East Palestine train derailment

[Gusington]

^This explains...everything

[Sir Slash]

Ahhh... So Pratt was the original Toxic Avenger. I will have to treat him with more respect around here. 

[JasonPratt]

A lot of my posts over the years have originated from here! (Including this one this morning.)

Only one of the chemicals here is really dangerous in its raw state -- it's basically a promoted hydrogen peroxide (the stuff you use on your cuts to kill infection) -- plus some acetone which isn't quite as bad -- but you wouldn't want to drink any of our hazchems, much less set them on fire.

[JasonPratt]

Having said that -- and getting back to the topic more-or-less -- not long ago the EPA warned that the need to use poly-carbon-fluorines and chlorines in modern day materials, is leading to an unexpected problem, precisely because these chemicals end up relatively inert, which means they can't be easily modified by common chemicals (whether organic or inorganic) in the environment.

A colorful example is how mold and even moss likes to grow on gelcoat, not because it's eating the gelcoat but because dirt lands on the gelcoat and just sits there providing a basis for plants to grow over time. But a more commonly known concept is that these items aren't biodegradable: they're forever chemicals. (So for a popular example think of plastic soda-can rings killing sea animals.)

At first people expected this meant the chemicals are harmless, once produced -- although often very harmful before production and/or if ever oxidized rapidly like through burning (the train derailment being the immediate example here). Also, at a macro-level they can be harmful for not biodegrading at a reasonable rate, such as with those soda-can rings harming sea life.

But now we're discovering that these particles do release from each other in tiny amounts, nanoparticles, which are still mostly-inert but which get into living creatures in a massive number of environmental ways, and settle inertly in areas they REALLY REALLY should not be settling! For example it gets into the grain we eat which also gets into the animals we eat which eat grain, and gets metabolized into us.

The short version is that we're poisoning ourselves, whether the short way or the long way, or both ways, by using these polymers.

[Pete Dero]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/20-norfolk-southern-train-cars-derail-in-springfield-ohio

A Norfolk Southern train derailed in Ohio on Friday, springing authorities into clean-up duty—again—and residents fearful for their safety.

The derailment occurred near state Route 41 in Springfield just before 5 p.m., according to WHIO. Of the train's 212 cars, about 20 derailed, with four containing residual amounts of diesel exhaust fuel and polyacrylamide water solution. It led to a temporary shelter-in-place order for nearby residents that was lifted early Saturday morning.

The train derailment is the company's third in the nation since early February, when 38 cars of a Norfolk Southern train derailed in East Palestine, Ohio, on Feb. 3. Some of the train's cars burned for days, sending toxic chemicals into the air and water supply and making clean-up crews sick as they responded. The incident forced emergency responses from officials in Ohio, West Virginia, and Pennsylvania, and forced residents within a mile of the site to evacuate.

Officials have removed more than 700 tons of contaminated soil and almost two million gallons of liquid from the site so far, according to NPR.

A second derailment happened on Feb. 16 outside of Detroit, with four Norfolk Southern rail cars tipping over. One of the train's cars contained liquid chlorine, but it was far removed from the four derailed cars and was one of the first ones sequestered once authorities responded, according to WHIO.

[Gusington]

Jesus Christ, Norfolk Southern 

[Pete Dero]

Jesus Christ, Norfolk Southern 

Is that the origin of the US expression : things are going South ?

[Gusington]

^It is now.

[FarAway Sooner]

In 2022, Norfolk Southern reported $4.8 billion in profits on $12.7 billion in operating railroad revenue.  It was a record-setting year for the company.  Make of that what you will.

http://www.nscorp.com/content/nscorp/en/news/norfolk-southern-reports-q4-and-full-year-2022-results.html

[Pete Dero]

Make of that what you will.

[Groggy]

In 2022, Norfolk Southern reported $4.8 billion in profits on $12.7 billion in operating railroad revenue.  It was a record-setting year for the company.  Make of that what you will.

http://www.nscorp.com/content/nscorp/en/news/norfolk-southern-reports-q4-and-full-year-2022-results.html

Nothing says profit over people when they are paying their stockholders $7.5 billion and the residents of East Palestine  $6.5 million.

