New toys for Yskonyn (43" monitor and GTX1080)

Started by Yskonyn, September 28, 2016, 05:21:38 AM

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Yskonyn

After quite some research I have decided to leave VR for now and instead upgrade my visual equipment.
As mainly a combat simmer my focus is on clarity and sharpness of the image so being prepared for the future of common 4K content should be wise.

I dicided against curved screens because I also use digital art software and trying to draw straight line on a curved screen doesnt work well.
I also decided against going for an ultra wide screen because their height usually isn't bigger than my current monitor and only give a wider FOV and better sharpness due to the increased res over my old monitor, but I use TrackIR in all sims so I dont feel FOV is an issue.
I prefer the screen ratio of a 16:9 unit.
So the conclusion is to go bigger to enable a greater immersion factor, but the screen needs to have decent pixel density and great colour uniformity.

Meet Philips' Brilliance BDM4350UC (dutch link)

A professional grade 43" 4K monster of a monitor with great clarity, good colour uniformity IPS panel and a decent response for gaming.
It runs at 4K at 60hz in HDMI 2.0 or DisplayPort 1.2.
At 650 euro's its basically a steal for the specs you get.

To power it I have also upgraded my videocard from a GTX780 to a GTX1080.
I went for the Asus ROG GTX1080 STRIX 8G after glowing reviews of the unit.

I had to solemny swear to my wife that I would be quiet for the coming years about further gear for the PC, but there you have it! :) Happy!
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Staggerwing

Sounds like a real find, that monitor!

PS: Your hyperlinks need a little cleanup- they somehow got embedded inside themselves:

Philips' Brilliance BDM4350UC


Asus ROG GTX1080 STRIX 8G


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Yskonyn

Thanks for re-linking Staggerwing!
I can pick up the hardware tomorrow.
Will report back with pictures and findings.
All giddy like a child before X-mas day. :)
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

Monitor technology is something I have always ignored and I'm beginning to feel like I'm missing the boat. I game from a 27" monitor with a max resolution of 1920x1080.

Yskonyn mentioned his new 43" 4k monitor in the VR thread and got me thinking that I'm due for an upgrade. I see a lot of big monitors out there that are advertised as 4K, but there are a lot of other stats and numbers and I'm not sure what is most important for gaming. I rather not spend a grand on a monitor. I see some on Amazon that are in the $500 to $600 range and spec wise they look very similar. What should I really be looking out for? What are the most important specs and does anyone have any suggestions for a nice big, 4k monitor for more or less a budget price? Quality is important, but I don't need a name brand.

I've already got a GTX 1080, so the monitor may be the only thing holding me back.
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Barthheart

Here is a site that does extremely detailed review of monitors. Link is for Yskonyn's monster.

https://pcmonitors.info/reviews/philips-bdm4350uc/

I'm sure there's enough info on this site to help you out.

Their recommendations page lists what's good about the monitors they review with respect to what you want to use it for.

https://pcmonitors.info/recommendations/


Yskonyn

#5
That's one of the sites I have used as well.

For gaming the most significant spec is response time and input lag. But the subject is far more nuanced than just one value. As the above mentioned site shows: there are various ways to test these two specs.
Also, in relation to response time you have to ask yourself what kind of gamer you are?
Are you a tournament oriented player who demands optimum performance where every single frame might count then 60hz screens are not your thing and you will be limited in choice and price.

For a normal gamer there is nothing wrong with a 60hz screen as long as the input lag is under control. Usually office oriented screens or those oriented towards digital creativity are slower screens but with very high consistency in colour, gamma, brightness and uniformity.
So the image looks great, but the input lag makes gaming not very comfortable with lots of ghosting artifacts.

If you are an all rounder like me then the task is difficult. A gamer screen often has very oversaturated colours by default and tweaking them properly depends on the manufacturer; some screens have more options to do this than others.
Furthermore gaming screens make you Choose between Freesync (AMD) or Gsync (Nvidia) where Gsync is harder to come by and is more expensive.

Then there is the question of going ultra wide or not?
Be advised that monitor sizes in inches are calculated on the screen diagonal. So a 34" ultra wide screen is less high than a 34" 16:9 screen.
I prefer the 16:9 aspect ratio myself, but others prefer ultra wide.

If you do want to go ultra wide then the question comes do I want curved or not?
For me it was easy; drawing straight lines on a curved screen is awkward, so I pass.
Curved is about 100 bucks more expensive than the same straight model.

The gamer questions are thus:
-what are its response time and input lag?
-do I want ultra wide or 16:9?
-do I want curved?
-do I want 4K or 1440p? (I wouldn't go for 1080p on a new upgrade)
-does the monitor scale non native resolutions ok?
-does my vidcard handle its native res?
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

Jesus...you're not making this decision any easier, or less complicated.  :crazy2:
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

I know! But I am here to help, JH!

Let's start simple: Do you want a big screen or not? What would be the minimum size (not res) of a new monitor to be a worthwhile upgrade for you?
And what monitor do you currently have?
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

Quote from: Yskonyn on September 29, 2016, 01:45:05 PM
I know! But I am here to help, JH!

Let's start simple: Do you want a big screen or not? What would be the minimum size (not res) of a new monitor to be a worthwhile upgrade for you?
And what monitor do you currently have?

I do want a big screen. Currently on my desktop I have two 27" monitors. One of the monitors is an acer and the other is an LG. They are both 1080p. I think I'd like to move up to no smaller than 34" and I'd like 4K capability.
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

Pretty much the same requirements I wanted.

