Stellaris

[OJsDad]

Hotfix 1.2.3

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####################### VERSION 1.2.3 ########################
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# Features
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* Added missing interactions to emancipation faction

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# Balance
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* Details mapmode is now on by default.

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# AI
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* AI will no longer repeatedly ask you to join the same war after being declined.
* AI will no longer invite you to war against yourself.
* Sectors should now be more keen to upgrade capital buildings when possible.
* Fixed an issue with AI rebel empires being overly passive in war.

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# User Interface
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* Added notifications for close/open borders.

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# Bugfixes
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* Fixed AI crisis disassembling itself
* Now possible to revoke independence support.
* Fixed notifications for votes to start wars.
* Fixed Regulated Xeno Slavery policy option being available before encountering any xenos.
* Fixed Regulated Xeno Slavery policy option not having the correct tech prerequisite

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# Graphics
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* Randomly generated empires are now able to use DLC portraits

[Anguille]

The Plant-like species have been released, but I am a little amazed at the price: 7 euro's. Not sure I am willing to pay 7 euros for every race they are going to add. 7 euros for a pack of 3, yes, but not per item.

Well...actually it's one species with 15 different races ;)....

Don't know if i'll get it.

[Grim.Reaper]

wow...seems like paradox getting blasted for the cost on their web site...believe Johan from Paradox retorted back that it is worth $20 and they should have charged that....

I haven't played this game in a while, been letting it mature a bit before I jump back in...so no hurry for this DLC, I am sure in a month will be a few $$$ on sale:)

[Silent Disapproval Robot]

I just started playing again 3-4 days ago.  It's still basically the same with a few bits of interface cleaned up, more diplomacy (but still no way to win but via conquest), and a bit more aggressive AI.  Sadly, today's patch invalidated my current campaign with the Space Babes so it's time to start over.

[ghostryder]

The DLC, while offering no real gameplay features and mostly a cosmetic race---does add significant code changes that have broken many mods. The main code change that breaks any mod adding races or ships is centered on  "playable = no" -now crashes the game and has to be changed to playable = { always = no }. Anyone on OSX is unable to play as well but I'm not so i did not research the changes causing that. It's perplexing in what is sold as a game offering and focusing on mod support is riddled with broken mods on each and every update and now as well as graphical DLC. It wouldn't be so bad if Paradox gave the modders a heads up- but they just simply make the changes and send users to tech support-which in this case wasn't even up on the changes themselves and in fact was discovered by the modders themselves.

As for the price? Well , you get the race graphics, a new shipset and a city background. I know of several mods offering the same--say Star trek New Horizons--offering up multple races as well as multiple ship sets, sound and GUI changes far more extensively and in about the same time frame -- so the idea Johan thinks it's a $20 DLC at a bargain price of $7 is--quite frankly almost laughable. Given the fact this is a European company that enjoys shorter work weeks and far more vacation time than the U.S. citizen---I suppose one could concider paradox the BMW of software development and justify it--but I will mention although the typical Lexus is no beamer it also doesn't suffer nearly the trips to the mechanic to fix various problems. In fact that pretty much sums up the DLC. A bit pricely suffering from mechanical issues it really has no buisness suffering from.

The plant race really doesn't do much for me--the ship set really is the best part of the DLC for creating custom races--and I'm really looking forward to more significant additions to races that would truely support say, a migration fleet like in Mass effect or the Borg in Star Trek. The game does have a synthetic option but really lacks the scientific ethics to match- and must be substituted with a ethic really more geared to a Alpha Centuri Morgan Industries Ethic.  Sector A.I. is horrendous to the point your better off modding it out. Federation A.I. is as bad ruining the Star trek experience and what the game screams for is not a fluff DLC such as this but a meat DLC Crusader Kings enjoyed---now that would be a $20 DLC.

[jamus34]

One of my biggest gripes with Stellaris is that the various races have no distinction besides visual. As stated that makes these species DLC's dubious at best.

I still like Stellaris, and given that I typically don't value visual upgrades in the form of dlc in my games I can largely ignore this however it is somewhat galling.

That all said if they want to charge for these while making actual content upgrades free for now then have at it.

[mikeck]

I just don't understand the problem with the cost of the DLC. It's worth what someone will pay for it. If you think $20 is not worth what you get, don't buy it! People on paradox going apoplectic because the DLC is simply a few graphic additions for $20!!! Yeah? I think that's overpriced too! So I won't buy it. If everyone agrees, then the price gets lowered. Beauty of a free market.

Be upset that a new patch ruins mods at little advancement of the game...but because a DLC sucks? Just don't buy it...

[ghostryder]

It's not $20 mikeck. It's $7. The $20 comes from a comment from Johan- saying that it would be worth that. To me $7 is a six pack of bad beer--I don't think it's pricey at all. There's a lot of art there-and i'll note that type of art is a heck of a lot more work than 3d art. A talented artist deserves to be paid well for good art would be my argument justifying the price.

[OJsDad]

Some thoughts on Stellaris vs Distant Worlds.  Not trying to get into which is better, just some thoughts on what I like for different game components;

Combat/Ship Design.

I give a point to DW for ship damage in combat and the loss of weapons and components during combat.  Watching ships in Stellaris get hammered to almost nothing yet they still have all of their weapons is not good.

