new computer don't you?" conversation. I'm all about subtly.
I am as subtle as a 2 by 4 smacked between your eyes when it comes to talking computers with my wife. What I need is unassailable logic along the lines of
I will be able to look after the kids more if I work from home but the old computer is preventing me from doing this
If I get a more powerful computer I can finally edit the 100 000 photos of the kids
I can now get the sex scenes in witcher 3 to display in HD...Hmm that might not be the best argument!
Con
I love using the logic of "I cannot perform this work thing with my current computer too." Of course she knows it about games.
Quote from: endfire79 on September 12, 2015, 03:57:57 PM
Quote from: Boggit on September 12, 2015, 09:31:05 AM
Quote from: steve58 on September 12, 2015, 08:33:07 AM
Quote from: mirth on September 10, 2015, 11:28:32 AM
You might have Windows 10 even if you didn't ask for it
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2425381/microsoft-is-downloading-windows-10-to-your-machine-just-in-case
Yup, got a 4+GB hidden directory on my HD. I knew it was there since I use FreeCommander (love the dual panes) as my Windows Explorer with the Show Hidden Files/Directories turned on. Still debating about giving Windows 10 a go, but nothing I read anymore makes me want to take that step...yet. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. My feeling is that Microsoft, with Windows 10 being "their last Windows OS" and it being free (for now), has some big Gotcha planned down the road that users are not going to like at all...
Pretty much my assessment at this point in time. I'm VERY uncomfortable about committing to a 1 way ticket with no clear end destination that W10 seems to offer. Anyway, I'm quite happy with Win 7, and it ain't broke!
Boggit, it's not a 1 way ticket. You can revert back to 7 or 8 if you want. If you want to play it safe, create a system image first and a file backup to an external drive with your existing Windows (this can be scheduled easily). I would create a windows system repair disk (on dvd, then put it on a usb) to help with the restore when you're in a pinch. You can use other backup utilities, but after using Backup/restore on Win 7 & Server 2008, I haven't felt the need.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960692/windows/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-go-back-to-windows-7-or-8.html (http://www.pcworld.com/article/2960692/windows/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-go-back-to-windows-7-or-8.html).
http://www.howtogeek.com/220723/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-downgrade-to-windows-7-or-8.1/ (http://www.howtogeek.com/220723/how-to-uninstall-windows-10-and-downgrade-to-windows-7-or-8.1/)
Thanks Endfire :), I appreciate you finding those links for me. O0
Boggit I had huge issues with my Win 10 install, so I had to do a reimage back to Win 7. The point is not to scare you. However I was told very clearly by a tech support I trust that the best way to deal with a Win 10 install is over a fresh install of Win 7/8. Don't install anything but the required updates and do a force Win 10 install BEFORE you install any other programs on the same drive.
Will be in a holding pattern until I hear these things have been remedied in Win 10:
Horrible driver support.
Auto update can be disabled permanently.
Key logging is removed completely.
Copies of my files stored automatically in the cloud is removed.
Turning on any cameras and mics automatically is removed.
And this statement is removed from the EULA/Privacy Agreement:
Finally, we will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary to: 1.comply with applicable law or respond to valid legal process, including from law enforcement or other government agencies; 2.protect our customers, for example to prevent spam or attempts to defraud users of the services, or to help prevent the loss of life or serious injury of anyone; 3.operate and maintain the security of our services, including to prevent or stop an attack on our computer systems or networks; or 4.protect the rights or property of Microsoft, including enforcing the terms governing the use of the services – however, if we receive information indicating that someone is using our services to traffic in stolen intellectual or physical property of Microsoft, we will not inspect a customer's private content ourselves, but we may refer the matter to law enforcement.
TANSTAAFL when it comes to M$.
Or in other words, looks like I'm headed back to Linux :)
I put Windows 10 on over the weekend but to be fair, I'm about to go back to 7.
Just niggling things - nothing major. The transition to 10 was easy enough - no dramas. Everything major seems to be ok, though I'm not a system nut - I don't go into the nuts and bolts.
But there's enough wee bits to make me want to go back to 7
I'll let you know what the reversal goes like
JD I'd backup anything truly valuable and then just do a clean OS install of Win 7. My HD completely crashed during the rollback to Win 7.
Quote from: Bison on September 30, 2015, 07:42:00 AM
JD I'd backup anything truly valuable and then just do a clean OS install of Win 7. My HD completely crashed during the rollback to Win 7.
I rolled back my daughters Windows 8.1 laptop from 10 and it went ok.
I'll give it a go. Worst case = fresh install. I don't have anything of huge importance...it's my gaming rig and I like to keep it that way. I'll of course back up my documents and photos.
The one worst thing about it is the various ways you need to deactivate various games...but even then, I'm like "wth".
Thanks for the heads up though. O0
30 ways Win 10 phones home
http://www.howtogeek.com/224616/30-ways-windows-10-phones-home/
Quote from: mirth on October 01, 2015, 02:06:28 PM
30 ways Win 10 phones home
http://www.howtogeek.com/224616/30-ways-windows-10-phones-home/
That's a good article because it also pretty much tells how to disable each one.
The problem with not upgrading because of snooping - and I do believe it's a real issue - is that if it's being introduced (and for free just now with the free upgrade) then it's likely going to be there - forever...and get worse.
It's kind of a necessity to accept it. What's the alternative? Sure - I can uninstall (and probably will) Windows 10 or someone can choose not to take it up - but eventually - somewhere down the road, you will have to move to a newer operating system. It's been that way since Dos and Windows 3.1 and it will be that way forever.
In the infamous words of a civilisation not of this planet - "Resistance is futile"...no?
When the time comes that I have to move on from Win 7, I'll be looking at a Linux distro. No way am I going to accept all this bullshit from MS. They're already trying to sneak some of the Win 10 spying shit into updates for Win 7. I no longer install Win 7 updates without reading the fine print first.
Quote from: bbmike on October 01, 2015, 02:14:19 PM
Quote from: mirth on October 01, 2015, 02:06:28 PM
30 ways Win 10 phones home
http://www.howtogeek.com/224616/30-ways-windows-10-phones-home/
That's a good article because it also pretty much tells how to disable each one.
You have to trust that Windows respects your settings though. Again, this is the company who voluntarily disclosed zero-day vulns to the NSA. Arstechnica already published a story wherein they prove that Windows still contacts a whole host of servers regardless of these settings.
I realise it's a very bitter pill for hardcore gamers to swallow, and I'm not without sympathy, but honestly, if you value your privacy you shouldn't be using Windows.
^Or Google. Or Apple. Or any of big tech.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on October 01, 2015, 04:26:58 PM
Quote from: bbmike on October 01, 2015, 02:14:19 PM
Quote from: mirth on October 01, 2015, 02:06:28 PM
30 ways Win 10 phones home
http://www.howtogeek.com/224616/30-ways-windows-10-phones-home/
That's a good article because it also pretty much tells how to disable each one.
You have to trust that Windows respects your settings though. Again, this is the company who voluntarily disclosed zero-day vulns to the NSA. Arstechnica already published a story wherein they prove that Windows still contacts a whole host of servers regardless of these settings.
I realise it's a very bitter pill for hardcore gamers to swallow, and I'm not without sympathy, but honestly, if you value your privacy you shouldn't be using Windows.
I value my gaming experience more than I value my privacy tbh. I'm not happy about it - and I'd rather they allowed me the privacy - but at the end of the day, I do nothing wrong and I want to play a whole host of games - not missing out on some because of my choice of OS and not having to jump through hoops for others...I just want to use my rig for gaming.
At the end of the day, there's a whole plethora of data gathered on me by all sorts of means that I already have no control over - so I'm not fussed about a bit more.
I know - if you want it to stop, vote with your feet - but I'm more bothered about my gaming being affected than what their "snooping" has in store for me.
Jesus - I use Photobucket which I believe has some sort of clause that says all photos uploaded by me belong to them (or at least they have the rights to use). It's just how it happens. Unless you're going to cut yourself off from all sorts of technology, you're going to be giving information away.
How many people out there who steer clear of Windows because of snooping have a mobile phone? Use apps on it? Have a tablet? Buy things online? Use credit cards? Buy insurance online? Holidays?
Just sayin'
That's what they're counting on. The indifference. Not picking on you, JD. Billions of people think the same way.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on October 01, 2015, 04:26:58 PM
Quote from: bbmike on October 01, 2015, 02:14:19 PM
Quote from: mirth on October 01, 2015, 02:06:28 PM
30 ways Win 10 phones home
http://www.howtogeek.com/224616/30-ways-windows-10-phones-home/
That's a good article because it also pretty much tells how to disable each one.
You have to trust that Windows respects your settings though. Again, this is the company who voluntarily disclosed zero-day vulns to the NSA. Arstechnica already published a story wherein they prove that Windows still contacts a whole host of servers regardless of these settings.
I realise it's a very bitter pill for hardcore gamers to swallow, and I'm not without sympathy, but honestly, if you value your privacy you shouldn't be using Windows.
I've always assumed anything on the computer isn't private. Kind of like talking on the phone. If I used Linux (and I might start) I'd feel the same way.
Nothing is secure. If you truly value your privacy you shouldn't be using anything that can transmit electronically. But in the modern world that's becoming increasingly impossible.
Anything you do online is not secure. You can take steps to reduce how much of your personal data you willingly hand over.
ok - so here's my problem.....
I decided to go back to Windows 7. However, when I selected that option, all I got was a blank white square....nothing in it. No options. Nothing.
I tried to do a restore to go back to a restore point - see if that worked. Same thing.
In the end I chose to go the reset option. I chose the option to keep my stuff, just reinstall Windows. It did this. However, Steam is gone, icons for some of my programs on my desktop are gone. Microsoft Office is gone.
