The last game is pretty much done, with nobody left but me, TMIT, and an AI Agartha. We're gonna keep duking it out in that game to try and test Dom 6 stuff, but in the meanwhile...
Era: Middle Age
Game name: Groggies 2
Password: Same as last time (or ask for a PM if you're new)
Deadline: Whenever we feel like it
Drop a line in this thread and claim a nation if you wanna drop in the deep end. Lobby is already created, all you have to do is go to Network > Enter Game Lobby and find Groggies 2.
Player - Nation:
1. al_infierno - Man
2. Ashara - Marignon
3. TheMeInTeam - Bandar Log
4. Myrmidon - Arcoscephale
5. Tanaka - Pyrene
I shouldn't do this... but oh well! Sign me up.
Tentatively as Arco. In no rush to start, but looking forward to playing with the Grogs once again!
Are we adding north/south wrap this time or keeping default? As I learned in previous game no north/south makes some wars really obvious to do, and will inform my strategy a bit since unlucky caps are more likely too. If it's possible for me to get Ulm'd, I will want to mitigate the risk of that ending the run immediately with nation choice and build.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on March 01, 2024, 09:50:19 PMAre we adding north/south wrap this time or keeping default? As I learned in previous game no north/south makes some wars really obvious to do, and will inform my strategy a bit since unlucky caps are more likely too. If it's possible for me to get Ulm'd, I will want to mitigate the risk of that ending the run immediately with nation choice and build.
Yes, north/south wraparound this time.
Time to return to monke I guess. I'll take Bandar Log.
Tanaka -- Are you Pyrene?
The previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Quote from: al_infierno on March 05, 2024, 10:07:33 PMThe previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Did you message Ajedica about joining? I thought he said he would join the next one...
Quote from: Tanaka on March 06, 2024, 05:25:34 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 05, 2024, 10:07:33 PMThe previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Did you message Ajedica about joining? I thought he said he would join the next one...
I did, and unfortunately he passed on it since he's about to be traveling a lot for work.
Quote from: al_infierno on March 06, 2024, 07:17:11 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 06, 2024, 05:25:34 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 05, 2024, 10:07:33 PMThe previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Did you message Ajedica about joining? I thought he said he would join the next one...
I did, and unfortunately he passed on it since he's about to be traveling a lot for work.
Looks like we are just waiting on Marignon and Bandar Log to start the game then?
Quote from: Tanaka on March 07, 2024, 01:51:56 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 06, 2024, 07:17:11 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 06, 2024, 05:25:34 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 05, 2024, 10:07:33 PMThe previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Did you message Ajedica about joining? I thought he said he would join the next one...
I did, and unfortunately he passed on it since he's about to be traveling a lot for work.
Looks like we are just waiting on Marignon and Bandar Log to start the game then?
Yep, I think they're both ironing out a pretender choice. Hoping to get started by Saturday.
Quote from: al_infierno on March 07, 2024, 02:20:21 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 07, 2024, 01:51:56 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 06, 2024, 07:17:11 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 06, 2024, 05:25:34 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 05, 2024, 10:07:33 PMThe previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Did you message Ajedica about joining? I thought he said he would join the next one...
I did, and unfortunately he passed on it since he's about to be traveling a lot for work.
Looks like we are just waiting on Marignon and Bandar Log to start the game then?
Yep, I think they're both ironing out a pretender choice. Hoping to get started by Saturday.
Only waiting on Marignon now...
Quote from: Tanaka on March 08, 2024, 02:35:30 AMQuote from: al_infierno on March 07, 2024, 02:20:21 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 07, 2024, 01:51:56 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 06, 2024, 07:17:11 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 06, 2024, 05:25:34 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 05, 2024, 10:07:33 PMThe previous game is officially over. Could still use some extra players in this one, if anyone wants to get their feet wet.
Any takers?
Did you message Ajedica about joining? I thought he said he would join the next one...
I did, and unfortunately he passed on it since he's about to be traveling a lot for work.
Looks like we are just waiting on Marignon and Bandar Log to start the game then?
Yep, I think they're both ironing out a pretender choice. Hoping to get started by Saturday.
Only waiting on Marignon now...
And looks like we are all set to go now all pretenders are in! Due to the recent new patch I've decided to change and have some fun with Asphodel. As tricky as they are!
Quote from: Tanaka on March 08, 2024, 12:42:37 PMAnd looks like we are all set to go now all pretenders are in! Due to the recent new patch I've decided to change and have some fun with Asphodel. As tricky as they are!
Did you mean to change back to Pyrene?
Quote from: al_infierno on March 08, 2024, 07:35:56 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 08, 2024, 12:42:37 PMAnd looks like we are all set to go now all pretenders are in! Due to the recent new patch I've decided to change and have some fun with Asphodel. As tricky as they are!
Did you mean to change back to Pyrene?
Yes I decided Asphodel is just too tricky for me to put up a good fight. Need more practice with them!
The game is afoot!
First turn is in. Good luck, everyone!
And second and third! We are off to a good start! Good luck everyone!
GL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Quote from: Myrmidon on March 10, 2024, 07:53:56 PMGL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Very cool. Good find!