Well, seeing you already have 27" 16:9 monitors I would say if you go for a 34" 21:9 ultra wide screen you will basically only increase your FOV and horizontal screenspace in Windows. The sensation of these monitors will not be one of them feeling bigger in general. 34" UW screens vary a bit in height, but they probably won't differ much in height from your current monitors. Something to keep in the back of your mind.

A 32" 16:9 screen, however, will look quite a notch bigger than your 27" screens, because it is a whole factor larger (height and width) due to the similar aspect ratio.

The discussion about wether 21:9 gives you a better immersion is an endless one. Why wouldn't a 16:9 screen bigger than the UW give you a similar immersion factor? Sure, the FOV is much more narrow by default, but some games allow you to alter the FOV in-game. A bigger screen makes a bigger FOV viable, also on a 16:9 screen.

So, you should first determine which aspect ratio you want to go for; 16:9 or UW. Go to a few shops and look at the UW screens. But much larger than 34" isn't on the market at the moment in UW (at least I haven't seen them for consumers). They are indeed wide, but again, the height is pretty similar to your 27" screens. A reason I didn't really felt it would be much of an upgrade (aside from resolution).

The UW 4k screens are screaming expensive. Especially the curved ones, but for gaming the resolutions should be read as follows: 1080p is the standard hi-res at the moment, 1440p is early adopter and 4k is enthousiast.
Therefore the 1440p screens are the most commonly found screens, especially in the UW segment. LG soon comes with an extended resolution monitor in its UW range. 1440p, but with even more pixels over its width. It will cost around 1200 euros and isnt particularly fast for gaming.

If you don't want ultra wide you can have bigger screens up to 60". But I don't think the largest models have great response times.
The Philips model I linked is the biggest screen I have found with a decent enough response time for gaming. IIyama offers a 40" model for 100 euro's cheaper, but it has a pretty bad colour calibration (and few options to tweak that) and its input lag was tested to be quite high. Probably not the best choice for gaming.
That's what makes the Philips stand out so much; for the size you get so much value. Excellent colours (it even comes with a calibration report), 4k, 43", no input lag and a response time of about 0.5 frames. Not great for competitive fighting games or Counterstrike players, but more than enough for Battlefield on a normal entertainment value level of play, as well as more than decent for wargames, strategy games and mmo's.
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

What do you think of these specs?

Quote
Ultrafast 5 ms response time

Allows pixels to change colors quickly to avoid streaking, blurring and ghosting in fast-moving scenes and video games.
34" LED HD 21:9 ultrawide monitor

Features tilt, pivot, swivel and adjustable height, along with 178° horizontal and vertical viewing angles and IPS technology, so you can work or play games with ease.
80,000,000:1 contrast ratio

Provides a high number of shades between black and white. This range enables accurate color reproduction when displaying images with extreme differences between light and dark for excellent picture quality.
3440 x 1440 maximum resolution at 60Hz

Creates a high level of picture detail for a clear, bold display.
DVI-D, HDMI, DisplayPort and VGA inputs

Allow simple connection to your PC or Mac

For under $600, seems like a really good deal.

Don't know much about AOC, but they seem favorably reviewed. Also, doesn't seem to be true 4K, but at 3440 x 1440, will I really notice a difference?
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

It isn't a 4K monitor indeed. It's a 1440p monitor. The 3440 is the horizontal resolution and indicates an ultra wide model.

The contrast ratio is most definately dynamic ratio which doesn't tell you very much according to pcmonitors.info.

What model is that AOC monitor? If its the one features in a review on pcmonitors.info then I remember reading on hardware.info a contradiction about the response time.
There they claimed that input lag was too high for gaming, but I would have to know the model type.
I do know that AOC does have several quality monitors in their lineup.
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

#12
Quote from: Yskonyn on September 30, 2016, 03:24:30 PM
It isn't a 4K monitor indeed. It's a 1440p monitor. The 3440 is the horizontal resolution and indicates an ultra wide model.

The contrast ratio is most definately dynamic ratio which doesn't tell you very much according to pcmonitors.info.

What model is that AOC monitor? If its the one features in a review on pcmonitors.info then I remember reading on hardware.info a contradiction about the response time.
There they claimed that input lag was too high for gaming, but I would have to know the model type.
I do know that AOC does have several quality monitors in their lineup.

Its the AOC Professional U3477PQU 34-Inch Screen LED-Lit Monitor.

Thanks.

I see they reviewed it favorably and gave it their recommendation. I guess the key is whether I really want 4k, or not.
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

That is the model I saw too.
According to hardware.info (pretty reliable IMO) they did measure quite a bit of input lag and response times were average for IPS panels.
While pcmonitors.info reviewed it more positively for gaming. So it might be worthwhile to investigate a bit further.
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Yskonyn

For reference at 60hz you get 60 frames per second. 1/60 = 0.016667 seconds per frame. So each frame is 16.66 miliseconds.
The most important response time measurement for gaming is 20%-80%-20% in the specs reviews give.
So anything over 16ms will give you about 1 frame delay.
Now, wether you can actually see or 'feel' this is an entirely different subject.

This is a nice article on Overdrive; a system used to speed up response times, but it has drawbacks:
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/monitors/2009/02/06/the-dark-side-of-overdrive/1

My Philips disables overdrive for its gaming mode altogether.

"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."