In addition to all that bollox, my option to revert to Windows 7 has gone. It wasn't working anyway, but I was hoping "resetting" the Windows 10 thing would just do that...reset Windows 10 and maybe fix whatever shite problem it was.
So - now I will be doing a full reinstall of Windows 7 and I won't be downloading this shite again.
Fair play - I was warned...but I didn't have a lot to lose except going the route I am now having to travel.
Good luck, JD. It sucks when crap like that happens. Not the end of the world, just a big pain in the butt.
Thanks.
Reinstalls are always a pain - which is why I had hoped the restore to Windows 7 would've worked. But they are beneficial from time to time.
Truth be told, I'm actually a lot less bothered than I normally would be about this and that's because I have my board games and modelling.
Quote from: JudgeDredd on October 03, 2015, 10:11:37 AM
Truth be told, I'm actually a lot less bothered than I normally would be about this and that's because I have my board games and modelling.
Good man O0
I'm back. Nice clean drive.
Now - to install ONLY the games I actually want to play! :2funny:
Quote from: JudgeDredd on October 03, 2015, 12:45:22 PM
I'm back. Nice clean drive.
Now - to install ONLY the games I actually want to play! :2funny:
That would almost makes the hassle you've gone through worth it, wouldn't you say?
Quote from: JudgeDredd on October 03, 2015, 12:45:22 PM
I'm back. Nice clean drive.
Now - to install ONLY the games I actually want to play! :2funny:
It's working for me. 2 games installed and that's it. I admit Sword of the Stars will be going on tonight too.
Quote from: Bison on October 03, 2015, 04:08:57 PM
Quote from: JudgeDredd on October 03, 2015, 12:45:22 PM
I'm back. Nice clean drive.
Now - to install ONLY the games I actually want to play! :2funny:
It's working for me. 2 games installed and that's it. I admit Sword of the Stars will be going on tonight too.
Not until your homework is done, Mister.
Damn it! I know, I know. Taking a break right now to watch State's football game.
Stupid get Windows 10 app was installed again by Windows Update. :tickedoff:
Yeah, I got it on my game rig a week or two ago. I couldn't find that '$something-or-other' folder anywhere so I ignored the icon.
Now the icon is gone. Somehow that seems even more ominous... ???
Quote from: Staggerwing on October 11, 2015, 08:59:26 AM
Yeah, I got it on my game rig a week or two ago. I couldn't find that '$something-or-other' folder anywhere so I ignored the icon.
Now the icon is gone. Somehow that seems even more ominous... ???
It probably downloaded and is sitting on your machine waiting to be installed.
I had to uninstall the damned update...again - http://www.howtogeek.com/218856/how-do-you-disable-the-get-windows-10-icon-shown-in-the-notification-tray/
Here's where to find the install files if they downloaded
http://www.addictivetips.com/windows-tips/what-is-the-windows-bt-folder-on-my-hard-drive/
FU Microscum. I've uninstalled KB3035583 (the update that adds the Get Windows 10 tray icon) twice and hidden it in Windows Update 3 times. And it still wants to install when updates are run. Malware BS!
MS really, really wants you to upgrade to Win 10
http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/10/windows-10-will-be-made-an-automatic-recommended-update-early-next-year/
Quote from: mirth on October 30, 2015, 11:11:00 AM
MS really, really wants you to upgrade to Win 10
http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/10/windows-10-will-be-made-an-automatic-recommended-update-early-next-year/
Screw 'em. I'm switching to Linux my next system.
Quote from: Greybriar on October 30, 2015, 09:00:02 PM
Screw 'em. I'm switching to Linux my next system.
Congratulations, you have achieved enlightenment! Enjoy the choice, freedom, and security, and don't hesitate to ask questions. :) O0
Yeah, I'm stacking up older machines that I need to run certain hardware/software but I'm going back to Linux for online stuff. I just have to finalize my intranet for the MS boxes/laptops and it's been a little hectic around the ranch.
NECROTHREAD, ARISE!
(Seemed pertinent since the last post was Halloween. >:D )
I thought I would add some notes from a Facebook friend, and a FB acquaintance.
Quote from: Erik'm having the damnedest time finding the right ethernet drivers for my computer. I think that I finally found the right one, but I'm waiting for it to restart. My Windows 10 experience is not off to a stellar start.. upset emoticon
Quote from: Novalis ReincarnatedDriver issues, unfortunately, have become part-and-parcel of free market in computer hardware. If you allow your OS to run on anyone's hardware, you take control of the drivers out of your hands and put it into the hands of manufacturers who know it is first and foremost your reputation on the line -- not theirs. In this case, Microsoft gave unprecedented additional time to manufacturers to update their drivers, as well as testing time ("Release Preview") out in the real world... and yet, a number of manufacturers did absolutely or nearly nothing to support users of their less-common or older devices.
It's frustrating.
I deal with it at work everyday. I've been in IT through upgrades from Windows 98/2000/ME to XP, to Vista, to 7, 8, 8.1, 8.1 Update (which should have been called 8.2), and now 10. Of all of those updates, _this_ one has been the easiest I've seen -- despite the usual groaning.
Do you know how to check the Hardware ID?
Also, I found an undocumented trick to *update* (not to find unknown) device drivers.
If you want to do that, go here: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3073930 -- then, click "Download the "Show or hide updates" troubleshooter package now." Then run it and click Next. Allow it to "Detect problems". Click "Hide updates". Now, it is important not to click "Next" -- ever. Just look at the updates available here. You won't see most of these driver updates in the normal Windows Update, for some reason. Open Device Manager (as an administrator) and match up the devices in that list with the updates in the troubleshooter (not always easy since updates will sometimes update the *name* of a device, too). When you find a device that occurs on both lists, right-click it in Device Manager, click "Update Driver Software...", and "Search automatically..." It will now go out and download the new update.
Also, be sure to open the Start Menu [aka Cortana] and type "Find and fix problems with devices" and run that troubleshooter because that one CAN identify unknown devices.
Quote from: ErikEverything is fine now, and I suspect that it is due to the firewall. I am will to bet that if I had just restarted a couple of times that everything would have worked fine. It's weird, but the first time I was logged in to Windows after all of the installing was done, it was all bare-bones, as though there were no device drivers installed. This is typical of a Windows instillation, but there were such grandiose promises about most software just seamlessly rolling over and not having to start from scratch. So I set about trying to find the drivers for my specific model, which was like pulling teeth-- almost everything that I found, even the drivers on Acer's own site were wrong. The biggest problem was that the folder that was labelled 64-bit was actually the 32-bit install, and I had to find the 64-bit version on a third-party site. I must have tried ten drivers before I got to the right one.
Oh, but wait-- there's more. So I finally have the right drivers, ok? And as I'm installing, it pops up that it is compatible with my hardware, so I'm about to do the happy dance all over the place. But then it tells me that the driver is already installed and that it needs to be uninstalled and the computer restarted before it can continue. squint emoticon
After a fantastic journey through system settings and the ethernet driver configuration, I came to the conclusion that God just hates me, pure and simple. This is not the worst thing that can happen.
After I found my Zen (smoked some pot and chugged some wine), I got back to it. It obviously wasn't working correctly, so fuck it, I might as well remove it and reinstall. Seemed like a good idea at the time...
The uninstall program never got past go. It's not like it was freezing, I could still do other things on my computer and it wasn't slowed down, and I could even move the uninstall program's window around, the window was just blank with no dialogs or status updates, the pointer was not busy, and the "close" button was greyed out. This was beginning to look like a bad episode of Anger Management.
After about twenty minutes of waiting, I ctrl+alt+deleted the bitch, just to see if I could wake her up. I clicked on "shut-down", and when it asked me if I was sure, I clicked "no'. It's a dirty old trick that my mom used to use on me when I was acting up-- grab me like she's gonna hit me and then growl in a low, "I'm done playing games" voice, "One last chance..."
Well, it worked-- the install program claimed to be done and that it needed to restart. So I restarted, and nothing was different. I don't even think that the program did a damn thing to my hard drive, because the driver was still installed and everything looked on the up and up, except for the fact that I couldn't connect to the internet through the ethernet. After trying the same thing like three times, I noticed that while I was waiting for the program to never be done, the firewall indicator was telling me that the firewall wasn't working properly. It wouldn't tell me anything about _how_ it wasn't working right, just that it wasn't working right and that I should click this button and let Commodo fix it.
Well, it's yet to let me down, so I trust Commodo.
And then my computer actually _did_ freeze. The pointer would move, but nothing would happen and the fan was working overtime for a good ten minutes before my give-a-fucker snapped and I hard rebooted. Yeah, I know, I got balls the size of something that would normally be seen chasing after Harrison Ford in some third-world lost temple. Hard rebooting while messing with drivers is one of the best ways to send your system FUBAR, and since I don't have the product key to this particular OEM (pre-installed factory BULLSHIT!!!), the idea of breaking my system would forever ensure that only pirated versions of Windows would ever again grace my HDD, which if you've ever tread that dark path, you know that one does not simply "pirate windows". unsure emoticon
But this time dumb luck won the day. It starts back up without a hitch and everything is just like it was before I upgraded, only you could tell that it was Windows 10 from the minimalist theme. I mean, the bitch was mint-- all my sound, video, and ETHERNET drivers were running right and better than before, almost like they were mocking me in my struggle. Computers are dicks.