Quote from: Myrmidon on March 10, 2024, 07:53:56 PMGL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Thanks for the tip! Anything you need to do after joining?
Quote from: Tanaka on March 11, 2024, 05:45:25 PMQuote from: Myrmidon on March 10, 2024, 07:53:56 PMGL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Thanks for the tip! Anything you need to do after joining?
Go to the #subscribe-here channel and enter "/subscribe_to groggies_2" without the quotes
Quote from: al_infierno on March 11, 2024, 06:54:08 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 11, 2024, 05:45:25 PMQuote from: Myrmidon on March 10, 2024, 07:53:56 PMGL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Thanks for the tip! Anything you need to do after joining?
Go to the #subscribe-here channel and enter "/subscribe_to groggies_2" without the quotes
Thanks got it to work!
Just curious what map setting did you use? Seems very small and a lot of water?
Quote from: Tanaka on March 11, 2024, 08:09:59 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 11, 2024, 06:54:08 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 11, 2024, 05:45:25 PMQuote from: Myrmidon on March 10, 2024, 07:53:56 PMGL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Thanks for the tip! Anything you need to do after joining?
Go to the #subscribe-here channel and enter "/subscribe_to groggies_2" without the quotes
Thanks got it to work!
Just curious what map setting did you use? Seems very small and a lot of water?
All defaults, except north/south wraparound. The map is very odd, with lots of weird peninsulas, impassable mountains, rivers, and WAY too much ocean.
Vanilla gen be like that.
In all honesty, as screwed as I have been in many games, and as crazy as it comes out, something about it is pretty cool after years of playing on MapNuke. I get having more balanced maps are fun, and preferable for competition games. But there's something refreshing about the vanilla gen for friendly games, warts and all.
Quote from: Myrmidon on March 12, 2024, 06:34:40 PMVanilla gen be like that.
In all honesty, as screwed as I have been in many games, and as crazy as it comes out, something about it is pretty cool after years of playing on MapNuke. I get having more balanced maps are fun, and preferable for competition games. But there's something refreshing about the vanilla gen for friendly games, warts and all.
Same, I grew real tired of MapNuke maps after about half a dozen games when it became clear it basically just makes the exact same perfectly balanced world every single time. I like the uniqueness of actually having a landmass that looks like something that might exist in real life.
Quote from: Myrmidon on March 12, 2024, 06:34:40 PMVanilla gen be like that.
In all honesty, as screwed as I have been in many games, and as crazy as it comes out, something about it is pretty cool after years of playing on MapNuke. I get having more balanced maps are fun, and preferable for competition games. But there's something refreshing about the vanilla gen for friendly games, warts and all.
Agreed. Map Nuke maps are so bland boring and samesy and I hate the colors. I really like what the Dom 6 maps look like now. It gives you that epic fantasy feel and the terraforming and weather effects are really cool. I also like how you never know what to expect instead of everything always being exactly the same.
Quote from: al_infierno on March 11, 2024, 11:53:07 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 11, 2024, 08:09:59 PMQuote from: al_infierno on March 11, 2024, 06:54:08 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 11, 2024, 05:45:25 PMQuote from: Myrmidon on March 10, 2024, 07:53:56 PMGL and HF all!
Incidentally, for any of you on Discord, there is a channel that actively tracks and pings with the status of the game. Dominions Envoy. https://discord.gg/uKQy2bEd
Until the clockwork bot is 100% up and running, it makes a nice way to keep up with the game status without having to log in directly or click on the game link.
Thanks for the tip! Anything you need to do after joining?
Go to the #subscribe-here channel and enter "/subscribe_to groggies_2" without the quotes
Thanks got it to work!
Just curious what map setting did you use? Seems very small and a lot of water?
All defaults, except north/south wraparound. The map is very odd, with lots of weird peninsulas, impassable mountains, rivers, and WAY too much ocean.
Gotcha. Well the map is interesting for sure haha. I'm glad there are no water nations!
Quote from: al_infierno on March 12, 2024, 08:25:22 PMQuote from: Myrmidon on March 12, 2024, 06:34:40 PMVanilla gen be like that.
In all honesty, as screwed as I have been in many games, and as crazy as it comes out, something about it is pretty cool after years of playing on MapNuke. I get having more balanced maps are fun, and preferable for competition games. But there's something refreshing about the vanilla gen for friendly games, warts and all.
Same, I grew real tired of MapNuke maps after about half a dozen games when it became clear it basically just makes the exact same perfectly balanced world every single time. I like the uniqueness of actually having a landmass that looks like something that might exist in real life.
Agreed the maps look much cooler and it really enhances the atmosphere!
For some inscrutable reason, I am being attacked from a corner position before turn 20 for the second game in a row. This time by Pyrene.
Corner wars are obnoxious and many players view them as griefing, myself included. In case the reason for that isn't obvious: neither side that wins can reasonably hold the territory for most nations.
