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Digital Gaming => Computer Gaming => Topic started by: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2020, 04:18:33 PM

Title: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2020, 04:18:33 PM
This looks very interesting...

Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Gusington on May 23, 2020, 04:25:40 PM
Fascinatingly grim...
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on May 23, 2020, 05:01:15 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2020, 04:18:33 PM
This looks very interesting...



Is this the same game someone was mentioning awhile back where I think the person gave people a sneak peak then?  I am forgetting the name.....or is this something different?  I know this doesn't help much, but I am old and can't remember:)
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2020, 05:05:43 PM
No. Totally different.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on May 23, 2020, 05:07:31 PM
Thanks, looks interesting...
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: al_infierno on May 23, 2020, 05:26:31 PM
"In order to raise awareness of the danger that nuclear weapons pose to our society"

Gosh, if only there were some kind of precedent for that sort of thing... Maybe they could start teaching it in high school?

All snark aside, this does look pretty cool, but is there actually a game or is it just a visualization tool?  Kinda reminds me of DefCon but with prettier graphics.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Phantom on May 25, 2020, 10:02:44 AM
If its a game I fear it will be a fairly short one...
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: MetalDog on May 25, 2020, 04:55:10 PM
I am sure the reviews will be glowing.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: al_infierno on May 25, 2020, 04:55:43 PM
^  :2funny:
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on May 25, 2020, 04:58:55 PM
Hopefully, it will yield enough of a fan base for ongoing support.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: airboy on May 25, 2020, 06:04:42 PM
I did something similar, by hand and using a world atlas for a class assignment in a cross listed ROTC/Physics class as an undergrad.  I had 50 30MT nukes and had to maximize population loss.  That was about one nuke sub at the time with MIRVs. 
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: MODy on June 04, 2020, 08:21:10 PM
Hi everyone! I'm Ivan, the developer of the Nuclear War Simulator. Ask me anything or let me know if you have feature requests or suggestions!

"All snark aside, this does look pretty cool, but is there actually a game or is it just a visualization tool?"
At least right now, there are no game elements as there is no goal to achieve. It is a sandbox, where you can do whatever you want. Later, I will probably add objectives and AI to make things more interesting.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on June 04, 2020, 08:32:49 PM
Quote from: MODy on June 04, 2020, 08:21:10 PM
Hi everyone! I'm Ivan, the developer of the Nuclear War Simulator. Ask me anything or let me know if you have feature requests or suggestions!

"All snark aside, this does look pretty cool, but is there actually a game or is it just a visualization tool?"
At least right now, there are no game elements as there is no goal to achieve. It is a sandbox, where you can do whatever you want. Later, I will probably add objectives and AI to make things more interesting.

Welcome! Glad you made it over.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Toonces on June 04, 2020, 09:02:47 PM
There is a real opportunity to make a spiritual successor to Bravo Romeo Delta, and maybe Defcon. 

I hope you'll consider continuing development to make a "game" out of you simulator.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: al_infierno on June 04, 2020, 09:16:44 PM
Quote from: MODy on June 04, 2020, 08:21:10 PM
Hi everyone! I'm Ivan, the developer of the Nuclear War Simulator. Ask me anything or let me know if you have feature requests or suggestions!

"All snark aside, this does look pretty cool, but is there actually a game or is it just a visualization tool?"
At least right now, there are no game elements as there is no goal to achieve. It is a sandbox, where you can do whatever you want. Later, I will probably add objectives and AI to make things more interesting.