So, what happened? It's just a guess, but I don't think that Windows was really done installing. I think that there was stuff going on under the hood, like writing to configuration files and updating the registry. But Microsoft is so eager to prove that they can be just as fast as Ubuntu (they have a long ways to go, like the kind of distance that requires faster than light travel), but still have that Windows edge, whatever that may be. In the rush to get the desktop up and running as fast as possible, I think that it loads the programs that are most necessary for the API and desktop environment first, and then everything else. This is what happens when a lazy little shit who's used to only working hard when the boss is watching creates an operating system-- it tries to trick you into thinking that it's done and ready to go when it hasn't even wiped, let alone pulled up it's pants. In other words, Windows has little-man's syndrome.
After all is said and done, I have to agree with David-- this was the easiest Windows install yet. That should tell you something about why so many people are interested in alternative operating systems like Lynux-- it may be weird and quirky at times, but anything is better than Windows. grin emoticon
Thanks for the update, Jason. It confirms my decision to stick with Win7 indefinitely.
That last story sure does make me appreciate Linux which has 99% of drivers anyone needs baked right into the kernel. Just install the OS and you're done, 15 minutes maximum. ;)
Quote from: Martok on January 12, 2016, 10:12:32 AM
Thanks for the update, Jason. It confirms my decision to stick with Win7 indefinitely.
Yep. Looks like we're gonna have to sort through every single update KB in Win7's future, though.
When I build the next PC, it may well be a dual-boot with Linux as the primary. Like JD, I'll still be stuck using Windows to some extent, possibly quite a lot, because all the games are compatible with it.
This is pretty sad because I've never taken much issue with using a new Windows version, after the initial driver & compatibility issues had been mostly addressed. Well.. except Windows 8 but that was pretty much a shitty tablet OS that came default on some poor sods' PCs; it wasn't pushed so heavily on everyone as Win10.
Quote from: Nefaro on January 13, 2016, 08:57:26 AM
Yep. Looks like we're gonna have to sort through every single update KB in Win7's future, though.
Bingo. I check every Win 7 update now before installing. MS is constantly trying to sneak in Win 10 related garbage.
Quote from: mirth on January 13, 2016, 09:10:29 AM
Quote from: Nefaro on January 13, 2016, 08:57:26 AM
Yep. Looks like we're gonna have to sort through every single update KB in Win7's future, though.
Bingo. I check every Win 7 update now before installing. MS is constantly trying to sneak in Win 10 related garbage.
At the risk of exposing myself for the drooling idiot I am, how does one check a Windows update to see if it does, in fact, contain Win10-related crap? And if so, how does one prevent that update from getting download/installed onto one's computer?
Quote from: Martok on January 13, 2016, 03:27:11 PM
Quote from: mirth on January 13, 2016, 09:10:29 AM
Quote from: Nefaro on January 13, 2016, 08:57:26 AM
Yep. Looks like we're gonna have to sort through every single update KB in Win7's future, though.
Bingo. I check every Win 7 update now before installing. MS is constantly trying to sneak in Win 10 related garbage.
At the risk of exposing myself for the drooling idiot I am, how does one check a Windows update to see if it does, in fact, contain Win10-related crap? And if so, how does one prevent that update from getting download/installed onto one's computer?
I have my update settings set to notify when new updates are available, but to not download/install unless I select them.
You can review each update and MS usually gives you a "More Info" link. For anything I'm not sure about, I do some additional Googling for that KB item to figure out if it's okay to install.
At this point, I'm pretty much only installing security updates and Windows Defender definitions.
Win 7 update settings: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/change-windows-update-installation-notification#1TC=windows-7 (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/change-windows-update-installation-notification#1TC=windows-7)
Win 7 updates to avoid:http://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/list-of-windows-7-telemetry-updates-to-avoid.379151/ (http://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/list-of-windows-7-telemetry-updates-to-avoid.379151/)
http://www.majorgeeks.com/news/story/windows_updates_to_hide_to_avoid_telemetry_or_windows_10_upgrade.html (http://www.majorgeeks.com/news/story/windows_updates_to_hide_to_avoid_telemetry_or_windows_10_upgrade.html)
Removing an update: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/remove-update#1TC=windows-7 (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/remove-update#1TC=windows-7)
You will be assimilated; given time, Uncle Bill will get you.
I'm getting ready to join the Linux revolution.
Thanks mirth. :)
Windows. The only OS whose users fight to not install the latest updates...
Quote from: mirth on January 13, 2016, 04:07:50 PM
I'm getting ready to join the Linux revolution.
If you're deeply invested in wargaming you should probably keep a Windows partition exclusively for gaming. But for me personally, there's a
very small number of Windows games I really wish I could play, and certainly not enough for me to devote any hard drive space to that most loathsome of operating systems. The Linux gaming market is already large enough that there are more games than I could possibly play. Not to mention the Vulkan drivers which are just around the corner. Now's a good time to jump in. :)
Quote from: Huw the Poo on January 13, 2016, 05:06:07 PM
Quote from: mirth on January 13, 2016, 04:07:50 PM
I'm getting ready to join the Linux revolution.
If you're deeply invested in wargaming you should probably keep a Windows partition exclusively for gaming. But for me personally, there's a very small number of Windows games I really wish I could play, and certainly not enough for me to devote any hard drive space to that most loathsome of operating systems. The Linux gaming market is already large enough that there are more games than I could possibly play. Not to mention the Vulkan drivers which are just around the corner. Now's a good time to jump in. :)
I have an old laptop I'm currently not using. If it has enough life left in it, I'm going to throw Mint on it. Otherwise I have an old desktop I can use.
A fine choice. I've stuck with Mint for longer than any other distro now. And the next update in May or June will have the Plasma 5 desktop!
I've been wanting to try Mint for awhile. I have a long weekend coming up so it will be a good time to work on it.
Mint works well on my little Gigabyte bookshelf sized pc. I may eventually turn that into my shopping and bill-paying living room computer but it does not have enough oomph to play many games. My latest build is still a WIP and needs a good gfx card but I'll probably dual-boot windows and Mint there as well. I wish there was a noob-friendly Linux equivalent to the OS X based Parallels so that I could run Mint all day and let any Windows-only game pop up in their own little virtual machine when needed. I know that there is WINE but trying to run Windows games under WINE has only left me frustrated.
Virtual box has been suggested as a possible way to run Windows stuff under Linux without rebooting. Do any of you Linux pioneers have experience with it?
I've wanted to try it but just have not had the time. I have done some work on PC VMs and some of them are pretty darned good but all I've done is run Windows under Windows.
Apparently running Windows in a VM with GPU passthrough is quite viable these days, although I've never tried it.
Staggerwing: have you heard of Play on Linux? (https://www.playonlinux.com/en/) I've used it myself with some success. It's a front-end for WINE. It's a repository for install scripts that other users have written to get games working with WINE. You basically just download the script for the game you want and run it, and POL will take care of the rest. It's pretty good when it works.
Just a heads up that Microsoft is now pushing Windows 10 as a recommended update that will automatically download.
Quote
Many users of Windows 7 and 8.1 will start seeing a more aggressive push to upgrade to Windows 10 in the coming days, as Microsoft starts to roll the new operating system out as a recommended update which will automatically download.
Microsoft said the rollout of Windows 10 as a recommended update will happen in phases starting Monday. Users who have their computers set to automatically download and install recommended updates will start to see an installer for the new operating system pop up prompting them to upgrade their computer.
Although the Windows 10 updater will automatically download to those computers, users will have the final say on whether they want to actually upgrade their machine to the new operating system. People who update to Windows 10 and end up disliking it can roll back to their previous OS up to 31 days after the upgrade.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3024278/windows/you-will-upgrade-to-windows-10-inside-microsofts-strong-arm-upgrade-tactics.html
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3028957/windows/microsoft-starts-recommended-update-roll-out-for-windows-10.html
M$ is hell bent on forcing Win 10 down our throats.
Thanks for the heads-up
steve. Definitely good to know.
Quote from: mirth on February 03, 2016, 10:38:34 AM
M$ is hell bent on forcing Win 10 down our throats.
Indeed. I do believe they can piss off (for the nth time).
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/02/09/windows-10-data-tracking-spying-levels/#100a9642857e
Quote from: mirth on February 12, 2016, 12:38:24 PM
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/02/09/windows-10-data-tracking-spying-levels/#100a9642857e
I can't get the page to load.... :(
Quote from: DoctorQuest on February 12, 2016, 02:36:41 PM
Quote from: mirth on February 12, 2016, 12:38:24 PM
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/02/09/windows-10-data-tracking-spying-levels/#100a9642857e
I can't get the page to load.... :(
I had trouble viewing it as well...in Chrome, but it loaded up in IE11.
p.s. His other recent Windows 10 articles are worth a read as well.
Oh Windows 10 you wacky OS....
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2447177/updategate-windows-10-is-resetting-default-apps-back-to-microsoft-stock
Quote from: mirth on February 16, 2016, 10:04:43 AM
Oh Windows 10 you wacky OS....
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2447177/updategate-windows-10-is-resetting-default-apps-back-to-microsoft-stock
...but, but it is/was Free!
Slowly, but surely, it seems Microsoft is letting slip (perhaps unintentionally) some of the real reasons behind making Windows 10 free to the masses....in this particular case, it appears to be more power/control of what they will LET users have/use on their computers. :-\
Yep, which is precisely why I refuse to use it. An operating system's only function should be letting you interact with your hardware. That's all. Windows can kiss my arse.
Not sure if its been mentioned yet in this thread, but apparently Microsoft is experimenting with ads in the Windows 10 lock screen. Yet another indication that the free Windows 10 wasn't/isn't really free...
http://www.komando.com/happening-now/348701/simple-steps-to-get-rid-of-windows-10s-lock-screen-ads
Indefensible.
And I won't defend it, but it is important to note it is easily turned off in your screen saver settings. At least for now.
Haven't I explained enough times in this thread what an OS should be? Should an OS be showing you adverts when you lock your screen?
