(Rather than further derail
W8taminute's StarDrive thread, I figured it would probably be better to simply split off BOTF onto its own thread.)
Quote from: Nefaro on July 24, 2013, 11:06:05 PM
Quote from: bbmike on July 24, 2013, 06:55:26 PM
To date, only Birth of the Federation has had good alien races.
Wasn't there some freeware re-release of it? Or was that just a mod?
I tried playing that again, within the last few years, but the damnable memory leaks just buggged the piss out of me. I always got sick of having to restart all the time whenever the game started slowing down and responsive got sluggish. Didn't seem to take very long each time I started playing, either.. just a couple minutes. >:( Ragequit!
I think it was more pronounced with newer hardware and OSes than the older stuff, too. It worked better on Win98 long ago in the far far away. If some mod or rebuilt version of BotF has pretty much eliminated this issue, then it's on!
I actually had a couple little 4-player LAN games of BotF back in '99. They were a lot of fun. The long string of nasty obscenities one of my buddies flung at me, after I annihilated his whole Ferengi war fleet, still makes me smile. ;D One of those LAN games froze up near the end, however. The game was notoriously buggy in multiplayer, IIRC. I really want to play this again if it works better than last time I tried.
If you've not already done so,
Nefaro, you may want to try downloading & installing the "Multi-installer" version of BOTF (you can get it here (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownloaddetails&lid=143)).
In addition to allowing you to install multiple mods (without having to reinstall the base game every time), the Multi-installer version also incorporates several user-created patches (courtesy of the game's small but hard-working modding community) that reduce some of the game's technical glitches and improve stability, including for MP. It still doesn't fix the major problems unfortunately -- you'll still suffer occasional crashes and that damnable turn lag -- but it does seem to mitigate them somewhat. In any case, BOTF players (including the handful who still do MP) generally agree the game is a noticeably better experience with the Multi-installer version.
That being said, the modding community is working on a few different projects (one of which is already being beta-tested) that should significantly enhance -- and perhaps even revolutionize -- this flawed (but still fun!) 4x game. I won't say much about them for now, however, if only because I don't want to raise expectations (including my own) -- that, plus it's going to easily be at least a year (probably longer) before most of these projects begin to bear fruit, so unfortunately we're likely to be waiting a good long while yet.
Quote from: Nefaro on July 24, 2013, 11:18:22 PM
The new Birth of the Federation.. is this the place you get it? >
http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/
Yes. Sort of.
It's not "new" per se. However, as I mentioned in my previous post, it's been -- spruced up, I guess you could say? -- a bit in the last few years.
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 02:15:01 AM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 24, 2013, 11:18:22 PM
The new Birth of the Federation.. is this the place you get it? >
http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/
Yes. Sort of.
It's not "new" per se. However, as I mentioned in my previous post, it's been -- spruced up, I guess you could say? -- a bit in the last few years.
Ahh! Thanks for the info.
I'll have to register at that site and get the latest one, then.
I also strongly recommend picking up one or more of the mods as well, particularly if you're wanting to get back into LAN/MP action at all, as most of the mods balance out the game better than the vanilla version.
While you probably know my personal favorite is the Balance of Power (BOP) mod, there's at least a few others worth mentioning: Easily the most popular one is the Ultimate Dominion Mod III (UDM3), probably because of the improved ship graphics and larger fleets (which together allow for some truly stunning -- if occasionally laggy -- battles).
The other prominent mods are:
All the Ages mod (AAM)
Uncivil Wars mod (UCW)
Ultimate Mod IV (UM4)
Error Correction mod (This one is essentially a large "patch" that fixes/addresses various gameplay issues.)
Galaxies mod (This last one is still in beta, but it's quite playable and pretty fun; it's just not balanced for MP yet.)
Happily, all the mods I just listed have a version compatible with the Multi-installer.
Do you need the original game? Where can I get it?
Posting here for future quick reference.
I will say that Birth of the Federation, together with Star Wars Rebellion, sparked my interest in space 4X games. These two gems are my personal benchmarks for the genre.
Quote from: LongBlade on July 25, 2013, 07:49:07 AM
Do you need the original game? Where can I get it?
I'd like to know, too. I cannot find it on GOG.
Quote from: solops on July 25, 2013, 09:57:56 AM
Quote from: LongBlade on July 25, 2013, 07:49:07 AM
Do you need the original game? Where can I get it?
I'd like to know, too. I cannot find it on GOG.
I think the link above is for the full installer that has some user fixes and mod swapper or something in it too.
Quote from: solops on July 25, 2013, 09:57:56 AM
Quote from: LongBlade on July 25, 2013, 07:49:07 AM
Do you need the original game? Where can I get it?
I'd like to know, too. I cannot find it on GOG.
Link (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownloaddetails&lid=143)
A quick word of warning: Some folks have had issues running BOTF on Windows 7 (although I myself and a couple of my friends have had no problem running the game on our machines), and it appears Windows 8 has a difficult time running it at all. There are solutions & workarounds, however (including that project that's currently being beta-tested).
Quote from: W8taminute on July 25, 2013, 08:59:16 AM
Posting here for future quick reference.
I will say that Birth of the Federation, together with Star Wars Rebellion, sparked my interest in space 4X games. These two gems are my personal benchmarks for the genre.
Birth of the Federation was the game that got me into space strategy titles as well. (My love affair with the genre was cemented a year later with
Imperium Galactica II: Alliances.) As a huge fan of both Star Trek and grand strategy games, BOTF became an instant classic for me -- to say nothing of a years-long addiction!
Quote from: Nefaro on July 25, 2013, 10:33:44 AM
Quote from: solops on July 25, 2013, 09:57:56 AM
Quote from: LongBlade on July 25, 2013, 07:49:07 AM
Do you need the original game? Where can I get it?
I'd like to know, too. I cannot find it on GOG.
I think the link above is for the full installer that has some user fixes and mod swapper or something in it too.
