Middle Provincial Era GROGPUBLIC game thread

Started by JasonPratt, September 17, 2018, 05:04:17 PM

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JasonPratt

#660
Actually, only the PM can make Proposals for voting, and right now that's Fulvius of the Plutocrats.

Once the Pleb Revolt is settled, Tribunes will become unlocked (on the following Turn's Senate) and then any Player with a Tribune card can discard it to make a Proposal or Veto.

Normally the Pleb Revolt would be the next Mandatory Business, after the Prosecution segment, but first the Republic needs a new PontMax, so that has to be backtracked to settle first.

Quote from: Ethel the Frog on November 25, 2018, 11:35:30 PM
Having reviewed  the Sixth Turn Grand Convocation, I think I am free to nominate anyone I want for PontMax, so I will nominate my guy whose name is partially occluded in the pictures.  is it Bacilius?  or Acilius? Anyway, that's who I am proposing.

It's Acilius. He's your "new man" in the Faction. Don't know why his name would be partially occluded... oh, it's because he has a Talent sitting next to him name. My bad.

Yes, the 6thTurnGrandCon doesn't have anything to say about getting a new PontMax one way or another; and any senator in Rome (which is all of them right now) can be validly Proposed for the Office. So Acilius would be a valid Proposal.


The Proposal is formally made, Acilius of the Plutocrats for the new Pontifex Maximus For Life (however long that may be...  ^-^ ) A vote will be required. The Frog will need to either call a vote order, or allow Players to vote at will.
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JasonPratt

#661
I'm at the office so I can't double-check the board yet, but I think the Plutocrats still have 14 votes, and I'm sure the Populists have 18 votes; and Malize has already stated he's willing to back Acilius if the Frog will propose in favor of resolving the Pleb Revolt next, which he has agreed to.

So provisionally that's 32 votes already FOR Acilius as the new PontMax4Life.

Potentially there are 13 votes (Conserv 11+2) plus 17 (Aristo 12+5) plus 14 (Militarist) plus 7 (Progs 5+2) =51 against.

And potentially another 17 (Aristo 12+5) plus 11 (Conserv) plus 14 (Mil) plus 5 (Progs) = 47 for.

This doesn't count personal Treasuries to buy votes, which might be a factor again.

Basically, if the Conservs, or Aristos, or Militarists join in, any one of them will be the swing majority for. (10 more votes 'for' will make the difference. Again, not counting bribes...)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
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Tripoli

Quote from: JasonPratt on November 26, 2018, 01:40:22 PM
I'm at the office so I can't double-check the board yet, but I think the Plutocrats still have 14 votes, and I'm sure the Populists have 18 votes; and Malize has already stated he's willing to back Acilius if the Frog will propose in favor of resolving the Pleb Revolt next, which he has agreed to.

So provisionally that's 32 votes already FOR Acilius as the new PontMax4Life.

Potentially there are 13 votes (Conserv 11+2) plus 17 (Aristo 12+5) plus 14 (Militarist) plus 7 (Progs 5+2) =51 against.

And potentially another 17 (Aristo 12+5) plus 11 (Conserv) plus 14 (Mil) plus 5 (Progs) = 47 for.

This doesn't count personal Treasuries to buy votes, which might be a factor again.

Basically, if the Conservs, or Aristos, or Militarists join in, any one of them will be the swing majority for. (10 more votes 'for' will make the difference. Again, not counting bribes...)

The militarists will also back, in exchange for resolving the plebe revolt
"Do I not destroy my enemies when I make them my friends?" -Abraham Lincoln

IncompetentIdiot


JasonPratt

Not back at the house yet to resolve, but I'm sure that this heavily lands Acilius as the new PontMax.

Next Mandatory Business is whether to solve the Plebian Revolt or not, and the Frog already declared he would do so, so unless he backs out after all then I'll treat that as the next Proposal: establish the Plebian Assembly (unlocking the Tribunes for next Turn, and discarding the Pleb revolt).

With Plutocrats (14), Populists (18), and Militarists (14) already signed on to concede the Pleb Revolt, that should be a majority. I'll have to resolve the Inf drop / Pop rise for Appius Claudius when I get home. (And adjust for Acilius of course.)

That should also finish Mandatory Business.

Valid and useful Other Business amounts to whether the Frog intends to have Appius Propose raising the remaining two Legions or not, before Proposing to send Manlius out (with X number of Legions) to.... um, I'll have to check which War, as per the Contract. (Raising the remaining Legions was NOT part of the Contract, so the Frog can Propose that or not. Strictly speaking he didn't Contract for how many he would send to whatever War it was with Manlius either...  ^-^ )

Meanwhile, if anyone has any Tribunes, don't get itchy yet: they can't be used until next Turn's Senate.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
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PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
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JasonPratt

^^ Thx!

