So the local sports show on the radio here went off on a two-hour tangent last night talking about greatest American rock bands. (They ruled out Bruce's E Street Band, calling them a 'backing band' even tho Bruce himself doesn't call them one.)
This all started with Bomani Jones asking his Twitter audience about it, and they just picked up the discussion.
The point they were trying to make was that most of the "The Greatest" bands - bands, not artists - were not American: The Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath were all British, where in the US we've had a huge string of major solo artists like Elvis, Bruce, Billy Joel, etc.
The US discussion, to me, is really down to 2 bands: The Eagles and Kiss, though the guys on the radio also threw the Beach Boys into the discussion.
Other bands mentioned on the air were:
Pearl Jam
The Ramones
Talking Heads (tho how you include Talking Heads and not Blondie is beyond me)
Metallica
The Band (who actually has a handful of Canadians)
Green Day
Counting Crows
Black Keys
Wilco
Bon Jovi
Dave Matthews Band (which seemed to me to be very similar to Bruce)
Bands no one mentioned on the air:
Van Halen
Creedence Clearwater Revival
Lynyrd Skynyrd
Journey
Styx
REO Speedwagon
Hootie and the Blowfish (when your debut album is the 3rd-best-selling album of all time, you get to be in the discussion)
all of which really start to stretch the definitions of "greatest" and all of which really start to suffer when compared to either The Eagles or Kiss
So what say y'all?
Is this 'Greatest' attribute based on best music, most chart success, or greatest influence on music that followed?
Here's a few of the top of my head:
REM
Doors
Velvet Underground
(More later... )
Aerosmith
Chicago
ELO. :2funny:
Aerosmith, the doors and REM were all mentioned also
ELO and Velvet Underground were not
Cheap Trick
Fleetwood Mac
Grateful Dead
Allman Brothers
I'm down with the Allmans. Invented a whole subgenre to themselves, Southern Rock.
ELO, other than being a personal favorite, was led by the incomparable Jeff Lynne. I contend, that next to Lennon and McCartney, there is no finer writer of pop songs than Lynne.
I really dislike The Eagles. You can't dismiss their string of hits and popular songs, or the fact that they threw three successful solo artists (Don Henley, Glenn Frey and Joe Walsh) into the mainstream. Though, I fear for my sanity the next time I hear Hotel California. GOD I hate that song!
For shear volume at a high rate of success, you can't beat Credence Clearwater Revival. Go back and look at their dominance of the pop charts. And there isn't a song of theirs that you don't a) instantly recognize and b) have to admit, that at some point in your life, you really dug that song.
And Dave Mathews is South African.
Actually, Dave Matthews is an American. He was born in S.A. but moved here as a young child and his band was formed in the USA. IIRC, he is a Virginian.
The Grateful Dead were mentioned on air too. Again tho, where do they measure up to Kiss or The Eagles?
Someone also brought up ZZ Top but thankfully it was quickly dismissed
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 26, 2014, 01:03:33 PM
The Grateful Dead were mentioned on air too. Again tho, where do they measure up to Kiss or The Eagles?
Someone also brought up ZZ Top but thankfully it was quickly dismissed
How are we measuring? if it's on musical talent then there will be too many opinions to count.
Hmmm..tough one. I love Garcia in Anthem of the Sun album mode but not in his country mode. Janis Joplin is near the top. The difficulty is some of my fav Amercian rock albums aren't by "Well Known" groups, like 13th Floor Elevators, Chicos Magnetic Band, Fifty Foot Hose, Cold Sun, Vanilla Fudge, Quick Silver Messenger Service and Golden Dawn. They have all made albums that for me beat any big ROCK SUPERSTAR band. So I couldn't say who is the greatest. If I had to go for one that I love and is well known I'd go for Janis Joplin she really rocked it.
they were fairly vague on the radio, but I think the intent was to try to measure a combination of longevity quality and influence.
ironically, they held up a bunch of English archetypes from several decades ago, but then dismissed many of the US suggestions such as Counting Crows, with the statement of "have you heard anything from them lately?" I am pretty sure I have not heard anything from led zeppelin or the beatles lately either.
You say The Beach Boys where mentioned. I really wouldn't say they where a rock band in the Rock sense of the word though I suppose it would be cataloged uder rock. Pet Sounds is a seminal album and up there in my fav albums released ever.
I'm definitely not a fan of The Eagles, safe middle of the road rock never really did it for me. I'd rather go for Crosby, Stills and Nash. I'd mentioned Jefferson Airplane After Bathing at Baxters and some other Grace Slick pre Jefferson songs..though Jefferson Starship would stop me from voting for them. How certain amazing ground breaking bands in sixties turned out utter tripe in the seventies and eighties I've no idea..maybe it was all a horrible comedown.