I don't think I can convince the lobby to leave me alone if I go kill Pyrene. That said, I also don't appreciate moves that amount to griefing, regardless of their intentions. Realistically, Pyrene's poor expansion should have put a target on them by now, to the extent that attacking me wouldn't be on their radar. Since that hasn't happened, I will make an offer. I will NAP anybody willing to take this conduct out of the game until Pyrene is gone, and am willing to commit to attacking anybody who backstabs the player attacking Pyrene if possible.
That way, winning a war means actually winning it and we can untangle the nonsense a bit. I do want my province back, though.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on March 13, 2024, 10:41:03 AMFor some inscrutable reason, I am being attacked from a corner position before turn 20 for the second game in a row. This time by Pyrene.
Corner wars are obnoxious and many players view them as griefing, myself included. In case the reason for that isn't obvious: neither side that wins can reasonably hold the territory for most nations.
I don't think I can convince the lobby to leave me alone if I go kill Pyrene. That said, I also don't appreciate moves that amount to griefing, regardless of their intentions. Realistically, Pyrene's poor expansion should have put a target on them by now, to the extent that attacking me wouldn't be on their radar. Since that hasn't happened, I will make an offer. I will NAP anybody willing to take this conduct out of the game until Pyrene is gone, and am willing to commit to attacking anybody who backstabs the player attacking Pyrene if possible.
That way, winning a war means actually winning it and we can untangle the nonsense a bit. I do want my province back, though.
What is a corner war? What is griefing? I decided to keep expanding because of just that. Bad expansion. I have so few provinces I have to expand or die. You were my best path. Don't take it personally it's just a game this was my best option and I decided to take a risk. Nothing to do with the last game or any other games. None of us were the reason Ulm attacked you last game. I'm just having fun playing a game. I'm sure you will have no problem killing me as always haha.
Corner war, I believe, refers to attacking someone so far away from you that you can't reasonably hold their territory. I.e. attacking someone in an opposite corner. I'm pretty sure TMIT is referring to me attacking them in the last game, not Ulm.
Griefing refers to the online practice of intentionally causing grief to other players. Common example would be Team Killing in a competitive FPS when one gets frustrated by their teammates.
"Expanding" into other players turf is an odd strat, to say the least. Don't you still have underground real estate you could claim? :P
Quote from: Tanaka on March 14, 2024, 02:06:45 AMQuote from: TheMeInTeam on March 13, 2024, 10:41:03 AMFor some inscrutable reason, I am being attacked from a corner position before turn 20 for the second game in a row. This time by Pyrene.
Corner wars are obnoxious and many players view them as griefing, myself included. In case the reason for that isn't obvious: neither side that wins can reasonably hold the territory for most nations.
I don't think I can convince the lobby to leave me alone if I go kill Pyrene. That said, I also don't appreciate moves that amount to griefing, regardless of their intentions. Realistically, Pyrene's poor expansion should have put a target on them by now, to the extent that attacking me wouldn't be on their radar. Since that hasn't happened, I will make an offer. I will NAP anybody willing to take this conduct out of the game until Pyrene is gone, and am willing to commit to attacking anybody who backstabs the player attacking Pyrene if possible.
That way, winning a war means actually winning it and we can untangle the nonsense a bit. I do want my province back, though.
What is a corner war? What is griefing? I decided to keep expanding because of just that. Bad expansion. I have so few provinces I have to expand or die. You were my best path. Don't take it personally it's just a game this was my best option and I decided to take a risk. Nothing to do with the last game or any other games. None of us were the reason Ulm attacked you last game. I'm just having fun playing a game. I'm sure you will have no problem killing me as always haha.
The reason I'm complaining is precisely that I'm not your "best path", and can't be in this game state. There is a 1 province corridor between us, before you also attacked Arco. Anybody who wins such a conflict would not be able to reinforce what they just took.
If you took the game state before you attacked me, posted it on multiple discord channels, and asked players to rank which nations would be reasonable for you to attack or be attacked by, I will bet money that I'm not in top 2 among their choices on average
*for either side* to start the war.
Many players would also consider a fight between nations positioned like this to be obviously detrimental, to the point of questioning the motives of players doing such a war/whether they're trying to win the game vs just harming a particular nation. This is why I'm calling it griefing. If you lose, you lose. If you win, you still lose. But you chose it anyway, and as a consequence it hurts my position as well. Obviously I don't like that : :huh:.
I get that it's probably not in bad faith, but it's such an odd choice that it looks like it's in bad faith. This is very similar to how you and Agartha both ended NAP with me in the last game, then claimed you didn't necessarily want to fight right away. When I mentioned that to Lucid, the first thing that came to mind for him was that it was deception and you were definitely planning an attack. That's what ending NAP de facto means. I understand now that both you and Agartha probably didn't see it that way...but in not seeing it that way, you misunderstand how the game works.
The most obvious explanation for my observations was that you were trying to vulture a province off me that would be harder to defend than most of my others as part of some coordinated strike from Arco. But then a) Arco didn't attack me and b) you attacked Arco too, which is some pants on head stuff lol.
Quote from: al_infierno on March 14, 2024, 12:49:09 PMCorner war, I believe, refers to attacking someone so far away from you that you can't reasonably hold their territory. I.e. attacking someone in an opposite corner. I'm pretty sure TMIT is referring to me attacking them in the last game, not Ulm.