Correct. It installs not just the base game with additional user-created patches (one of them in particular makes the game run better on modern PC's), but also allows you to install multiple mods parallel to each other. It's a pretty neat program.
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 11:24:02 AM
A quick word of warning: Some folks have had issues running BOTF on Windows 7 (although I myself and one of my friends have had no problem running the game on our machine), and it appears Windows 8 has a difficult time running it at all. There are solutions & workarounds, however (including that project that's currently being beta-tested).
I certainly can't run BOTF on my Win7. The menu flickers and flashes dark, doesn't show some gfx, etc.
Is that Direct 3D installation option the one you were referring to as being in beta??
Thanks, Martok. I downloaded and installed it. It appears to work fine on my Win 8 machine. It's just that now I don't know what I'm doing.
Quote from: LongBlade on July 29, 2013, 02:14:37 PM
Thanks, Martok. I downloaded and installed it. It appears to work fine on my Win 8 machine. It's just that now I don't know what I'm doing.
This might help :)
http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.4712 (http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.4712)
Darkspire
Quote from: Nefaro on July 29, 2013, 01:44:28 PM
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 11:24:02 AM
A quick word of warning: Some folks have had issues running BOTF on Windows 7 (although I myself and one of my friends have had no problem running the game on our machine), and it appears Windows 8 has a difficult time running it at all. There are solutions & workarounds, however (including that project that's currently being beta-tested).
I certainly can't run BOTF on my Win7. The menu flickers and flashes dark, doesn't show some gfx, etc.
Is that Direct 3D installation option the one you were referring to as being in beta??
Make sure you run it in Comparability Mode (I think Windows 98) and run as Administrator. Also, in your
botf.ini make sure you set 3D=DIRECT3D
Quote from: Nefaro on July 29, 2013, 01:44:28 PM
Is that Direct 3D installation option the one you were referring to as being in beta??
No, although apparently it's helped some folks get BOTF to run.
What I was referring to is Flocke's MPR++ project (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2720&sid=5800df4a669c06717cb3b7403f321461). It's already allowed a number of people to run the game in both Win7 and Win8 (when they couldn't get the game to run before), so you may want to check it out. If you post in the thread that you're interested in trying it out, Flock (the project's creator) or Thunderchero (site admin) will probably send you a download link for it.
Quote from: LongBlade on July 29, 2013, 02:14:37 PM
Thanks, Martok. I downloaded and installed it. It appears to work fine on my Win 8 machine. It's just that now I don't know what I'm doing.
Heh, welcome to my world. ;)
If you wish to read/skim the manual at all, just click the link provided by
Darkspire. (By the way,
muchas gracias!) Some of it's helpful -- more so the earlier parts -- some of it not. (One of the areas where the game tends to dinged is mediocre documentation.)
In general, though, you use the right mouse button a lot in BOTF: Doing so brings up the "marker window", which contains the buttons to access (among other things) your research, diplomacy, and intel screens. You obviously still spend a lot of time on the main galactic map as well, but the right mouse button is what the player mainly uses to switch back & forth between the various different screens.
A few suggestions regarding setup options for your first couple games (in no particular order):
1.) Set Random Events to off.
2.) Set the difficulty no higher than Normal. (Otherwise the AI is absurdly aggressive.)
3.) Choose either the Spiral or Elliptical galaxy map.
4.) Choose the Large map size (if you're playing vanilla BOTF), as this will give you a little space to dink around in before you run into the other four major powers.
Anything else you wanna know, I'm more than happy to
ramble spout off help. ;)
Quote from: bbmike on July 29, 2013, 03:10:14 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 29, 2013, 01:44:28 PM
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 11:24:02 AM
A quick word of warning: Some folks have had issues running BOTF on Windows 7 (although I myself and one of my friends have had no problem running the game on our machine), and it appears Windows 8 has a difficult time running it at all. There are solutions & workarounds, however (including that project that's currently being beta-tested).
I certainly can't run BOTF on my Win7. The menu flickers and flashes dark, doesn't show some gfx, etc.
Is that Direct 3D installation option the one you were referring to as being in beta??
Make sure you run it in Comparability Mode (I think Windows 98) and run as Administrator. Also, in your botf.ini make sure you set 3D=DIRECT3D
A couple very good tips there. Thanks
bbmike!
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 11:24:02 AM
Birth of the Federation was the game that got me into space strategy titles as well. (My love affair with the genre was cemented a year later with Imperium Galactica II: Alliances.) As a huge fan of both Star Trek and grand strategy games, BOTF became an instant classic for me -- to say nothing of a years-long addiction!
I never played Imperium Galactica II. At that time I refused anything that had RTS in the description. I guess I kinda still do. ::)
Quote from: bbmike on July 29, 2013, 03:14:03 PM
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 11:24:02 AM
Birth of the Federation was the game that got me into space strategy titles as well. (My love affair with the genre was cemented a year later with Imperium Galactica II: Alliances.) As a huge fan of both Star Trek and grand strategy games, BOTF became an instant classic for me -- to say nothing of a years-long addiction!
I never played Imperium Galactica II. At that time I refused anything that had RTS in the description. I guess I kinda still do. ::)
Well I certainly don't blame you. :) Even for me, RTS games are the exception to the rule, with IG2 and
Distant Worlds being the two big ones for me.
Thanks for the help, all :)
I never read the manuals, prefer to find things out myself by trial and error, well more error than trial :)
Here is the link for the tutorial.
http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.8872 (http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.8872)
Darkspire
Quote from: bbmike on July 29, 2013, 03:10:14 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 29, 2013, 01:44:28 PM
Quote from: Martok on July 25, 2013, 11:24:02 AM
A quick word of warning: Some folks have had issues running BOTF on Windows 7 (although I myself and one of my friends have had no problem running the game on our machine), and it appears Windows 8 has a difficult time running it at all. There are solutions & workarounds, however (including that project that's currently being beta-tested).
I certainly can't run BOTF on my Win7. The menu flickers and flashes dark, doesn't show some gfx, etc.
Is that Direct 3D installation option the one you were referring to as being in beta??
