The first case of Ebola to be diagnosed in the US was announced today in Texas. The person had no symptoms when he flew from West Africa to Texas, but developed the symptoms a day or two after arriving in the country. He is in a hospital in Dallas being treated.
Yeah. Just saw that one the news.
Was listening to the press conference just now. The problem is that when you're first infected you don't have much of the virus in your body, so it's difficult to detect even with a test.
It's a stealth virus that may appear almost anywhere.
is it time for dustin hoffman yet
Tootsie?
snort
thankyou for that - its been a long day
Don't make me break out the rheesus monkey.
arent you the sites rheesus monkey?
what's that about spanking the monkey.
our work here is done
deadly disease to gus masturbating in 6
<<applause>>
I am the site's rheesus monkey but ebola is not explicitly mentioned in the contract.
Quote from: Gusington on September 30, 2014, 07:09:39 PM
I am the site's rheesus monkey but ebola is not explicitly mentioned in the contract.
page 3, paragraph 5, sentence #3:
"Any diseases caught during the completion or fulfillment of your job as Gus are not the fault of Grogheads or its staff, moderators or forum users."
to be fair we were thinking crabs or herpies when we put that in there.
Quote from: undercovergeek on September 30, 2014, 06:44:56 PM
our work here is done
deadly disease to gus masturbating in 6
<<applause>>
Sometimes we outdo ourselves around here O0
Leaked photo released from Gus's last "weekend" out with the troops, using his new E-2 status to full effect on his squad's E-1s:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.telegraph.co.uk%2Fmultimedia%2Farchive%2F01884%2Fmonkey-scratch_1884031i.jpg&hash=175cc7181590df219416a066c7b5fd09e1166528)
Clearly I am not pictured there. I have far less hair.
everyone does before they meet Smuck.
That's the bald truth.
^ Okay, I can't even get mad at that one. That was actually pretty good.
<slow clap for Bawb>Quote from: GDS_Starfury on September 30, 2014, 07:55:19 PM
Quote from: Gusington on September 30, 2014, 07:09:39 PM
I am the site's rheesus monkey but ebola is not explicitly mentioned in the contract.
page 3, paragraph 5, sentence #3:
"Any diseases caught during the completion or fulfillment of your job as Gus are not the fault of Grogheads or its staff, moderators or forum users."
to be fair we were thinking crabs or herpies when we put that in there.
Bwahahaha!!
Brilliant,
Star. Simply brilliant. 8)
danke
my mental anguish now involves singing Lola when I hear ebola and switching out the words. :-\
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on October 01, 2014, 05:53:59 PM
my mental anguish now involves singing Lola when I hear ebola and switching out the words. :-\
Ha...well I've been doing THAT all freakin' day. :uglystupid2:
if your thinking like me then you ought see a therapist straight away.
Thanks Star.
E bo la LALALA E bo la LALALA E BO LA
I'm sure I can rewrite the whole song with diseased lyrics given a few minutes.
as long as theres air guitar its alright
Her name was Ebola
She was a dis-ease
With reddish blood in their hair
And their phlegm dripping down to there
She would vomit pro-fuse-ly, and do the mont-eh-zu-ma cha-cha
And while she drove to the hospital in her car
Ebola bled her out by far
Across the crowded street, the ER worked her from 8 til 4
They were young and deader than doornails
Who could ask for more?
At the E-bol-a...(EEee!) E-bol-a vi-rus...
The hottest fevers north of Ha-vah-nah...
At the E-bol-a...E-bol-a viiiii-ruuuuuus...
Bleeding eyeballs and anuses were always in fashion
At the E-bol-a...they fell in a co-maaaa....
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on October 01, 2014, 06:12:29 PM
if your thinking like me then you ought see a therapist straight away.
Case in point: see above. :D
I went to the bar and met an african chick
wouldnt ya know the bitch got me sick
with ebolaaaa
e b o l a ebolaaaa
"Ebola in the USA" does sound like the title of a Mellencamp song.
uhhhh.... You mean Springsteen?
No, that's a John Cougar Mellencamp song - R-O-C-K in the U-S-A.
Yeah get you more mature 'Murican rockers in order, people.
Freelance NBC cameraman returning this morning to Nebraska from Liberia, with Ebola.
I wonder when "they" will ban all travel from countries known to be Ebola exporters.