Acilius' Influence as the new PontMax goes up 4 to 9; bringing the Plutocrat total influence to 41 -- tying and thus deactivating the Aristocrats' activists. (He also gets the extra-cash-die for being PontMax. ;) )
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

JasonPratt

The Frog validates by chat that he did intend to Propose discarding the Plebian Revolt, thus unlocking Tribune functionality; and as noted there are already enough votes to carry a majority. (Not that anyone other than the PM's player might want to not vote for it, since it effectively grants more power to all the players!) Appius sacrifices 2 Influence to discard the Event (down again to 15; Plutocrat total back down to 39, Aristos back in the lead again and activisting, which I declare to be a real word now. ;) ) But he gains 2 Pop (up to 2).

Having double-checked the expansion rules now that I've gotten back to the house, I see that Tribune functionality begins IMMEDIATELY! -- so anyone who already has a Tribune, you can play it at any time during this or any future Senate Phase.

This leads into a discussion of what Tribunes do, so I'll post that next.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

JasonPratt

Okay, here is a sample Tribune Intrigue Forum card which I copy-pasted from somewhere and will presently delete off the board.  ^-^



The text is really quite explanatory, including the several exceptions to its usage.

Historically, Tribunes were supposed to be the bridge between the Plebian Assembly and the Senate, and stood for popular election. A senator could be a Tribune but anyone of the proper age could be. Some Statesmen later in the game will also effectively be Tribunes; and the PontMax is kind of a half-tribune since he can veto most Proposals once a Turn the way a Tribune can. When Statesmen are Tribunes, they function like having a permanent Tribune that instead of discarding after use is only tapped out for the Turn.

There is one Latin Era Tribune in the game, which since we've used up all the Latin Era cards you may deductively expect someone to be holding right now. It is equal in all respects to other Tribunes, and unlike the pre-Early Statesmen he will not be discarding at the start of the Early Era. (I don't recall if there are any Italian Era Tribunes per se, but if so they'll be equal in ability, too.)


For all practical purposes, any Player with a Tribune Intrigue card can make a Proposal just like the PM can -- at the expense of discarding your Tribune. You can also use this ability to interrupt the PM closing the Senate by Proposing something for a vote (which is the only way to interrupt closing the Senate for the Turn, by the way. Even assassination won't do that.)

Tribunes also allow their Players to veto Proposals or Prosecutions. A Presiding Magistrate's Player doesn't need a Tribune to make a Proposal of course, but he can use one to veto someone else's Proposal!

Note the condition as the card states: you can only veto a vote before or during your own Faction's voting. Once you vote, you're locked into your choice, win or lose.

That's it. They're quite simple really! And they hugely change the game's dynamics.  >:D
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

JasonPratt

Oh, forgot to mention: I went back to double-check who has any Tribunes face down. I've sent reminders to anyone who does -- like I said, you can expect at least one Tribune to be lurking on the fringes of a Faction ready to be played (the Latin Era Tribune), but I won't say if there are any more primed to go yet.

If you didn't receive a private message from me, you don't have one yet.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

JasonPratt

I think this catches me up, and finishes Mandatory Business.

Per his Contract, the Frog must eventually Propose sending Manlius to the Pyrrhic War with some number of Legions (unspecified by the Contract); but he should decide whether or not he's going to Propose Raising the 9th and/or 10th Legion before then, too.

Or, someone could Tribune that Proposal first -- though that seems a bit of a waste of a Tribune in this case!  ::)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

JasonPratt

Incidentally, if anyone is unhappy with the Plutocrats concentrating so much political power: a Tribune can be used to Propose stripping the PontMax of his office! However, this vote uniquely requires more than 2/3 majority to pass.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

Ethel the Frog

Wow.  Tribune cards look crazy useful.  This will indeed change the game dynamic.  I am totally into the idea of having them--they will prevent any one of us from having abusing the monopoly on initiating proposals.  It diffuses power, but makes influence more important.  And, yeah, I can see that they would make the game dynamics a lot more complicated.

My gmail is dmakman@gmail.com.  Can we all connect on google hangouts and make that for discussion and use this more for displaying the board? I think separating the two functions of discussion and updating the board, will make it easier to play. 

Erax

Regarding the legions, I say we raise both, it'll help minimize losses.

Ethel the Frog

Ok. I am proposing we raise two legions.  (Has the tribune proposal passed?) 

Vote in any order on this and on the tribune thing if it has not passed yet.  THen let me know what the next order of business is.