A human and environmental tragedy means it's the cost of doing business to NS.

[Sir Slash]

"Railway Operating Revenue" and "Revenue from Railway Operations", isn't that the same thing? Anyway, the first was 13% and the second, 5%. So maybe a total of 18%? Nice profits but it hardly classifies them as Robber Barons. Or criminals. Their successful or failed Clean-Up program, directed by the EPA at every step, will.

If their operations are safe or un-safe that's a different matter and should be scrutinized thoroughly. As should all transportation systems currently in use. Open, fair investigations should follow and the results be made public for all. If it's all about the, 'Bengamins', we should know.

[FarAway Sooner]

Not exactly, Groggy.  The $7.5B is their Railroad Operating Expense.  Profits, also called "margin", "net income", "earnings", or a couple other names that all involve various footnotes to make it clear, was $4.8B.

Their "operating" profit margin is $4.8 / $12.7 = 38% or so after rounding.  "Operating" margin is profit excluding big one-time events (e.g., revenue from selling off a bunch of their freight cars and locomotives, expenses from buying a new company, etc.).  Firms are required to publish full profitability as well, but they often use "operating" numbers to try to get rid of background noise and make it easier to do year-over-year comparisons.

I'd need to look at their financial statement, rather than just their earnings announcement, but that $4.7B number is probably earnings before dividends, interest and taxes (companies are taxed on profit, and the rest goes back to shareholders as either reinvestments in the company (e.g., new tech, new rolling stock, etc.) or as dividends (paid out directly to stockholders in the form of cash). 

Payment to debt holders complicates things somewhat, but I'll try not to take us down the Accounting Rabbit Hole unless anybody wants to go.  All you need to know is that a 37% profit margin is extremely healthy for almost any business.

[Windigo]

Not exactly, Groggy.  The $7.5B is their Railroad Operating Expense.  Profits, also called "margin", "net income", "earnings", or a couple other names that all involve various footnotes to make it clear, was $4.8B.

Their "operating" profit margin is $4.8 / $12.7 = 38% or so after rounding.  "Operating" margin is profit excluding big one-time events (e.g., revenue from selling off a bunch of their freight cars and locomotives, expenses from buying a new company, etc.).  Firms are required to publish full profitability as well, but they often use "operating" numbers to try to get rid of background noise and make it easier to do year-over-year comparisons.

I'd need to look at their financial statement, rather than just their earnings announcement, but that $4.7B number is probably earnings before dividends, interest and taxes (companies are taxed on profit, and the rest goes back to shareholders as either reinvestments in the company (e.g., new tech, new rolling stock, etc.) or as dividends (paid out directly to stockholders in the form of cash). 

Payment to debt holders complicates things somewhat, but I'll try not to take us down the Accounting Rabbit Hole unless anybody wants to go.  All you need to know is that a 37% profit margin is extremely healthy for almost any business.

That is an excellent P/E ratio. Just saying....

[Groggy]

Not exactly, Groggy.  The $7.5B is their Railroad Operating Expense.  Profits, also called "margin", "net income", "earnings", or a couple other names that all involve various footnotes to make it clear, was $4.8B.

Their "operating" profit margin is $4.8 / $12.7 = 38% or so after rounding.  "Operating" margin is profit excluding big one-time events (e.g., revenue from selling off a bunch of their freight cars and locomotives, expenses from buying a new company, etc.).  Firms are required to publish full profitability as well, but they often use "operating" numbers to try to get rid of background noise and make it easier to do year-over-year comparisons.

I'd need to look at their financial statement, rather than just their earnings announcement, but that $4.7B number is probably earnings before dividends, interest and taxes (companies are taxed on profit, and the rest goes back to shareholders as either reinvestments in the company (e.g., new tech, new rolling stock, etc.) or as dividends (paid out directly to stockholders in the form of cash). 

Payment to debt holders complicates things somewhat, but I'll try not to take us down the Accounting Rabbit Hole unless anybody wants to go.  All you need to know is that a 37% profit margin is extremely healthy for almost any business.

The railroad operating expenses are $7.9 billion dollars not $7.5 billion.