I think I'd go for a American and British amalgamation and say Jimi Hendrix and the Experience.
The Doors. Their music holds up today. God knows what they would have come up with had Jim Morrison lived. And their music was really of its own place and time as well. As well as other places and times. Pass the acid dude.
Counting Crows??? Vomit. 'Mr. Jones' should disqualify them immediately.
Doesn't Fleetwood Mac include some Brits? Like Mick Fleetwood himself?
Who compiled this list? A bunch of doddering old farts in a retirement home?
Git offa mah rockin roll lawn!
Yeah..The Doors has it all from great tunes to a charismatic lead singer and well known world wide.
Quote from: Gusington on July 26, 2014, 05:31:17 PM
The Doors. Their music holds up today. God knows what they would have come up with had Jim Morrison lived. And their music was really of its own place and time as well. As well as other places and times. Pass the acid dude.
Counting Crows??? Vomit. 'Mr. Jones' should disqualify them immediately.
Doesn't Fleetwood Mac include some Brits? Like Mick Fleetwood himself?
Counting Crows are pretty good Gussy. Not on a level with the Doors, but, good nonetheless.
Dave Mathews was born in S.A. So, that makes him South African. And I do realize to whom I am replying :) The rest of the band is from here. And yes, Virginia was where they hailed from.
KISS, for anyone who has seen them perform, puts on a GREAT show! Very high energy and enjoyable. Of course, that was 30 years ago, so, they may have slowed down, but, there it is.
I went to a Counting Crows show with a girlfriend about 20 years ago. Cake opened for them, and were great. I slept through the rest of the show :)
Anybody that can bang Courtney Cox and whos favorite musician is Van Morrison, can't be all bad.
I love Van Morrison and Courtney Cox. But I would hang out with Van at a U2 show and take Courtney Cox to see Cake.
The jimi hendrix experience. There is NO part of rock and roll that wasnt effected and its stood the test of time.
QuoteI really dislike The Eagles. You can't dismiss their string of hits and popular songs, or the fact that they threw three successful solo artists (Don Henley, Glenn Frey and Joe Walsh) into the mainstream. Though, I fear for my sanity the next time I hear Hotel California. GOD I hate that song!
Jeez, I thought I was the only person who hates Hotel California. ???
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 27, 2014, 04:25:20 PM
The jimi hendrix experience. There is NO part of rock and roll that wasnt effected and its stood the test of time.
Noel Redding and Mitch Mitchell were both Brits. But, the Master of the Stratocaster, on his own merits, can stand for American rock any time he wants.
Quote from: Al on July 27, 2014, 04:52:25 PM
QuoteI really dislike The Eagles. You can't dismiss their string of hits and popular songs, or the fact that they threw three successful solo artists (Don Henley, Glenn Frey and Joe Walsh) into the mainstream. Though, I fear for my sanity the next time I hear Hotel California. GOD I hate that song!
Jeez, I thought I was the only person who hates Hotel California. ???
As I grow older, and the same song hits my auditory nerve for the umpteen millionth time, I find that there are some I truly despise from the first note. And I couldn't even tell you exactly why in most cases. Invariably, though, as soon as it comes on, I turn it off.
I love Jimi Hendrix. And I also never liked The Eagles. I like Glenn Frey and Don Henley solo stuff a lot more for some reason. Except for Glenn Frey's Miami Vice phase. Like Smuggler's Blues. Now that's godawful.
What is the obsession with the Doors? A band with a couple of decent songs and a bunch of B-sides. Dying young was the best thing that happened to Jim Morrison career-wise.
Quote from: mirth on July 27, 2014, 05:05:49 PM
What is the obsession with the Doors? A band with a couple of decent songs and a bunch of B-sides. Dying young was the best thing that happened to Jim Morrison career-wise.
THANK YOU. I'm glad I'm not the only one. Morrison drunkenly rambling into a microphone is apparently 'genius', while the endless keyboard noodling makes me want to track down Ray Manzarek and stab him. Ugh.
They are better than the Eagles, though. That also isn't saying much.
Pffft Doors - guy couldn't sing a fkng note
The Doors were tuneful when it suited them. But, they were selling Jim Morrison. And he's one of those, 'guys want to be him, girls want to be with him,' type of guys. Dark, moody, good looking and good enough at being a bullshitter to make everyone think he was deep. They were my first, 'favorite,' band.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 26, 2014, 06:05:49 PM
Who compiled this list? A bunch of doddering old farts in a retirement home?
It wasn't a singular list, it was a conversation. But one of the factors they brought up was longevity, which is why Fall Out Boy doesn't count.
