The "Uber" Command: Modern Air/Naval Ops Thread

[RyanE]

Like I said, but suspecting you didn't read the entire conversation, I use it when building scenarios a lot or looking to see how something works.  I assume that is what its built for.

OK, its beta, but are you putting it back in based on feedback?  Since we are talking semantics, the release is called a Service Release.  The definition of an SR is a release for standard product still under development and being serviced.  Whether its fixing bugs or delivering promised features, it is considered part of the original release.

In any software business, its very bad form to remove functions on SRs.  Its a good way to get into trouble.

[bostonmyk]

While I think taking a legal approach is a little over the top.  I mean, the devs have been pretty good up to this point.  I am just curious to see if this issue goes any further.  I am worried that these devs tend to get a little vindictive when things don't go their way.  Its basically how the game got built.  I just don't want them to take any angst out on the product.

btw, the issue has just penetrated over on the main game forum.  We'll see how that plays out.  Maybe no one cares.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4234287

I noted the same approach on their forum...look what else we have for you.  No one has asked what they might be taking away to make room for this new thing.

Yeah that was me. You can check out my other comments here and there.

Would you like us to post all features we've added since release here? I think you an I both know there are lots if you play the game with any regularity but I'm 100 percent willing to let the judge and jury here take a look and let us know that they think. Let me know.

Thanks

MIke

[RyanE]

I have 3-4 recordings on this machine alone.  And I play on a few different machines. 

You have stepped in the middle here.  Again, read the whole thing.  I am not going to repeat myself again just because you don't want to go back and read what's already been said.

[Zulu1966]

Fortunately/Unfortunately Command and SB were 80% of my gaming time over the last year.  I do play a little CM and some IL2 Stalingrad.

What's funny is this one started out innocuous enough and then went all pear shaped.  If the dev hadn't come in and stomped around a little, this discussion would have been 4 or 5 posts.

Yeah probably but you also failed to mention its a beta which is a big miss.

How often do you use this feature and how often do you think others do? Part of the Beta is figuring out if changes are acceptable correct?

Mike

Thats a frankly ridiculous thing to say. What - you mean taking the feature out is in beta - to see if taking it out works - jeezzz you even say that when the Dev has come here himself and explained it has gone and why and told us all tough shit if we dont like it - now you are trying to say its only a Beta ... LMFAO

[Jarhead0331]

Just for the record, not the first time this has happened.

http://blogs.berkeley.edu/2013/11/21/when-product-features-disappear-amazon-apple-tesla-and-the-troubled-future-for-21st-century-consumers/

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100331/0128358800.shtml

http://www.ign.com/articles/2010/04/29/sony-sued-for-removal-of-linux-support-from-ps3

http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca9/11-18066/11-18066-2014-01-06.html

http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca9/11-18066/11-18066-2014-01-06.html

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/sony-might-owe-you-money-heres-why/1100-6441109/
I do believe there will be law on this someday, if there isn't already precedent.

EDIT - there already is precedent and it looks like the case was settled. I'm going to look into this in more detail, but it appears there is a possibility that a court could have found that removal of features from software that has been paid for is a violation of certain statutes and laws. 

The last link from October 2016 reveals Sony settled the case by paying at least $55 to a class of 10,000,000. Do the math.

I hope Dmitris is still reading this thread.

The release is currently in beta. Users have an option to download it or not. Change isn't permanent yet.

Got any links on that?

Thanks

Mike

I'm not here to argue with you, only to show that similar decisions could run afoul of various state and federal laws. I think the position that it's a "beta", though, and not permanent "yet", is a bit disingenuous. Anyway, if you want links to fully explore your risk, hire a lawyer. I happen to be one and will be glad to assist . Drop me a pm if interested.

[mirth]

Yeah probably but you also failed to mention its a beta which is a big miss.

How often do you use this feature and how often do you think others do? Part of the Beta is figuring out if changes are acceptable correct?

Mike

So is there a plan to keep it in then? That isn't how it was presented by Dimitris. What are the other features currently in the game you are considering possibly removing?

[RyanE]

Guy, are you going to keep posting without reading anything.  That has already been discussed several times.  Can you please save everyone some time and PLEASE go back and read it.  Or are you going to do your usual "going off half-cocked" like you do on the Matrix forum.  PLEASE, PLEASE go back and read the last 2-3 pages.  If you really want answers to your questions, you'll get them there.

btw, this was all calming down and now you seem to want to just keep oit going.  Its not making you guys look very good.

[RyanE]

These guys need a PR firm.

[Grim.Reaper]

What a bizarre set of posts....now it's being implied it may not be removed?  I guess the other developer forgot to mention that while he was explaining it was purposely removed to make more money on the professional version.  So they were just testing us if w would miss it?  Ok....

[Zulu1966]

While I think taking a legal approach is a little over the top.  I mean, the devs have been pretty good up to this point.  I am just curious to see if this issue goes any further.  I am worried that these devs tend to get a little vindictive when things don't go their way.  Its basically how the game got built.  I just don't want them to take any angst out on the product.

btw, the issue has just penetrated over on the main game forum.  We'll see how that plays out.  Maybe no one cares.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4234287

I noted the same approach on their forum...look what else we have for you.  No one has asked what they might be taking away to make room for this new thing.

Yeah that was me. You can check out my other comments here and there.

Would you like us to post all features we've added since release here? I think you an I both know there are lots if you play the game with any regularity but I'm 100 percent willing to let the judge and jury here take a look and let us know that they think. Let me know.

Thanks

MIke

No - what I would like you to do is explain how any of the features you have added are relevant to deliberately removing something I paid a lot of money to you for. Regardless of whether I have used it once or a million times - I paid for it. Why cant you guys get into your heads just how bad that looks on any and all levels ?