Quote from: JasonPratt on October 08, 2014, 02:11:06 PM
Freelance NBC cameraman returning this morning to Nebraska from Liberia, with Ebola.
Hoo boy. Not good. Hope he's OK.
I can't help but hum a certain Doors song to myself for the last few weeks.
QuoteAn afternoon news conference has been called in Frisco, a suburb of Dallas, to discuss a possible second case of Ebola.
According to a statement from the City of Frisco, the patient claims to have had contact with Thomas Eric Duncan, referred to as Dallas 'patient zero.'
It is not clear how the patient had contact with Duncan or if the patient was one of the about 50 people being monitored by federal, state and local health officials.
source: http://dfw.cbslocal.com/?lead=frisco-patient-exhibiting-ebola-symptoms
Dude in Dallas with Ebola died today.
http://www.usatoday.com/media/cinematic/video/16912869/us-ebola-patient-dies-latest-developments-on-virus-usa-now/
QuoteIf Ebola reaches South America, the U.S. border will be swamped by a huge wave of terrified migrants, says a top military commander.
"If it breaks out, it's literally, 'Katie bar the door,' and there will be mass migration into the United States," Marine Corps Gen. John F. Kelly, chief of U.S. Southern Command, said Tuesday at a speech in Washington, D.C.
"They will run away from Ebola, or if they suspect they are infected, they will try to get to the United States for treatment," he said at National Defense University.
source: http://dailycaller.com/2014/10/08/ebola-could-trigger-huge-migration-into-the-us-says-top-general/
This sucks. I hope he doesn't have it.
QuoteFirst responders have transported a Dallas County Sheriff's deputy to Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital to be monitored for Ebola as a precaution.
The patient, Michael Monnig, was transported from a Frisco Care Now facility where he was complaining of "stomach issues," according to sources.
Monnig's children told CBS 11's Andrea Lucia that their dad woke up this morning feeling sore and a little nauseated.
source: http://dfw.cbslocal.com/?lead=frisco-patient-exhibiting-ebola-symptoms
I can't decide if this is the beginning of the apocalypse, or if it's just sensationalism and fear-mongering.
Sadly I don't know enough about infectious diseases to make an informed decision on this one.
And this is not a queue-up for Starfury, I assure you. >:(
I think there are now 3 infectious diseases in Florida.
ebola, something thats killed a kid and something I cant remember.
I want to move back to Texas.
Quote from: Toonces on October 08, 2014, 09:43:38 PM
I can't decide if this is the beginning of the apocalypse, or if it's just sensationalism and fear-mongering.
Sadly I don't know enough about infectious diseases to make an informed decision on this one.
And this is not a queue-up for Starfury, I assure you. >:(
It's a bit of both.
The problem is that most everyone in the govt & CDC is poo-pooing the danger, and yet it seems like little by little, more people are getting sick.
We're headed into cold and flu season. I already have a cold. Ebola's symptoms are initially the same as the flu. It's not supposed to be easy to get. But it isn't easy to detect until it's well underway, either.
You do the math.
Maybe we should be calling Ebola "Captain Trips" and start stocking up on milkyway bars.
I'm about ready to panic.
Quote from: Staggerwing on October 09, 2014, 05:16:13 AM
Maybe we should be calling Ebola "Captain Trips"
Isn't it just?
So if this is the apocalypse, do I need to buy a gun finally?
yes
All you really need for a real shit storm is one of these people infecting someone who works in a meat processing plant of any kind. Guy cuts himself for instance, gets a drop into a giant vat of ground beef. The plants intentionally mix the meat of 1000s of animals so it is hard to trace.
We need to get to robotic meat processing.
Free kindle book (fiction) on ebola. I just noticed it. SUB .com for .ca if required.
http://www.amazon.ca/Ebola-Terrorism-Thriller-Bobby-Adair-ebook/dp/B00NEDGH5C/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1412917472&sr=1-1
Sounds creepy.
Quote from: Toonces on October 09, 2014, 09:03:05 PM
So if this is the apocalypse, do I need to buy a gun finally?
Hard to say. You're in the Navy. They seem to have no shortage of small arms. Stick with them and you should get one for free.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 10, 2014, 12:08:07 AM
Free kindle book (fiction) on ebola. I just noticed it. SUB .com for .ca if required.
http://www.amazon.ca/Ebola-Terrorism-Thriller-Bobby-Adair-ebook/dp/B00NEDGH5C/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1412917472&sr=1-1
Sounds creepy.