Quote from: MetalDogBut, the Master of the Stratocaster, on his own merits, can stand for American rock any time he wants.
Hendrix they counted as a solo artist; same rules as Springsteen.
I don't deny that there's a lot of Eagles tunes that are overplayed. But there's plenty of Floyd, Stones, Aerosmith, and Zeppelin tunes that are overplayed too.
Some of my favorite Eagles tunes are the non-radio hits, like "Those Shoes".
And Joe Walsh was already an established artist with the James Gang and his early solo stuff when he joined the Eagles
The Doors were one of my first favorite bands too, along with U2 and Public Enemy, circa 1986. Hard to believe at the time that Morrison was gone for only about 15 years. Right now Cobain has been gone longer at this point!
I would throw my lot in with Aerosmith. Not my favourite American band, but their longevity and influence cannot be denied.
KISS would get an honourable mention.
Groundbreaking would go to the Doors, and the Beachboys.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 27, 2014, 06:44:55 PM
I don't deny that there's a lot of Eagles tunes that are overplayed. But there's plenty of Floyd, Stones, Aerosmith, and Zeppelin tunes that are overplayed too.
I could fill a thread of songs that are overplayed and the dial immediately changed. "Another Brick In the Wall, Pt. 2," "The Stroke," by Billy Squier, "Sweet Home Alabama," or "Freebird." All that shit can rot. Aerosmith's version of, "Come Together." Journey, "Wheel In the Sky." The list, literally, goes on and on.
Quote from: Centurion40 on July 27, 2014, 08:03:05 PMI would throw my lot in with Aerosmith. Not my favourite American band, but their longevity and influence cannot be denied.
But a greater influence than Kiss?
I like Kiss, and The Eagles. Neither are my all-time favorite band. But their combination of influence, longevity, and success just pummel all the other current options in my mind. In 15 more years, I'd hope Pearl Jam is in that conversation, but it'll take that long to truly get a sense of their influence.
(https://scontent-b-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t1.0-9/10479143_10152102663681524_2226477831617906906_n.jpg)
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 28, 2014, 05:43:58 AM
Quote from: Centurion40 on July 27, 2014, 08:03:05 PMI would throw my lot in with Aerosmith. Not my favourite American band, but their longevity and influence cannot be denied.
But a greater influence than Kiss?
I like Kiss, and The Eagles. Neither are my all-time favorite band. But their combination of influence, longevity, and success just pummel all the other current options in my mind. In 15 more years, I'd hope Pearl Jam is in that conversation, but it'll take that long to truly get a sense of their influence.
no Bon Jovi?
NO
lol
booooooooooooooooooooooooo
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 28, 2014, 10:53:23 AM
(https://scontent-b-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t1.0-9/10479143_10152102663681524_2226477831617906906_n.jpg)
100% agree, but he's a solo artist and therefore not in this discussion ;)
Quote from: undercovergeek on July 28, 2014, 11:11:37 AM
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 28, 2014, 05:43:58 AM
Quote from: Centurion40 on July 27, 2014, 08:03:05 PMI would throw my lot in with Aerosmith. Not my favourite American band, but their longevity and influence cannot be denied.
But a greater influence than Kiss?
I like Kiss, and The Eagles. Neither are my all-time favorite band. But their combination of influence, longevity, and success just pummel all the other current options in my mind. In 15 more years, I'd hope Pearl Jam is in that conversation, but it'll take that long to truly get a sense of their influence.
no Bon Jovi?
Geek, if you ever denied entry into the United States,
THIS will be the reason.
pearl jam can suck a bag of aids ridden dicks.
Harsh man. Harsh.
oh I cleaned it up before hitting post.
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 28, 2014, 07:35:28 PM
oh I cleaned it up before hitting post.
Used that favorite sock of yours, didn't you?
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 28, 2014, 06:50:39 PM
pearl jam can suck a bag of aids ridden dicks.
QFT!
Eddie Vedder is one step above Cobain in my book. And that's because he is still drawing breath.
for the era and genre of music you simply cant beat the Pixies with maybe the Smashing Pumpkins far far behind.
Come on man. Alice in Chains??
Alice In Chains is by FAR the best band to come out of Seattle at that time. I dig the Smashing Pumpkins, but AIC is heavy and awesome in a way that I've never heard.
Pixies? Smashing Pumpkins? Well they excel at being bitchy little posers I guess.
^O snap!
Also AiC is still putting out good music, with their new lead singer and bassist. RIP Layne Staley and Mike Starr.
all of that coming from a buncha guys that never stepped a foot in a pit.
::)
A Pixies pit? What happens there? Somebody run up and apply black eyeliner to you a little too roughly?