And even so - now you have done that - you expect us to believe that all along you have been adding features merely cause you are good guys ? As opposed to winning a nice contract with the military - who were only interested in it in the first place cause we who paid a premium price for the game gave you time to develop it to the point they were. Jeeeez - you guys stink. Minus one customer for anything else you put out. Maybe Matrix as well.

[bostonmyk]

Like I said, but suspecting you didn't read the entire conversation, I use it when building scenarios a lot or looking to see how something works.  I assume that is what its built for.

OK, its beta, but are you putting it back in based on feedback?  Since we are talking semantics, the release is called a Service Release.  The definition of an SR is a release for standard product still under development and being serviced.  Whether its fixing bugs or delivering promised features, it is considered part of the original release.

In any software business, its very bad form to remove functions on SRs.  Its a good way to get into trouble.

The title of the string you downloaded the files from is titled Command v1.11 Service Release 7 - Release Candidate [CURRENT: B906.15]. If this is not clear we're definitely open to suggestions on how to do it
better.

Once all Updates and SR's are done they get pushed via the update button or through steams pipeline.

I can't speak to your experience in the software business only mine. Our current paradigm has been successful because we've able to collect valuable feedback and catch bugs and fix them prior to release. I haven't seen much negative feedback on doing this and I'm pretty confident in saying its produced a better product. So it works, most our players seem happy so we're going with it until it doesn't work.

Thanks!

Mike

[RyanE]

I didn't go after anyone.  He is plain wrong in stating that something like Fraps will do the same thing.  So I'll spell it out...

1) Records entire session of game
2) Replays session
3) All menus of game are active
4) Views can be changed
5) is organic to game
6) You can jump into the game at any point of the recording

If the feature was so simple as Fraps, I suspect the pro users wouldn't be very interested.

I don't like quoting myself, but its easier.

Am I wrong?  Is there an app out there that does the above?  Was my assumption too broad?  Is Kushan reading this?

Yeah its pretty unique. Fact is though I've seen maybe one recording used anywhere and same for everybody else. Are we wrong? Do you record much?

Thanks

Mike

Wait a minute here...You mean the guy who bragged about how much he knows the game and length of time playing didn't know this fact.  So I guess length of time playing doesn't count for much as we thought.  Sheesh!  There's a bunch of posts I had to make that I'll never get back.

While I am as appreciative as anyone of people like Kushan putting work into developing content for a game, it doesn't give them an automatic pass on throwing crap around on a forum.

[bostonmyk]

Just for the record, not the first time this has happened.

http://blogs.berkeley.edu/2013/11/21/when-product-features-disappear-amazon-apple-tesla-and-the-troubled-future-for-21st-century-consumers/

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100331/0128358800.shtml

http://www.ign.com/articles/2010/04/29/sony-sued-for-removal-of-linux-support-from-ps3

http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca9/11-18066/11-18066-2014-01-06.html

http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca9/11-18066/11-18066-2014-01-06.html

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/sony-might-owe-you-money-heres-why/1100-6441109/
I do believe there will be law on this someday, if there isn't already precedent.

EDIT - there already is precedent and it looks like the case was settled. I'm going to look into this in more detail, but it appears there is a possibility that a court could have found that removal of features from software that has been paid for is a violation of certain statutes and laws. 

The last link from October 2016 reveals Sony settled the case by paying at least $55 to a class of 10,000,000. Do the math.

I hope Dmitris is still reading this thread.

The release is currently in beta. Users have an option to download it or not. Change isn't permanent yet.

Got any links on that?

Thanks

Mike

I'm not here to argue with you, only to show that similar decisions could run afoul of various state and federal laws. I think the position that it's a "beta", though, and not permanent "yet", is a bit disingenuous. Anyway, if you want links to fully explore your risk, hire a lawyer. I happen to be one and will be glad to assist . Drop me a pm if interested.

Ok

[RyanE]

I am not going to argue the quality of the product or your commitment to it.  My personal opinion is that both are very good.  I will argue your approach to customers and the trend I am seeing of turning your backs on the retail customers who gave you the money to potentially win big.  You haven't done it yet, but I am starting to see the cracks in the wall.  Its called "getting too big for your britches", "forgetting your root", "stepping on the backs of the people who got you there", etc.

You guys, as business people have a very obvious habit of alienating people all around.  You guys never seem to be able to say you made a mistake on things like this.

I'm sure your answer will be "they were all out to get me".  You giys should consider merging with esims, your business styles mesh well.

[bostonmyk]

I didn't go after anyone.  He is plain wrong in stating that something like Fraps will do the same thing.  So I'll spell it out...

1) Records entire session of game
2) Replays session
3) All menus of game are active
4) Views can be changed
5) is organic to game
6) You can jump into the game at any point of the recording

If the feature was so simple as Fraps, I suspect the pro users wouldn't be very interested.

I don't like quoting myself, but its easier.

Am I wrong?  Is there an app out there that does the above?  Was my assumption too broad?  Is Kushan reading this?

Yeah its pretty unique. Fact is though I've seen maybe one recording used anywhere and same for everybody else. Are we wrong? Do you record much?

Thanks

Mike

Wait a minute here...You mean the guy who bragged about how much he knows the game and length of time playing didn't know this fact.  So I guess length of time playing doesn't count for much as we thought.  Sheesh!  There's a bunch of posts I had to make that I'll never get back.

While I am as appreciative as anyone of people like Kushan putting work into developing content for a game, it doesn't give them an automatic pass on throwing crap around on a forum.

I'm not exactly following you but guessing I'm not going to change your mind on this. Oh well.

Anyways sorry you're upset about this. We hope you enjoy the game and whats to come.

Have a nice night all!

Thanks!

Mike