Thanks for the reply, and welcome!  O0  This looks like a very cool project, and it would be interesting to see basic game elements added.  If a sandbox is all you were going for in the first place, there's certainly nothing wrong with that, but it would be cool to at least have a multiplayer mode where players can pick a country and nuke the crap out of each other.  That might be easier to implement than an AI - but you're the expert here and not me :D
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: MODy on June 05, 2020, 01:56:24 PM
I have decided not to have multiplayer in it and I am not planning to add it in the future. I was experimenting with multiplayer at the beginning but dropped it for a number of reasons:
- it requires a lot of work and I would rather spend the time to introduce more details into the simulation
- it requires a minimum level of community and thus limits the opportunities to use the simulation
- most people playing strategy games do not bother with multiplayer
- the focus is on the humanitarian impact, while multiplayer interactions would require a lot more focus on the military system side

If you want an interesting nuclear multiplayer, try SIGNAL: https://pong.berkeley.edu/e-game/
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: hellfish6 on June 05, 2020, 03:19:42 PM
That's fascinating. Would it be able to simulate a nuclear conflict in 1962 (Cuban Missile Crisis)? Does it have the weapons and warheads for that?
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: MODy on June 06, 2020, 10:18:17 AM
It is definitely possible to create (and share) historical or future weapon types and simulate historical scenarios. One problem however is that the population distribution has changed dramatically since then so the casualties prediction will be wrong.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Gusington on June 06, 2020, 12:23:19 PM
Future weapons too? That is really interesting.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Oche on June 12, 2020, 06:14:51 AM
Holy mushroom clouds Batman!
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: steve58 on June 12, 2021, 03:47:58 PM
...and going to be released through Matrixgames:

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=5034379



Link to its Product page is the Professional Software page (https://pro.matrixgames.com/game/nuclear-war-simulator-professional-edition).  Wonder if it will be available to us grog-types.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Wburn on June 12, 2021, 04:56:51 PM
Link to its Product page is the Professional Software page.  Wonder if it will be available to us grog-types.

I was wondering that myself I think there are 2 versions of CMANO , one for gamers and another for the high end gamers.
Professional Edition
Command: Modern Air Naval Operations was designed from the onset to be highly usable as a serious gaming and analysis tool, and has been frequently used in this capacity.[16][17] An official "professional edition" was unveiled in May 2015, offering advanced functionality tailored to the needs of defense-related professionals and organizations, think tanks, etc.[18] Features exclusive to the Professional license include: full database-editing access, umpire-controlled WEGO-style multiplayer, Monte-Carlo mode (statistical analysis), data import/export and more (these additional abilities are offered piecemeal to allow customers to tailor Command to their needs.)[19] One of the first unveiled professional customers has been BAE Systems.[20]
Maybe they will release a dumbed down version without those UFOs.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: solops on June 12, 2021, 05:22:41 PM
I have had this for a long time. It is neat, but it is not finished. Also, there has been no word on how to get the Steam/Slitherine version for those of us who bought into it long ago.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Old TImer on June 15, 2021, 06:10:42 PM
How is this game different from the recent  "ICBM" ?
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on June 15, 2021, 06:31:10 PM
Quote from: gregb41352 on June 15, 2021, 06:10:42 PM
How is this game different from the recent  "ICBM" ?

It is much less of a game and more of an educational sandbox. Very detailed though and calculates some pretty impressive data with respect to yield, radiation, flash and fire damage, etc.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on October 17, 2022, 04:20:14 PM
Matrix/Slitherine picked this one up awhile ago. Been a long time since there were any updates. But looks like there has been a good amount of development since the last build I played.

Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: solops on October 17, 2022, 04:46:35 PM
It gets beta party chefs every 2 or 3 weeks.

I love auto spell. "Party chefs" is artificial stupid code for "patches".
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on October 17, 2022, 05:23:42 PM
Quote from: solops on October 17, 2022, 04:46:35 PM
It gets beta party chefs every 2 or 3 weeks.

I love auto spell. "Party chefs" is artificial stupid code for "patches".

Where? I have it on itch, which predates the publishing deal with Matrix. That version hasn't been updated in quite some time.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: solops on October 17, 2022, 08:39:03 PM
I bought it long ago from the dev, who provided Steam keys last year. I get periodic updates via Steam.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on October 17, 2022, 09:20:02 PM
Quote from: solops on October 17, 2022, 08:39:03 PM
I bought it long ago from the dev, who provided Steam keys last year. I get periodic updates via Steam.

