Back in the water!

[MarkShot]

Mama, don't let your babies grow up to be bubble heads!

[bob48]

^^ Reminds me of all the hours I spent with Silent Service by MicroProse.

[Greybriar]

For me, submarine simulations began with WolfPack, The Hunt for Red October, and Silent Service II. Especially Silent Service II. The graphics in Aces of the Deep blew me away and were the best of any sub sim for several years. The Silent Hunter series was a great one and I was an avid fan of it through Silent Hunter III (except for the StarForce DRM which was later removed).

[MarkShot]

I just did a very well executed Kilo Demo attack with DW/LWAMI.  Sorry, but I don't have time for lots of screens.

In this mission, you must using a Kilo (diesel electric sub) sink an escorted cargo ship.  There are neutrals around which may not be sunk.  The FFG escort may NOT be sunk even if it engages you.

I say very well executed, because you can find a ton of Youtube videos ("Look, Ma, I did it!"), but they are cr*p.  Why?  Well, technically you get a MISSION COMPLETE if the cargo ship is killed.  This is not that hard to do if you have experience with this type of game.  Otherwise, concepts and working the stations could be a challenge in itself.

But the real challenge is to sink the cargo ship and live to tell about it.  That's the rub.

Thoughts which come to mind on how to do that would be:

(1)  Standoff and shoot

(2)  Ready the tubes well before shooting to cut down on loud transients

(3)  Launch over the shoulder to reduce the noise radiated

(4)  Run the torpedo below top speed to delay its detection (and also increase its range)

I've tried, and I don't think #2 and #3 matter much.

Standoff and shoot is always a good idea.  However, it should be noted that the 53-65K (wake homer) and the USET-80 (active/passive) torpedos have a maximum range of 10nm when launched at 80% top speed (around 40-45KTS).  Your targets will be moving at around 18KTS and you will be anywhere from 10nm to 5nm when you launch depending on what you do.

The problems which arise with #1 and #4 are:

(1)  To standoff far enough to delay that detection, you are going to be close to the maximum range of your weapon even when it is running slower and quieter.  The weapon could well die before reaching the target.

(2)  Being so far away with a weapon running at reduced speed will give the target considerably more time to evade.  Both these weapons are smart weapons (not dumb WWII straight run fish), but they are not the fancy wire guided weapons which the SSNs carry.  There will be no mid-course corrections.

(3)  Sooner or later, the weapon will be detected by the FFG.  When that happens, it acts as a big sign ... "Here I am!  Come and get me!".

(4)  If you look at the map, standing off leaves you with no where to evade.  On two sides, you have knee deep water.  On the other side, you have the FFG coming to you.  On the last side, the water is again shallow and evasion is questionable.

So, what is the right thing to do in order to get the kill and evade?  (Note:  This would be much easier if your orders allowed you to kill the FFG.  It would be trivial.)

Answer:  Close with your target.  Why?

(1)  You will reduce the time the target has to escape.  In any case, the launch will be detected.

(2)  You can run the torpedo at top speed without having exhausted its fuel which will also get it there quicker.

(3)  You just barely make it to a position where evasion becomes possible despite being detected.

Okay, so we see in terms of scoring the kill why closing is better than standing off.  But how is this going to help us to get away?

(1)  You have open water to the West to evade.  It's far less tight than where we start.

(2)  You will shoot on "lag LOS"; meaning you are going in the opposite direction of your targets.  This is the best approach to putting distance between you and where the FFG will come looking for you.

How do we execute this strategy exactly?

(1)  You fire an active USET-80 at the cargo ship.  A passive or wake homer would only make sense if you were avoiding detection with it.  But you are not.  So, an active torpedo with the right range stands a much better chance of latching on to the target (the right target).

(2)  Your orders say that you may not kill the FFG.  But they say nothing about scaring the sh*t out of it.  So, you fire a big warhead 53-65K at it.  This is a wake homer.  You set the RTE (run to enable) to the maximum range of the weapon.  Effectively,  it is going to run out of gas before it goes live.  However, the FFG does not know that.  The result of this will be to occupy the FFG.  It is going run away for at least 4-5nm.  And it will also need to cover that distance (time) on the way back.

(3)  Upon launching, you go from your good tracking speed of 6KTS to 10KTS.  Your SONAR will be compromised, but your goal is to displace from the point of launch.  This is the fastest you can go without cavitating (making a lot of noise).

So, how did this work out?  (need you even ask)

(1)  The cargo ship is neatly killed.

(2)  The FFG runs until the 53-65K gives up the ghost.

(3)  The FFG then first heads to the sunk cargo ship, and then it heads towards the point of launch.  It finds nothing in either location, and initiates a wider search.  But by then are just beyond detection range and opening the distance.

(4)  I ran for about about two hours West at 10KTS.  At which point, I was quite safe and my battery was down to 60%.

