Consolidated Syria Conflict Thread

[Airborne Rifles]

Oh boy, this could get ugly quick...

Turkey shoots down unidentified aircraft along their border:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/16/world/turkey-aircraft-claim/index.html

[Grimnirsson]

The question is why is Turkey still in the Nato, I mean Erdogan is no less a dictator as Assad, he has for years been trying to stamp out the opposition, he now uses the IS conflict as sort of cover for that too and attacks the anti-IS Kurdish fighters, the press is no longer free in Turkey, journalists Erdogan doesn't like, are being arrested and he is cultivating an anti-West Muslim attitude and even encourages his fellow-men living in other countries to keep themselves apart from their surrounding society, because he thinks assimilation is a bad thing. That was his message to the Turks living here in Germany when he recently visited for his canvassing tour.

The world has to get rid of the Islamic State, that has to be the priority, not Assad or Turkey. That's why I think Putin's game over there is helpful, just to make things happen in a situation that was ruled for too long by ignoring reality or by being paralyzed by whatever political agenda. 

[Grimnirsson]

According to German news it was a drone that was shot down. And according to Generalmajor Igor Konaschenkow it was not a Russian drone.

[Airborne Rifles]

^ Well that's good news.

[Centurion40]

Right now, supporting Assad is just about the only realistic strategy for defeating ISIS, unfortunately.

How about pissing off Turkey, Iran, Iraq and Syria in one fell swoop by supporting the Kurds with as much military support and weapons as the West can muster?

Guaranteed to pull the rug from under Putin's feet but I doubt there is a Western leader with the balls to do it.

I lack faith in the Kurds abilities.  They may have done ok opposing the post-Saddam Iraqi army, but their record against ISIS has been spotty.

[Nefaro]

Right now, supporting Assad is just about the only realistic strategy for defeating ISIS, unfortunately.

How about pissing off Turkey, Iran, Iraq and Syria in one fell swoop by supporting the Kurds with as much military support and weapons as the West can muster?

Guaranteed to pull the rug from under Putin's feet but I doubt there is a Western leader with the balls to do it.

I lack faith in the Kurds abilities.  They may have done ok opposing the post-Saddam Iraqi army, but their record against ISIS has been spotty.

I don't see them being the big power player there anytime soon.  But their biggest problem is having so many neighboring enemies.  They are surrounded by multiple opposing factions.  The Turks and ISIS, most definitely.  Assad's Syrian regime holds no special love for them, and the Iraqis certainly don't since they posit some claim to their land. 

IIRC, they've all had varying degress of hostility towards the Kurds in recent times.  That's probably why our limp POTUS hasn't given them much support in the current situation - he's terrified of pissing anyone off.  Even our enemies, to some extent.

[Centurion40]

The Kurds are also not acting as a unitary force.  Even the "vaunted" Pershmerga is not a unified entity.

Peshmerga (Kurdish: پێشمەرگە Pêşmerge, Kurdish pronunciation [pɛʃmærˈɡæ]; meaning "one who confronts death") are the military forces of the autonomous region of Iraqi Kurdistan.[3] The overall formal head of the peshmerga is the President of Iraqi Kurdistan. The peshmerga force itself is largely divided and controlled separately by the Democratic Party of Kurdistan and Patriotic Union of Kurdistan.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peshmerga

[bayonetbrant]

In bizarro-world, we're happy about all the HMMWVs we destroyed after the Iraqi 'army' abandoned them.

[Staggerwing]

I wonder how many of those 126 tanks were western made.

[Nefaro]

In bizarro-world, we're happy about all the HMMWVs we destroyed after the Iraqi 'army' abandoned them.

If anything is facepalm worthy, that is.

[Bison]

I hate to say it, but that graphic reminds me of the body count from Vietnam.  A means to show "progress" in the war in terms of numeric quantities, i.e. high numbers equal positive results, but ignores the reality of the actual effect on the battlefield.

[LongBlade]

I hate to say it, but that graphic reminds me of the body count from Vietnam.  A means to show "progress" in the war in terms of numeric quantities, i.e. high numbers equal positive results, but ignores the reality of the actual effect on the battlefield.

Hadn't thought of that. You're right.

[Gusington]

Totally agree with Bison - very much like Vietnam era body counts.

[Airborne Rifles]

I hate to say it, but that graphic reminds me of the body count from Vietnam.  A means to show "progress" in the war in terms of numeric quantities, i.e. high numbers equal positive results, but ignores the reality of the actual effect on the battlefield.

Depends. Who's the ones reporting the numbers? If it's the Air Force or US government, then yes, just like Vietnam. If some independent group, then it seems like just a depressing statistical graphic.

[bayonetbrant]

Either way, the presence of 300-odd HMMWVs on the chart is just f'n' embarrassing to the US