Humankind! Civ-like game from Endless Space developers

Started by Rayfer, August 19, 2019, 03:39:32 PM

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Martok

I've really been making an effort to not comment on Humankind since it was announced, as 1.) I don't want to poo-poo it before it's even out, and 2.) the Civilization franchise badly needs real competition to jolt it out of its lethargy.  What I've seen of this game thus far has not impressed me, though:  There are a lot of neat-sounding concepts that get mentioned, but then seem pretty lame in the actual details/execution. 

I want to be wrong, and I may very well be so.  But I already know that I won't purchase Humankind until long after it's released. 
"Like we need an excuse to drink to anything..." - Banzai_Cat
"I like to think of it not as an excuse but more like Pavlovian Response." - Sir Slash

"At our ages, they all look like jailbait." - mirth

"If we had lines here that would have crossed all of them. For the 1,077,986th time." - Gusington

"Government is so expensive that it should at least be entertaining." - airboy

"As long as there's bacon, everything will be all right." - Toonces

Gusington



слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

Destraex

It's not in space and it's not real time like Stellaris which would really limit the multiplayer side of the game. It's hard to play a turn based game in a multiplayer setting with more than two people. I have had games with six people in stellaris, saved them part way through and come back to them.
Those two factors I think, will really limit the playerbase.
"They only asked the Light Brigade to do it once"

Martok

Quote from: Gusington on March 14, 2020, 06:14:35 PM
I want you to be wrong too! BE MORE WRONG
Well I often am, so I wouldn't fret overly much.  ;) 


Plus, as I've mentioned before/elsewhere, I'm not a fan of Amplitude's products, so my critiques should definitely be taken with at least a grain of salt or two.  I just cannot get into their games, no matter how much I want to.  I love that they're passionate about making strategy games, but the ones they make simply don't appeal to me. 




Quote from: Destraex on March 14, 2020, 07:24:17 PM
It's not in space and it's not real time like Stellaris which would really limit the multiplayer side of the game. It's hard to play a turn based game in a multiplayer setting with more than two people. I have had games with six people in stellaris, saved them part way through and come back to them.
Those two factors I think, will really limit the playerbase.
I'll play devil's advocate and disagree with you.  I predict that won't have any significant impact, negatively or otherwise. 

While the MP community of any 4x game is often vocal, it generally makes up only a very small percentage of the total player-base.  Thus, regardless of how enjoyable (or not) Humankind's MP ends up being, its affect on the the size of the games player-base (and/or amount of sales) will be minimal. 

"Like we need an excuse to drink to anything..." - Banzai_Cat
"I like to think of it not as an excuse but more like Pavlovian Response." - Sir Slash

"At our ages, they all look like jailbait." - mirth

"If we had lines here that would have crossed all of them. For the 1,077,986th time." - Gusington

"Government is so expensive that it should at least be entertaining." - airboy

"As long as there's bacon, everything will be all right." - Toonces

Destraex

Martok, do you disagree with my first point, my hypothesis that sci-fi is more popular than an ancient setting?
With regard to multiplayer, I really do think that Stellaris has a larger multiplayer community than those 4x games that came before. As with any game that is not purely multiplayer, it will have a much larger single player community. I agree with that. However I think that a strong multiplayer community is a catalyst for success. Because the social aspect of a strong multiplayer community will ensure huge multimedia coverage at every turn throughout the life of the game. Which in turn will feed single player sales as well as bringing on more multiplayer people.
So when I say Stellaris has a larger multiplayer community than most of it's type, I mean that this new game, I just cannot see having a community like that to help it's sales. It's an advantage I think real time 4x games have and something that I would say is one of the key ingredients to being better than Stellaris.
From my perspective, a major motivator for people is the possibility that even though you buy it intending to learn and play primarily in single player mode, that you have the option to enjoy it with friends and therefore will talk with friends about it. Enriching the experience considerably.

Now you may be right, single player games may sell more copies than multiplayer games. But I would be interested to see the difference in figures for comparable games with and without a strong multiplayer offering.
"They only asked the Light Brigade to do it once"

Martok

Quote from: Destraex on March 14, 2020, 10:01:41 PM
Martok, do you disagree with my first point, my hypothesis that sci-fi is more popular than an ancient setting?
Argh, sorry.  No, I was referring to the virtues of turn-based vs. real-time as it applies to MP in 4x/grand-strategy games. 

That being said, I partially and/or potentially disagree with that statement as well, depending on how precisely you care to parse things (I feel like I'm entering JP-levels of detail/explanation here)... 


If you're referring specifically to 4x titles, then yes I would agree that those with science-fiction settings (especially ones in space) are more popular than 4x games set in ancient history.  (The Civilization franchise doesn't count, since the games cover all historical eras.)  That is overwhelmingly apparent. 

