Clash of Arms games' "La Bataille" series

GJK · June 01, 2016, 12:07:23 PM

Any players of this series here? I'm looking to get into it as I hear it's the best game that there is at the scale that I want to play Napoleonics at (regimental). If so, do you use the "Regs" or the "Marie-Louise" version of the rules? Any thoughts on those or the system in general is appreciated-

bob48 · June 01, 2016, 12:19:41 PM

I played some a very long time ago, so can remember little about the game. I had a friend who was well into the system, but, not being much interested in that period myself I did not really absorb very much. One thing I do remember is that the counters were designed to represent the uniforms of the units, which, whilst impressive was confusing if you're not a Nappy fan :-)

GJK · June 01, 2016, 04:27:30 PM

Thanks Bob - yeah, Nappy stuff is new to me (was more an ACW buff) but my brother is all into it now and so I started to do some research on a boardgame that we might try playing together and everybody seemed to be pointing towards "La Bataille". It reminded me of The Gamers "Civil War Brigade Series" a bit so thought I'd look into it. I have the opportunity to pick up a reasonably priced copy of one of the entry games to the system so thought that I'd get some opinions from fellow gamers here. Seems that the "Regs" rules are pretty intense and will require a good bit of studying and that the "Marie-Louise" rules are akin to the Starter Kit rules for ASL. I'm going through the rules for Regs now just to see just how steep a learning curve they are.

bob48 · June 01, 2016, 05:04:46 PM

I do seem to remember being pretty baffled most of the time (yeah, I know - par for the course) and that the rules did not flow very well, but that may well have been me just not knowing the system.

panzerde · June 01, 2016, 05:48:51 PM

I've yet to play anything in this series, though I think Cyrano has. There are a number of entries about it over at Big Board Gaming, however. I intend to give it a try when next I'm in a Napoleonic mood.

I've steered more toward the OSG games. I'm more interested in the Grand Tactical and Operational scales. However, if you want something similar to the Civil War Brigade Series, why not try the Napoleonic Brigade Series, also by The Gamers? Basically the same system, adapted for Napoleonics?

besilarius · June 01, 2016, 06:53:09 PM

Have not kept up with the games, or changes to the system.
After the first five or six games, it seemed the best "game" was the first on Moscowa (Borodino). Still pretty straightforward rules and a fairly straightforward situation that either side could win.

GJK · June 01, 2016, 06:56:58 PM

Quote from: panzerde on June 01, 2016, 05:48:51 PM
I've yet to play anything in this series, though I think Cyrano has. There are a number of entries about it over at Big Board Gaming, however. I intend to give it a try when next I'm in a Napoleonic mood.

I've steered more toward the OSG games. I'm more interested in the Grand Tactical and Operational scales. However, if you want something similar to the Civil War Brigade Series, why not try the Napoleonic Brigade Series, also by The Gamers? Basically the same system, adapted for Napoleonics?

Thanks PD - yeah, we did play "Marengo" and it was enjoyable but it seemed like a "dumbed down" version of CWBS so we're looking for something with more depth. I could certainly live with NBS though however it has very few games and is very much a dead series. I understand that Elias is working on an update to the series and I've been following that and will surely give that one a try once the first game in that series is released.

I have "1809" and have been thinking of having a look into that series as I have also heard great things about Zucker's games (they seem to be "the" go-to game for that scale). If we can't grok La Bataille, that might be where we go (though again, I like a bit more tactical).

panzerde · June 01, 2016, 07:05:10 PM

"1809" is definitely operational. OSG has a much larger series that is more brigade scale, with a focus on individual battles rather than campaigns. Not terribly rules heavy, but detailed enough to be interesting.

Nefaro · June 01, 2016, 08:47:16 PM

Quote from: bob48 on June 01, 2016, 12:19:41 PM
I played some a very long time ago, so can remember little about the game. I had a friend who was well into the system, but, not being much interested in that period myself I did not really absorb very much. One thing I do remember is that the counters were designed to represent the uniforms of the units, which, whilst impressive was confusing if you're not a Nappy fan :-)

Did this series include Zorndorf from CoA?

I recall owning that long ago, but never got around to it.