Griefing refers to the online practice of intentionally causing grief to other players. Common example would be Team Killing in a competitive FPS when one gets frustrated by their teammates.
"Expanding" into other players turf is an odd strat, to say the least. Don't you still have underground real estate you could claim? :P
Ah thanks for the explanations. I think you guys can see that in suiciding risk against two players I am definitely not griefing one. Underground is pretty much finished.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on March 14, 2024, 01:47:50 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 14, 2024, 02:06:45 AMQuote from: TheMeInTeam on March 13, 2024, 10:41:03 AMFor some inscrutable reason, I am being attacked from a corner position before turn 20 for the second game in a row. This time by Pyrene.
Corner wars are obnoxious and many players view them as griefing, myself included. In case the reason for that isn't obvious: neither side that wins can reasonably hold the territory for most nations.
I don't think I can convince the lobby to leave me alone if I go kill Pyrene. That said, I also don't appreciate moves that amount to griefing, regardless of their intentions. Realistically, Pyrene's poor expansion should have put a target on them by now, to the extent that attacking me wouldn't be on their radar. Since that hasn't happened, I will make an offer. I will NAP anybody willing to take this conduct out of the game until Pyrene is gone, and am willing to commit to attacking anybody who backstabs the player attacking Pyrene if possible.
That way, winning a war means actually winning it and we can untangle the nonsense a bit. I do want my province back, though.
What is a corner war? What is griefing? I decided to keep expanding because of just that. Bad expansion. I have so few provinces I have to expand or die. You were my best path. Don't take it personally it's just a game this was my best option and I decided to take a risk. Nothing to do with the last game or any other games. None of us were the reason Ulm attacked you last game. I'm just having fun playing a game. I'm sure you will have no problem killing me as always haha.
The reason I'm complaining is precisely that I'm not your "best path", and can't be in this game state. There is a 1 province corridor between us, before you also attacked Arco. Anybody who wins such a conflict would not be able to reinforce what they just took.
If you took the game state before you attacked me, posted it on multiple discord channels, and asked players to rank which nations would be reasonable for you to attack or be attacked by, I will bet money that I'm not in top 2 among their choices on average *for either side* to start the war.
Many players would also consider a fight between nations positioned like this to be obviously detrimental, to the point of questioning the motives of players doing such a war/whether they're trying to win the game vs just harming a particular nation. This is why I'm calling it griefing. If you lose, you lose. If you win, you still lose. But you chose it anyway, and as a consequence it hurts my position as well. Obviously I don't like that : :huh:.
I get that it's probably not in bad faith, but it's such an odd choice that it looks like it's in bad faith. This is very similar to how you and Agartha both ended NAP with me in the last game, then claimed you didn't necessarily want to fight right away. When I mentioned that to Lucid, the first thing that came to mind for him was that it was deception and you were definitely planning an attack. That's what ending NAP de facto means. I understand now that both you and Agartha probably didn't see it that way...but in not seeing it that way, you misunderstand how the game works.
The most obvious explanation for my observations was that you were trying to vulture a province off me that would be harder to defend than most of my others as part of some coordinated strike from Arco. But then a) Arco didn't attack me and b) you attacked Arco too, which is some pants on head stuff lol.
I think you think I am a logical player which I am not. I play risky and unpredictable. Just my playstyle and personality. More for fun than winning. If you are looking to analyze my every move I am the wrong guy for that because you will not be able to.
It is deception to end a NAP? I did not claim anything but you did attack me first afterwards. I also had no idea what Agartha was doing until they ended NAP and then decided to quit. Interesting that you talked to Lucid about our game haha.
It might help to work backwards. Why do you think players make non-aggression pacts? What purpose does this achieve in a game?
Ending NAP and then saying "you attacked me first" is an oxymoron...basically the same thing as declaring war and then saying the other nation attacked you. Ending NAP comes with considerations/requirements attached that are inherently hostile. It's that part where both me in the moment and Lucid when I mentioned it on his comments concluded it was deceptive.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on March 14, 2024, 01:47:50 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 14, 2024, 02:06:45 AMQuote from: TheMeInTeam on March 13, 2024, 10:41:03 AMFor some inscrutable reason, I am being attacked from a corner position before turn 20 for the second game in a row. This time by Pyrene.
Corner wars are obnoxious and many players view them as griefing, myself included. In case the reason for that isn't obvious: neither side that wins can reasonably hold the territory for most nations.
I don't think I can convince the lobby to leave me alone if I go kill Pyrene. That said, I also don't appreciate moves that amount to griefing, regardless of their intentions. Realistically, Pyrene's poor expansion should have put a target on them by now, to the extent that attacking me wouldn't be on their radar. Since that hasn't happened, I will make an offer. I will NAP anybody willing to take this conduct out of the game until Pyrene is gone, and am willing to commit to attacking anybody who backstabs the player attacking Pyrene if possible.
That way, winning a war means actually winning it and we can untangle the nonsense a bit. I do want my province back, though.
