Cold Waters

[Toonces]

Alright, spent another hour with it. 

I'm firmly on the fence.

The course/speed/depth thing is just annoying enough to make me want to refund the game.  The first time I drove the sub to periscope depth was painful enough that I can see this will keep me from playing the game.

You can't save the game mid-mission if there are enemies nearby, weapons in the water, etc.  So once you commit to a mission you have to stick with it until you've cleared datum enough to exit out.  The game has an autosave feature so that it will autosave on entering a mission so if you have to abort you can reload from a save just prior to mission start.

First mission I got to intercept a Boomer.  To move on the campaign screen you point and hold the left mouse button and the sub drives to the point.  You get red icons and you just drive your boat into the red icon.  Very similar to RSR but faster and overall the map seems smaller scale.  Not sure if there is a setting for this; there might be.  Once you collide, you go to a screen and choose the range at which to start the engagement, from 25kyd to 5kyd.  Every time I started my sub was at depth doing full or flank speed which was annoying.

When you get contact you get a S1, S2, etc. box.  If you click on it, you'll get whatever info you have on the target in your contact box that has your own boat data as well.  There is a sensor screen where you can cycle the identities until you find the one that matches the waterfall display and you can classify the contact.  It's extremely annoying to use, but works.  Conversely, if you wait long enough your crew will auto id the target once the solution matches some number.

Shooting couldn't be easier.  Press space, put the cursor where you want to shoot, and press right mouse and the torp fires.  There are some basic settings for the torp but I didn't use them.  You can guide the wireguided torps in, but I accidentally cut the wires each shot.  This part looks just like RSR, with the incoming and outgoing torpedo icons, kind of like the sonar on Crimson Tide.  Noisemakers can be deployed and flash on the tactical display.  Be sure you pay attention while driving the ship in evasion as it's easy to get distracted and end up driving in circles or passing desired depth.

Graphics are neat.  In the engagement I had a Boomer and two Victors.  Killed all three, but had to defend against an enemy torp.  Went to 3D view and I could see my sub and the three dead subs on the bottom with bubbles coming out.  You'd have to have about 5 miles underwater visibility, but it was still neat looking. 

After I took out the subs I kept getting an active sonar hit, and after a minute or two the 3D automatically switched to a Bear dropping a torp on me.  Cool.  Evaded that and exited out of the mission for a success.

You then to back to the campaign screen and get assigned another mission like intercept a convoy at some location.  I don't remember if that's how RSR worked; I thought it was more freelancing, but regardless it seems that it would be possible to freelance if you just ignored the mission tasking.

In between missions you get these things like posters to describe the status of the campaign.  I didn't particularly care for this element. 

And that's about it.  It was fun in a way, but fun like Atlantic Fleet is fun.  Which makes sense I guess.  I think the Strike Fighters vs. DCS comparison is apt.  If you are comfortable switching between those two sims, you might find this is just fine.

[JudgeDredd]

^holy crap. No time to read at the moment, but thanks for the depth of the post  O0

[mirth]

Good post, Toonces. I'm going to hold off. It sounds like an under $20 purchase to me.

[Toonces]

Ok, I did a little more research.  There's a 148 count and growing thread regarding the WASD controls on Steam.  Sounds like the devs are receptive to changing that so I suspect an option to manually set these things will eventually come in a patch.

Also read that the game is highly moddable right from the get go, and supported by the devs.  There's even a mod guide on the Steam forums.  You can create single missions, campaigns, edit the database, etc.  I suspect once this gets a little momentum we'll see a lot of community-created content. 

Finally, it sounds like the devs have a lot of DLCs already planned, so they're in it for the long haul.

I'm cautiously optimistic that after some growing pains this game will gather a nice following.

[Nefaro]

Alright, spent another hour with it. 

I'm firmly on the fence.

The course/speed/depth thing is just annoying enough to make me want to refund the game.  The first time I drove the sub to periscope depth was painful enough that I can see this will keep me from playing the game.

You can't save the game mid-mission if there are enemies nearby, weapons in the water, etc.  So once you commit to a mission you have to stick with it until you've cleared datum enough to exit out.  The game has an autosave feature so that it will autosave on entering a mission so if you have to abort you can reload from a save just prior to mission start.