Make sure you run it in Comparability Mode (I think Windows 98) and run as Administrator. Also, in your botf.ini make sure you set 3D=DIRECT3D
Already did the first two. Changing the ini setting didn't do anything either. Perhaps I'll uninstall and use the other install option.
edit: Nope, no luck using the Hades (Direct3D) install option. Perhaps it'll work better on my desktop with the AMD card.
Quote from: Darkspire on July 29, 2013, 05:53:02 PM
I never read the manuals, prefer to find things out myself by trial and error, well more error than trial :)
Here is the link for the tutorial.
http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.8872 (http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.8872)
Darkspire
Meh, I don't put much stock in the game's tutorials. Being both non-interactive *and* not having the instructions included (you have to read them separately in Adobe), this severely limits their usefulness IMHO. Honestly, I found it was best to simply learn by doing.
Quote from: Nefaro on July 29, 2013, 07:44:27 PM
Already did the first two. Changing the ini setting didn't do anything either. Perhaps I'll uninstall and use the other install option.
edit: Nope, no luck using the Hades (Direct3D) install option. Perhaps it'll work better on my desktop with the AMD card.
That sucks
Nefaro. :(
Seriously, though, if you wind up still having issues, you may want to see about giving MPR++ a try. Not that it's been a magic cure for everyone, but it might not hurt to check it out if you continue to have problems getting the game to run.
Quote from: Martok on July 30, 2013, 01:12:39 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 29, 2013, 07:44:27 PM
Already did the first two. Changing the ini setting didn't do anything either. Perhaps I'll uninstall and use the other install option.
edit: Nope, no luck using the Hades (Direct3D) install option. Perhaps it'll work better on my desktop with the AMD card.
That sucks Nefaro. :(
Seriously, though, if you wind up still having issues, you may want to see about giving MPR++ a try. Not that it's been a magic cure for everyone, but it might not hurt to check it out if you continue to have problems getting the game to run.
I may try that out sometime. I certainly enjoyed BOTF years ago and hope to have it running reasonably well, again, at some point. I probably enjoyed it more than MOO2.
I still have the disc and manual. ;D
Quote from: Nefaro on July 30, 2013, 04:53:53 PM
I probably enjoyed it more than MOO2.
So did I. In fact, I think that in some ways, BOTF ruined me for MOO2. I've never been enthralled with the latter game (as so many 4x enthusiasts are), probably at least in part because I've always loved the former so much.
Quote from: Nefaro on July 30, 2013, 04:53:53 PM
I still have the disc and manual. ;D
As do I. 8)
Quote from: Martok on July 30, 2013, 05:33:57 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 30, 2013, 04:53:53 PM
I probably enjoyed it more than MOO2.
So did I. In fact, I think that in some ways, BOTF ruined me for MOO2. I've never been enthralled with the latter game (as so many 4x enthusiasts are), probably at least in part because I've always loved the former so much.
The same happened to me...i discovered MOO2 only afterwards...
I have to admit, I'm always pleasantly surprised by the number of BOTF enthusiasts in this place. As a percentage of the membership, I'd guess we comprise a fairly respectable fraction.
Quote from: Anguille on July 30, 2013, 05:39:41 PM
Quote from: Martok on July 30, 2013, 05:33:57 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 30, 2013, 04:53:53 PM
I probably enjoyed it more than MOO2.
So did I. In fact, I think that in some ways, BOTF ruined me for MOO2. I've never been enthralled with the latter game (as so many 4x enthusiasts are), probably at least in part because I've always loved the former so much.
The same happened to me...i discovered MOO2 only afterwards...
I should've specified that I too didn't discover MOO2 til long after BOTF was released. By the time I did, the former just didn't hold much appeal for me.
Wow! So I may be the only one who played MOO2 and BOTF in their historically released order, here? :o
Another grand strat space game from that time period I loved was Star Wars: Rebellion. It had a different title in Europe IIRC. While the interface was odd to learn at first (and the reason it got a poor review showing IMO), the gameplay was wonderfully unusual and took a good deal of future insight for your strategies to work (since once you committed to a jump, you had to wait quite awhile for the fleet to arrive & there was no stopping it). I still have the manual, disc, and poster with all the mil unit specs. I fired that one up a few years ago and it still worked okay, although it required a NoCD hack else the disc check would flip Vista/XP out and not work.
I wanted to love Rebellion, and I did like it in concept. That damn UI was so painful, though, that I just couldn't get past it.
Quote from: Martok on July 30, 2013, 11:35:54 PM
I wanted to love Rebellion, and I did like it in concept. That damn UI was so painful, though, that I just couldn't get past it.
It's a good game...i just hated to see my x-wings flying backwards :o
Quote from: Martok on July 30, 2013, 11:35:54 PM
I wanted to love Rebellion, and I did like it in concept. That damn UI was so painful, though, that I just couldn't get past it.
I almost gave up on it, way back in the day, but I experienced a big "Eureka!!" moment on how the interface worked. Mainly regarding how you move the two fleet/unit windows back and forth (like a sliding panel that can move from one side to the other only) and the mouse button orders functionality. Once I figured out how to bring up the unit windows and move them back & forth to get to other stuff behind them, it became easier.
After installing under Win7 on a modern PC I get the errors mentioned above: The menu flickers and flashes dark, doesn't show some gfx, etc.
This is the only way I could get the game to run without crashes due to video problems:
1. Install BoTF (probably from .iso is your best bet)
2. If you run it the way it is, it will freeze and crash, due to Windows 7 not being able to automatically dumb itself down to those levels
3. Enter compatibility mode... to enter compatibility mode on Windows 7:
3a. Right Click on the icon I am sure you have placed on the desktop, and click "Properties"
3b. Click the "compatibility" tab
3c. check the "run in compatibility mode" check box
3d. set the compatibility for "Windows 98/Windows ME"
3e. in the settings area, turn the following things on:
- Run in 256 colours
- Run in 640 x 480
- Disable Visual Themes
- Disable display scaling on high DPI settings
4. Click "Apply"
5. Run trek.exe (that is the icon you have just edited)
QuoteRun in 640 x 480
ugh, and that's not causing eye cancer? :o
Martok (and anyone else who has experience with BotF), for new players do you recommend playing vanilla BoTF before trying one of the mods?