Didn't one of Tom Clancy's books have a plot about making Ebola into a aerosol to spread it around NY or something? They had a large group of people held captive and were "growing" Ebola in a camp In Africa somewhere....
Quote from: Barthheart on October 10, 2014, 10:34:39 AM
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 10, 2014, 12:08:07 AM
Free kindle book (fiction) on ebola. I just noticed it. SUB .com for .ca if required.
http://www.amazon.ca/Ebola-Terrorism-Thriller-Bobby-Adair-ebook/dp/B00NEDGH5C/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1412917472&sr=1-1
Sounds creepy.
Didn't one of Tom Clancy's books have a plot about making Ebola into a aerosol to spread it around NY or something? They had a large group of people held captive and were "growing" Ebola in a camp In Africa somewhere....
Rainbow 6
Actually, Executive Orders is the one you're describing. The Iranians usean Ebola strain as a bioweapon to attack the US. Rainbow 6 was the follow-on. Eco-terrorists created an airborne strain and attempted to wipe out most of the human race.
In the Clancy book, the aerosol was sprayed at the Olympics in Australia, then spread around the world. I think it was Rainbow 6. Cant remember if the team shut them down. I will have to reread it. I thought it was one of the better books.
You also realize it all starts with the chicken Terminators we design to get infectious people out of the loop. Then it is bigger Terminators for larger animals. Then....
Skynet?
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 10, 2014, 12:59:03 PM
In the Clancy book, the aerosol was sprayed at the Olympics in Australia, then spread around the world. I think it was Rainbow 6. Cant remember if the team shut them down. I will have to reread it. I thought it was one of the better books.
They stop it from happening in Rainbow. In Executive Orders there is a national outbreak, but it burns itself out. The strain used is too deadly and can't spread quickly enough.
Yes. I can see it now, one legged Gramps telling the story of working with the chicken Terminators. "They started getting lippy. I got fed up with it, giving one a kick. The little bastard wrung my leg at the knee."
Tom Clancy, the prophet of our age...
If someone gets Ebola, I would think the first line of defense is to consume...
...Ebola chicken soup!
Amirite?
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.prosportsdaily.com%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Fpsdlakerland2.gif&hash=f3b3610a373d473dab520df5aaaad691505730c4)
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on October 10, 2014, 04:01:38 PM
If someone gets Ebola, I would think the first line of defense is to consume...
...Ebola chicken soup!
Amirite?
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.prosportsdaily.com%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Fpsdlakerland2.gif&hash=f3b3610a373d473dab520df5aaaad691505730c4)
well fucking played!!!
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fgifatron.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F05%2Ftaxi-drive-clap.gif&hash=a5e299c533b63ee856b2a9ee5bb7bd318388e833)
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on October 10, 2014, 04:01:38 PM
If someone gets Ebola, I would think the first line of defense is to consume...
...Ebola chicken soup!
Amirite?
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.prosportsdaily.com%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Fpsdlakerland2.gif&hash=f3b3610a373d473dab520df5aaaad691505730c4)
I like it. With gobetti pasta.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fde.barilla.com%2Fexport%2Fsites%2Fde.barilla%2FProdukte%2Fpasta%2FKlassische_Sorten%2Fimg%2Fclassici-gobbetti-formato.png&hash=b2248ad47c6f4d248fb0dadb429a37ce5f8e1662)
Incidentally, Rainbow Six, like a few other Clancy story elements, is borrowed pretty directly from Don Pendleton novels about Mack Bolan the Executioner, specifically the first team-up novel between Bolan, the Phoenix Force (foreign anti-terrorist team whom Rainbow 6 is patterned after, with "John Clark" being a strong expy of Mack Bolan, who was involved in starting the team as John Phoenix) and Able Team (originally Vietnam A-Team expy with personal ties to Bolan, who started a private investigation company but were drafted into the Stony Man group to fight domestic terrorism) -- they all get together to stop a Malthusian cult dedicated to using an engineered virus to wipe out 99% of the human race, and have a big showdown at the cult's base in South America.
So credit where it's due: Pendleton (or rather his ghostwriter, maybe, though he's credited with it) wrote it first in Stony Man Doctrine.
