Author Topic: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?  (Read 6174 times)

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Offline Martok

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"Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« on: June 02, 2013, 02:54:00 AM »
Apparently, it's at least partially spurred by secularists getting fed up with Erdogan's Islamist-style government: 


Anti-government riots in Istanbul


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Offline Gusington

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2013, 10:10:49 AM »
Saw a bit of this on TV yesterday. But being the protesters are secular, wouldn't that make them the opposite of Arab Springers who have since been hijacked by groups like the Islamic Brotherhood, etc.? The Arab Spring in Libya, Tunisia, etc. were made up of religious groups who began protesting against dictatorships.
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Offline eyebiter

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2013, 10:26:40 AM »
While reading that article, kept seeing parallels with 1979 Iran after the Shah. Massive economic development progress in a decades time leads to social instability.  The newly elected government changes its tune once in office and immediately takes steps to implement an Islamic theocracy. Other than demonstrations the secular class is powerless to stop the inevitable slide toward repression.. The turkish military has already been purged of troublemakers and is likely being prepared for the next phase.

Offline Gusington

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2013, 10:36:08 AM »
^That doesn't give me a warm fuzzy.
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Offline Mr. Bigglesworth

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2013, 01:33:02 PM »
Can an Islamic theocracy stay part of NATO? I don't think so.
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Offline Martok

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2013, 02:23:51 PM »
Saw a bit of this on TV yesterday. But being the protesters are secular, wouldn't that make them the opposite of Arab Springers who have since been hijacked by groups like the Islamic Brotherhood, etc.? The Arab Spring in Libya, Tunisia, etc. were made up of religious groups who began protesting against dictatorships.

Hence why I put Arab Spring in quote marks, as it's indeed not really the same setup this time around.  :) 




The turkish military has already been purged of troublemakers and is likely being prepared for the next phase.

IMO, this was the key move Erdogan and his cronies made when they came into power.  As soon as all those generals got axed, I knew what was coming. 

"Like we need an excuse to drink to anything..." - Banzai_Cat
"I like to think of it not as an excuse but more like Pavlovian Response." - Sir Slash

"At our ages, they all look like jailbait." - mirth

"If we had lines here that would have crossed all of them. For the 1,077,986th time." - Gusington

"Government is so expensive that it should at least be entertaining." - airboy

"As long as there's bacon, everything will be all right." - Toonces

Offline LongBlade

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2013, 06:05:05 PM »
Turkey has traditionally been a secular state ruled from behind the scenes by its military. It's move away from a secular state is the anomaly. Not that radicals can't change the course of the state, but it's only been recently that it's even been a question of where its government tilted. That's the big reason why it was included in NATO. Well, that, and our listening stations were so much closer to the USSR.

Offline Centurion40

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #7 on: June 03, 2013, 08:32:47 AM »
I don't see strong parallels between Turkey today and 1970s Iran.  Iran had a dictator installed by western oil companies, via the CIA.  The dictator (although enlightened and progressive) held no elections and had a savage secret police force.  The dictator forced progressive reforms on a people, many of whom were not ready or accepting of the changes.  They felt that they had no voice and were being violently oppressed... because they had no voice and were being violently oppressed.

Turkey has elections.  People have a voice, they have rights.  The police are not engaged in widespread torture.
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Offline Centurion40

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2013, 08:34:34 AM »
Did anyone see Anthony Bourdain's "Parts Unknown" in Libya?

I didn't catch it all, but it did make me feel a bit better about the state of affairs in Libya.  In that it didn't seem like Libya was all about radical Islam after the revolution.
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Offline Gusington

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2013, 09:23:15 AM »
I did see that and thought it was great. Libya is a much more diverse country than I thought. Italian influence is still stronger there than I ever would have guessed too.
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Offline Centurion40

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2013, 11:31:28 AM »
When I was in college, we had a couple of dozen Libyans studying engineering.  They were mostly good guys who were just looking to get laid and party, like everyone else.  There were one or two uptight ones, who were probably Qaddafi's watchdogs.
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Offline Gusington

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2013, 12:07:22 PM »
Did you see the female Libyan doctor in the Bourdain show?
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Offline LongBlade

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2013, 12:14:29 PM »
Did you see the female Libyan doctor in the Bourdain show?

No, but knowing you she probably came with a theme song.


Offline Gusington

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2013, 01:34:23 PM »
I did fall in love with her a little bit,she was hotter than I would have ever expected a Libyan woman to be
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Offline Mr. Bigglesworth

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Re: "Arab Spring" in Turkey? Or much ado about nothing?
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2013, 01:49:30 PM »
Pics or it didn't happen.
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