So, I just spent 30+ hours playing Battle Academy (and all the DLC's) and enjoyed it. However, even on med-high level I found the game a little too "beer & pretzels" towards the end.
I've looked at Combat Mission 2 games and after watching scads of videos I think it's not for me. I've tried HoI 4 and I found it too irritating (but I will re-visit it later this year).
I've been looking at John Tiller's Campaign Series and I've seen a couple youtube videos and I like what I saw. But, my concern is if that game is going to be too steep a learning curve for this noobie war gaming brain of mine.
So, if Battle Academy is say a "3" on the complexity level and I find Combat Mission 2 a "9/10" where do you see JTCS falling?
Thanks gents!!
4 to 5
Actually it plays like BA if you think about it.
It doesn't count ammo and men.
These are abstracted. There are only two ammo states (Full and Low). Casualties are counted by steps. Some basic morale states (disrupted and routed).
The game feels like a tabletop wargame with toy soldiers.
But equipment is more varied. Scale is larger. And more historical results.
You should know that there is also a bit of a learning curve since it's a good idea to know, or have an idea, about what all the values, action points, etc dictate in JTCS.
It's basically a platoon-level tabletop wargame on the computer. With more number values to learn regarding weapon effectiveness, movement, armor penetration, cover & concealment terrain values, and all that.
You can still play it without understanding all that stuff, but you'll probably feel the need to learn it if you play for awhile. In order to improve your strategies, learn the units strengths & weaknesses and how effectively they interact in certain situations. That means reading some of the manual.
Quote from: Nefaro on July 18, 2016, 10:29:06 PM
You should know that there is also a bit of a learning curve since it's a good idea to know, or have an idea, about what all the values, action points, etc dictate in JTCS.
That's the important key. The Tiller games can be very simple to play - you click and move, you click and fire. Gets a little boring honestly. HOWEVER, if you really choose to look 'under the hood' so to speak and really evaluate the capabilities and abilities and start to learn to get a good read on your chances of success vs failure, then they can be some really good games (for a computer game :P ). Check out his Midway game - if WW2 carrier stuff interests you at all....that's my favorite Tiller game and is much more than just "click and move/shoot". There's a bit of learning curve with that one though.
Also, I'd actually recommend The Operational Art of War III over Tiller for you. It can also be as simple or as complex (even more so) as you want it but there's literally 100's (1000's?) of free scenarios out there so you can battle just about anything (and not just WW2). Check out http://www.matrixgames.com/products/317/details/Norm.Koger's.The.Operational.Art.of.War.III for more info on it.
Thanks gents
Is there a graphics option in OAoW? Not a huge fan of counters...I know..../shame :-\ (I like eye candy)
Quote from: GJK on July 18, 2016, 11:00:17 PM
Also, I'd actually recommend The Operational Art of War III over Tiller for you. It can also be as simple or as complex (even more so) as you want it but there's literally 100's (1000's?) of free scenarios out there so you can battle just about anything (and not just WW2). Check out http://www.matrixgames.com/products/317/details/Norm.Koger's.The.Operational.Art.of.War.III for more info on it.
I thought TAOW3 had far more learning curve than JTCS. Especially under the hood.
TAOW is definitely more complex as it counts equipment quantity and has that fluid turn structure.
JTCS and Campaign Series Middle East are like chess.
Easy to play, difficult to master.
Check out Squad Battles and Panzer Battles as well.
Do all the JT games have the option to show the unit instead of the Nato like counters? I know JTCS does, but is that option available in Panzer Battles and Squad Battles?
Thanks for all the comments/suggestions
There are unit graphics in Squad Battles.
Funny the differences; I refuse to play anything with little toy soldier pictures on the counters. ;D
Seriously though, you didn't say (or maybe you did) - are you looking for something tactical? More strategic or operational? Would grand strategic interest you? WW2 only?
Quote from: GJK on July 19, 2016, 11:09:12 AM
Funny the differences; I refuse to play anything with little toy soldier pictures on the counters. ;D
Seriously though, you didn't say (or maybe you did) - are you looking for something tactical? More strategic or operational? Would grand strategic interest you? WW2 only?
WW2 only, strategic/tactical/potato...patato....I'd play it all :crazy2:
If I had to choose......tactical. I think the JTCS is smaller scale battles?
I like the little toy solider/tanks......it's the little kid in me I guess O0...although I found Battle Academy graphics charming at first, but I got bored quickly of the cartoonish look
Quote from: acctingman on July 19, 2016, 12:32:26 PM
Quote from: GJK on July 19, 2016, 11:09:12 AM
Funny the differences; I refuse to play anything with little toy soldier pictures on the counters. ;D
Seriously though, you didn't say (or maybe you did) - are you looking for something tactical? More strategic or operational? Would grand strategic interest you? WW2 only?
WW2 only, strategic/tactical/potato...patato....I'd play it all :crazy2:
If I had to choose......tactical. I think the JTCS is smaller scale battles?
I like the little toy solider/tanks......it's the little kid in me I guess O0...although I found Battle Academy graphics charming at first, but I got bored quickly of the cartoonish look
Yes, JTCS is Platoons/250m hexes. West Front, East Front, Pacific all in the same bundle. It is starting to show its age a bit with especially 2D not having a Zoom-In view, but if it's 3D miniatures you want that's not an issue then :)
Solo or MP?
I am a SB junkie. Mostly PBEM. I think somewhere around 1250 games. Just love the titles. I am into squads and single tank games, so it's SB and BA for me. I have lots of MP BA and BA2 games under my belt. MP is where BA/BA2 is at - IMHO.
Tigers on the Hunt is another good game too. :) Fun little title IMO. Just solo play only.
Solo play only. Not sure why, but I've never got into MP (minus my MMO days, but I had a guild I ran around with for 14 yrs in various games)
I'll take a look at Squad Battles. I like the CS because it has all the theaters in one game.
Very true about JTCS having it all. Just remember the scale of SB and JTCS are different.
Squad Battles game scale is 40 meter hexes and 5 minute turns. Units are normally at the squad and single vehicle level.
JTCS game scale is 6 minute turns and 250 meter hexes. Units are Company and Platoon sizes.
You might want to look at Panzer Battles too.
http://www.johntillersoftware.com/PanzerBattles/BattlesOfNormandy.html
Richie, I love SB too. Let me know if you're up for a game.
IIRC not all of the Squad Battles series has graphical units. Some do, others just have the counters with pixel art on them.
Even in those that have JTCS style imitation-3D representations, the 2D map is made to look like it's at an angle. Which looks terrible and makes the hexes look stretched sideways.
I've enjoyed the Squad Battle games, despite some minor complaints, but I've always played them in 2D mode with the counters+art. Whereas, with JTCS, I always use the "3D" view (with pixel units at the closest zoom layer).
Going to wait until I see the JTCS on sale and snatch it up.
Thanks to all for the info
Quote from: acctingman on July 19, 2016, 10:37:13 AM
Do all the JT games have the option to show the unit instead of the Nato like counters? I know JTCS does, but is that option available in Panzer Battles and Squad Battles?
Thanks for all the comments/suggestions
Panzer Battles has three different counter types that can be changed on the fly;
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.johntillersoftware.com%2FPanzerBattles%2FBattlesOfNormandy%2FNormandy5.png&hash=2e6050e7ba56ac0f390f3a37039caa29586364e1)
Plus it is a pretty fine game too. O0