Frankly, as much as MS has been bashed for years for not being innovative, I think this is pretty smart of them. I don't know if it'll work, or if I'll like it, but I applaud them for trying something different.
Remember when we used computers for work with words and numbers and then fire up lazer thingies that went shoom shoom shoom...
Now we spend all day trying to defend ourselves from the operating system...TURN OFF YOUR SCREEN SAVERS MATES! - THEY'RE TRYING TO SNEAK WIN10 IN THROUGH IT. SET DEFAULT TO STUN AND PERFORM THE COCHRAN DECELERATION MANEUVER TO BLOCK THAT POP UP!
DAMN IT JIM, I'M A NERD, NOT A DEFENSIVE ENGINEER!
OH SHE'S COMING AROUND AGAIN CAP'N...BOOT LINUX NOW!
jesus...
Microsoft is relentless
http://www.winbeta.org/news/internet-explorer-security-patch-includes-ad-generator-upgrading-windows-10
FYI, the Windows 10 nagware was installed again on my Win 7 machine this weekend after installing some updates
https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/4c7s4o/psa_windows_update_is_attempting_to_install_the/
This time, I used the GWX Control Panel tool to remove it.
http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/
I'm very close to not installing any more updates from MS. This morning I saw more than a dozen new updates waiting to be installed. I'll have to go through each one to determine whether or not it is Win 10 crapware.
Hopefully this whole fiasco is making people think very seriously about why they continue with Windows at all. Linux is a perfectly viable option (and free) and in terms of software people would have less to "sacrifice" than they think.
As a Linux gamer, I'm in the same boat now as I was when I used Windows: too many games, not enough time, and it "improves" all the time. I currently have 298 games in my Steam library that are fully supported on Linux (out of more than an astonishing 1,900 available). I'll never get around to them all. I've said it before and I'll say it again: there's literally zero reason for me to use Windows, and it will never darken my hard drive again.
I doubt I will be a Windows user beyond Win7 (which is a very solid OS). I'll keep it installed as long as possible, but Microsoft has really pissed me off with all the Win 10 crap.
Only reason I put Linux on the back-burner as a primary OS for now it that I couldn't get any printers to work. The process was too convoluted for me and I frequently have a lot of stuff I need to print and scan.
Of course, I had OS X to fall back on... ^-^
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fr0iBiqn.png&hash=26274e6a6dcfcf46875826a151f8d35e12d852a3)
MS has gotten really aggressive with Win 7 hold outs like me. A few days ago, I turned on my computer, and the "helpful" little Win Upgrade box had a count-down going. 59 min to upgrade...it kept counting down and there was no "off" button. Finally I just started hitting everything, and eventually, found an "upgrade later" button. Jerks...I am not impressed...
I'm just counting the days until my computer-illiterate co-worker clicks on the nice friendly upgrade box on our shared Win7 system. She's already zeroed out the inventory twice on the new EMR/POS software I've been tasked with trying to get up and running... forcing me to re-inventory everything each time. ::)
hahahaha! :2funny:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/04/28/windows_10_live_tv/
I received an irate email from a friend of mine the other day. He'd left his laptop on while he went off to do something else, and when he came back he suddenly had Windows 10. He's furious about it, and I can't say I blame him.
Microsoft is a totally different company now than from the time I worked there. I'd concider myself old school Microsoft--I wasn't there at the beginning but pretty close to the beginning when they started to get market share, at Win95a. I don't know why anyone would use windows 3.1 at the time, but Win95a was at least funtional--though for games decidely slower. Then of course came windows 95b, and then Windows95c. This was when I began questioning my career choices because this was one huge nightmare from an Engineer's standpoint. There was no SFC system, no version control. A windows 95a owner would have an windows error and decide..."gee I'll just reinstall windows and fix it." But of course he had been updating Windows all along..to effectively be Windows 95c. A new Explorer, A newer network component...pretty much a newer everything---and then than windows 95a reinstall that replace all that or part of that with the original 'old' files---or in other words Windows exploded--literally with 100s of mismatched files---and in those days Windows had no built in tools. We engineers did everything through Dos---and Microsoft's "never lose the costumers' data" policy paired with, "they must be not only satified, but 'very satisfied' when surveyed later or it came back to bite the engineer as a bad mark on his employment record. That was no easy trick, leading someone through renaming and replacing files through Dos who really was just grasping where the desktop was--the only saving grace we had was we Engineers had unlimited time and access to every Microsoft resource to get the job done---and if I had to ferry a free copy of Front Page to insure my surveys were always 'very satisfied' I did not hesitate an instant to press the send button.
That was Microsoft's overall company outlook---very satisfied customers--to the point they's gladly spend 10x the cost of the original Windows disk to keep that one costumer happy. And that was endlessly drilled into us at all times. For us--it was highly stressful-but Microsoft probably also had the best break rooms you ever saw--and out of an 8 hour day you were only required to actually log 6 actively working hours- the rest labled "research hours' was usually translated to banking the 8 ball into the side pocket in the breakroom.
In those days I believe we were the best- and we truely were. Even if AOL wouldn't fix your browsing problem a call to us garanteed a fix. Even if it was an AOL problem. HP printing troubles? Sure. I knew which companies gave good tech support merely by the fact of which costumers were not calling us with their problems. I once hand rebuilt a drive table with a movie producer's assistant to recover the script of "The Blues brothers 2000", to fixing Miss Sugar Britches cam so her porn site remained fluid....boy did the higher ups pick up their headsets and monitor that one.
You moved around--I did everything from excalation to SFC systems in 98 to virus's.
Then the wurm turned. "research' began to get cut down to an hour and half, inner Engineer tools we created were forbidden in lue of outsourced tools developed by third party vendors- the worse being 'clarify' in my memory-which made it neccessary to have 2 computers--one to just keep up with running tech notes of the case- but then even the inner IT department disappeared and was outsourced. I saw the writing on the wall- soon we were going to be outsourced, and I quite roughly 6 months before 4800 other engineers all lost their jobs to some guy on a Camel---around the release of XP----and Microsoft has never been the same since in my view.
That "must be very satisfied" approach that made them number one was replaced by stock market margin calls- The money became the pursuit and the overall goal changed. One only has to look at the awful GUI in Windows 10 to see this. We must put up with that on our portable dumb phones armed with tiny screens and disabled and crippled ARM chips to help keep the dead tech battery alive 30 minutes- but why must we endure that on our desktops? Because one size fits all--like Obama Care--is supposed to be more profitable.
Now--the Engineers that still exist are pretty good. No one can deny DirectX has pretty much ditched and buried OpenGL in every way one can think- which is the main reason Apple sucks now as a gaming option as well as Linux- but the money marketing continues to creep in and influence the end product in degree's highly destructive to the end product. In the early days I was proud to be a member of MS--today it's an embarrassment. I wouldn't ever work there now.
Good post Ghostryder. I do want to address one thing you said though:
Quote from: ghostryder on May 03, 2016, 01:30:50 AMNo one can deny DirectX has pretty much ditched and buried OpenGL in every way one can think
Not really. It's true that DirectX was more popular for a long time, but that wasn't due to technical reasons, that was due to Microsoft's shitty practices. OpenGL couldn't be further from "buried" - in fact, it's the basis for Vulkan, which has the backing of industry giants (not least of all, Valve). OpenGL is very much in the ascendancy.
Quotewhich is the main reason Apple sucks now as a gaming option as well as Linux
Also wrong. There are
many reasons gaming has not really been viable on Mac and Linux historically. The two biggest are a lack of compatible engines (now solved thanks to the support of engines such as Unity and Unreal) and lots of middleware supporting Windows only, which is also now becoming less of an issue.
By "buried' I wasn't referring to it's popularity...I was referring to it's tech edge. Open GL holds up to perhaps directx 9--but after that it's been buried. It just does not do what DirectX does--and a lot of that is hugely significant. From it's memory managment to what it can get you GPU to do--opengl has fallen far far behind. In every way possible. Before that opengl was generally superior-and has been throughout the years--but they've stagnated in the last few years.
I like Linux as an OS but it's dependancy on Opengl puts it behind the curve for game performance and visuals. Everything else is fine--it's security is and has always been superior and always will be because active x will never go away--people want thier stuff to pass from MS office, to whatever--and those security holes will always be vunerable.
Also, it's not so much game engines like Unity..it's mono---that has solved the cross platform worries. Sure, Unity uses mono -but so does a lot of other comercial engines. Mono can translate any .net language across platforms. So thank mono and the .net languages. You can thank Unity for giving devs very high dollar features that used to cost a quarter of a million to licience for a mere $1500-- but they were not responsible for mono nor the .net languages. That was Microsoft. They dev'd the whole framework. and though C# ain't perfect it's a hell of a lot better than C++ to work with and is by far the most popular today---again a Microsoft creation.
The next time someone mods thier game through an xml file---used now as the defacto-- that again is part of the Microsoft .net Framework.
In fact, if it were not for this framework and mono The Unity Engine would have forever been a small dev tool restricted to apple machines that few gamers would have ever heard of. It was not until they migrated to Windows that they exploded and became the default go to for every wannabe game dev out there--again, that wasn't apple's doing or the opensource community-that was Microsoft---and love or hate them they have done more for gaming 10x 10x a dozen times over more than Apple-Linux or whomever.
As far as Vulkan goes, remember that's just a reworked Mantel API. It's main advantage is, of course, cross platform. That doesn't mean it's technically superior to DirectX but as far as dev's go--big ones like Valve--why use DX12 that only runs on windows when Vulkan works across platforms--including windows?
What i think that will result in is a good chance Microsoft will open source it's code. It recently already did this with Roslyn with .net--it makes since to do it here--or else all that tech advance stuff will be wasted as no dev really need use a DirectX12 backend. But make no mistake---tech wise DX12 smokes Vulken.