What is a corner war? What is griefing? I decided to keep expanding because of just that. Bad expansion. I have so few provinces I have to expand or die. You were my best path. Don't take it personally it's just a game this was my best option and I decided to take a risk. Nothing to do with the last game or any other games. None of us were the reason Ulm attacked you last game. I'm just having fun playing a game. I'm sure you will have no problem killing me as always haha.
The reason I'm complaining is precisely that I'm not your "best path", and can't be in this game state. There is a 1 province corridor between us, before you also attacked Arco. Anybody who wins such a conflict would not be able to reinforce what they just took.
If you took the game state before you attacked me, posted it on multiple discord channels, and asked players to rank which nations would be reasonable for you to attack or be attacked by, I will bet money that I'm not in top 2 among their choices on average *for either side* to start the war.
Many players would also consider a fight between nations positioned like this to be obviously detrimental, to the point of questioning the motives of players doing such a war/whether they're trying to win the game vs just harming a particular nation. This is why I'm calling it griefing. If you lose, you lose. If you win, you still lose. But you chose it anyway, and as a consequence it hurts my position as well. Obviously I don't like that : :huh:.
I get that it's probably not in bad faith, but it's such an odd choice that it looks like it's in bad faith. This is very similar to how you and Agartha both ended NAP with me in the last game, then claimed you didn't necessarily want to fight right away. When I mentioned that to Lucid, the first thing that came to mind for him was that it was deception and you were definitely planning an attack. That's what ending NAP de facto means. I understand now that both you and Agartha probably didn't see it that way...but in not seeing it that way, you misunderstand how the game works.
The most obvious explanation for my observations was that you were trying to vulture a province off me that would be harder to defend than most of my others as part of some coordinated strike from Arco. But then a) Arco didn't attack me and b) you attacked Arco too, which is some pants on head stuff lol.
It occurred to me that after the Pyrene incident with you, me having a bunch of troops on the border looked bad. :2funny: I had lost a fort in another game on the last turn of it's construction to an indy attack, and absolutely didn't want that happening in this game, so I just garrisoned the province to make sure it didn't happen again, and probably ended up sending the wrong message.
Then Pyrene just decided to up and steal one of my provinces. I won't complain though, I'm just gonna go kick his ass.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on March 14, 2024, 04:37:00 PMIt might help to work backwards. Why do you think players make non-aggression pacts? What purpose does this achieve in a game?
Ending NAP and then saying "you attacked me first" is an oxymoron...basically the same thing as declaring war and then saying the other nation attacked you. Ending NAP comes with considerations/requirements attached that are inherently hostile. It's that part where both me in the moment and Lucid when I mentioned it on his comments concluded it was deceptive.
Again you are trying to apply logic to me. I am not logical. I am the opposite of Commander Spock. More like Captain Kirk haha. I am much more likely to go down in flames!
This has been a fun fight guys! Now the question is what happens to my two enemies as they bear down on my cap? Do they share my territory or fight to the death? And what happens as Man and Marignon sleep? Will they awaken? Stay tuned for more!
I'm getting less out of the war despite killing your god, but that's what you chose in making these attacks. It's better than getting nothing for me, but still not a great transition of game state. Helps Arco a lot, me a little. Maybe if you still had the stuff you sac'd to hold one of my provinces for a few turns, you could put up a fight (would be hard vs what Arco is sending your way though). As it stands now, you're helpless, and the correct move for Mari is to just vulture whatever is possible :p.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on March 16, 2024, 01:57:26 PMI'm getting less out of the war despite killing your god, but that's what you chose in making these attacks. It's better than getting nothing for me, but still not a great transition of game state. Helps Arco a lot, me a little. Maybe if you still had the stuff you sac'd to hold one of my provinces for a few turns, you could put up a fight (would be hard vs what Arco is sending your way though). As it stands now, you're helpless, and the correct move for Mari is to just vulture whatever is possible :p.
Since I am helping Arco a lot you should probably attack him now. We can call a ceasefire and go against Arco and Marignon together! :ROFL:
Fighting Mari is borderline impossible from my position, and it looks like the Man attack on Arco shifts the gains from your land to Mari.
There will be no cease fire, though. You de facto lost the game when you lost your god + 19 sacreds alongside that PD dump. In a different world, we'd have been natural allies in this game since two of your actually-viable opponents were also potential targets for me. Given your conduct though, it's better if you're off the board in this one :p.
Other than one more province to raid there's not much left for me to take from you.
Good game all! Good luck in the carnage to come!
Hope you'll join us again in the next one!
Quote from: Tanaka on March 19, 2024, 10:54:38 PMGood game all! Good luck in the carnage to come!
Carnage indeed! I finally got into my first big scuffle with Myrmidon. He whooped my ass, but it was an awesome battle to watch!
Quote from: al_infierno on March 22, 2024, 01:02:12 PMQuote from: Tanaka on March 19, 2024, 10:54:38 PMGood game all! Good luck in the carnage to come!
Carnage indeed! I finally got into my first big scuffle with Myrmidon. He whooped my ass, but it was an awesome battle to watch!
What else is happening in the game? We need updates!