Quote from: mirth on July 31, 2013, 07:31:40 PM
Martok (and anyone else who has experience with BotF), for new players do you recommend playing vanilla BoTF before trying one of the mods?
I think that's the usual M.O. for any game.
Quote from: Grimnirsson on July 31, 2013, 11:32:59 AM
QuoteRun in 640 x 480
ugh, and that's not causing eye cancer? :o
It gives
me cancer just thinking about it. And 256 colors? Ouch!
I wonder if I should try lowering the desktop colors to 16-bit?
Quote from: Nefaro on July 31, 2013, 07:43:49 PM
Quote from: mirth on July 31, 2013, 07:31:40 PM
Martok (and anyone else who has experience with BotF), for new players do you recommend playing vanilla BoTF before trying one of the mods?
I think that's the usual M.O. for any game.
Sure, but with something that old I'm wondering if there are issues with the base game that would make it preferable to jump right into a mod.
Quote from: solops on July 31, 2013, 09:24:37 AM
After installing under Win7 on a modern PC I get the errors mentioned above: The menu flickers and flashes dark, doesn't show some gfx, etc.
This is the only way I could get the game to run without crashes due to video problems:
1. Install BoTF (probably from .iso is your best bet)
2. If you run it the way it is, it will freeze and crash, due to Windows 7 not being able to automatically dumb itself down to those levels
3. Enter compatibility mode... to enter compatibility mode on Windows 7:
3a. Right Click on the icon I am sure you have placed on the desktop, and click "Properties"
3b. Click the "compatibility" tab
3c. check the "run in compatibility mode" check box
3d. set the compatibility for "Windows 98/Windows ME"
3e. in the settings area, turn the following things on:
- Run in 256 colours
- Run in 640 x 480
- Disable Visual Themes
- Disable display scaling on high DPI settings
4. Click "Apply"
5. Run trek.exe (that is the icon you have just edited)
Is this for the Multi-installer? Or is this for installing directly from the disk?
Quote from: Nefaro on July 31, 2013, 07:45:09 PM
Quote from: Grimnirsson on July 31, 2013, 11:32:59 AM
QuoteRun in 640 x 480
ugh, and that's not causing eye cancer? :o
It gives me cancer just thinking about it. And 256 colors? Ouch!
I wonder if I should try lowering the desktop colors to 16-bit?
Yeah, that makes me cringe just picturing it. BOTF already suffers from having its resolution locked at 800 x 600; I can scarcely imagine running it at an even lower resolution.
I've no idea if that would work,
Nefaro (I'm hopelessly clueless when it comes to technical issues like this), but you can certainly give it a try and see if it does the trick.
Quote from: mirth on July 31, 2013, 07:54:41 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on July 31, 2013, 07:43:49 PM
Quote from: mirth on July 31, 2013, 07:31:40 PM
Martok (and anyone else who has experience with BotF), for new players do you recommend playing vanilla BoTF before trying one of the mods?
I think that's the usual M.O. for any game.
Sure, but with something that old I'm wondering if there are issues with the base game that would make it preferable to jump right into a mod.
As long as you're playing BOTF off the Multi-installer,
mirth -- and not off the disk -- it doesn't really matter. It's the Multi-installer that includes the most recent patches/updates (which automatically get applied to the mods as well), so the vanilla game will run just as well as any of the mods.
The mods generally address issues of balance, content, visuals, and (to some extent) mechanics & gameplay. Some of them do also fix various minor bugs (such as being unable to make diplomatic contact with minor races already membered to another empire), but generally speaking, they don't fundamentally affect actual performance.
FYI it runs just fine on my Win 8 system.
Quick question on the mods. Does the Balance of Power mod also include all of the fixes from the Error Correction mod? If not, which would you recommend?
Quote from: Martok on July 31, 2013, 08:39:38 PM
As long as you're playing BOTF off the Multi-installer, mirth -- and not off the disk -- it doesn't really matter. It's the Multi-installer that includes the most recent patches/updates (which automatically get applied to the mods as well), so the vanilla game will run just as well as any of the mods.
The mods generally address issues of balance, content, visuals, and (to some extent) mechanics & gameplay. Some of them do also fix various minor bugs (such as being unable to make diplomatic contact with minor races already membered to another empire), but generally speaking, they don't fundamentally affect actual performance.
Thanks, Martok. I installed the Multi-Installer version last night and I added the Balance of Power mod. I'm going to give it a go with that.
Quote from: tgb on August 01, 2013, 07:52:36 AM
FYI it runs just fine on my Win 8 system.
Glad to hear it,
tgb! I won't pretend I have a clue as to why the game runs fine on Win7/8 for some folks and not for others, but regardless I'm very pleased it's working well for you.
Quote from: tgb on August 01, 2013, 07:52:36 AM
Quick question on the mods. Does the Balance of Power mod also include all of the fixes from the Error Correction mod?
It includes a lot of the various fixes, but not all of them, no. Quite a few of the fixes were discovered after BOP stopped getting updated, which was a couple years ago. (We're afraid the mod's creator, Gowron, may have passed away -- he'd been ill for some time -- but no one's been able to confirm this.)
Quote from: tgb on August 01, 2013, 07:52:36 AM
If not, which would you recommend?
Well UDM3, AAM, and the Galaxies mod probably include the most number of fixes (other than the EC mod), as they're the ones that have been most recently updated. However, none of them include all the fixes discovered thus far -- not even the Error Correction mod, although it's only missing a few of them.
Happily, however, there is another option: One of the modders has created a tool called BOTF Patcher (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2515&sid=752c072766a0e381e474bca9a8362930), which allows you to apply just about any & all existing fixes to whatever mod you're playing. If there's a patch incompatible with a certain mod (which incidentally, probably means the mod already incorporates said patch), it'll appear as red, so you don't have to worry about it messing up your game.