Quote from: MetalDog on July 28, 2014, 08:55:22 PM
Alice In Chains is by FAR the best band to come out of Seattle at that time. I dig the Smashing Pumpkins, but AIC is heavy and awesome in a way that I've never heard.
You *do* know that Smashing Pumpkins are *not* a Seattle band, right?
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 28, 2014, 09:15:02 PM
all of that coming from a buncha guys that never stepped a foot in a pit.
::)
Fuck you. I was on MTV in 92 in the pit at a Pantera show
a pit.... ::)
somewhere theres a Wonka meme for that.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 28, 2014, 10:29:48 PM
Quote from: MetalDog on July 28, 2014, 08:55:22 PM
Alice In Chains is by FAR the best band to come out of Seattle at that time. I dig the Smashing Pumpkins, but AIC is heavy and awesome in a way that I've never heard.
You *do* know that Smashing Pumpkins are *not* a Seattle band, right?
Yeah. Just stream of consciousnessed the post. Combined a couple of posts.
Quote from: MetalDog on July 28, 2014, 06:30:07 PM
Quote from: undercovergeek on July 28, 2014, 11:11:37 AM
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 28, 2014, 05:43:58 AM
Quote from: Centurion40 on July 27, 2014, 08:03:05 PMI would throw my lot in with Aerosmith. Not my favourite American band, but their longevity and influence cannot be denied.
But a greater influence than Kiss?
I like Kiss, and The Eagles. Neither are my all-time favorite band. But their combination of influence, longevity, and success just pummel all the other current options in my mind. In 15 more years, I'd hope Pearl Jam is in that conversation, but it'll take that long to truly get a sense of their influence.
no Bon Jovi?
Geek, if you ever denied entry into the United States, THIS will be the reason.
Its about the only question they don't ask me at passport control but ill try and slip it in next time!
They should be asking you about that rash that isn't goong away and then move on to the Bon Jovi.
I have been in pits against my will, as I am really too small for that shit. My glory came in the winter of 1994 at a Stabbing Westward show when I got kicked in the head by a ski boot. That was enough.
I was loved up and raving in the late eighties and early nineties..to much love for any pits etc etc:)..more hugs..and kissing strangers.
i have a saudi, iraq, and kuwait visa stamp in my passport - they dislike me enough already
I didn't go to many concerts in my youth except a few that I'd go to every time they hit San Antonio, one of which was Queensryche. I know, I know - they're metal, not rock, but some of their songs blur the lines a little, at least for me. Operation: Mindcrime is one of the most epic albums ever.
I'd suggest Tom Petty (surprised nobody's mentioned him yet), Ted Nugent, The Cars, or ZZ Top also.
As far as The Doors go, I got sick of them back when I was a child because my mom loved them. They have a couple of songs I do like, but for the most part, barf.
I used to really enjoy Alice In Chains and Soundgarden, but they both released songs that were murder-inducing annoyance wrapped in three minutes - Mr. Jones and Spoonman, respectively.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on July 29, 2014, 09:49:30 AMI'd suggest Tom Petty (surprised nobody's mentioned him yet), Ted Nugent, The Cars, or ZZ Top also.
Tom Petty = solo artist, not a band (same rules as Bruce)
Ted Nugent = solo artist
ZZ Top = already mentioned
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 26, 2014, 01:03:33 PMSomeone also brought up ZZ Top but thankfully it was quickly dismissed
The Cars = get real :coolsmiley:
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on July 29, 2014, 09:49:30 AMI used to really enjoy Alice In Chains and Soundgarden, but they both released songs that were murder-inducing annoyance wrapped in three minutes - Mr. Jones and Spoonman, respectively.
Back on your meds!
Mr. Jones can go take a leap into a pit of spiders.
Quote from: Gusington on July 29, 2014, 07:29:39 AM
They should be asking you about that rash that isn't goong away and then move on to the Bon Jovi.
I have been in pits against my will, as I am really too small for that shit. My glory came in the winter of 1994 at a Stabbing Westward show when I got kicked in the head by a ski boot. That was enough.
The two I recall as being the craziest were:
1) The absolutely massive pit for Ministry at lolapalooza in '92. The singer threw a bunch of bones into the crowd and people started going all 2001 on each other. I took a jaw bone to the jaw bone. The pit was so massive it took a lot of time and effort just to make it back out of the thing.
2) I was working in Ulsan, S. Korea and went up to Seoul for the weekend to visit some girls who were teaching there. Several pitchers and a tab later and I ditched them because they dragged me to some shit club that played faggy music like Depeche Mode, The Smiths and the like. Somehow ended up in Itaewon drinking with a rugby team from Oz and we found a metal bar built out of cement and pain and populated with a bunch of marines. Not so much of a pit but more of a brawl set to music (which I guess is also kind of faggy in a West Side Story kind of way.)