How did I miss out on that? I'll have to reach out to him.

Nevermind. I figured it out. I never got a notification that steam keys were available.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: em2nought on October 18, 2022, 08:38:20 PM
I guess the 2022 version of this simulator requires the least work on Artificial Intelligence EVER in a wargame.  :uglystupid2:  Scary!
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on January 27, 2023, 05:23:49 AM
Supposedly scheduled for release on 2/2/23.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1603940/Nuclear_War_Simulator/ (https://store.steampowered.com/app/1603940/Nuclear_War_Simulator/)

Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on January 27, 2023, 07:13:57 AM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on January 27, 2023, 05:23:49 AMSupposedly scheduled for release on 2/2/23.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1603940/Nuclear_War_Simulator/ (https://store.steampowered.com/app/1603940/Nuclear_War_Simulator/)



Yep, matrix posted release info here.  Looking forward to this one.

https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=10126&t=392177
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Old TImer on January 27, 2023, 06:26:43 PM
I don't know what to make of this one philosophically.

Having lived through the vast majority of the actual Cold War, it's umm un-nerving (is that a word?) to contemplate playing.  On the other hand, the ability to (hopefully) manipulate what a nuclear war short of massive retaliation looks like?  The mind spins.

Any other duck and cover kids out there?
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on January 27, 2023, 07:07:04 PM
Quote from: gregb41352 on January 27, 2023, 06:26:43 PMI don't know what to make of this one philosophically.

Having lived through the vast majority of the actual Cold War, it's umm un-nerving (is that a word?) to contemplate playing.  On the other hand, the ability to (hopefully) manipulate what a nuclear war short of massive retaliation looks like?  The mind spins.

Any other duck and cover kids out there?

Do you have any problem wargaming WWII? I don't see why philosophically this should be any different. I've been tinkering around with this for years. This is a simulator in every sense of the word. It really is not a game. There is no plot and no campaign, rather only a set of scenarios modeling various strategic and/or tactical nuclear exchanges of varying scope and intensity. Objectives can certainly be set by scenario designers, but there are no real winners. Check out the devlogs on steam and you'll see how deeply delivery systems, warheads and their effects of blast, shock, fire, radiation and fallout are modeled down to individual human beings. It's definitely the most detailed program covering nuclear war since Bravo Romeo Delta, which I still play from time to time.

I think it's worth a look. It's a very well researched educational tool.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: bobarossa on January 27, 2023, 08:43:21 PM
I worked in military R&D in the 80's.  My manager had a circular sliderule like thing that let you dial in yield and detonation height and it would tell you crater diameter, blast radius, etc.  Was both facinating and unnerving.  I imagine playing this would be similar.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Sigwolf on January 27, 2023, 08:56:26 PM
Seems very much like an updated Defcon, which is somehow almost 17 years old.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1520/DEFCON/
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on January 27, 2023, 09:04:02 PM
Quote from: Sigwolf on January 27, 2023, 08:56:26 PMSeems very much like an updated Defcon, which is somehow almost 17 years old.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1520/DEFCON/

This is absolutely nothing like DEFCON. The only thing they have in common is that they both purport to include nuclear weapons. But seriously, its like comparing Gary Grigsby's War in the East with Panzer General.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Old TImer on January 28, 2023, 01:12:53 AM
JH:
"Do you have any problem wargaming WWII? I don't see why philosophically this should be any different. I've been tinkering around with this for years. This is a simulator in every sense of the word. It really is not a game. There is no plot and no campaign, rather only a set of scenarios modeling various strategic and/or tactical nuclear exchanges of varying scope and intensity. Objectives can certainly be set by scenario designers, but there are no real winners. Check out the devlogs on steam and you'll see how deeply delivery systems, warheads and their effects of blast, shock, fire, radiation and fallout are modeled down to individual human beings. It's definitely the most detailed program covering nuclear war since Bravo Romeo Delta, which I still play from time to time.

