The "Uber" Command: Modern Air/Naval Ops Thread

[RyanE]

The main problem is it takes a fairly significant investment of time and effort to play it and get the most out of it.  Playing a scenario to try to beat the AI is only a small part of the game.  The biggest part is learning about the systems, units, strategy, tactics, etc. that are beyond what is in the manual.  It would be impossible for the devs to document all the ways to use the systems.  It takes using google, the resources on the website, reading, etc. to understand how it all fits together.

Command is about the only game I play now because the investment needed in time and effort is the only way to get the most out of it.

[Grim.Reaper]

And that likely is the reason I haven't been able to play or wrap my head around it....seems like on the borderline of work, versus playing a game.  But I get it that some folks enjoy that, but apparently must not be for me.

[Pete Dero]

Some day I will have to wrap my head around this game....all the scenarios sound great and should be the type of game I like, but I just end up staring at the screen:(

My brain is just not advanced enough to "get" how to play it correctly....

This channel (and a week spare time) could be very usefull :

https://www.youtube.com/user/baloogan/videos?flow=grid&sort=da&view=0

Also great (from forum member Kushan) :

[Dimitris]

And that likely is the reason I haven't been able to play or wrap my head around it....seems like on the borderline of work, versus playing a game.  But I get it that some folks enjoy that, but apparently must not be for me.

That's very much how I feel about all the Football Manager games :D

[Grim.Reaper]

And that likely is the reason I haven't been able to play or wrap my head around it....seems like on the borderline of work, versus playing a game.  But I get it that some folks enjoy that, but apparently must not be for me.

That's very much how I feel about all the Football Manager games :D

I tend to understand sports management games better, but yes even some of the football manager depth overwhelms me as well....trust me, I want to play this game (I own it) but to my own fault, just hard for me to invest an extreme amount of time in videos, googling to learn weapon systems, etc......this is not at all a knock on the game, just a realization may be beyond my scope of comprehension.

[RyanE]

The other problem is there are people who want to come in and play a 2000 unit USSR vs NATO scenario and have everything laid out for them.  These guys seem dead set against playing a Peru vs Chile scenario with 20 units.  Then they come and proclaim the game is too hard.

If you stick to some small scenarios and focus on learning the interface, the game is quite manageable.

[Grim.Reaper]

The other problem is there are people who want to come in and play a 2000 unit USSR vs NATO scenario and have everything laid out for them.  These guys seem dead set against playing a Peru vs Chile scenario with 20 units.  Then they come and proclaim the game is too hard.

If you stick to some small scenarios and focus on learning the interface, the game is quite manageable.

Not sure if that was meant towards me, but that is not the case at all....haven't even tried to touch the large scenarios.  There are some games that click with people and some games that don't....this just happens to be one of those that don't for me at the moment.  It's "hard" from my perspective right now, but not at all suggesting that is a reflection of the game or on the people who have figured it out.

[Yskonyn]

I agree. We've gotten more tools to work with over the course of patches. The only thing that annoys me is the auto-RTB of units that are on a mission. Once they RTB I can't find a way to cancel that and keep them in the AO.
For example, A-10C's have a BIG gun that's of much use after they've shot all their missiles and bombs off, but once it goes RTB I can't get them back.
The only way I know how, is to have them under manual control all the time, but that gets tedious with lots of units.
If there is another way, please enlighten me!

[Dimitris]

The other problem is there are people who want to come in and play a 2000 unit USSR vs NATO scenario and have everything laid out for them.  These guys seem dead set against playing a Peru vs Chile scenario with 20 units.  Then they come and proclaim the game is too hard.

If you stick to some small scenarios and focus on learning the interface, the game is quite manageable.

Not sure if that was meant towards me, but that is not the case at all....haven't even tried to touch the large scenarios.  There are some games that click with people and some games that don't....this just happens to be one of those that don't for me at the moment.  It's "hard" from my perspective right now, but not at all suggesting that is a reflection of the game or on the people who have figured it out.

I'm fairly certain the criticism was not directed at you. In fact I have a sound idea who he has in mind  8)

[Dimitris]

I agree. We've gotten more tools to work with over the course of patches. The only thing that annoys me is the auto-RTB of units that are on a mission. Once they RTB I can't find a way to cancel that and keep them in the AO.
For example, A-10C's have a BIG gun that's of much use after they've shot all their missiles and bombs off, but once it goes RTB I can't get them back.
The only way I know how, is to have them under manual control all the time, but that gets tedious with lots of units.
If there is another way, please enlighten me!

You can unassign them (U key), and then manually control them as you see fit. Have to be careful with their fuel if they were RTBing because of bingo.