It's a very handy and fairly easy-to-use tool -- at least, I'm assuming it's easy to use, since *I* was able to figure out how to use it (and I'm honestly as dumb as can be when it comes to this sort of thing :P ) -- and I can't recommend it enough. I used the Patcher for the BOP mod, and it worked like a charm.
Quote from: mirth on August 01, 2013, 05:34:45 PM
Quote from: Martok on July 31, 2013, 08:39:38 PM
As long as you're playing BOTF off the Multi-installer, mirth -- and not off the disk -- it doesn't really matter. It's the Multi-installer that includes the most recent patches/updates (which automatically get applied to the mods as well), so the vanilla game will run just as well as any of the mods.
The mods generally address issues of balance, content, visuals, and (to some extent) mechanics & gameplay. Some of them do also fix various minor bugs (such as being unable to make diplomatic contact with minor races already membered to another empire), but generally speaking, they don't fundamentally affect actual performance.
Thanks, Martok. I installed the Multi-Installer version last night and I added the Balance of Power mod. I'm going to give it a go with that.
Aweseome, man. I hope you enjoy it!
Is there any way to mod out the Borg only and still play with the other random events?
Also, I am playing with the multi-mod version. This is fast becoming one of my favorite games and it is much, much better than MOO2. All these years and all that developers have given us in new offerings is slicker graphics and better UI....disappointing.
Quote from: solops on August 02, 2013, 07:14:27 AM
Is there any way to mod out the Borg only and still play with the other random events?
There is, although I'm not sure if I remember exactly how to do it. I know it's actually a pretty simple fix, though.
I think you go into the stbof.ini file and edit BORG=ON to BORG=OFF (make sure the file still shows RANDOM EVENTS=ON). It's something like that, anyway; I may be forgetting a step or two.
Quote from: solops on August 02, 2013, 07:14:27 AM
Also, I am playing with the multi-mod version. This is fast becoming one of my favorite games and it is much, much better than MOO2. All these years and all that developers have given us in new offerings is slicker graphics and better UI....disappointing.
Cool! Glad you're enjoying it
solops. :D
Incidentally, I've (finally!) started my AAR for BOTF. Link (http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=7030.msg170826#msg170826)
I'm not really writing it as a "how to" guide or anything (especially not the first chapter) -- I usually write more story-based AARs -- but newbies to the game might get a little better feel as to how Birth of the Federation plays.
Fun. I need to sit down and read that.
I hope you enjoy it!
The next chapter will deal with more of the "meat-and-potatoes" of gameplay: I'll be including a fair number of screenies that show what I put in build queues early on, which tech field(s) I research first, where I establish my first colony, etc.
I hate to ask a stupid question, but this IS the Internet, and Martok, I think your BotF AAR thread has been hijacked enough. :)
I've gone to the website Mirth specified back in the AAR (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/), and the site has a tutorial for installing the "Multi main installer." However, clicking that link ("BOTF_1.0.2_English_German_e.exe") takes me to a page that says "You are trying to access a restricted area."
It seems like this should be a pretty simple procedure, but there's so many files and things listed there I wouldn't know where to begin, especially when the page doesn't work. At least, not for me.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 03, 2013, 04:57:56 PM
I hate to ask a stupid question, but this IS the Internet, and Martok, I think your BotF AAR thread has been hijacked enough. :)
I've gone to the website Mirth specified back in the AAR (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/), and the site has a tutorial for installing the "Multi main installer." However, clicking that link ("BOTF_1.0.2_English_German_e.exe") takes me to a page that says "You are trying to access a restricted area."
It seems like this should be a pretty simple procedure, but there's so many files and things listed there I wouldn't know where to begin, especially when the page doesn't work. At least, not for me.
You have to register at the site, to download it.
Although it may be hosted somewhere else that doesn't require a login.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 03, 2013, 04:57:56 PM
It seems like this should be a pretty simple procedure, but there's so many files and things listed there I wouldn't know where to begin, especially when the page doesn't work. At least, not for me.
Well...you
are a cat.
Quote from: Nefaro on September 03, 2013, 06:18:49 PM
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 03, 2013, 04:57:56 PM
I hate to ask a stupid question, but this IS the Internet, and Martok, I think your BotF AAR thread has been hijacked enough. :)
I've gone to the website Mirth specified back in the AAR (http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/botf/), and the site has a tutorial for installing the "Multi main installer." However, clicking that link ("BOTF_1.0.2_English_German_e.exe") takes me to a page that says "You are trying to access a restricted area."
It seems like this should be a pretty simple procedure, but there's so many files and things listed there I wouldn't know where to begin, especially when the page doesn't work. At least, not for me.
You have to register at the site, to download it.
Although it may be hosted somewhere else that doesn't require a login.
Nefaro is correct: You have to have an account at AFC before you can download stuff there. It's free, and there's no "you have to have
x number of posts first" requirement, but you do need to create an account first.
STILL playing BotF...what a great game. It is a shame developers don't seem to create this kind of goodness very often.
Nag self: I really need to try and get the next chapter in my AAR written out and posted in the next two days. Argh...
Quote from: solops on September 05, 2013, 06:58:24 AM
STILL playing BotF...what a great game.
Awesome! Glad you're continue to have fun with it
solops.
Who are you playing as, btw? I like the Federation, but the Romulans have long been my personal favorite.
Quote from: solops on September 05, 2013, 06:58:24 AM
It is a shame developers don't seem to create this kind of goodness very often.
I agree. Although I frequently caution myself to not view BOTF through rose-tinted lenses anymore than I can help (gods knows the game does have plenty of flaws!), it amazes me how few other 4x games give me the same level of enjoyment -- for me personally, only
Armada 2526 and
Distant Worlds can truly compete with it (and even they don't quite have the same level of addictiveness IMHO).