I think it's worth a look. It's a very well researched educational tool."

I'll undoubtedly check it over.  The difference between this and World War 2 is that I didn't participate in that one but I kinda feel like I did participate in the Cold War.  I remember being unsettled as a youth in the knowledge that the world could end at any time.  I remember the Cuban Crisis and not knowing what was going to happen. \\
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Ian C on January 30, 2023, 08:19:13 AM
I checked out the STEAM page. I do appreciate this level of detail in an academic sense, but nothing more, as the subject is unnerving and sobering.

However, as an amateur writer of fiction and a roleplaying game player I think it would be very useful for creating plausible scenarios as a basis for fiction or post-apocalyptic tabletop roleplaying games like Twilight 2000.




Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: solops on January 30, 2023, 09:22:41 AM
I have been messing with this since well before it went to Steam and it is way cool. Matrix has a similar offering from the guy who did Polaris Sector called ICBM. It is much more of a game and has more national management tools but less nuke exchange details. Sigh....brings back the good old days, hiding under my school desk, etc. One of my favorite games was Nuclear Destruction. It was a play-by-snail-mail only game that we played back in the early, early 1970s (late 60s?). It required a moderator to whom we would all mail our turns for processing. He would then mail the results back. It was a big deal when a company called Flying Buffalo computerized the processing part, but we still had to mail turns and results back and forth. Good times... end of the world as we know it and all.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on January 30, 2023, 10:42:48 AM
I played the play by Mail nuclear game....but think my country was destroyed like in the first week or two so was short lived:)
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on January 30, 2023, 12:00:01 PM
Quote from: gregb41352 on January 28, 2023, 01:12:53 AMI'll undoubtedly check it over.  The difference between this and World War 2 is that I didn't participate in that one but I kinda feel like I did participate in the Cold War.  I remember being unsettled as a youth in the knowledge that the world could end at any time.  I remember the Cuban Crisis and not knowing what was going to happen. \\

I accept this, but don't really understand it. Unless you served in the military in some capacity during the Cold War or in one of its associated conflicts, I don't see passive observation and witness counting as "participation". At least, not to the point of making one uncomfortable to play a wargame. It would be like me saying I participated in Operation Iraqi Freedom because I was alive when it took place. Don't think that flies.

But, yes...it is a rather morbid and unthinkable topic, so I certainly understand why it could potentially be off-putting as a "game".
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Pete Dero on January 30, 2023, 01:32:26 PM
Slitherine TV - Nuclear Weapon Simulator w/Ivan (Developer)


Now live : https://www.twitch.tv/slitherinetv
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: bobarossa on January 30, 2023, 10:51:04 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on January 30, 2023, 12:00:01 PM
Quote from: gregb41352 on January 28, 2023, 01:12:53 AMI'll undoubtedly check it over.  The difference between this and World War 2 is that I didn't participate in that one but I kinda feel like I did participate in the Cold War.  I remember being unsettled as a youth in the knowledge that the world could end at any time.  I remember the Cuban Crisis and not knowing what was going to happen. \\

I accept this, but don't really understand it. Unless you served in the military in some capacity during the Cold War or in one of its associated conflicts, I don't see passive observation and witness counting as "participation". At least, not to the point of making one uncomfortable to play a wargame. It would be like me saying I participated in Operation Iraqi Freedom because I was alive when it took place. Don't think that flies.
I disagree.  While I suffered no danger during Iraqi Freedom and could not claim to have participated, facing nuclear anhilliation during the 60's was something we all participated in as we were all likely to die from it.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: solops on January 31, 2023, 12:44:50 AM
I gotta say, it never bothered me. I was born in 1956. I do remember the Cuban missile crisis, sort of, and I was aware of it all in the later 60s. I started wargaming in '65 or 66 (AH Gettysburg), so nukes became something we looked into as our gaming horizons expanded. The whole nuke thing never bothered any of us that I can recall. It was just a thing that was there, nothing you could do about it and it had no effect on daily life, other than the occasional drill at school.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on January 31, 2023, 03:04:14 AM
Quote from: bobarossa on January 30, 2023, 10:51:04 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on January 30, 2023, 12:00:01 PM
Quote from: gregb41352 on January 28, 2023, 01:12:53 AMI'll undoubtedly check it over.  The difference between this and World War 2 is that I didn't participate in that one but I kinda feel like I did participate in the Cold War.  I remember being unsettled as a youth in the knowledge that the world could end at any time.  I remember the Cuban Crisis and not knowing what was going to happen. \\

