Attacking a corner in an automatic transmission car

Started by W8taminute, October 04, 2022, 12:20:36 PM

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W8taminute

All right party people.  Let's talk about something completely different.

I figure we have quite a few people here from all over the world who drive a car on a day to day basis.  We should have plenty of input therefor on this.  I would ask this.  Keep in mind however I drive a manual and have done so for my entire life.  I'll never bow down to owning an automatic of my own.  It's easy to go through a corner in a manual without losing momentum but how do you do it in an automatic?

Now say you're on an urban road driving an automatic and are about to approach a corner that you don't have to stop for.  The corner is sharp enough to cause to you slow down a bit before entering.  Once you bleed off speed in an automatic and at the same time enter a turn most automatics have trouble selecting the right gear to get you through.  Note this is not an issue in a manual. 

So basically you press the gas a bit after completing most of the turn but the car jerks itself as it tries to figure out what gear you need.  You ultimately have to stomp on the accelerator to get the car to give you the power you wanted 5 seconds ago. 

How do you guys negotiate a corner safely but not losing momentum or having to stomp on the gas to catch up after leaving the turn?
"You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend."

Romulan Commander to Kirk

JasonPratt

I would say the ability to conserve maximum momentum through the corner depends A LOT on several factors including the current speed and delta-v changing the vectors (which will also be a function of mass = current weight); the center of gravity moving through the stability triangle (itself a function of the vehicle width and height, e.g. how top-heavy is the vehicle); the size of the tires, possibly also the tread; maybe the stiffness or springiness of the suspension; is the vehicle operating in rear, front, 4x4, or AWD (key differences between the latter two in how the vehicle assigns power to the wheels); is the vehicle translating between non-and-all/4WD due to slips in the differential thanks to the sharp cornering; the surface condition of the corner; the sharpness of the vector angle change (e.g. how large an intersection might be, and whether the vehicle is lane changing in transition)... I'm probably forgetting some factors... oh, how effectively the vehicle applies torque, how much torque is even available at that gear and throttle setting...

These all count for a manual, too, of course. But I know what you mean: a person may be able to intuitively adjust balance (so to speak) with experience, even in deciding what gear to shift into to keep the most momentum. I've done some aggressive cornering in a manual before, but I don't recall even trying in an automatic.

I suppose the simplest answer, focuses on how to remove the automatic's attempt at 'deciding' what gear to shift into, if any. So, either drive in, or shift into, L- or (better if available) paddle mode, and force the vehicle to stay in the selected gear through the turn.

But the practical answer about timing, angle-of-attack, etc. (the 'driving' through the attack) is going to depend on what vehicle is being driven at the time, thus all those other factors.
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JasonPratt

(I should add that I recently bought a Silverado 1500 Z71 RTS, and after I get more used to it I'm going to study how to get the best mpg out of the pseudo-manual paddle-shifts, since I'm NEVER going to get used to ~10mpg in the city.  :buck2: But I have previously hated trying to drive an automatic by pseudo-manual, without a clutch, so I'm not entirely looking forward to it, except as a theoretical challenge.)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

W8taminute

Very good response Jason.  You bring up a lot of the science to the whole thing I didn't even consider. 

As for trying to drive an automatic with paddle shifters I've tried that before.  My muscle memory keeps looking for a clutch to press before and after changing gears and I simply can not coordinate my hands properly to shift through the gears.  The reason I think is because my gut tells me that the car is going to jerk and stall because you forgot to press the clutch you idiot!  Haha!
"You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend."

Romulan Commander to Kirk

Sir Slash

I just hit the gas until the vehicle accelerates enough to keep it stable in the turn. Or, pretty much what already pointed out in your question. I'm not coordinated enough to drive a manual. Back when I learned to drive, I was more concerned with keeping my free hand on the girl sitting next to me.  ^-^
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JasonPratt

Update: since then, I have rediscovered why I hated paddle-shifters. It isn't only that they lack a true clutch -- it's because they aren't really gears.

They really are only Low Gear settings in an automatic. All they do is lock out upper gears. Any gears lower than the setting are still set and cycled by the automatic transmission. (I was kind of spoiled about this by my prior car, a RAV4 Limited AWD, having a continuous variable transmission.) Thus unless I drop down to L1, which is usually useless for attacking a corner, the transmission will still try to gear itself down in confusion under the circumstances.

What I have also rediscovered is the art of shifting into neutral for coasting, especially down slopes, like on a bicycle. Keeps the rpms minimal as possible. But that doesn't help conserving momentum when attacking a corner, of course. Which to be fair I probably shouldn't be doing in a Silverado anyway.  ::)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

jamus34

I just ordered a performance MT vehicle.

Mainly because I love rowing my own gears, MT's in performance vehicles are already rare and the ICE will be going away or at least regulated to a "battery charger" sooner than later so I wanted to get something now.

I don't particularly hate autos, my issue is you really do not have control of the vehicle. I have found that the car manufacturers have so tuned the AT's for gas mileage some vehicles are almost impossible to get any performance out of them.

This is an issue trying to go 0-70 to merge on a highway.

Insert witty comment here.