Anyway, the best US rock band is Tool.
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 29, 2014, 10:38:22 AM
1) The absolutely massive pit for Ministry at lolapalooza in '92. The singer threw a bunch of bones into the crowd and people started going all 2001 on each other. I took a jaw bone to the jaw bone. The pit was so massive it took a lot of time and effort just to make it back out of the thing.
The pit for Ministry at Lollapalooza in Raleigh was huge, and it was muddy. Most of us hit the cooling misters to try to wash the mud off afterwards, and got totally soaked. And then got cold as hell since the sun had already gone done by the time the Chili Peppers came on, and suffered greatly.
the one at Florida Fair Grounds in Orlando dug up enough dirt and mud that the storm drain was visible.
what great days those were! O0
you ventured as far north as Orlando?!?! Are you trying to become a Yankee or something?
The Wife was at lollapalooza 1992 and woke up half dead in a mud pit without shoes. She was 17 at the time.
Tool is very good...I actually like more songs by A Perfect Circle. I also like both Depeche Mode and The Smiths...they were really big in my junior high and high school.
LOVE Soundgarden and Chris Cornell. But I hate Spoonman...cheesy at best.
What's wrong with Pearl Jam? (Am I in the minority here?).
CCR, Styx, Van Halen are on my list for sure.
-CCR
- Styx
- Blue Oyster Cult
- Bon Jovi (yes, I like them, eat it)
-Van Halen
- REO Speedwagon
I would put Metallica up there for sure. Forget the talk about them going mainstream etc, they are successful and that is a goal in that industry.
For more recent stuff:
- Rage Against the Machine (some bits were really good, not crazy about the singer)
- Audioslave (again, loved the guitarist)
- Live (may not be the greatest, but Lightning Crashes is always on my roadtrip playlist)
- Pantera
- Pearl Jam
- White Lion (it was the 80s)
- Linkin Park
Metallica might could possibly challenge the top two, and you're not in the minority on Pearl Jam (if you are, you've got company!)
But think about any of the bands you listed, and consider if the combination of influence, success, and longevity trumps either Kiss or The Eagles? Personally, I'd rather listen to Van Halen, Pearl Jam, or Motley Crue, but I have a hard time denying that those top two just kick everyone else's butts in those categories, Grateful Dead and Beach Boys included.
That is true, I have to agree. Both Kiss and The Eagles had all of those.
I still have not been able to get on the Grateful Dead wagon, but they do have many followers.
ZZ Top where OK when The Moving Sidewalks. Love abit of texan psych.
As a viable, recording, band, The Eagles ran from '72 to '79 with exactly one album after that, in 2007. KISS, on the other hand, started in '74 and released at least one album per year from then until 1985. From there, seven more albums were released, with the most recent being 2012's, Monster. So, I say to you, if those are the only two bands that need to be vetted to be crowned, then KISS has already won.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 29, 2014, 03:43:00 PM
Metallica might could possibly challenge the top two, and you're not in the minority on Pearl Jam (if you are, you've got company!)
But think about any of the bands you listed, and consider if the combination of influence, success, and longevity trumps either Kiss or The Eagles? Personally, I'd rather listen to Van Halen, Pearl Jam, or Motley Crue, but I have a hard time denying that those top two just kick everyone else's butts in those categories, Grateful Dead and Beach Boys included.
And while I am at it, Metallica easily crushes The Eagles using those three criteria. They invented a genre of music, thrash. They can charge just as much, if not more, for concert tickets than The Eagles. AND, as a going concern, have recorded and released more albums for longer than Henley and his boys.
Now that those poseurs have been dealt with...what do we do with KISS?
Have a cold gin?
Yeah, but the Eagles still sell out tour after tour after tour. Kiss does pretty well, too, but not at the level the Eagles do as a live act.
Metallica popularized thrash, but "invented"? I think there's a bunch of bands that were in pretty early.
I agree that Metallica is probably going to end up in the conversation as we start to see their level of influence, as they've been comparably successful and are starting cross the longevity bridge.
Please don't think I'm just some Eagles fanboi; I'm just trying to recognize that as "great" American bands go, they're at the top of the conversation with not a lot of peers.
Alright, I'll give on invented. For now. Metal is as sub-genre'd as any form of music. And thrash flourished around a lot of different progenitors of other subs. I would definitely say they only had competition from Slayer. And Anthrax, and Scott Ian and the boys were most definitely third behind the other two biggies. Just a matter of which you preferred first.