So what really do need to know is whether I take this "free" Win 10 upgrade as a Win 7 user or not? So far, I'm happy with Win7 - save not the update last September that has borked any safedisc driven game I have on disk - but otherwise happy with it.
As far as I can tell Win 7 is due to be supported until 2020, and given the speed that Win 10 has overtaken Win 8, I don't know if that will be superceded before then, or if MS will be introducing a subscription service, as has been mooted, which will longer term make a Win 10 installation an open ended expense.
When Win 7 runs out, I have a dilemma, although Huw's experience with Linux is encouraging. I don't know how complicated it is though to install it and configure my machine to run all my old Win based games? Maybe Huw can explain how he does that?
With just under 3 months to go to take advantage of the "free" Win 10 upgrade, I want to make an informed decision. I'm happy with Win 7, but I worry if sticking with it is going to make any new games totally incompatible with it, or if I do trade up to Win 10, that my existing software investment in games will be seriously affected? Some pundits are saying Win 10 is a definite improvement, hence my quandary. I really do appreciate your reasoned opinions here. :)
Is it possible to do the upgrade just to get the license and then re-install Windows 7? That way you would have the ability to upgrade for free whenever you want.
Quote from: bbmike on May 05, 2016, 03:04:20 PM
Is it possible to do the upgrade just to get the license and then re-install Windows 7? That way you would have the ability to upgrade for free whenever you want.
I think you could upgrade to Win 10 and also create a Win 10 install disk (or USB stick). You could theoretically then roll back to Windows 7. If you wanted to reinstall Win 10, you could do a clean install from the install media you created. The Win 10 license for upgrades is tied to the hardware you upgraded on, so it should recognize the same hardware and license during a clean install.
Take all of that with a grain of salt. I wouldn't try it myself.
Here are some details on the Win 10 licensing
http://www.redmondpie.com/windows-10-product-key-and-activation-how-to-find-it-and-how-it-works/
Oops. Mirth beat me to it. At least we're both wrong if that is the case.
My understanding is that you MUST do a true "upgrade" from Win 7 (or win8) to Win 10 FIRST. This means you can't do a "clean" install the first time. You must use your Win 7 (or win8) system to do the upgrade. Then once you are registered as a Win 10 user you can wipe your system and do clean installs anytime after that. Just keep your previous Win 7 key handy.
You should be able to create an install DVD by going here and downloading the media creation tool.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10
Scroll down to the "Download tool now" link. Creating a DVD eliminates needing an internet connection to do the install. You still need to get online to activate the silly thing at some point.
So to answer your question I think you can do an upgrade, wipe the system, reinstall Win 7 and still have a legal copy on Win 10 on the shelf for later.
I may try all this using a virtual machine. That might be a win-win in terms of testing the process and not having to blow away my current Win 7 install.
I may try it as well. I have a desktop that I'm going to give my dad that came with Windows 7. I upgraded it to Windows 10 but might try rolling it back after recording the key.
Quote from: Boggit on May 05, 2016, 02:47:43 PM
When Win 7 runs out, I have a dilemma, although Huw's experience with Linux is encouraging. I don't know how complicated it is though to install it and configure my machine to run all my old Win based games? Maybe Huw can explain how he does that?
Hi Boggit. I have to apologise if I've given the impression that I still play Windows games - I don't. The list of games that support Linux (maybe around 2,000 by now) is already huge, and 65% of my own library is fully playable on Linux. I don't really miss the games I can't play any more, with just a very small handful of exceptions (Endless Space, Rift etc).
The last time I wanted to play a Windows game, it was Sins of a Solar Empire. Thankfully it worked perfectly using WINE, a Windows compatibility layer. WINE works just fine for a lot of Windows-only games, although it can involve some faffing. There are programs like Play On Linux (https://www.playonlinux.com/en/) that can automate it though, with varying degrees of success.
My stance hasn't changed...if the ability to play every single game matters more than the massive catalogue of reasons
not to use Windows, then your choice is clear. But for many people, myself included, there's no reason to use Windows at all. I consider myself a hardcore gamer and my needs are absolutely satisfied by the Linux gaming market. You'd be surprised what's available. Shadow of Mordor, for example. Tomb Raider. Alien: Isolation. All of Paradox's modern games. More than I'll ever have time to play. :)
If you want more specific advice about playing Windows games on Linux, just ask.
Personally if your on Windows 7 there's no compelling reason to go to 10. That's something best done when your getting a new system--and quite frankly when this machine dies I'll still look for a system with windows7--or I'll build one. Right now they are still available (Microcenters give a windows7 cd with every windows 10 system they sell) I really hate the GUI that much on the new OSs.
Quote from: ghostryder on May 05, 2016, 05:47:58 PM
I'm really hate the GUI that much to old to learn a new GUI on the new OSs.
Here ya go Ghosty, fixed your typo.
@All :)
Thanks for the feedback. O0 My Win 7 came pre-installed, although I was given a key to validate the installation. I did a backup of the system when I first got the PC in case it all crashed, but I haven't reinstalled on this system - ever. So I'm a little nervous of wiping the system after a Win 10 installation, and reinstalling. I suspect that my Win 7 backup is now wildly out of date, but providing I can get my updates/service pack, I guess it is doable. I'm just a bit uncertain, that's all.
@Huw. :) Yes I would be interested in knowing about getting Windows games to work on Linux. O0 I have quite a large software investment over the years, so that is a huge factor in my thinking. I certainly can't afford to replace it with a different version.
Quote from: Boggit on May 06, 2016, 08:06:21 PM
@Huw. :) Yes I would be interested in knowing about getting Windows games to work on Linux. O0 I have quite a large software investment over the years, so that is a huge factor in my thinking. I certainly can't afford to replace it with a different version.
OK, well, I'm not an expert because I don't really do it myself, but the first thing I would suggest is installing the aforementioned Play On Linux because it not only automates installation and configuration of WINE, but also has scripts to install and launch specific games. The scripts can all be downloaded and run from within the POL client. Rather brilliantly, it will download and install the Windows version of Steam which, in many cases, is all that's required to play Steam games. For example, if I want to play Sins of a Solar Empire, I just launch POL, then the Windows version of Steam, then Sins itself as normal. It just works. Here (https://www.playonlinux.com/en/supported_apps.html) is a database of POL scripts.
After installing POL and therefore WINE, you can also launch WINE directly and tell it to install whatever software. Then your system should be setup to recognise Windows software and if you click to launch it, it should launch via WINE. Of course, it isn't always that simple and you may need to do a bit of fiddling specific to certain games. Here (https://appdb.winehq.org/) is the appdb for WINE. Find the game you're interested in and you will see users' reports of trying various games along with tips for getting them to work.
There are also other commercially available programs such as CrossOver (https://www.codeweavers.com/products/crossover-linux/features) which do a similar job to POL but cost money. I've never tried any of them but apparently CrossOver is very good.
Finally, one last option would of course be to dual boot, and this works just fine for many people. I did it myself for a long time (until I finally got fed up of it). What I did was boot into Windows purely to play games and nothing else, then I'd boot into Linux to do everything else. This is a perfectly viable solution if you
must be able to play your entire library. In fact it's pretty much the only solution. However there may come a day when you get pissed off with having to reboot all the time. ;)
I probably can't be much more help than that since I've never really used WINE very much, but that's a start anyway. There are countless guides to using WINE around the web so have a look around. :)
Edit: Don't fall for the sunk cost fallacy! You may have a huge games investment, but how much of it are you really ever going to play again? When I switched to 100% Linux I lost access to literally hundreds of games, but I don't miss more than a handful of them really. And more and more games support Linux out of the box these days, or at least shortly after launch. :)
Here ya go Ghosty, fixed your typo.
ROFL! That too!
today's outrage... It's Tuesday, so I checked for upgrades on my Win 7 machine. Without looking at the detailed list of "important" updates, I hit "install updates"...and Win 10 began to install. I cancelled it after much difficulty. Getting really tired of this. I just wish there was a viable alternative to Win...I'd drop these guys fast.
Quote from: ArizonaTank on May 11, 2016, 12:36:10 AM
today's outrage... It's Tuesday, so I checked for upgrades on my Win 7 machine. Without looking at the detailed list of "important" updates, I hit "install updates"...and Win 10 began to install. I cancelled it after much difficulty. Getting really tired of this. I just wish there was a viable alternative to Win...I'd drop these guys fast.
Yeah, I also noticed the tick box on the update, which I'd unticked and had been ticked again... ???
@Huw
Thanks for the explanation - much appreciated. O0
OK, so I may be the last person in the world to know that Windows' Personal Assistant, Cortana, is named after the AI in the HALO game series. Having just read a synopsis of that game series I am left to wonder:
How long till Life imitates Fiction and the MS' Cortana also goes all Skynet for real?
Quote from: Staggerwing on May 15, 2016, 09:07:09 AM
How long till Life imitates Fiction and the MS' Cortana also goes all Skynet for real?
:))
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fshirtigo.co%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F06%2Fevolutiontotermination.jpg&hash=9e5aa9c32337365be0d8e41d996785e28fdcf0a8)
(https://i.imgur.com/5Kteg.jpg)
^^ Yep. I use both Win and MacOS, and that's accurate.
Almost accidentally installed Win 10 on either my Surface or the Presence again this weekend; just forgot to check whether the optional thing (namely Win 10) had been checked, since some update back there reactivated its flag. Fortunately they've made it easier to cancel out of installing it.
I suppose I'll have to get it on a new computer someday, and/or when they stop supporting Win 8.1 (which who knows could be any time). But only if Falcon says it's worth it.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 16, 2016, 01:37:20 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/5Kteg.jpg)
Actually, the last few OS X upgrades have been free.