Not much else really, from what I've seen. It took ages of dancing around for me and Arco to finally have our big scuffle, and far as I can tell, Bandar Log and Marignon are chilling back with their popcorn, building up their sacred reserves, and enjoying the show!
Updates and game news stimulates interest in Dom 6 and may attract new players.
Arco seems to have fully recovered from my attempt at stabbing them in the heart. They went for a heavily defended throne last turn, and lost a big guy with a ton of items in the process. Probably hurt a bit in terms of gems, but no big loss of troops.
I've also pretty much recovered all my lost strength, but I'm feeling a LOT more cautious about trying to invade anyone. Arco proved they can easily handle my cavalry corps with the magic equivalent of massed artillery, and Marignon and Bandar Log are way too big for me to try and take on alone.
Right now the game momentum firmly rests in the hands of Marignon and Bandar Log. Between them they probably own about 75% of the map and neither have faced significant losses in their limited conflicts yet. Remains to be seen how this Cold War gets hot.
Oh... also, there's a new game update today :wink:
I am at war with Arco now. So far it's been raiding on either side, somewhat favoring me because I have more stuff. However, it's the army fight that will be decisive, which hasn't happened yet.
I had a scout on that attempt for tier 3 throne too. Spring hawks fit 3 to square and have a 6 AN shock damage attack. The golem had 5% regen and 10 SR. Here is the DRN chart for dominions. (https://illwiki.com/dom5/dominions-random-number). At -4, each attack has an 18% chance of dealing at least some damage (and will sometimes hit for significantly more).
at 3/square and 8 surrounding squares, 24 spring hawks can attack per round. At least one of them will hit for damage in >99% of rounds. On average, quite a few will, with each successful damage also having a chance to stun the target.
I would not feel comfortable sending something into them w/o at least 20 SR. They only have a 1% chance to deal damage per attack then, so you still have a > 80% chance per round to not take damage (good enough that regen can keep up as long as it's decent). This is a very similar scenario to how massed air elementals killed al infierno's monument despite its > 1000hp a few years ago...too many lightning swarm attacks --> stunlock due to some but not sufficient SR.
In terms of the game state, Mari and I have done what made me nervous about Xibalba last game - pushed infra and made lots of mages uncontested. At least, I believe Mari also made lots of mages. Their troop count of any-fort sacred knights of the chalice is incredible though, and I'm personally hoping that came at the expense of some research speed, because if it didn't I probably can't keep up with the sheer volume of elite sacreds coming my way sooner or later...assuming I actually defeat Arco. We can fully expect late-game techs at play in this one...I just hope I'm the only one who has them.
In terms of win probability, I estimate that either me or Mari has > 99% in this game. Unless Arco beats me w/o losses, Mari could just wash over all of us 1v3 if I lose my army vs Arco in mutually destructive fighting. If I beat Arco, the most likely outcome is that Mari and Man dogpile me...even though it would almost certainly be Bandar + Man dogpiling Mari if I were leading that nation. Trying to win from Arco's or Man's position would be incredibly difficult. They are much worse off in this game than Agartha and Xibalba were after I took Ubar with Mekone, though not quite as bad as Lanka was in that game.
Throne rush win will also be difficult. Mari needs to take tier 3 throne (presently in Arco's land) AND one of my underwater thrones to win. For me to win, I need that tier 3 throne and to capture a tier 2 off Mari...similarly deep in her territory as the UW stuff would be in mine. I doubt either of us will win just by jumping onto a throne next to someone's cap and nobody doing anything about it like last time lol.
Anyone see any good thugs yet?
Quote from: solops on April 06, 2024, 07:41:07 AMAnyone see any good thugs yet?
I did some pretty solid thugging with a Lord Warden geared up with a coral blade, blade of grass, and some decent armor. At least until he came toe-to-toe with Arco's main army. :embarrassed:
Nearly all of Arco's unforted territory was taken via thugs, only 3 provinces taken with conventional forces (ichtyids in one water province, priest + tiger riders sniping 1 province, and probably can't thug the hamadryad province w/o army support). I didn't meet much PD, but the stuff I used could kill 50+ PD easily so it would be a bad deal w/o mages behind it.
You can't solo operate thugs into decently designed armies, even less so if they have good tech. Needs a tailor-made SC, and only if a weakness is spotted in army scripting.
Unfortunately, Arco disease attritioned a big % of my army, although he still lost more or less all of his remaining capability when I took cap successfully. Did a good job making me bleed for it though, Mari is definitely position 1 in terms of troop power and has at least one tech at level 7 (evo), since Mari has harbingers also conj 6. Might be even higher.
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on April 06, 2024, 07:47:04 PMYou can't solo operate thugs into decently designed armies, even less so if they have good tech. Needs a tailor-made SC, and only if a weakness is spotted in army scripting.
Oh yeah, it wasn't intentional at all. Either a happy accident on Arco's part, or a well placed counter-thug army.
GG All!
Yeah, RNGesus slapping me in the middle of the map with the only 3 pt throne in my capring was pretty rough. I tried to acquit myself well in spite of the circumstances.
Maybe with some hardcore diplomancing, I may have been able to eek out a better outcome? But my current game count has me a little too occupied for such things. Even with said diplomancing, I'm still the monkey in the middle, with the throne strapped to my neck needed for anyone to win the game, so may as well happily accept one's fate.