Specifically for gun attacks, there's a doctrine option ("use gun for A2G attacks" or somesuch) that determines if the AC will stick around and keep strafing after dropping its heavy stores, or depart. We added it after players feedback that both behaviors can be valid, depending on context. (Quite a few cases where local air defences are so intense that you really don't want to stick around and spar)

[Pete Dero]

I agree. We've gotten more tools to work with over the course of patches. The only thing that annoys me is the auto-RTB of units that are on a mission. Once they RTB I can't find a way to cancel that and keep them in the AO.
For example, A-10C's have a BIG gun that's of much use after they've shot all their missiles and bombs off, but once it goes RTB I can't get them back.
The only way I know how, is to have them under manual control all the time, but that gets tedious with lots of units.
If there is another way, please enlighten me!

Hope this is what you are looking for :

Select side doctrine menu
General
Air operations
RTB when winchester -> select no

[Kushan]

The main problem is it takes a fairly significant investment of time and effort to play it and get the most out of it.  Playing a scenario to try to beat the AI is only a small part of the game.  The biggest part is learning about the systems, units, strategy, tactics, etc. that are beyond what is in the manual.  It would be impossible for the devs to document all the ways to use the systems.  It takes using google, the resources on the website, reading, etc. to understand how it all fits together.

Command is about the only game I play now because the investment needed in time and effort is the only way to get the most out of it.

I disagree. It takes no more effort then any other game. I've been playing since right before launch and I still don't know off hand the capabilities of half the units in it off the top of my head. I think people get too caught up in the the huge database and all the numbers but there are only a few that really "matter" to the average player. Lets take a SAM system, doesn't matter the type. For the most part the two things that matter are the range of the radar and the range of its weapons. Depending on the era of the scenario, the knowledge that older SAM system will probably be less effective against some modern aircraft will also come into play

Same goes for aircraft, what really matters in most situations is the range of the current loadout, whether or not its LO/stealth, sensors, etc. But you don't need to know off the top of your head the climb rate of an F-15 or its fuel consumption in the different fuel bands, other then faster = use more fuel, unless you really want to micro every little detail.

I agree. We've gotten more tools to work with over the course of patches. The only thing that annoys me is the auto-RTB of units that are on a mission. Once they RTB I can't find a way to cancel that and keep them in the AO.
For example, A-10C's have a BIG gun that's of much use after they've shot all their missiles and bombs off, but once it goes RTB I can't get them back.
The only way I know how, is to have them under manual control all the time, but that gets tedious with lots of units.
If there is another way, please enlighten me!

Go into the units ROE (you can multi select all the aircraft at a base) settings and turn off RTB when winchester. You will still have to watch your gun ammo on your A-10s, since when they run out they wont RTB until there fuel gets low.

[RyanE]

That is easy to say for someone who has been playing it as long as you have.  Someone just asked what the difference between DEAD and SEAD is on the forum.  That is the kind of stuff that jumping in and playing won't help you with.  You have to go ask or google it.  The game assume you either know a lot of nomenclature and tactics or are willing to make the effort to go look it up.

[RyanE]

Another example...questions about WRA.  Its not in the manual anywhere.  You have to make the effort to not only look it up in the FAQ on another website.  Even then, it is not exactly intuitive.  There can be thousands of options in WRA settings and without playing around with it, it can seem very dense.

Not blaming the devs...it would be almost impossible to document every option in Command.  Sometimes its up to the player.  It does sometimes seem like work.

[Dimitris]

Another example...questions about WRA.  Its not in the manual anywhere.

Touche  :) It was added in one of the free updates, and our "print version" manual is still stuck on v1.00 (which is why we have the "Manual Addendum" pages).

We gave a brief description of the mechanics and its benefits when we first presented it, and Baloogan has dedicated one of his new UI tutorial videos to it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHiXU5Nil8M&list=PLgRuKky0mojZkb5tSIpJgEy0WR4rzt6tA&index=8

We're not perfect, but we're trying :)

You have to make the effort to not only look it up in the FAQ on another website.  Even then, it is not exactly intuitive.  There can be thousands of options in WRA settings and without playing around with it, it can seem very dense.

Not blaming the devs...it would be almost impossible to document every option in Command.  Sometimes its up to the player.  It does sometimes seem like work.

This is fair, and it's one of the unavoidable consequences of presenting a tool that is so powerful/flexible that it can be used in ways that the original creator cannot yet envision (imagine e.g. Graham Bell trying to write down operating instructions for the iPhone :) ). What we _can_ do, and most frequently try to, is to frame the practical benefits in setups most familiar to the user base ("yes, you can now tailor your AMRAAM shot doctrine so you easy-loft singles at long range against a transport while ripple-firing at medium range against a MiG-29") and then let players run with it.

If the logic sounds familiar, you may have fond memories of MicroProse's epic manuals - we sure do  ;)