I think what the game does especially well is atmosphere & immersion: When I fire it up, it really feels like I'm playing as the Federation, Klingons, Romulans, etc. For as imperfect -- and old -- as this game is, I've always felt that anyone who likes both Star Trek and strategy games owes it to themselves to at least give BOTF a try.
Thanks for the feedback on the registration, guys (duhhh).
I'm having trouble with them, though. I registered earlier today but it wouldn't accept my login credentials, so I got frustrated and tried 'Lost Password,' and it told me no e-mail was on file. But when I went to re-register and entered my e-mail, it said that e-mail was already registered.
Maybe it's human-approved? Ah well. I'm dying to play BotF in a non-vanilla format without having the damn Cardassians, Romulans, and Klingons always four sectors from Sol, even on large maps. Or having tons of stars near Sol, but them having one gas giant and one tiny Tundra rock that can support a pop of 25. Sigh.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 05, 2013, 05:26:41 PM
I'm having trouble with them, though. I registered earlier today but it wouldn't accept my login credentials, so I got frustrated and tried 'Lost Password,' and it told me no e-mail was on file. But when I went to re-register and entered my e-mail, it said that e-mail was already registered.
Maybe it's human-approved?
I don't *think* your account needs to be manually approved by the admins, but then it's been so long since I registered myself that I really don't remember anymore.
Let me PM the AFC staff and see if I can find out what's going on. Just so I'm not assuming, is your handle the same over there as here? (If not, feel free to PM me your AFC handle if you like.)
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 05, 2013, 05:26:41 PM
I'm dying to play BotF in a non-vanilla format without having the damn Cardassians, Romulans, and Klingons always four sectors from Sol, even on large maps. Or having tons of stars near Sol, but them having one gas giant and one tiny Tundra rock that can support a pop of 25. Sigh.
Believe me, I sympathize!
Fortunately, most of the mods address the overabundance of gas giants (and the shortage of good/big planets) in some shape or form. In addition, at least four of the mods -- All the Ages, Balance of Power, Galaxies, and Ultimate Dominion 3 -- either automatically come with significantly larger maps, and/or include a Large Map version that you can choose to install as well.
Thanks, Martok, that would be great. My handle is indeed the same. Glad I did it that way.
I have a lot to learn when it comes to the mods, but I think at this point any mod would be better than the vanilla version.
"All the Ages" sounds interesting - I assumed there had to be some kind of mod out there that started at the true beginnings, such as giving the Federation the NX-01 first, then later the Constitution-class, then the Enterprise-class, and so on. Is my assumption too far off? Sorry if the answers are right there in the modding site, but it's hard to figure out where to start or what to work with.
I actually found a d/l link for it which didn't require registration, a couple months ago. Can't find it now. :-\
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 06, 2013, 01:49:10 PM
Thanks, Martok, that would be great. My handle is indeed the same. Glad I did it that way.
Hey, I'm just happy to help if I can. 8)
By the by, I heard back from one of the admins. Here's what he had to say:
Quotehi Martok,
no user by that name is registered, after he registered did he confirm registration from e-mail that was sent? it may have went to his junk mail. if he does not confirm from the link in that e-mail he can not sign in.
thunderchero
So if you've not already done so, you may want to check your junk folder to see if you've received a registration confirmation. If that doesn't take care of the issue, let me know!
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 06, 2013, 01:49:10 PM
I have a lot to learn when it comes to the mods, but I think at this point any mod would be better than the vanilla version.
Oh, unquestionably. I know of very few people who play BOTF without some sort of mod these days. I (obviously) enjoyed the vanilla game immensely, but at a certain point I realized I wanted more.
I personally went with the BOP mod because it balanced things out much much better while still retaining the "flavor" of the original game. As you said, however, pretty much any mod improves on the vanilla experience.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 06, 2013, 01:49:10 PM
"All the Ages" sounds interesting - I assumed there had to be some kind of mod out there that started at the true beginnings, such as giving the Federation the NX-01 first, then later the Constitution-class, then the Enterprise-class, and so on. Is my assumption too far off? Sorry if the answers are right there in the modding site, but it's hard to figure out where to start or what to work with.
Yep, you've pretty much described it to a "T". :)
The mod is divided into five "eras" (which correspond to the five civilization levels each faction can start at): Enterprise, TOS, movies, TNG, and DS9/Voyager.
As your research progresses, you'll reach a new era (I believe every other tech level), which will unlock new ships corresponding to that era. I've not played the ATA mod much myself, but it's been generally well-received and recommended.
*sigh*
I found the e-mail in my Gmail Spam folder. I never look in there, but then again I don't usually use that e-mail to register for anything like this.
Thanks for your help, I appreciate it. I was able to deduce that I flubbed my handle with a typo, and it was more than 24 hours since I tried, so I was able to redo it and voila, access.
Cool! Glad you were able to get it worked out. Now go and try out some mods. 8)
I had a few issues trying to get it to run, but finally figured it out. All the Ages is pretty fun. I won't have time to get into it today but I hopefully will later tonight or tomorrow.
Thanks again! 8)
You're welcome, good sir. :D
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 07, 2013, 01:18:04 PM
I won't have time to get into it today
Sigh. I know the feeling...
OK, so I couldn't stay away from it.
This is a little weird...
I played a bit of one game, where I ran into minor race after minor race. I saved it, then came back later, but the save game was gone.
That wasn't the weird part. Later, I started another game, saved it, and the save game was there. The weird part is this:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1175.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fr624%2FMichaelE6%2FGalaxy.jpg&hash=53201f489a97144271a2df68d4f60c31ee7cf8aa)
That's a nice big map, BTW. Anyway, the only minor race I've run into is the Gorn (which is AWESOME). I've long since absorbed them into the Federation. But I've not run into any other minor race. And I set it to 'Many' in the options screen.
You ever run into that, Martok? (Or anyone else?)
The only complaint I have so far with this huge map is that there's two zoom levels - teeny and gigantic. It's impossible to discern details in the large map, and the smaller one, I'm constantly having to double click around to move the map view. I wish there were more finite controls with zooming.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 07, 2013, 05:13:31 PM
Anyway, the only minor race I've run into is the Gorn (which is AWESOME). I've long since absorbed them into the Federation. But I've not run into any other minor race. And I set it to 'Many' in the options screen.