I will certainly advance the cause of Van Halen. How many of you, with any aspirations of rock and roll stardom, didn't imagine you were Eddie Van Halen or Diamond Dave. They cranked out six albums in eight years and all of them were good to great. And then Dave leaves and they bring in Sammy Hagar and make four consecutive Number 1 albums!!! That's just For Unlawful Carnal KnowledgED UP!!
given the choice between the Eagles, KISS and Van Halen I'd take Van Halen any day.
^ Out of those three, certainly.
Though KISS is the only one of the three I've seen live, and that was two years ago. They put on a hell of a show along with Motley Crue and some no-name minor band I'd never heard of before and forget the name of now.
I saw KISS twice in the 80's. Ironically, it was without the makeup, which, at the time, was supposed to be the new normal. No more makeup. Of course, they went back on that a short time later and now I am in the minority of KISS concert goers. And they put on a helluva show. Queensryche opened for them the second time I saw them. Could have sworn they were on the road promoting Operation: Mindcrime. Never did get them, although I had a couple of friends who dug them.
I think Van Halen certainly belongs in the discussion... definitelyna big influence on people
Quote from: MetalDog on July 29, 2014, 09:54:40 PM
I saw KISS twice in the 80's. Ironically, it was without the makeup, which, at the time, was supposed to be the new normal. No more makeup. Of course, they went back on that a short time later and now I am in the minority of KISS concert goers. And they put on a helluva show.
I remember all that - I think the album was Animalize and it was 1984 when they first came out without the makeup on. They impressed me big time live...not just because the show was incredible, but also keeping in mind these are 60+ old men still rocking their asses off, and in Houston August heat outdoors, in full makeup and costume.
Quote from: MetalDog on July 29, 2014, 09:54:40 PM
Queensryche opened for them the second time I saw them. Could have sworn they were on the road promoting Operation: Mindcrime. Never did get them, although I had a couple of friends who dug them.
I didn't get into Queensryche until the Empire album came out. I had a couple of friends that were into them and they suggested we go to a concert. I remember it clearly as Suicidal Tendencies opened, and I thought they sucked. Then Queensryche came out and they pretty much played Operation: Mindcrime in its entirety, which confused me as I didn't listen to that album, though I heard a couple of their songs. It was funny for me, anyway, going to the concert and expecting them to do mostly stuff off of Empire and here I'm thinking during the show, "WTF is this?...Oh, I know that one...wait, what the hell is that?"
First Kiss album with no makeup was Lick It Up in '83. I still like Animalize as one of my top 2 or 3 all-time Kiss albums.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 30, 2014, 06:48:11 AM
First Kiss album with no makeup was Lick It Up in '83. I still like Animalize as one of my top 2 or 3 all-time Kiss albums.
D'oh, my bad with the album. Animalize was my first KISS album, admittedly.
If you're a KISS fan and you haven't seen the movie
Role Models, you should check it out. Lots of great references in that movie.
I never got into Queensryche at all and now I think I kay have missed out...how many albums do they have? Are they still together? All I know is Operation Mindcrime and Silent Lucidity. I imagine Queensryche being similar to Dream Theater but not as...long winded.
To me Van Halen, in any incarnation, is definitely in the top 5, if not top 3.
Queesryche are still around and recently had a nasty split with Geoff Tate and a legal fight over the name. They've still put out excellent music, but are well past their peak, in large part because Chris DeGarmo left the band in '97.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 28, 2014, 05:43:58 AM
Quote from: Centurion40 on July 27, 2014, 08:03:05 PMI would throw my lot in with Aerosmith. Not my favourite American band, but their longevity and influence cannot be denied.
But a greater influence than Kiss?
I like Kiss, and The Eagles. Neither are my all-time favorite band. But their combination of influence, longevity, and success just pummel all the other current options in my mind. In 15 more years, I'd hope Pearl Jam is in that conversation, but it'll take that long to truly get a sense of their influence.
Point well taken on the Eagles.
According to the Recording Industry Association of America, the Eagles rank #5 on the all-time best selling artists list. After (in order) The Beatles, Elvis Presley, Garth Brooks, and Led Zeppelin. I must note that they are the only American rock band in the top 5, or even the top 10. Aerosmith comes in at #13, tied with the Rolling Stones.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_music_artists_in_the_United_States
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 28, 2014, 10:20:09 PM
A Pixies pit? What happens there? Somebody run up and apply black eyeliner to you a little too roughly?
:2funny:
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 29, 2014, 10:56:01 AM
you ventured as far north at Orlando?!?! Are you trying to become a Yankee or something?
:2funny:
Quote from: bayonetbrant on July 29, 2014, 07:53:41 PM
Please don't think I'm just some Eagles fanboi; I'm just trying to recognize that as "great" American bands go, they're at the top of the conversation with not a lot of peers.
