Hearts of Iron IV

Ian C · February 28, 2019, 03:40:08 PM

Too much coffee and 4 hours sleep.

BTW - has anyone figured out how to do Naval things yet? It's a bit confusing with different areas lighting up when you select 'Patrol'.

The changes:

solops · February 28, 2019, 03:53:40 PM

Changed the WW2 borders to modern day??!? This is a joke, right? It is too insane to be serious, right?

Ian C · February 28, 2019, 03:55:49 PM

Quote from: solops on February 28, 2019, 03:53:40 PM
Changed the WW2 borders to modern day??!? This is a joke, right? It is too insane to be serious, right?

Certain borders. Quote:

"Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact borders are no longer achievable. Borders of Germany (General Government) in 1942 are no longer achievable. Borders of Bulgaria are no longer achievable. Borders of Montenegro and Albania under Italian rule are no longer achievable. Zaolzie looks even worse and out of place than before the update. Borders from the partitions of Yugoslavia are no longer achievable."

jomni · February 28, 2019, 05:24:55 PM

I never seem to care until this was pointed out. And I know how HOI tends to go in an ahistorical direction the more you play. But the argument also goes the other way. Since end-game is ahistorical, there's no need to do the modern-day borders.

Old TImer · February 28, 2019, 05:50:12 PM

Quote from: SirAndrewD on February 28, 2019, 03:27:09 PM
The borders decision is a really, really odd move on the part of the devs.

I would think a WW2 game would concentrate on WW2 era borders.

Totally agree. Paradox dropped the ball with this. It IS supposed to be WW2.

CJReich46 · February 28, 2019, 06:23:24 PM

Quote from: gregb41352 on February 28, 2019, 05:50:12 PM
Quote from: SirAndrewD on February 28, 2019, 03:27:09 PM
The borders decision is a really, really odd move on the part of the devs.

I would think a WW2 game would concentrate on WW2 era borders.

Totally agree. Paradox dropped the ball with this. It IS supposed to be WW2.

Agreed. This is strange. Why would they do that? I read the forum thread. Wow. So we're appeasing You Tuber/Meme boys/Modders? Give me a break.

Jarhead0331 · February 28, 2019, 08:45:04 PM

It is an illogical decision to be sure, but I honestly don't think the average "casual" player will notice, or really care that much. At least, that's my take from having just perused around the map...Now, some seem to suggest that the redrawn boundaries do impact the game by preventing certain historical events or outcomes. If this is the case, then the situation is definitely more serious.

SirAndrewD · February 28, 2019, 09:03:32 PM

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on February 28, 2019, 08:45:04 PM
It is an illogical decision to be sure, but I honestly don't think the average "casual" player will notice, or really care that much. At least, that's my take from having just perused around the map...Now, some seem to suggest that the redrawn boundaries do impact the game by preventing certain historical events or outcomes. If this is the case, then the situation is definitely more serious.

I didn't notice and I've got degrees in the subject. However, once someone pointed it out it bugs me. It's like a projectionist friend of mine that works at and indie theater. I can't go see movies with him at big theaters because he always points out how out of focus things are and how the 18 year old minimum wage projectionist forgot to do this and that. I'd never have seen it otherwise, but once I did, I couldn't unsee it.

glen55 · February 28, 2019, 10:43:46 PM

I glanced over the forum. I have seen several remarks about subs being of value now (you HOI 4 vets know how worthless they have been in prior patches).

This is the most substantive description I saw, and it's pretty tantalizing:

QuoteMerely a first playthrough as ( always) UK vanilla without the DLC...

Well things have certainly changed! And on the whole I detect some genuine strategy and choices to be made rather than min max gibberish.

The naval interface is going to take some getting used to but love the mechanics, which seem to be very realistic. Also finally a genuine submarine threat... Possibly an overpowered one but too early to say conclusively. Spotter fleets and heavy decisive battle fleets seems right on the money.

Seems like I lost almost half the Royal Navy to training accidents ( muggins removed the repair shipyards) which is excellent and well researched. Could we maybe assign a few select naval bases as designated repair hubs though? Wouldn't want to leave my preciouses within NAV range by accident.

If I was going to be picky I might suspect at this stage that airpower is a little too cheap on fuel compared to naval or land, and naval a touch too pricey. Not that I object to the huge fuel usage of the BBs etc... Though cruisers, especially light, seem unusable and DDs far too fuel hungry. A distinction has to be made between, especially for DDs, pottering around at steerage and flank combat.

Now I was going to hold off on buying the DLC itself as I rather expected things to be a bug strewn mess... On the base game though, I'm really starting to feel as though you've nailed it.

And by that I mean I'm struggling to see how a dominant meta will easily emerge. Could be wrong but even against the AI I detected the option to give ground and hit once supply lines were extended and fuel used up. Naval battles are genuinely decisive given the importance of trade and, dare I say it, even politics plays an important part if you think strategically?

My only real concern is that getting the US on side is going to be an I win button.

Also one small feature request... Rather than merely sinking enemy trade convoys how about capturing them and the resources they contain?

SirAndrewD · March 01, 2019, 01:53:42 AM

Well, heck, as a first I was doing a USA play on my first Man the Guns game.

And yeah, first time ever, the Axis actually took over Norway!!!

But it was Italy..

Ian C · March 01, 2019, 04:34:04 AM

East European & Balkan borders aside, it is a significantly better game. The fuel and naval additions have made the strategic layer deeper.

JudgeDredd · March 01, 2019, 04:56:18 AM

I have had this game since launch and I've hardly touched it. The same reason I hardly touched WitP - I'm lost.

I love the idea of the game. I love the look. But I have no idea how to conduct a country in war and managing said countries resources, let alone several. I did get into HoI2 Doomsday once, but not for the duration of the war. I probably made it a year in, if that.

I need to sit and invest some time in it - but then that's what I said about WitP.

It'll probably never happen - and that makes me sad :(

jomni · March 01, 2019, 05:00:19 AM

Just play and discover things along the way. Don't aim to master all the stuff. That's how I played EU. Shouldn't the game run itself on autopilot anyway?

Ian C · March 01, 2019, 06:20:03 AM

Naval tutorial. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdRe41MDUnM

Basic: make a fleet group. Assign an admiral who them controls all fleets under him in that group.

Set your patrol fleets to patrol missions in one or more areas. Set a Strike Fleet on the 'Strike' mission and it sits in port. It sorties when an enemy fleet is spotted by one of your groups in that fleet.
There can be more than one Strike Fleet.

Rayfer · March 01, 2019, 07:46:34 AM

Quote from: Ian C on March 01, 2019, 06:20:03 AM
Naval tutorial. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdRe41MDUnM

Basic: make a fleet group. Assign an admiral who them controls all fleets under him in that group.

Set your patrol fleets to patrol missions in one or more areas. Set a Strike Fleet on the 'Strike' mission and it sits in port. It sorties when an enemy fleet is spotted by one of your groups in that fleet.
There can be more than one Strike Fleet.

I still haven't wrapped my head around how a fleet and its associated task forces work together. I'll have to watch the tutorial you attached. Thanks.

Edit: While watching the video, he keeps interchanging the words fleet and taskforce as if they are one and the same thing...my understanding is they aren't. A fleet is made up of any number of separate task forces yet each task force isn't itself a fleet. Correct? Ps. Ian C: you're my go-to guy for this stuff, thanks.