Best of luck to the remaining players. I'd say a nice tossup between Mari and Bandar at this point, perhaps depending on the initiative shown, as well as who Man decides to team up with.
Have fun with it!
Quote from: Myrmidon on April 07, 2024, 10:01:55 AMGG All!
Yeah, RNGesus slapping me in the middle of the map with the only 3 pt throne in my capring was pretty rough. I tried to acquit myself well in spite of the circumstances.
Maybe with some hardcore diplomancing, I may have been able to eek out a better outcome? But my current game count has me a little too occupied for such things. Even with said diplomancing, I'm still the monkey in the middle, with the throne strapped to my neck needed for anyone to win the game, so may as well happily accept one's fate.
Best of luck to the remaining players. I'd say a nice tossup between Mari and Bandar at this point, perhaps depending on the initiative shown, as well as who Man decides to team up with.
Have fun with it!
So what ended up happening? Who is at war with who now?
Quote from: Tanaka on April 11, 2024, 06:53:06 PMSo what ended up happening? Who is at war with who now?
Still moving slowly, but I just declared war on both Bandar and Mari to keep things exciting :evil:
Quote from: al_infierno on April 11, 2024, 07:31:06 PMQuote from: Tanaka on April 11, 2024, 06:53:06 PMSo what ended up happening? Who is at war with who now?
Still moving slowly, but I just declared war on both Bandar and Mari to keep things exciting :evil:
Ohhh you just pulled a Tanaka nice! Spice that #$%^&%$% up! :ROFL:
Quote from: Tanaka on April 11, 2024, 10:41:18 PMQuote from: al_infierno on April 11, 2024, 07:31:06 PMQuote from: Tanaka on April 11, 2024, 06:53:06 PMSo what ended up happening? Who is at war with who now?
Still moving slowly, but I just declared war on both Bandar and Mari to keep things exciting :evil:
Ohhh you just pulled a Tanaka nice! Spice that #$%^&%$% up! :ROFL:
Are you dead yet? Lol
Quote from: Tanaka on April 16, 2024, 08:12:58 PMQuote from: Tanaka on April 11, 2024, 10:41:18 PMQuote from: al_infierno on April 11, 2024, 07:31:06 PMQuote from: Tanaka on April 11, 2024, 06:53:06 PMSo what ended up happening? Who is at war with who now?
Still moving slowly, but I just declared war on both Bandar and Mari to keep things exciting :evil:
Ohhh you just pulled a Tanaka nice! Spice that #$%^&%$% up! :ROFL:
Are you dead yet? Lol
Game's going pretty slowly, but I think we're about to hit turn 1 of war. Mari and Bandar both went to war at the same time, so remains to be seen what each first move will be. Who will go for all that tasty Manly real estate? Time will tell!
I don't really have enough spare troops to siege your forts, so at best I could raid you. I'll kill your stuff if you force me to do it, but it's really not a priority for me at all. My game will be won or lost based on how fights with Mari go.
If you don't dome your forts, I will just disease and curse anything Mari sends onto your infrastructure to prevent her taking it. If you can prevent her cracking walls for a few turns after I do that, the low-MR mounts in particular will have horrible afflictions. Disease takes something like 10 turns to kill usually, but due to the hp decrease, a cursed unit will take lots of afflictions before then.
If you have a crone of Avalon with air, use wailing winds. It's an extremely obnoxious spell (worse than blood rain) and I will be surprised if Mari can storm a fort with that up unless she just unloads like 30 pillars of fire or puts up wrathful skies and one of those catches your mage (she has the air queens so this is extremely likely to be active). Might want to gear against that! She can also cast mass flight to fly over your walls, unless one of you puts up storm. If you can take 200-300 flying blessed knights of the chalice, then don't bother, but otherwise storm is a good idea. Almost guaranteed you see fire storm since her bless has FR in it. So yeah, just make sure you have lots of buffs, including both shock and fire resistance, a means to deal with flying to surround you, a way to see in the dark, and a way to manfight hundreds of sacreds. Easy, right?
Her win condition for the war is to overrun us with troops and equalize/surpass me in infrastructure. Mine is to kill her armies before she takes infra, after which my any-fort sacreds, while weaker, will be more numerous and boosted by the throne giving them awe.
Mari's armies are larger than mine + Man's combined right now, and she has multiple tech 8s researched. I'm a bit ahead of her in tech, but tech differential isn't too impactful when both sides have 8s.
Unfortunately Ash had to drop out, I've set Man to AI and taken over as Mari. I've got an absolute ton of toys to play with here and I can see why she was having a bit of analysis paralysis there at the end!
Anyway, I don't fancy my chances of winning against Bandar Log even if I take the time to micro the hell out of everything Mari has. BL is entrenched with several underwater thrones that I'd need to win which are inaccessible to me, and I reckon I'd have to play a hell of a game to get TMIT into a surrender state.
I'm not conceding by any means, but my goal now is to set off as much fireworks as possible, as quickly as possible!