You ever run into that, Martok? (Or anyone else?)
I have indeed. Unfortunately, it's a bug inherent to the super-large maps -- one which, despite the modders' best efforts, they've been unable to rectify.
For technical reasons I don't pretend to understand, the minor races sometimes get mostly bunched up on just one side of the map (which is probably why you ran into so many on that first game with the lost save file). It doesn't always happen, but you can expect to run into it from time to time.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on September 07, 2013, 05:16:54 PM
The only complaint I have so far with this huge map is that there's two zoom levels - teeny and gigantic. It's impossible to discern details in the large map, and the smaller one, I'm constantly having to double click around to move the map view. I wish there were more finite controls with zooming.
Yeah, it's a common complaint with the extra-large maps. Unfortunately, this is a limitation of the game's engine, one the modders can't touch. Having a genuine zoom function function is easily one of the players' top requests.
This link doesn't need a login to download
http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/get-files?cw_action=fileview&file_id=1958
Quote from: spelk on January 15, 2017, 04:55:34 PM
This link doesn't need a login to download
http://www.armadafleetcommand.com/get-files?cw_action=fileview&file_id=1958
Indeed it doesn't. :)
Major props to thunderchero for creating this all-in-one installer. Makes things much easier, especially with regards to adding mods. I was gonna post the link; was (pleasantly) surprised someone had beaten me to it. 8)
Does it include the MPR++ mod by Flocke?
Bloody hell. :o
Quote from: tgb on August 01, 2013, 07:52:36 AM
FYI it runs just fine on my Win 8 system.
Quick question on the mods. Does the Balance of Power mod also include all of the fixes from the Error Correction mod? If not, which would you recommend?
Wow you guys have gotten me back into this great game. Thanks for all the tips! BTW looks like the Ultimate Mod has what you are looking for:
"Corrections, Bugfixes and Patches
This mod would not have happened were it not for the very kind assistance of Thunderchero first and foremost with helping me come to terms with many of the new fixes now available, and numerous other topics which I struggled to get to grips with as I slowly got back into modding again. Additional big thanks must also go to DCER, Gowron, Flocke, spocks-cuddly-tribble, Quasardonkey, Joker, Peter1981, and others I'm certain (i'm sorry if I've forgotten to list them all) for their hard work, research, and tremendous insight into improving this game!
UM5 has been generally augmented, and patched with some 70+ patches and fixes with QD's Botf Patcher tool; plus the Error Correction Mod patches, and comes with the Energy screen project enhancement. Also included are a few of my own custom-written patches (based on others research/solutions), including: territorial claim expanded for both inhabited systems and starbases; no more base structure micromanagement and upgrades - upgrade is automatic with Tech increase; max 9 planets to a system (Gas giants disabled); credit output adjustments, Tech levels increased to 12 (technically 13: Tech 0-12); the required population for Trade routes slightly increased. Also I made some habit.bin alterations to fix vanilla bugs (ie Cardassians not liking desert planets, yeh go figure) and provide for the Dominion in place of Ferengi. There's probably other stuff I forgot, but that's it in a nutshell."
^ UM5 (Ultimate Mod 5) has become my favorite mod since Dafedz released it...
<goes to look> holy crap, almost 4 years ago??! :o The addition of the Dominion as a major empire (and demoting the Ferengi to a minor race), new skins for a lot of the ships, introduction of many new minor races, separate of the tech tree into "Eras", and almost complete elimination of those tedious building upgrades (thereby also eliminated a lot of the "micromanagement hell" that BOTF suffers from) has really breathed new life back into the game for me.
Quote from: bbmike on January 26, 2017, 05:14:01 PM
Does it include the MPR++ mod by Flocke?
Afraid not. It's not so much a mod as an attempt to port the game to a new graphics engine, and it's still very much in an alpha state.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on January 26, 2017, 10:17:06 PM
Bloody hell. :o
Do it. You know you want to. >:D
Tried, but it keeps fighting me.
First download attempt got all the way to almost the end of the 1.1GB file size, and said "download failed."
Re-downloaded and installed; everything seems to be working fine, but thus far it's given me three errors when trying to run the .exes for the mods. It's still going but apparently having issues. :(
Quote from: Martok on January 27, 2017, 01:14:11 AM
^ UM5 (Ultimate Mod 5) has become my favorite mod since Dafedz released it...<goes to look> holy crap, almost 4 years ago??! :o The addition of the Dominion as a major empire (and demoting the Ferengi to a minor race), new skins for a lot of the ships, introduction of many new minor races, separate of the tech tree into "Eras", and almost complete elimination of those tedious building upgrades (thereby also eliminated a lot of the "micromanagement hell" that BOTF suffers from) has really breathed new life back into the game for me.
Quote from: bbmike on January 26, 2017, 05:14:01 PM
Does it include the MPR++ mod by Flocke?
Afraid not. It's not so much a mod as an attempt to port the game to a new graphics engine, and it's still very much in an alpha state.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on January 26, 2017, 10:17:06 PM
Bloody hell. :o
Do it. You know you want to. >:D
UM5 Mod has become your favorite over the BOP Mod now Martok?
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on January 27, 2017, 10:06:47 AM
Tried, but it keeps fighting me.
First download attempt got all the way to almost the end of the 1.1GB file size, and said "download failed."
Re-downloaded and installed; everything seems to be working fine, but thus far it's given me three errors when trying to run the .exes for the mods. It's still going but apparently having issues. :(
Hmm. Apologies for asking what might be an insultingly obvious question, but did you first uninstall any current/previous version of BOTF? If not, you probably want to do so (and then uninstall/reinstall the new version), as that's been known to cause issues in the past.
Quote from: Tanaka on January 27, 2017, 03:47:50 PM
UM5 Mod has become your favorite over the BOP Mod now Martok?