A point to Stellaris for the ship designer.  While I realize it added flavor in DW, I never under stood why I had to add crew quarters and life support.  It should be factored in.  Not a deal break though.  The worst part by far though is that everything is in one long list.  In Stallaris, weapons are separated from shields, power, and armor and other ship components.

Point for DW in ship design that you can made a ship a large are you want, no matter the class. 

Huge point for Stellaris.  Being able to design and use multiple designs of each ship class.  You want a Cruiser with lots of missiles and a second one with Point Defense, you can do it.  Though I haven't seen any Anti-Missile Missiles or general area defenses yet.  The defenses seem to be for just a single ship.  I also really like being able to mix and match the different hull types to design a ship.
   I'm an idiot.

Fleet combat.  Huge point to Stellaris.  Nothing I hate more in DW than sending a fleet into combat and have ships get destroyed because they attack almost piecemeal. 

I would love for both to allow formations.  I would also love to see both allow task forces/squadrons to be broken off and tactics used.  Send your very fast direct fire corvetts/frigates to single around the side while your dreadnoughts with heavy shields and armor lead the main force with missile heavy cruisers and battleships with heavy direct fire weapons, and your carriers stand will outside missile range while their strikecraft head in. 

[sandman2575]

Huge point for Stellaris.  Being able to design and use multiple designs of each ship class.  You want a Cruiser with lots of missiles and a second one with Point Defense, you can do it.  Though I haven't seen any Anti-Missile Missiles or general area defenses yet.  The defenses seem to be for just a single ship.  I also really like being able to mix and match the different hull types to design a ship.

Though you can certainly do this as well in DW. Nothing prevents you from having different variants of the same class.

[OJsDad]

Stellaris vs DW

Economy;

A big point to DW for the variety of resources and the need to have them to build various kinds of ships components.  Losing access to those components can cost you the war more than technology and fleet size.  Stellaris is trying to do some of this, just not coming off very well right now.  I think the only strategic resource I really look for right now in Stellaris are Betharian gas for energy and the two for terraforming.

A big point for Stellaris in understanding what's going on with your economy.  I don't know how many times I've been playing DW and watch my economy go from good growth to crashing and having no idea why it's happening.  In Stellaris it's pretty easy to understand what's going on. 

Ten points for Sectors in Stellaris.  I know they're still issues with them, and that not everyone likes them because they want to manage all of their planets, but for those of us that want them, they add a lot of game flavor and take a lot of micro management out of your hands.  I would like it if you could set the amount of energy and minerals that are sent to the empire at different levels, ie 25% minerals and 90% energy.

-1 point to DW for the chaos that is your economy.  In addition to what I said above, it just feels that you either run with exploration and construction ships in auto mode or your micro managing them.  I want to be able to assign construction ship 1 to build mining stations for resources xyz until it cannot build any more or I change it's orders.  I really wish DW had a dual monitor option to put the map on one screen and a multi panel setup on the other. 

[OJsDad]

Huge point for Stellaris.  Being able to design and use multiple designs of each ship class.  You want a Cruiser with lots of missiles and a second one with Point Defense, you can do it.  Though I haven't seen any Anti-Missile Missiles or general area defenses yet.  The defenses seem to be for just a single ship.  I also really like being able to mix and match the different hull types to design a ship.

Though you can certainly do this as well in DW. Nothing prevents you from having different variants of the same class.

Thanks Sandman.  I don't know what I never realized that before.  Was there a time when you could only have one design of each type.  Oh well.  I loaded DW and looked and see where I was missing this feature. 

[Barthheart]

Huge point for Stellaris.  Being able to design and use multiple designs of each ship class.  You want a Cruiser with lots of missiles and a second one with Point Defense, you can do it.  Though I haven't seen any Anti-Missile Missiles or general area defenses yet.  The defenses seem to be for just a single ship.  I also really like being able to mix and match the different hull types to design a ship.

Upgrading while do this multi type in one class gets messy though. Say you have a beam setup destroyer and a missile setup destroyer. All types of destroyer will only upgrade the latest type you created. So if you create a new version of the the missile DD then create a new version of the beam DD and then go to upgrade your old missile DDs they will all change to the newest beam type DD.
Not sure how to get around this....

[sandman2575]

Was there a time when you could only have one design of each type.

It's possible -- I bought DW from Matrix when it came out years ago, and really struggled to get into it. Mostly forgot about it until DW Universe came out on Steam, and I thought, what the hell, why not give it another go. Made a real effort to learn the game and glad I did -- it's to me by far still the best space 4x out there (I have a strange soft-spot for SotS II as well!). 

My love of DW has actually really made it difficult for me to get into Stellaris. Stellaris -- surprisingly enough for a Paradox game -- just seems quite shallow and rigid by comparison to me.

[OJsDad]

Was there a time when you could only have one design of each type.

It's possible -- I bought DW from Matrix when it came out years ago, and really struggled to get into it. Mostly forgot about it until DW Universe came out on Steam, and I thought, what the hell, why not give it another go. Made a real effort to learn the game and glad I did -- it's to me by far still the best space 4x out there (I have a strange soft-spot for SotS II as well!). 

My love of DW has actually really made it difficult for me to get into Stellaris. Stellaris -- surprisingly enough for a Paradox game -- just seems quite shallow and rigid by comparison to me.

I like DW also.  My comments weren't meant to put one over the other, just to compare notes.  You pointing out that you can have multi designs of ship classes was something that I had totally missed over the several years.  Should put a whole new look on the game for me.