First mission I got to intercept a Boomer.  To move on the campaign screen you point and hold the left mouse button and the sub drives to the point.  You get red icons and you just drive your boat into the red icon.  Very similar to RSR but faster and overall the map seems smaller scale.  Not sure if there is a setting for this; there might be.  Once you collide, you go to a screen and choose the range at which to start the engagement, from 25kyd to 5kyd.  Every time I started my sub was at depth doing full or flank speed which was annoying.

Holding LMB on the campaign map moves you at full speed.

RMB is the slow 'creep' speed. 

So try to switch to RMB when nearing possible enemy ship location.

RSR was like this, where you had to hold a button down to transit quickly but let off near encounters or you'd start in the combat zone at transit speed.

Forces you to estimate where your intended target will be in the future.  To get ahead of it in time to slow and do the silent sub thing.  Don't wanna be chasing at high speed, but setting up an ambush ahead of them.

When you get contact you get a S1, S2, etc. box.  If you click on it, you'll get whatever info you have on the target in your contact box that has your own boat data as well.  There is a sensor screen where you can cycle the identities until you find the one that matches the waterfall display and you can classify the contact.  It's extremely annoying to use, but works.  Conversely, if you wait long enough your crew will auto id the target once the solution matches some number.

Shooting couldn't be easier.  Press space, put the cursor where you want to shoot, and press right mouse and the torp fires.  There are some basic settings for the torp but I didn't use them.  You can guide the wireguided torps in, but I accidentally cut the wires each shot.  This part looks just like RSR, with the incoming and outgoing torpedo icons, kind of like the sonar on Crimson Tide.  Noisemakers can be deployed and flash on the tactical display.  Be sure you pay attention while driving the ship in evasion as it's easy to get distracted and end up driving in circles or passing desired depth.

Graphics are neat.  In the engagement I had a Boomer and two Victors.  Killed all three, but had to defend against an enemy torp.  Went to 3D view and I could see my sub and the three dead subs on the bottom with bubbles coming out.  You'd have to have about 5 miles underwater visibility, but it was still neat looking. 

After I took out the subs I kept getting an active sonar hit, and after a minute or two the 3D automatically switched to a Bear dropping a torp on me.  Cool.  Evaded that and exited out of the mission for a success.

You then to back to the campaign screen and get assigned another mission like intercept a convoy at some location.  I don't remember if that's how RSR worked; I thought it was more freelancing, but regardless it seems that it would be possible to freelance if you just ignored the mission tasking.

Yep!  It was like that, with a mission given at any one time.

You can still run into all kinds of stuff on the campaign map, of course.  O0

In between missions you get these things like posters to describe the status of the campaign.  I didn't particularly care for this element. 

And that's about it.  It was fun in a way, but fun like Atlantic Fleet is fun.  Which makes sense I guess.  I think the Strike Fighters vs. DCS comparison is apt.  If you are comfortable switching between those two sims, you might find this is just fine.

Hoping they at least add some depth control hotkeys. 

I'd also think that implementing a 'Set Course' command, which uses a mouse click to set heading similar to how you launch torpedoes down a bearing, wouldn't need to be done from scratch.  Because weapon launches already do much of that.

Could also use a small 3D-view window on the TAB tactical display screen.  That screen looks more useful in an engagement, with more screen space dedicated to the map.  May as well get some use out of the 3D icing on it.


The meta is definitely RSR.   Which is great.  A direct copy of the style, if not all the functionality regarding navigation.  They just need to tighten up & add a few interface features, along with any bugs.

[bbmike]

I very accurately predicted what would happen.  This was declared the modern equivalent of RSR.  I see people get excited about games a lot.  Nothing wrong with that.  But this thread seemed to go a little over the top.

Grogheads presents: Real Wargamers of Genius

Today we salute you, Mr. totally accurate predictor of overhyped bad games.

Calling it like you see it, you're living the dream of every grognard.

You pop into every thread just so you can leave your two cents, and then say, I told you so after the fact.