It has indeed. :)
Not that I now dislike BOP, of course -- or for that matter, UDM3, ATA, or UCW2, which are all great mods still. It's just that for me, UM5 has become the "best fit" for the overall changes it makes to the game. It also helps that, thanks to the fact that UM5 still receives occasional updates, it incorporates most of the latest bug-fixes and improvements (such as the 18-ship task forces and the improved resolutions).
Quote from: Martok on January 28, 2017, 03:42:53 PM
Hmm. Apologies for asking what might be an insultingly obvious question, but did you first uninstall any current/previous version of BOTF? If not, you probably want to do so (and then uninstall/reinstall the new version), as that's been known to cause issues in the past.
Nope, this is the rig I got last June...I had done that AAR on my old rig. Never did install BotF on it.
Is there a way to speed up the game? Turn processing time for a large map is at least 30 seconds.
Quote from: Martok on January 28, 2017, 03:42:53 PM
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on January 27, 2017, 10:06:47 AM
Tried, but it keeps fighting me.
First download attempt got all the way to almost the end of the 1.1GB file size, and said "download failed."
Re-downloaded and installed; everything seems to be working fine, but thus far it's given me three errors when trying to run the .exes for the mods. It's still going but apparently having issues. :(
Hmm. Apologies for asking what might be an insultingly obvious question, but did you first uninstall any current/previous version of BOTF? If not, you probably want to do so (and then uninstall/reinstall the new version), as that's been known to cause issues in the past.
Quote from: Tanaka on January 27, 2017, 03:47:50 PM
UM5 Mod has become your favorite over the BOP Mod now Martok?
It has indeed. :)
Not that I now dislike BOP, of course -- or for that matter, UDM3, ATA, or UCW2, which are all great mods still. It's just that for me, UM5 has become the "best fit" for the overall changes it makes to the game. It also helps that, thanks to the fact that UM5 still receives occasional updates, it incorporates most of the latest bug-fixes and improvements (such as the 18-ship task forces and the improved resolutions).
Thanks that is the mod I will try then!
Sweet, a Birth of the Federation thread! i guess until recently, i had just overlooked star trek games, not that i am against star trek, i enjoyed TNG and Deep Space 9, but i just didnt know what was out there for star trek strat games and so i have just bought a copy of BOTF now after seeing it on Space Game Junkie!
all those other ones look good too like Star Fleet command series!
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on January 28, 2017, 04:47:46 PM
Quote from: Martok on January 28, 2017, 03:42:53 PM
Hmm. Apologies for asking what might be an insultingly obvious question, but did you first uninstall any current/previous version of BOTF? If not, you probably want to do so (and then uninstall/reinstall the new version), as that's been known to cause issues in the past.
Nope, this is the rig I got last June...I had done that AAR on my old rig. Never did install BotF on it.
Damn. Well I hate to say it, but you may wish to post in the AFC forums regarding your difficulties getting the game to run (depending on how great your desire is to play BOTF again). Not that Thunderchero & co. are miracle-workers (;)), but they have been able to help the vast majority of folks who are having technical problems.
Quote from: DicedT on January 30, 2017, 02:07:26 PM
Is there a way to speed up the game? Turn processing time for a large map is at least 30 seconds.
Unfortunately, that's because of the memory-leakage bug that was never fixed from the original game (and which modders have been unable to fix themselves, despite their most sincere efforts -- it remains BOTF's worst bug). Even on modern computers, turn times can drag upwards of a minute or two late in a campaign. :buck2:
While there's no known solution to this bug, there are two things that can help alleviate it: 1.) Occasionally exiting the game and restarting it. 2.) Destroying enemy ships & outposts/starbases (part of the memory problem is related to BOTF tracking all the vessels & stations in-game, so reducing the number of them flying/sitting around helps).
Quote from: Tanaka on January 30, 2017, 10:19:12 PM
Thanks that is the mod I will try then!
Awesome. Hope you enjoy it!
Quote from: agathosdaimon on January 31, 2017, 01:48:36 AM
Sweet, a Birth of the Federation thread! i guess until recently, i had just overlooked star trek games, not that i am against star trek, i enjoyed TNG and Deep Space 9, but i just didnt know what was out there for star trek strat games and so i have just bought a copy of BOTF now after seeing it on Space Game Junkie!
all those other ones look good too like Star Fleet command series!
Happy you stumbled your way across this thread then,
agathosdaimon! :)
You can easily be forgiven for having overlooked Star Trek games, however, as it's long been generally agreed that most aren't that good anyway. :P Even Birth of the Federation (much as I've always personally loved it) was, in absolute terms, only a slightly-above-average game at release (if memory serves, I believe it garnered an aggregate score of 65-70%).
Probably the biggest reason I *continue* to enjoy BOTF is because of the small, but still active, community over at ArmadaFleetCommand that has dedicated itself to the game over the years. This is especially true not only with respect to all the great mods some of those folks have released, but also in regards to the various bug-fixes and technical improvements (such as the higher-resolution patches) that the community has delivered in the past decade as well. (I never play the vanilla version of the game anymore.)
Also/besides... This is obviously highly subjective, but for me, BOTF still captures the Star Trek "feel" better than just about any other game I've played, especially as compared to other strategy games (usually with Trek-themed mods). Even though modern 4x titles have far outpaced BOTF in terms of better mechanics, AI, gameplay, UI, and any of a half-dozen different areas, the game still holds a little of that old magic for me. :)
Quote from: DicedT on January 30, 2017, 02:07:26 PM
Is there a way to speed up the game? Turn processing time for a large map is at least 30 seconds.
I'm sure it also still has that memory leak nobody can get to.
Used to drive me nuts, the slow but progressive slowdown every turn.
Although it seems like the perfect star trek game is yet to appear (though i hear star trek online is good , i dont like the online part of it) I have a great fondness for imperfect games in any case - i have actually gone all the way now and ordered the starfleet command and armada games too - and even Bridge Commander and Star TRek Legacy - i saw some good mods for all these games too,