Quote from: al_infierno on May 01, 2024, 12:29:37 AMUnfortunately Ash had to drop out, I've set Man to AI and taken over as Mari. I've got an absolute ton of toys to play with here and I can see why she was having a bit of analysis paralysis there at the end!
Anyway, I don't fancy my chances of winning against Bandar Log even if I take the time to micro the hell out of everything Mari has. BL is entrenched with several underwater thrones that I'd need to win which are inaccessible to me, and I reckon I'd have to play a hell of a game to get TMIT into a surrender state.
I'm not conceding by any means, but my goal now is to set off as much fireworks as possible, as quickly as possible!
Dang everytime there is about to be a big battle someone drops out. Was looking forward to the show...
Quote from: Tanaka on May 01, 2024, 12:45:28 PMQuote from: al_infierno on May 01, 2024, 12:29:37 AMUnfortunately Ash had to drop out, I've set Man to AI and taken over as Mari. I've got an absolute ton of toys to play with here and I can see why she was having a bit of analysis paralysis there at the end!
Anyway, I don't fancy my chances of winning against Bandar Log even if I take the time to micro the hell out of everything Mari has. BL is entrenched with several underwater thrones that I'd need to win which are inaccessible to me, and I reckon I'd have to play a hell of a game to get TMIT into a surrender state.
I'm not conceding by any means, but my goal now is to set off as much fireworks as possible, as quickly as possible!
Dang everytime there is about to be a big battle someone drops out. Was looking forward to the show...
I had a big fight with Arco, and likely still will with Mari as we try to position/raid etc (if he takes too long, leprosy + baleful star combo will bleed the large stacks down). Game has just been very slow past ~10 days since previous Mari player wouldn't put the turn in :p.
Took the win on magic phase attacks on thrones. Mari was very powerful! GG all!
One last big fight before the end:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FCzHUaWV.jpg&hash=42193d222e164971dc77ea98dbaee235a2521325) (https://imgur.com/CzHUaWV)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FrpgJwbm.jpg&hash=caf553e06dd3780fa1e701442c6990d2033e2535) (https://imgur.com/rpgJwbm)
Quote from: TheMeInTeam on May 04, 2024, 11:50:12 PMTook the win on magic phase attacks on thrones. Mari was very powerful! GG all!
One last big fight before the end:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FCzHUaWV.jpg&hash=42193d222e164971dc77ea98dbaee235a2521325) (https://imgur.com/CzHUaWV)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FrpgJwbm.jpg&hash=caf553e06dd3780fa1e701442c6990d2033e2535) (https://imgur.com/rpgJwbm)
Amazing you defeated an army of that size with just a few monkeys. What was the secret magic?
Wow. That Mari army had serious quality, too, not only quantity!
Did they attack into a ludicrous Kursk-style defense??
I mean seriously, if you still have that save game, I'd like to see you present the replay with explanations of what's going on in screenshots.
^ TMIT can probably provide more details, but the big foil for Mari was Foul Vapors. Both armies were stacked with fire resist, so the fire evos flying back and forth didn't have too huge an impact, but Bandar Log had solid poison resist and cast Foul Vapors along with Rigor Mortis and a ton of other stuff. Mari's armies had no poison resist, which did in a lot of their Knights of the Chalice after some turns of slapfighting.
Oh, and I forgot to cast Antimagic, so all of Mari's army had a slightly lower than desirable Magic Resist.
I did have an army myself, it was further down/off screen. Mostly some foot sacreds, with some leftover ichtyids and some undead. Heavily outnumbered, but could cover the front. I lost the mages I did due to mass flight, should have expected that and cast storm, but didn't.
As al notes, foul vapors was the primary killing tool, but I had a lot of other things going on too:
- FR of 5 in bless plus mass spell got me to 10, completely nullifying firestorm cast by other side.
- I put up all of the following buffs: antimagic, army stoneskin, army regeneration, relief, army mistform, army poison resistance.
- I also cast rigor mortis, and Mari forgot to cast antimagic, giving me a big advantage in fatigue (rigor is now hard-to-negate MR check).
Mari had mistform on everything too (cast by air queen), so the front lines were a slap fight. However, it was rare enough damage would get through mist form and > 20 prot on my end to overcome regeneration. Similarly, I could not very effectively kill Mari sacreds w/o magic weapons using front line.
Thus I took very little damage from the foul vapors procs, and regen helped cover what got through the poison. Mari had no poison resistance at all (bit of a misplay, it was possible using those mages of spring and matrix item, similar to how I used D1 revenant to cast the big death spells). Vast majority of the deaths were to poison as a result.
Also used poison (and howl wolves) in the teleport attack on the unforted throne underground: (https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FhDTGRGb.jpg&hash=4b139be63355f1432712bfd11883b5a0cd8c9f23) (https://imgur.com/hDTGRGb)
Since that throne turned out to have the points needed to win the game, Mari had to retake province in magic phase that turn from the 3 cap-only monkey mages, or else stopping the win was impossible (I cast a remote fort spell, built a lab, and ordered god to teleport there on ensuing turn).
Unfortunately, the game doesn't keep old saves I don't think, so I'd only have the turn of victory.