The screen shot below shows everyone's track shortly after the two torpedos are launched.  You'll notice that the FFG is turning into me as it detects the launch, but it will soon turn away when it realizes what it is headed its way.  The cargo ship has yet to get a clue.  By the time it does, it will be too late.  The screenshot is from a save game with "Truth" on, but that is not the way I play.

I hope you enjoyed my first AAR in more than six months!

[MarkShot]

BTW, the white circle is an 8NM range circle on my boat.  This is the maximum range of my weapons more or less at top speed.

[MarkShot]

It's tempting to go play some AOD or SHCE.  But if I do, I will not get any time conning DW/LWAMI before my desktop goes off line.

After that, it is time to experience RSR on my laptop along with HCCE and H363.  I never really got into Harpoon.  I think part of the problem was just the vast collection of platforms and weapons that I am unfamiliar with.

Lastly, let me say, "*#*&* Apple!".  Both AOD and SHCE would play beautifully on my iPad2 with DOSBOX, but Apple prohibited DOSBOX from the APP Store, and I will not jail break!

[MarkShot]

Oh, I am very tempted to go back out on patrol.  I saw an excellent 4 hour UK documentary on YouTube the other day on the Atlantic War that hasn't ever run on USA cable.

I must get up from my PC now!  Right now!!!

(I have over 1,200 screenshots hosted.  Enjoy them, since they all go poof in 2 months.)

[Toonces]

I would have said that Kilo mission was impossible when you described it, but it never ocurred to me to shoot a "scare shot" at the FFG.  That was brilliant!

Nice job.

[Herman Hum]

Gotta agree with that.  Nice way to think outside the box!

[LongBlade]

Gotta agree with that.  Nice way to think outside the box!

The sign of a true wargamer - thinking outside the box. Very nice.

[Bison]

Good stuff Mark. 

[MarkShot]

Back on dry land again.

I guess while my desktop is still available, I'll probably be playing some CMBB/CMAK.  I guess I just don't have the patience for working through DW right now.

But one nice thing about older games ... is that you know you have the complete package.  There is no complete ... more complete ... most complete ... ultimate complete edition to get and continuous mods and tweaks.  DW and it's most comprehensive mod hasn't really been touched for four years ... this includes third party scenarios.  So, like many of my older games, I have everything for it.  It's more whether I have and want to invest the time than whether I run into CTDs or am waiting for a patch.

The other nice thing about old games.  You know exactly what you are getting into.

I wonder what I'll do when I get a new PC.  It seems everything has gone DRM, online being connected, small incremental pay for updates, and DLC/in game purchases.

Sad ... the hobby that has been so much part of my life may be coming to an end ...  Oh, well ...

[Bison]

Nah...it's just another opportunity my friend.  You get to keep the old stuff on the shiney new rig and try out some newer stuff too.  There are a lot of games to choose from that came out in the last few years that are now complete too.  gog.com is coming out with new DRM free games all the time and  I also think you'd really enjoy one of the CMX2 games.  Shock Force is as complete as it's ever going to be for example.  Battlefront is developing the next modern combat game and CMSF is all community now.  Great game and you get to use Bradleys, Tanks, several different NATO forces.  With mods it'll look great on a new rig.  Or go with one of the new WW2 CMX2 and live on the edge with the base game and future content pending.  Try out one of the train sims and relax driving a train around.  Sure the DRM sucks, but if you wait until the Holiday sales you can get a bunch of content on the cheap.  Give a few bucks for hours of entertainment.

[MarkShot]

I may end up restoring all the sub stuff tomorrow morning. Even though I find myself frustrated with this stuff I keep ask myself how to do the current mission.

I am an akula in the port of San diego. They looking to sink me. They are an FFG and Helo.

I Can win by slipping out undetected or I can take out the FFG and Helo. The helo is by far the greater danger.

My best plan would be to silently evade until I could quickl kill the FFG and displace before the Helo arrives.

Avoiding the Helo is very much a matter of chance. The helo's MAD detector will catch a sub up to 900M down. The only way to achieve that situation is to travel the continental. However, that puts me in the detection range of the FFG.

[Nefaro]

I'm pretty sure that launch transients are broadcast for 360 degrees (in the game), so there's no need to fire over-the-shoulder unless you're doing so in preparation for evading in that direction.  It's also not recommended if you are using wire-guided fish because there is code in the game to account for having the wire accidentally cut on big turns and that may also be tied to your heading compared to the torpedo's bearing.

I say do your best to sink the FFG from range - one less to worry about.  And you can't evade the helo so you just gotta be ready on the gas pedal & countermeasure hotkeys while watching for a torpedo drop like a hawk.  IIRC the countermeasure effectiveness was lowered with the LWAMI mod so they're not gonna be hitting ~75% effectiveness like vanilla nor will they make the torpedoes detonate near them because I'm pretty sure the modders talked about needing to lower that chance to zero long ago.