Yep.
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 29, 2014, 09:31:04 PM
given the choice between the Eagles, KISS and Van Halen I'd take Van Halen any day.
Yep. Went to Vegas to see 'em back in '12.
(https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/t1.0-9/564947_10151764745645072_1127505883_n.jpg)
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 28, 2014, 10:20:09 PM
A Pixies pit? What happens there? Somebody run up and apply black eyeliner to you a little too roughly?
while I understand that 'Here Comes Your Man' is the only song of theirs your familiar with there is a lot of harder music in their collection.
The more I ponder it, the more I feel the need to change my vote to the Eagles. Add to that, the individual musical contributions of Eagles members Glenn Fry, Don Henley, Joe Walsh, and Don Felder... well, it's tough to think of an American band that can match them.
Just don't mention Glenn Frey's mid 80s solo stuff...loke Smugglers Blues -shudder-
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 30, 2014, 09:15:14 AM
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on July 28, 2014, 10:20:09 PM
A Pixies pit? What happens there? Somebody run up and apply black eyeliner to you a little too roughly?
while I understand that 'Here Comes Your Man' is the only song of theirs your familiar with there is a lot of harder music in their collection.
I'm sure they do an absolutely riveting cover of "It's Raining Men".
The heat is on...
(sax solo)
Yeah man, that exactly.
Quote from: MetalDog on July 29, 2014, 07:31:01 PM
And while I am at it, Metallica easily crushes The Eagles using those three criteria. They invented a genre of music, thrash. They can charge just as much, if not more, for concert tickets than The Eagles. AND, as a going concern, have recorded and released more albums for longer than Henley and his boys.
Now that those poseurs have been dealt with...what do we do with KISS?
I was wondering when Metallica was going to be mentioned. I figured they had to be sooner or later. If the choice for "greatest" were between them, KISS, and the Eagles, then Metallica gets my vote easily.
But my personal favorite group is almost certainly Alice In Chains. 8)
So does "rock greatness" equate to being the first to help shape/define a genre or niche of that music?
In other words...whomever did it first, does that necessarily make them greater than the bands that follow in their wake?
I'm meaning something like, for example, the grunge movement. Nirvana, Alice in Chains...I remember the story of how the Warrant front man saw the writing on the wall, literally, when one day his record company's studios had the Cherry Pie album poster in the waiting area, then the next, it was Alice In Chains. There were a slew of bands after that, which helped define the genre, and of course that spun off more angles and experimentation.
But when you think of the "greatest bands," oftentimes it's one that started something. I'm saying that just because a band did it first, or was one of the first, doesn't mean they're necessarily the best.
Ok. So I intend to reply to B_C's post about being first. I want to put forward Sabbath as an example. I know they aren't American, but, they are the archetype for metal. I think Metallica has surpassed them and Iron Maiden has at least drawn even and those three bands were going to be the support for first not always being best.
Now. As the Internet often does, it rewards your stream of consciousness searches and this is how it went:
1) I wanted to impress upon everyone how Ozzy and the boys started in the hippie hey day. I just couldn't remember the year
Black Sabbath and
Paranoid came out. So I went to the Sabbath Wiki (it's 1970 for both, by the way).
2) While scanning the Wiki, I saw the lineup of singers from the 80's and 90's after they fired Ozzy. Ian Gillan, of Deep Purple fame, made one album with BS called
Born Again.
3) So I follow the
Born Again Wiki link and read that the tour for said album featured these giant Stonehenge plinths, famously lampooned in
This Is Spinal Tap.
4) I see that 'Trashed,' a song I liked, was the first track of the album and I go to Youtube to hear the song. I find a listing for 'The Official Video,' and as the screen capture looks sufficiently 80's, I pick that one and discover...
...pure AWESOME!!!!!!
youre such a hippy.
we should start a Grogheads band and call it Crusted Sock.
Im thinking we could start off as an Eagle death metal cover band with an acid infused clarinet solo.
I will be one of our drummers. Naturally we should have three in the band.
As far as bands that started something and were the best at it, I think Alice in Chains fits that description, and they still going!
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on July 30, 2014, 10:35:40 PM
Im thinking we could start off as an Eagle death metal cover band with an acid infused clarinet solo.
And then there is the actual Eagles of Death Metal:
"Best" can be such a subjective term.
Is the rock band that won the most awards the best? Is the rock band that sold the most records the best? How about most Billboard Top 10s?