If, however, you're referring more generally to grand-strategy games -- which typically include 4x games under its umbrella -- then the question becomes a lot murkier.  The success & popularity of the Total War franchise, Paradox's various historical titles (Crusader Kings, Europa Universalis, etc.), and older series like Imperialism and Lords of the Realm make a pretty compelling counter-argument. 




Quote from: Destraex on March 14, 2020, 10:01:41 PMWith regard to multiplayer, I really do think that Stellaris has a larger multiplayer community than those 4x games that came before. As with any game that is not purely multiplayer, it will have a much larger single player community. I agree with that. However I think that a strong multiplayer community is a catalyst for success. Because the social aspect of a strong multiplayer community will ensure huge multimedia coverage at every turn throughout the life of the game. Which in turn will feed single player sales as well as bringing on more multiplayer people.
So when I say Stellaris has a larger multiplayer community than most of it's type, I mean that this new game, I just cannot see having a community like that to help it's sales. It's an advantage I think real time 4x games have and something that I would say is one of the key ingredients to being better than Stellaris.
From my perspective, a major motivator for people is the possibility that even though you buy it intending to learn and play primarily in single player mode, that you have the option to enjoy it with friends and therefore will talk with friends about it. Enriching the experience considerably.

Now you may be right, single player games may sell more copies than multiplayer games. But I would be interested to see the difference in figures for comparable games with and without a strong multiplayer offering.
All fair points.  I would be interested in those figures as well. 

"Like we need an excuse to drink to anything..." - Banzai_Cat
"I like to think of it not as an excuse but more like Pavlovian Response." - Sir Slash

"At our ages, they all look like jailbait." - mirth

"If we had lines here that would have crossed all of them. For the 1,077,986th time." - Gusington

"Government is so expensive that it should at least be entertaining." - airboy

"As long as there's bacon, everything will be all right." - Toonces

Anguille

#36
Very long discussion here! Nice.

I have had my share of struggle to enjoy the games by Amplitute. I think they have some of the best artwork and music on the market. From gameplay point of view, i don't think that they are that good but the games have involved a lot. After some effort to understand the game, Endless Space 2 is a very cool game and much better than Stellaris.

Now, i won't mind the bigger cities if the maps are big enough.

On MP: i also don't think that 4x are great for that and that the majority plays single play as it just takes too much time.

Also, i fully agree with Martok...it's been far too long since Civilization games had any type of competition.

Gusington

I can't say I enjoy their games because I haven't had the time to really learn them but I respect the obvious hard work they put into them. Still looking forward to Humankind (and a title change for it).


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

steve58

Another casualty of COVID19.  But the devs are going to have an OpenDev over the summer.

"Register for the chance to get access to three time-limited scenarios focusing on specific core features of the game (exploration, tactical battles, basic city management). Throughout the summer, scenarios will be released one at a time, and additional players will gain access with each new scenario drop. Any new access granted will include access to all the previous scenarios."
Government is not the solution to our problem—government is the problem.   Ronald Reagan
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.   Thomas Jefferson
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.   George Orwell  The truth is quiet...It's the lies that are loud.   Jesus Revolution
If you ever find yourself in need of a safe space then you're probably going to have to stop calling yourself a social justice warrior. You cannot be a warrior and a pansy at the same time   Mike Adams (RIP Mike)

Gusington



слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

steve58

#40
Unlocking on Steam on Aug 17.  Fanatical currently has Digital Deluxe version for $42.

Myself, I think I'm going to wait on this one for a bit.

p.s.  mods can maybe change OP thread title?

p.p.s  Martok, long time no see?
Government is not the solution to our problem—government is the problem.   Ronald Reagan
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.   Thomas Jefferson
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.   George Orwell  The truth is quiet...It's the lies that are loud.   Jesus Revolution
If you ever find yourself in need of a safe space then you're probably going to have to stop calling yourself a social justice warrior. You cannot be a warrior and a pansy at the same time   Mike Adams (RIP Mike)

Gusington

Does anyone know if players can choose which eras they play through? If I want to play only until the medieval or renaissance eras, can I do that?


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

Grim.Reaper

And don't be stupid like me.....pre-ordered and then find out coming out as part of the GamePass subscription service which I own:)  $40 down the drain.......

Gusington



слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

steve58

Government is not the solution to our problem—government is the problem.   Ronald Reagan
The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.   Thomas Jefferson
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.   George Orwell  The truth is quiet...It's the lies that are loud.   Jesus Revolution
If you ever find yourself in need of a safe space then you're probably going to have to stop calling yourself a social justice warrior. You cannot be a warrior and a pansy at the same time   Mike Adams (RIP Mike)