Don't go all Sheldon Cooper on us.
omfg
http://www.cnet.com/news/microsoft-windows-10-upgrades-get-more-sneaky-pushy/
mirth, how do know that Microsoft hasn't already upgraded your system to Windows 10? They probably just left the Windows 7 skin in place as camouflage. (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aarcentral.com%2Fpics%2Fthinking.gif&hash=8d0acedf27b14588d564e6304e4c273477dffb35)
>:D
You're probably right :uglystupid2:
I had to Bitch-Slap my PC last night to stop it upgrading to Win 10. All by itself and when my favorite show was on like it knew I wasn't watching. :o I'm afraid to leave it turned on by itself anymore.
Also had my Win 7 start a spontaneous long (and not to be interrupted) process of converting to Win10 without any input from me (not to mention asking for my permission)...
Fortunately, for some reason it failed and I got "stuck" with Win 7 (poor me ;) ).
Yup, Window 10 started itself Friday morning on my wife's laptop, but we were able to stop it before any damage done.
Question, has anyone tried to install Win 10 on a virtual PC? I'm starting to think I might try that route (if its possible), just to grab a Win 10 key before the July deadline.
Quote from: steve58 on May 22, 2016, 09:51:40 AM
Yup, Window 10 started itself Friday morning on my wife's laptop, but we were able to stop it before any damage done.
Question, has anyone tried to install Win 10 on a virtual PC? I'm starting to think I might try that route (if its possible), just to grab a Win 10 key before the July deadline.
The key would probably be tied to the particular computer you ran the VM on, no? Or could you move it to a newer pc if you deauthorized it somehow on the old one?
Quote from: Staggerwing on May 22, 2016, 09:59:06 AM
The key would probably be tied to the particular computer you ran the VM on, no?
That is my understanding. The key is tied to the machine.
The Windows 10 key is tied to the OS key that you perform the upgrade with. It is possible to install Win10 without a key, in which case it can not be registered with MS and will have some features disabled/bonus nag-ware enabled. Licenses for unregistered installations of Win10 can be purchased for US$120 for home edition, $200 to go pro.
Hardware does not factor into this AFAIK
Quote from: Rekim on May 22, 2016, 10:19:54 AM
The Windows 10 key is tied to the OS key that you perform the upgrade with. It is possible to install Win10 without a key, in which case it can not be registered with MS and will have some features disabled/bonus nag-ware enabled. Licenses for unregistered installations of Win10 can be purchased for US$120 for home edition, $200 to go pro.
Hardware does not factor into this AFAIK
If the original was OEM, not retail (the case for any folks who didn't home-build), can you still use that key on a different machine? I alway thought the OEM keys were hardware specific.
Yes, OEM keys are tied to hardware.
Everything I've read about the upgrade key has indicated it is tied to machine (most likely to the Motherboard ID).
http://www.howtogeek.com/226510/how-to-use-your-free-windows-10-license-after-changing-your-pc%E2%80%99s-hardware/
http://www.thewindowsclub.com/windows-10-license-hardware-configuration
Windows 10 licenses carry the rights of the original key that it is upgraded from. OEM licenses are tied to hardware. Retail licenses are not.
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-win_upgrade/will-upgrading-motherboard-after-upgrading-to/a26e93c4-6886-4b44-99cf-7bf49ccba6ee?auth=1
Quote from: Rekim on May 22, 2016, 10:57:12 AM
Windows 10 licenses carry the rights of the original key that it is upgraded from. OEM licenses are tied to hardware. Retail licenses are not.
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-win_upgrade/will-upgrading-motherboard-after-upgrading-to/a26e93c4-6886-4b44-99cf-7bf49ccba6ee?auth=1
If I understand correctly, those who previously upgraded their OEM versions of Windows with a retail upgrade will have 'liberated' their license from being tied to a motherboard and would be able to take Win10 on to other rigs if they upgrade to it in time.
Drat, then sounds like if I want to grab a Windows 10 key, I'm going to have to do the upgrade, and then revert. :(
Quote from: steve58 on May 22, 2016, 03:04:25 PM
Drat, then sounds like if I want to grab a Windows 10 key, I'm going to have to do the upgrade, and then revert. :(
I tried the revert and it seems to work just fine. Since I have OEM copies of Win 7 I am taking the approach of building a new partition with my Win 7 install and then upgrading that partition to Win 10. I can boot back and forth as I like. It worked fine on my Win 7 laptop and I am in the process of doing this on my gaming desktop.
Granted this is a LOT easier if you have OEM media rather than a pre-install.
My issue appears to be that with an OEM copy I can't do a clean install of Win 10. I can't get it to activate. (I haven't tried the "call MS for a automated activate" option). What DOES seem to work is a clean install of my OEM Win 7 followed by a Win 10 upgrade. I can live with that.
Still doing a lot of testing. I did manage to use VirtualBox to do a Win7 install and Win 10 upgrade. No issues with Win 10 activation.
Quote from: steve58 on May 22, 2016, 03:04:25 PM
Drat, then sounds like if I want to grab a Windows 10 key, I'm going to have to do the upgrade, and then revert. :(
If you have a spare drive just clone your existing one to it and upgrade the spare.
...and the Microsoft SOBs are still pushing W10. Just looked up KB 3035583 (http://www.infoworld.com/article/3075480/microsoft-windows/microsofts-get-windows-10-app-kb-3035583-re-appears-for-no-reason.html) which suddenly showed up.
http://www.infoworld.com/article/3075480/microsoft-windows/microsofts-get-windows-10-app-kb-3035583-re-appears-for-no-reason.html
Look on the bright side...this will only happen until Windows 10 is no longer "free". Then you won't get any more of this! ;D
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F0MkMRzf.jpg&hash=c102ac806e064cb7bd96edff7fa3713897cb6104)
^ :2funny:
Pretty much sums up my feelings on MS and Win 10
http://www.networkworld.com/article/3077932/windows/credibility-and-trust-microsoft-blows-it.html (http://www.networkworld.com/article/3077932/windows/credibility-and-trust-microsoft-blows-it.html)
QuoteYou're not learning. Look at the amount of trust and veracity that was dashed against the rocks of Windows 7 users. Their OS actually worked for a change, and THEY DIDN'T WANT TO CHANGE. They wanted to get off the upgrade merry-go-round, wanted stability, and you gave them the total debacle called Windows 8.
You skipped 9, and despite the large warmth (hugely offset by perceived privacy issues), you crammed them with messages. Leave them alone. Stop it. You're behaving badly. Time to send a product manager to China or perhaps to the Xbox returns warehouse
Quote from: mirth on June 06, 2016, 10:19:55 AM
Pretty much sums up my feelings on MS and Win 10
http://www.networkworld.com/article/3077932/windows/credibility-and-trust-microsoft-blows-it.html (http://www.networkworld.com/article/3077932/windows/credibility-and-trust-microsoft-blows-it.html)
QuoteYou’re not learning. Look at the amount of trust and veracity that was dashed against the rocks of Windows 7 users. Their OS actually worked for a change, and THEY DIDN’T WANT TO CHANGE. They wanted to get off the upgrade merry-go-round, wanted stability, and you gave them the total debacle called Windows 8.
You skipped 9, and despite the large warmth (hugely offset by perceived privacy issues), you crammed them with messages. Leave them alone. Stop it. You’re behaving badly. Time to send a product manager to China or perhaps to the Xbox returns warehouse
Good article. I agree with it too. In the main I have been quite happy with Win7 too. Do I trust the motives of MS with Win 10? I'm really not sure about whether going down the Win 10 route is something I'd live to regret later, which is a huge trust issue with Microsoft.
I found this yesterday to get control the GWX icon and downloads... It was recommended by a number of site and it seems to be working fine on my Win 7 PC... You can toggle off the WIn 10 DL icon on or off as you please. Also it says it will prevent any inadvertent downloads.
http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/
Luddites!
Enjoy the collective, Locutus.
You mean 7 of 10. :P
Quote from: bbmike on June 12, 2016, 05:40:49 PM
Luddites!
Well maybe. I must admit I was swayed by someone who claimed to be an MS engineer of 15 years on YouTube who was giving his view of it, plus his thoughts behind the business model for "giving" Win 10 away. There's no thing as a free lunch, so he had some credibility...
The rub is that you cannot hang on to Win7 forever. After MS stops supporting it you won't be able to spend much time online for fear of never-to-be-repaired security holes and most new apps won't run unless you stay OS-current. The only solution is to either give in to the Big Data Mine, or only use WinXXX to play your latest PC games and then, when more sensitive matters are at hand, either dual boot or switch machines and go with either one of the lesser evils (OSX or Chrome OS) or join the Occupy Internet movement of Linux.
Quote from: Staggerwing on June 12, 2016, 07:02:44 PM
The rub is that you cannot hang on to Win7 forever. After MS stops supporting it you won't be able to spend much time online for fear of never-to-be-repaired security holes and most new apps won't run unless you stay OS-current. The only solution is to either give in to the Big Data Mine, or only use WinXXX to play your latest PC games and then, when more sensitive matters are at hand, either dual boot or switch machines and go with either one of the lesser evils (OSX or Chrome OS) or join the Occupy Internet movement of Linux.
It gets ever more complicated... one way to destroy the internet by making things ever more difficult, I suppose... Still like you say I can always move to Linux.
M$ in trouble after Win10 update installs itself on Win7 machine, leaving it unstable. Californian woman sues and gets $10,000 as M$ does not contest the suit. A trickle leading to a flood?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36640464
So with ten days to go for the free upgrade, anyone else going to do ahead and do it? My friend upgraded his Windows 7 to 10 and he said he has no issues, but he doesn't use it as a gaming platform like I do.