The mention of the counters having the uniform artwork reminds me of it, though. I thought that was pretty cool at the time. But the map was quite the opposite, being a single yellowed parchment color with terrain in simple black ink. I suppose they were going for the simple hand drawn look, but it was a stark contrast which seemed rather odd at the time.

A glance at the rule book gave me the impression it would probably be a long scattered slog to get through, which is why I never ended up spending the time to learn it. About two decades ago, though, so it's all a bit fuzzy.

MengJiao · June 02, 2016, 07:57:56 AM

Quote from: Nefaro on June 01, 2016, 08:47:16 PM
Quote from: bob48 on June 01, 2016, 12:19:41 PM
I played some a very long time ago, so can remember little about the game. I had a friend who was well into the system, but, not being much interested in that period myself I did not really absorb very much. One thing I do remember is that the counters were designed to represent the uniforms of the units, which, whilst impressive was confusing if you're not a Nappy fan :-)

Did this series include Zorndorf from CoA?

I recall owning that long ago, but never got around to it.

The mention of the counters having the uniform artwork reminds me of it, though. I thought that was pretty cool at the time. But the map was quite the opposite, being a single yellowed parchment color with terrain in simple black ink. I suppose they were going for the simple hand drawn look, but it was a stark contrast which seemed rather odd at the time.

A glance at the rule book gave me the impression it would probably be a long scattered slog to get through, which is why I never ended up spending the time to learn it. About two decades ago, though, so it's all a bit fuzzy.

Zondorf is from what seems to me to be a more interesting game system, the Battles from the Age of Reason series. There's a primer for the series. It uses the Fontenoy map, but sometimes with counters from earlier games in the series.

I prefer Battles from the Age of Reason to the Nappy stuff (of which I had more than enough in the 1980s and 1990s).

Nefaro · June 02, 2016, 05:33:11 PM

That was it.

Kinda wish I still had Zorndorf, but it'd probably just continue collecting dust for a long time until eventually getting to it. I also prefer the earlier stuff to Napoleonics.

Counters looked pretty amazing. The rest looked a bit messy.

panzerde · June 02, 2016, 05:59:20 PM

Good Age of Reason games are thin on the ground. I'd certainly like to grab something of that era. I like my Napoleonics, but I certainly am as much interested in Marlborough or the Seven Years War. I have to say that Fontenoy from the Battles of the Age of Reason is looking tempting...

MengJiao · June 02, 2016, 06:15:34 PM

Quote from: panzerde on June 02, 2016, 05:59:20 PM
Good Age of Reason games are thin on the ground. I'd certainly like to grab something of that era. I like my Napoleonics, but I certainly am as much interested in Marlborough or the Seven Years War. I have to say that Fontenoy from the Battles of the Age of Reason is looking tempting...

Fontenoy is definitely a good game, but I would get the primer too. The intricacies of the simulation are even more daunting for the 1740s. It's no wonder those battles seem so
weird. It think (as with the age of sail) the standard terminology or standard view of cause and effect is based on how things were in the 1805-1815 period yet in say 1780 to 1800 things were quite different and in 1740-1780 almost unimaginably different.

panzerde · June 02, 2016, 08:37:20 PM

Quote from: MengJiao on June 02, 2016, 06:15:34 PM
Fontenoy is definitely a good game, but I would get the primer too. The intricacies of the simulation are even more daunting for the 1740s. It's no wonder those battles seem so
weird. It think (as with the age of sail) the standard terminology or standard view of cause and effect is based on how things were in the 1805-1815 period yet in say 1780 to 1800 things were quite different and in 1740-1780 almost unimaginably different.

Thanks for the recommendation. I'll go hunting a copy tonight I think.

Cyrano · June 10, 2016, 01:57:44 PM

People trying to sneak a peak at my final Waterloo piece..

"La Bataille" and I have a very, very strange relationship. I go into more detail in the piece, but it's the first system I can recall that I both really enjoyed and that simultaneously made me think the designer had gone one bridge too far.

The analysis of the ML rules above is a fair one vis-a-vis the comparison to the ASL Starter Set and I might go so far as to join with those who prefer to play the Starter rules and the ML rules to the full-on Regulations. Everyone will have his or her own unique threshold and mine with Napoleonics is very high indeed -- I played Empire...a lot -- but, perhaps it's the time available or some other factor, but these rules no longer draw me in as they once did.