I accept this, but don't really understand it. Unless you served in the military in some capacity during the Cold War or in one of its associated conflicts, I don't see passive observation and witness counting as "participation". At least, not to the point of making one uncomfortable to play a wargame. It would be like me saying I participated in Operation Iraqi Freedom because I was alive when it took place. Don't think that flies.
I disagree.  While I suffered no danger during Iraqi Freedom and could not claim to have participated, facing nuclear anhilliation during the 60's was something we all participated in as we were all likely to die from it.

I guess it's just a matter of semantics on how broadly one wants to define participation. So, thank you for your service, I guess.  :crazy2:
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on January 31, 2023, 06:48:22 PM
Is anyone interested in writing a review of this sim for Grogheads? If so, I will supply you with a code.

Please PM me if interested.

Thanks!  :bow:
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on February 01, 2023, 08:26:04 PM
It's been a tough week on the wallet, Undisputed, Second Front, Rimworld, and few VR games, and now Nuclear War is tomorrow.  I thought it was going to be a slow time of the year.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on February 01, 2023, 08:29:42 PM
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on February 01, 2023, 08:26:04 PMIt's been a tough week on the wallet, Undisputed, Second Front, Rimworld, and few VR games, and now Nuclear War is tomorrow.  I thought it was going to be a slow time of the year.

Write a review and it can be yours on Grogheads.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on February 01, 2023, 08:33:05 PM
Although I plan to find it interested, I suspect I won't be able to understand all its details so not likely a game in my wheelhouse.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Grim.Reaper on February 02, 2023, 10:54:35 AM
Released, $29.99.  The prices is exactly what I suspected it to be so no surprise there.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Redwolf on February 06, 2023, 02:44:22 PM
How does this compare to "ICBM", also by Matrix?
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on February 06, 2023, 03:07:15 PM
Quote from: Redwolf on February 06, 2023, 02:44:22 PMHow does this compare to "ICBM", also by Matrix?

ICBM is to Company of Heroes as NWS is to Gary Grigsby's War in the West.  NWS is much more of a study simulation, where as ICBM is much more of a strategy game.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: undercovergeek on February 06, 2023, 05:20:02 PM
I think the same misconception is displayed in steam reviews - its simply not a game and doesn't pretend to be
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: al_infierno on February 06, 2023, 06:00:18 PM
Looks fairly interesting, apparently you can create an NPC and give them a plan for when the bombs drop, and the simulator sees whether or not they'd survive.  From the reviews it apparently doesn't cover absolutely everything such as flash blindness, but it looks fairly comprehensive.
Title: Re: Nuclear War Simulator
Post by: Jarhead0331 on February 06, 2023, 06:12:04 PM
Quote from: al_infierno on February 06, 2023, 06:00:18 PMLooks fairly interesting, apparently you can create an NPC and give them a plan for when the bombs drop, and the simulator sees whether or not they'd survive.  From the reviews it apparently doesn't cover absolutely everything such as flash blindness, but it looks fairly comprehensive.

There is a whole AI. You can turn the AI on for any nation and it will automatically formulate attack and first strike plans and/or retaliatory plans. The tracking of casualties is what I would describe as extremely robust, particularly when compared to other options in this subject matter. I wouldn't necessarily count the absence of stats pertaining to flash blindness as a negative. The depth of data calculated is staggering as is.