I am tempted to do the upgrade this week as it appears to be easy to downgrade back to Windows 7 within 30 days of the upgrade. My only concern is that I have a Norton Ghost backup of my HDD before it crashed in February and Ghost doesn't really work with Windows 10. I wanted to hang onto this backup in case I want to retrieve some files before the drive crashed.
I will not be upgrading. Win 7 will continue to supported with security patches until 2020. I'll switch to Linux by then.
M$ can kiss my hairy ass.
Win update hasn't worked on my Win 7 pc since I removed the Win 10 pimp bot kernel.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 19, 2016, 02:33:58 PM
Win update hasn't worked on my Win 7 pc since I removed the Win 10 pimp bot kernel.
How did you remove it? I used GWX Control Panel. It removed the Win 10 notification crap, but I still get regular updates from MS. I check everything now before I install any updates and I pretty much limit to security stuff.
Quote from: WallysWorld on July 19, 2016, 01:55:04 PM
So with ten days to go for the free upgrade, anyone else going to do ahead and do it? My friend upgraded his Windows 7 to 10 and he said he has no issues, but he doesn't use it as a gaming platform like I do.
I am tempted to do the upgrade this week as it appears to be easy to downgrade back to Windows 7 within 30 days of the upgrade. My only concern is that I have a Norton Ghost backup of my HDD before it crashed in February and Ghost doesn't really work with Windows 10. I wanted to hang onto this backup in case I want to retrieve some files before the drive crashed.
btw - it is possible to reserve a Win10 license for your Win7 box without the need to install it right away
I suppose they'll stop supporting Win 8.1 eventually, but by then I'll be looking at new computers anyway.
Still, if there's a way to reserve a free Win 10 for my computers, I'd be somewhat interested. I don't want to risk starting the update process to find out how, though!
The Paranoid way: Clone your HDD, swap out the clone for the original, upgrade the clone to Win10, then put the original HDD back in. Now you have a Win10 license tied to your mobo.
The trusting way: Upgrade your rig to Win10, play with Win10 for a week or two, then revert your rig back to Win8.1 within 30 days using the revert option. Now you have a Win10 license tied to your mobo.
I finally gave in and updated my desktop PC to Win10, from Win7.
There is only one reason I felt the need to do so. Future use of DirectX 12. Which MS had originally said they would include on Win7-8, but took it back after realizing it was a good way to push Win10. I'm not sore about that in the least! <sarcasm> :knuppel2:
Frankly, I don't think Win10 has any real value over the Win7 I was using. Other than the above mentioned manipulation forced up on us.
Hell.. the surprising compatibility of most drivers & programs, after the switch, just proves to me that it's still mostly Windows 7 underneath. Only with extra spyware, an annoying Cortana (which was quickly turned off), and a slightly different look. ::)
MS still did the same shit they always do, in newer versions of Windows. Further burying essential windows settings panels & options under even more layers of misdirection. They add an extra click or two, and move a part of the path around, every damn time. They're either trying to hide them or attempting to force you to use the windows search box and recall the control panel sections by name. :tickedoff:
Just getting stuff like the Windows Sound or Disk Management options via mouse clicks, in Win10, was pissing me off with fruitlessness. I eventually started resorting to typing them in the damn Windows search box to get to it, and other settings like it. Worse every time. Still glad it's not as horrid as Windows 8.. what a piece of shit that UI was. But they still left some of it buried, as they did with that one.
With three days to go, I finally decided against the upgrade. Not enough positives to upgrade and I'm happy with Windows 7 and lastly with another three and a half years of Windows 7 support, I should have a new PC by 2020.
Quote from: WallysWorld on July 26, 2016, 03:27:07 PM
With three days to go, I finally decided against the upgrade. Not enough positives to upgrade and I'm happy with Windows 7 and lastly with another three and a half years of Windows 7 support, I should have a new PC by 2020.
That also factored into my decision to upgrade this one.
While it is likely that I'll build a new PC near the end of Win7 support, it also means that this one will become the new computer connected to my HDTV. Which means it'll still get used on occasion, afterward.
It'll be used for a long time to come. Still think the upgrade was just due to MS manipulating me into doing so, between Dx12 and future security updates.
So, the wretched Win10 reminder thing has indulged in a new trick. After I declined the free upgrade during startup, by the way.
You know the reminder has its own little icon in the system tray at (usually) the bottom of the screen, over on the right with other startup item icons. Since it loads near the beginning, it has a tendency to move semi-randomly as other things load in; meaning that it's possible to click on it accidentally if you try to turn off or otherwise access certain icons (like the Steam icon) before loadin has finished.
That happened to me a few minutes ago. So the Win update (since I right-clicked on it) threw up a little menu window. You know the drill: "Get Windows 10" "Check your upgrade status" "Go to Windows Update" etc.
Naturally I didn't want any of those so I clicked elsewhere to get rid of the popup window.
It won't
go
away
!
I'm looking at it right now, while typing this. I've tried everything short of starting a game, which I can't do from steam because the menu section for "Learn About Windows 10" is active under the system tray bar!
Win10, y'all. Win10. Of all the Win10s in the world, Win10, you're the Win10iest. :uglystupid2: :crazy2:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.kinja-img.com%2Fgawker-media%2Fimage%2Fupload%2Fs--S-oLuIgz--%2Fc_fit%2Cfl_progressive%2Cq_80%2Cw_636%2Fxja6p0h6kmswll2iul4u.jpg&hash=6e104e304c4e95cbf333f1f0a1deb4f7cbf4ac94)
...yesterday eve i gave in :-[
(well, not after some final phone conference with my local leading IT-guru super-nerd friend about the pros and cons before )
there was no new terror that eve in Europe i had to watch unfold live over social and regular media, so i got bored and dared to terrorize myself with "Let's try the upgrade ...and live with the fallout"
(this is not completely correct: we had a shopping center #Weserpark swapped by SWAT for a psychotic dangerous refugee escaped from an mental institution, a mosque raided by SWAT for a tiny tiny crack down on local islamists in #Hildesheim ... and the best media ruckus of all: a burning suitcase which gave a puff when an spraycan inside 'exploded' a mile away from a refugee registration center in #Zirndorf ...where the do-gooders leftgreen plus media were lusting to report about first 'rightwinger retaliations') ...welcome to the #Merkelsommer (a political term on twitter) of 2016
and it looks like i am blessed and have seen no hassle so far beside adjusting to the new look and feel of W10
Against the MS spy activities i used a recommended free tool that let me switch all setting on one page and also give an explanation on every item to switch on/off
https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10
so it saved me 130 bucks i would have to spend in the future and let the DirectX12-option supporting games roll in without a second thought
knocking on wood for further testing my regular stuff
I'm not planning on upgrading my gaming rig soon but I've already upgraded my son's computer (all he does is watch youtube videos and browse Amazon) and the 'microform' computer I use to run my 3D printers (no financial stuff and web browsing is limited to Thingiverse and printing forums) and I do have to say that they both run smoothly.
My biggest gripe besides privacy concerns is, as mentioned above, that many of the system settings are buried deeply or are only accessed in non-intuitive ways. Want to check your device drivers for the first time? Good luck without first looking it up online.
Upgraded my rig this past weekend and so far everything's working fine.
Except that Edge doesn't play well with this forum's message buttons for images, youtube etc, or smilies...?
Turned off everything I could find for privacy, but will use Mike's link to search out more. O0
Upgraded my wife's old laptop yesterday just so I could actually lay eyes on Windows 10. Can't upgrade her current laptop since she uses it for work and Windows 10 may not play nice with some of the apps she needs. Still debating about my rig...
Quote from: Barthheart on July 28, 2016, 06:41:00 AM
Upgraded my rig this past weekend and so far everything's working fine.
Except that Edge doesn't play well with this forum's message buttons for images, youtube etc, or smilies...?
Turned off everything I could find for privacy, but will use Mike's link to search out more. O0
I found Edge to be more worthless than Internet Explorer. Still using Firefox and Chrome. Wait, wasn't that a Battlestar movie?
Quote from: Barthheart on July 28, 2016, 06:41:00 AM
Except that Edge doesn't play well with this forum's message buttons for images, youtube etc, or smilies...?
Chrome works fine w/ Win10.
Well, today is the last day (July 29) to "upgrade" to Windows 10 for free. Been playing around with it a bit on my wife's old laptop. Thinking I'll probably cave shortly and upgrade on my desktop. I can always go back to Windows 7. Wish me luck... ::)
Quote from: steve58 on July 29, 2016, 09:37:25 AM
Well, today is the last day (July 29) to "upgrade" to Windows 10 for free. Been playing around with it a bit on my wife's old laptop. Thinking I'll probably cave shortly and upgrade on my desktop. I can always go back to Windows 7. Wish me luck... ::)
Will they allow you to revert to Win7 after the free update period?
*I'd suggest checking whether your wife's "old laptop" is compatible with Win10.*
Was reinstalling Win7 on my laptop a few months ago and noticed, on the manufacturer's driver download site, a warning. That my laptop's mainboard chipset and BIOS didn't support Win10. There is an optional BIOS firmware update available, but it's listed "use at your own peril" type of thing and only for attempting Win10 on it. ???
In the case of my laptop, I'm staying with Win7 anyway. It's weak little GT640M video isn't going to be cranking gfx options up on anything fancy, so Dx12 (my only reason for upgrading, really) isn't needed on it.
Its already installed and running OK (as far as I can tell) on the old laptop, didn't get any warnings prior to or during the install. Even downloaded/installed ClassicShell on it...