Would Bruce Springsteen or Tom Petty count if you considered them Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band, or Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers?
http://www2.gibson.com/news-lifestyle/features/en-us/top-american-bands-0701-2011.aspx
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/culturepicturegalleries/10558614/10-greatest-American-rock-bands-of-all-time.html
http://www.ranker.com/crowdranked-list/greatest-american-rock-bands
http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2013/01/who-is-the-greatest-american-band-your-updated-list/
http://www.thetoptens.com/best-american-rock-bands/
Quote from: Centurion40 on July 31, 2014, 08:10:57 AM
Would Bruce Springsteen or Tom Petty count if you considered them Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band, or Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers
The dudes that started the whole bit on the radio that inspired this conversation explicitly ruled out Springsteen & Petty as "solo dudes with backing bands"
Springsteen has admitted that it's not really the case for him, but both of them have released significant solo catalogs without their backing bands, lending some credence to the argument that they really are guys in bands that happen to have their names on them.
Quote from: MetalDog on July 30, 2014, 10:25:34 PM
Ok. So I intend to reply to B_C's post about being first. I want to put forward Sabbath as an example. I know they aren't American, but, they are the archetype for metal. I think Metallica has surpassed them and Iron Maiden has at least drawn even and those three bands were going to be the support for first not always being best.
Now. As the Internet often does, it rewards your stream of consciousness searches and this is how it went:
1) I wanted to impress upon everyone how Ozzy and the boys started in the hippie hey day. I just couldn't remember the year Black Sabbath and Paranoid came out. So I went to the Sabbath Wiki (it's 1970 for both, by the way).
2) While scanning the Wiki, I saw the lineup of singers from the 80's and 90's after they fired Ozzy. Ian Gillan, of Deep Purple fame, made one album with BS called Born Again.
3) So I follow the Born Again Wiki link and read that the tour for said album featured these giant Stonehenge plinths, famously lampooned inThis Is Spinal Tap.
4) I see that 'Trashed,' a song I liked, was the first track of the album and I go to Youtube to hear the song. I find a listing for 'The Official Video,' and as the screen capture looks sufficiently 80's, I pick that one and discover...
...pure AWESOME!!!!!!
Hehe, that part was good :)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.skierpage.com%2Fimages%2Fmisc_posts%2Fspinal_tap_stonehenge.jpg&hash=bb9022d4fa7bdd6b5dc07b286a0b68dc701c4b46)
Ozzy's bio, "I Am Ozzy," is pure awesome if you want to read all about how he got started, from being a little thief nicking TVs and the like until he had that fateful knock on his door one day.
Do you hear it in your head as Ozzy's incoherent mumbling when you read it?
Yes, pretty much. What's funny is whomever wrote it for him did it in his voice, so some words are spelled just like you'd hear him say them.
I'll give a couple that were profoundly influential on an entire genre of music:
The Ramones
The Beach Boys
The Eagles
Lynard Skynard
The Ramones established the punk rock sound and part of the rock n' roll dress code (jeans, black leather jackets, chuck taylor tennis shoes). Both the Sex Pistols and the Clash formed after seeing the Ramones.
The Beach Boys - amazingly influential on multiple different types of genre's. Surf music (and surf punk) came from them. They were more popular than the Beatles and the Rolling Stones until Brian Wilson went psycho.
The Eagles - amazingly influential mostly for fusing country music and rock n' roll. They had a distinct sound that has largely been carried forward in pop Country music.
Lynard Skynard - the least influential of the bunch because they were profoundly important for Southern Rock - and admittedly minor music genre.
Entirely reasonable.
Iron Butterfly.
Only because of (1) In-a-gadda-da-vida and (2) it was the first music I brought home that my mom absolutely hated...so naturally I bought all their albums.
Greatest American Rock Band? Of course not, but a soft spot in my heart nonetheless.
i paid money for a Poison album just to annoy my mum
Quote from: undercovergeek on August 11, 2014, 11:08:57 AM
i paid money for a Poison album just to annoy my mum
If Rock and Roll doesn't annoy your mum, you're not doing it right ;D
Quote from: undercovergeek on August 11, 2014, 11:08:57 AM
i paid money for a Poison album just to annoy my mum
At least calling themselves "Poison" wasn't false advertising. :P
As much as I despise Poison and that whole genre (looking at you Motley Crue), Bret Michaels and the boys put on a pretty good show. High energy, lots of hot girls bouncing to the music and a solid two hour set. I was surprised. Two things to note, 1) I was there with a hot chick, which explains my presence and 2) it was the 80's.
whatever faults you might have with most of the 80s LA metal bands, you can't deny those guys worked their asses off on stage. I saw Quiet Riot at a crappy club in Raleigh in '93 that wasn't even half-full, and those guys put on a show worthy of an arena.
Love 'em or hate 'em, Tom Morello gave KISS the hands-down best RnRHoF Induction Speech of all time