Sure, there is danger...afterall, you might break your dongle, or it may be lost in your luggage.

Your keen instincts tell you to avoid games that your fellow gamers are excited about, and if they turn out to be good, who cares? You'll pick it up on sale.

So crack open an ice cold Bud Light, accurate predictor boy. 'Cause we all know, when the going gets tough, the tough get dongles.

That post should have come with a warning! Can Maker's Mark do permanent damage to nasal passages? 

[mirth]

It can't. Not permanent. Though it stings like hell.

[Nefaro]

Ok, I did a little more research.  There's a 148 count and growing thread regarding the WASD controls on Steam.  Sounds like the devs are receptive to changing that so I suspect an option to manually set these things will eventually come in a patch.

Also read that the game is highly moddable right from the get go, and supported by the devs.  There's even a mod guide on the Steam forums.  You can create single missions, campaigns, edit the database, etc.  I suspect once this gets a little momentum we'll see a lot of community-created content. 

Finally, it sounds like the devs have a lot of DLCs already planned, so they're in it for the long haul.

I'm cautiously optimistic that after some growing pains this game will gather a nice following.

They mentioned adding playable Russkie and British nuke boats in the future.  Along with different campaign years.   8)

I waffled a bit at the $40 price tag.  But this is something I've wanted a modern version of for years.  I've not seen anything negative from the developers, so it was an easy wallet prying for me.

[jamus34]

My thought on the nav complaints- I would like the option to set depth / course in feet / degrees but I also see the value of being able to manually "drive the boat" in all honesty I think both are needed.

That said I think I'm going to take the wait and see approach. If the devs can shore up some of the issues I will pick it up.

[Jarhead0331]

One strange issue I'm having...even though my settings are set to full screen, my task bar is still visible at the bottom of the screen. It partially covers the weapons and damage control menus and if I try to select the bottom two weapon slots that are partially concealed by the task bar, it takes me to desk top. I've also tried changing the resolution and taking it out of full screen mode. No change. Any suggestions?

[mirth]

Refund.

[Barthheart]

One strange issue I'm having...even though my settings are set to full screen, my task bar is still visible at the bottom of the screen. It partially covers the weapons and damage control menus and if I try to select the bottom two weapon slots that are partially concealed by the task bar, it takes me to desk top. I've also tried changing the resolution and taking it out of full screen mode. No change. Any suggestions?

Very odd... have you accidentally set the lock on the Task Bar?

[Barthheart]

Well, I'm having fun with it. It's pretty much the level of realism I expected... but not predicted!

Yes a Periscope Depth button would be nice. Using all the current controls I had no problem getting to 40-50 ft for periscope depth.
Yes a set course direct entry would be nice.

Having played a LOT of Atlantic Fleet, Killer Fish is very good at updates and improvements.

I find myself playing mostly on the grid map but you do have to go to the periscope and visually locate targets then laser tag them for better idents. Mission I was just in the seas were very rough and the waves would obscure the view through the periscope on occasion. Luckily, maybe, the view was not bobbing up and down or I'd probably hurl.

Haven't started a campaign yet, but have worked through all the tutorials and a couple of single missions. This could easily eat up a lot of time.

O0 so far.

[mikeck]

Is there a requirement that you develope any type of solution at all for your Torps or missiles or basically donyiu just fire down the bearing and auto-boom

[mirth]

Well, I'm having fun with it. It's pretty much the level of realism I expected... but not predicted!

Yes a Periscope Depth button would be nice. Using all the current controls I had no problem getting to 40-50 ft for periscope depth.
Yes a set course direct entry would be nice.

Having played a LOT of Atlantic Fleet, Killer Fish is very good at updates and improvements.

I find myself playing mostly on the grid map but you do have to go to the periscope and visually locate targets then laser tag them for better idents. Mission I was just in the seas were very rough and the waves would obscure the view through the periscope on occasion. Luckily, maybe, the view was not bobbing up and down or I'd probably hurl.

Haven't started a campaign yet, but have worked through all the tutorials and a couple of single missions. This could easily eat up a lot of time.

O0 so far.

Urge to buy...rising