Well, started the upgrade around 11am and at ~1:50pm, it was at 96%. The closer it was getting to 100%, the slower the update seemed to be going. Next thing I see is the upgrade screen telling me that the Windows 10 Upgrade was starting/downloading...WTF. Looked on my C drive and the update folder had gone for over 3GB, down to 10-20MB. So the whole update had somehow restarted. I'm thinking the computer gods are trying to tell me to just stick with Windows 7...
What are you windows 10 guys doing for a reformat ? Are you guys saving a copy of the download ? How will the free up grade work a year from now when you do a complet os reinstall and have no disk?
Edit:
Lol, figured it out, you can download an ISO of a fresh full windows 10 install from thier website and put it on a flash drive or Dvd as a boot disk when reformatting. Your upgraded key is now tied to windows 10, just install the ISO when reformatting and off you go.
Quote from: Skoop on July 29, 2016, 04:54:52 PM
What are you windows 10 guys doing for a reformat ? Are you guys saving a copy of the download ? How will the free up grade work a year from now when you do a complet os reinstall and have no disk?
Edit:
Lol, figured it out, you can download an ISO of a fresh full windows 10 install from thier website and put it on a flash drive or Dvd as a boot disk when reformatting. Your upgraded key is now tied to windows 10, just install the ISO when reformatting and off you go.
Having purchased OEM copies of Win 7 my process was a little different. I actually had to reinstall Win 7 and THEN upgrade to Win 10 using the downloaded ISO. I could not do a clean Win 10 install without having issues with the product key. On the other hand, doing a clean install of my OEM Win 7 followed by the Win 10 upgrade worked fine every time. As it stands right now I have Win 10 installed on a different partition on both my desktop and laptop and I can boot whichever way I want.
Quote from: DoctorQuest on July 29, 2016, 09:26:23 PM
Quote from: Skoop on July 29, 2016, 04:54:52 PM
What are you windows 10 guys doing for a reformat ? Are you guys saving a copy of the download ? How will the free up grade work a year from now when you do a complet os reinstall and have no disk?
Edit:
Lol, figured it out, you can download an ISO of a fresh full windows 10 install from thier website and put it on a flash drive or Dvd as a boot disk when reformatting. Your upgraded key is now tied to windows 10, just install the ISO when reformatting and off you go.
Having purchased OEM copies of Win 7 my process was a little different. I actually had to reinstall Win 7 and THEN upgrade to Win 10 using the downloaded ISO. I could not do a clean Win 10 install without having issues with the product key. On the other hand, doing a clean install of my OEM Win 7 followed by the Win 10 upgrade worked fine every time. As it stands right now I have Win 10 installed on a different partition on both my desktop and laptop and I can boot whichever way I want.
The downside being that, after installing Win7, it'll have even more Windows updates to do before it upgrades to Win10. >:(
It really hasn't seemed to be that bad. I just plan on giving up the computer for a couple of hours for that sort of work, anyway. Upgrades and installs are sort of hurry up and wait exercises at the best of times.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2016/08/windows-10-microsoft-blatantly-disregards-user-choice-and-privacy-deep-dive
I thought this was pretty good. I've downloaded the Spybot program he recommends and it seems to work well. (I already use Spybot S&D).
Spybot rocks. Been using it for 10-plus years.
MS recently had me answer a poll as to how likely I would be to recommend W10 to a friend! I selected "Not at all likely." I was then prompted to give the reason for my answer. I said "Because of the incredibly obnoxious and arrogant manner in which you forced me to switch. Did you think I'd forget?"
Heh. Nice response. O0
Quote from: Ubercat on October 25, 2016, 02:04:49 PM
MS recently had me answer a poll as to how likely I would be to recommend W10 to a friend! I selected "Not at all likely." I was then prompted to give the reason for my answer. I said "Because of the incredibly obnoxious and arrogant manner in which you forced me to switch. Did you think I'd forget?"
Landru. Gates. He remembers. He knows and he watches. You are strange. Are you not of the Body?
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/01/11/microsofts_new_windows_telemetry_manager/
Microsoft going to add a Game Mode to Windows 10 (https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2017/01/16/windows-10-game-mode-performance/#more-423575).
http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/17/14956540/microsoft-windows-10-ads-taskbar-file-explorer
We need a Grogs Linux team. Or at least maybe a sticky tech topic for folks to share information.
I get frustrated by most of the Linux community. A lot of them are snots when it comes to helping those less knowledgeable but they have plenty of time to denigrate Windows users as stupid. I've seen it on these forums.
I'm ready to replace my wife's Win 10 machine with a Mac. F**k you, MS.
Well, we had Huw but he's been silent for quite some time now.
Quote from: bbmike on March 17, 2017, 03:47:20 PM
Well, we had Huw but he's been silent for quite some time now.
He was the resident Linux expert.
I know. I hope he's ok. One wonders what happens to people to annoy Microsoft.
All hail Emperor Gates!
Quote from: DoctorQuest on March 17, 2017, 03:53:46 PM
I know. I hope he's ok. One wonders what happens to people to annoy Microsoft.
He is OK, I talk to him on Steam now and again. He has, for whatever reason, stopped posting here.
Quote from: bob48 on March 17, 2017, 04:39:56 PM
Quote from: DoctorQuest on March 17, 2017, 03:53:46 PM
I know. I hope he's ok. One wonders what happens to people to annoy Microsoft.
He is OK, I talk to him on Steam now and again. He has, for whatever reason, stopped posting here.
Good to hear he is OK.
Quote from: DoctorQuest on March 17, 2017, 05:06:29 PM
Quote from: bob48 on March 17, 2017, 04:39:56 PM
Quote from: DoctorQuest on March 17, 2017, 03:53:46 PM
I know. I hope he's ok. One wonders what happens to people to annoy Microsoft.
He is OK, I talk to him on Steam now and again. He has, for whatever reason, stopped posting here.
Good to hear he is OK.
+1
+2. O0
Very glad to hear Huw is ok. Tell him to drop us a line sometime.
A linux grog subforum would be quite welcome. I've tried to make the switch to Linux several times now only to be stymied by stupid stuff like getting printers to work. I'm getting ready to try again and trying to decide between two different 'distros' (versions of linux): LinuxMint and Ubuntu. Ubunto is slightly closer to OSX in 'feel' and Mint slightly closer to Windows. For any others trying to decide here's an article about the two:
http://lifehacker.com/5993297/ubuntu-vs-mint-which-linux-distro-is-better-for-beginners
The biggest hurdle to sticking with Linux of any kind is accepting that sooner or later you will have to use it''s version of Terminal and command line, at least occasionally. I imagine that there must be quite a few grogs who are already familiar with them. Most of the general population who use Windows or OSX may never even need to know those things exist.
Linux command line isn't too bad. If you need to know how to tank an Apache server, let me know.
Why do I get the feeling those instructions would be preceded by "You know,in the end it's actually a funny story but..."
Quote from: mirth on March 17, 2017, 10:52:31 AM
http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/17/14956540/microsoft-windows-10-ads-taskbar-file-explorer
What a bunch of goobers. :buck2:
Quote from: Staggerwing on March 17, 2017, 06:45:37 PM
Why do I get the feeling those instructions would be preceded by "You know,in the end it's actually a funny story but..."
It's like you know him or something...
So, if you want that latest, fastset CPU, Microsoft sez...
Quote
Microsoft is blocking Windows 7 and 8 updates on Intel's seventh generation Core i3, i5 and i7 (Kaby Lake), AMD's Ryzen (Bristol Ridge) and Qualcomm's 8996 processors. Devices powered by these processors must update to Windows 10 in order to receive updates from Microsoft.
The problem will manifest only when you try to run Windows Update, when you'll see an error message: "Windows could not search for new updates" and "Code 80240037 Windows Update encountered an unknown error".
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ianmorris/2017/03/17/microsoft-admits-forcing-more-users-onto-windows-10/#77cff197780f
Seriously, it's like they're actively trying to get their customers to hate them. >:( ::)
That shouldn't take much more effort.
https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft-windows-10-keylogger-enabled-default-heres-disable/
Conspiracy theory! :) I dislike MS a little more each and every day.
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:07:59 PM
https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft-windows-10-keylogger-enabled-default-heres-disable/
Thanks for that. I was on and I turned it off. But I still think Obama is tapping my wires.
Quote from: bbmike on March 22, 2017, 12:13:58 PM
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:07:59 PM
https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/blog/2017/03/microsoft-windows-10-keylogger-enabled-default-heres-disable/
Thanks for that. I was on and I turned it off. But I still think Obama is tapping my wires.
Worse. Trump is.
This reminds me I need to re-read 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 at some point in the near future.
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:20:34 PM
This reminds me I need to re-read 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 at some point in the near future.
Don't re-read 1984. It will only depress you to realize we've moved well past Orwellian.
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:26:45 PM
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:20:34 PM
This reminds me I need to re-read 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 at some point in the near future.
Don't re-read 1984. It will only depress you to realize we've moved well past Orwellian.
I need the validation.
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:26:45 PM
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:20:34 PM
This reminds me I need to re-read 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 at some point in the near future.
Don't re-read 1984. It will only depress you to realize we've moved well past Orwellian.
Past Orwellian and straight into Gilliganian?
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:27:41 PM
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:26:45 PM
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:20:34 PM
This reminds me I need to re-read 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 at some point in the near future.
Don't re-read 1984. It will only depress you to realize we've moved well past Orwellian.
I need the validation.
A dozen kids isn't enough validation?
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:28:39 PM
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:27:41 PM
Quote from: mirth on March 22, 2017, 12:26:45 PM
Quote from: Bison on March 22, 2017, 12:20:34 PM
This reminds me I need to re-read 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 at some point in the near future.
Don't re-read 1984. It will only depress you to realize we've moved well past Orwellian.
I need the validation.
A dozen kids isn't enough validation?
Not for my conspiracy theory self it isn't.