Bolan and Stony Man Team novels are still being released several times a year, by the way, and Bradley Cooper was picked up earlier this year to play Mack Bolan in a forthcoming movie -- or so says Wikipedia; I hadn't heard of that yet. But my brother and I grew up reading the series, though I only ever really cared for the Phoenix Force branch, so when "John Clark" was introduced in Clancy's novels I picked up on who he was 'supposed to be' pretty quickly. ;) (Ditto the Punisher, Marvel's expy of the character!) Though I was surprised how far Clancy eventually took it, with the Without Remorse and Rainbow 6 novels!
I dropped out of the Clancy series after The Teeth of the Tiger, which I never did read; I see the Ryanverse books have continued on into this year (next to be released in Dec), though now written by one of his collaborators of course.
I am convinced the two posts to support that terrible Ebola joke were only positive thanks to bouncing Asian breastiges.
But that's okay. I will sleep fine tonight.
I told that joke at a party tonight and everyone loved it!
except the dipshit chick who never gets anything.
I seriously hope people take this as a wakeup call to put funding into infectious disease containment over the stupid scan/ grope fiasco. Terrorists may kill a few people, infectious disease can wipe out large %ages of the world population. Emergency response really has to have it's shit together for flues and other nasties.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg4.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20110712001813%2Fvillains%2Fimages%2Fd%2Fdc%2FMelty-toht.gif&hash=0497f0fb66f0b738337a9cba5fdf21456da7ef09)
a local radio host put it this way today an Im pretty hard pressed to not agree.
in the US last week there were 2 cases of ebola and one of them died.
how many people in the same geographic sphere died from the common flu in the same time period?
how many died from car accidents?
how many died from violent crime?
it might be true that more people died last week from an undiagnosed std like syphilis then died from ebola.
another great job by current news outlets.
^ There are significant flaws in your argument, but I'm too drunk to point them out. Something about Ebola being infectious, deadly to anyone who gets it, and with no known immunization or cure. Something like that.
and Meg wasnt even wearing a big watch.
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on October 11, 2014, 01:23:24 AM
how many people in the same geographic sphere died from the common flu in the same time period?
how many died from car accidents?
how many died from violent crime?
against flu (the real flu not the 'cold') there is a preemptive vaccine-shot every autumn ...but a lot of people don't went for it, even when its free (like here)
car accidents don't spread, well ...violent crimes only when the critical mass 'of anarchy' is reached ;)
let's shut down fast private travel options to/from those African countries
and never ever get a ill person for treatment on a plane and rest of world is safe (the UN + NGOs can set up shop down there for there in-country privileged staff) so the rest o world is safe ....until the virus may mutate or not
and stay away from cheap hookers who love to cater to far-traveling black boys ...the semen-fluid of Ebola survivors stays infectious for up to several month (test after 49 days was positive)
Quote from: MikeGER on October 11, 2014, 02:40:53 AM
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on October 11, 2014, 01:23:24 AM
how many people in the same geographic sphere died from the common flu in the same time period?
how many died from car accidents?
how many died from violent crime?
against flu (the real flu not the 'cold') there is a preemptive vaccine-shot every autumn ...but a lot of people don't went for it, even when its free (like here)
car accidents don't spread, well ...violent crimes only when the critical mass 'of anarchy' is reached ;)
let's shut down fast private travel options to/from those African countries
and never ever get a ill person for treatment on a plane and rest of world is safe (the UN + NGOs can set up shop down there for there in-country privileged staff) so the rest o world is safe ....until the virus may mutate or not
and stay away from cheap hookers who love to cater to far-traveling black boys ...the semen-fluid of Ebola survivors stays infectious for up to several month (test after 49 days was positive)
If this were a routine disease like the flu, I'd agree with you, Mike.
However, governments do not break out the hazmat suits for the common cold or the flu. Ebola is different.
The measures you cite sound good, but the guy who just died in TX demonstrated that what looks great on paper doesn't necessarily translate into a reality:
First, the guy reported to a hospital, advised them he was ill and from W Africa. They turned him away. Second, one of the first responders appears to have contracted it. Third, the ambulance that transported him wasn't sterilized until half a dozen more patients were transported in it.
Ebola is not "just another disease."
I may be behind on the news reports but I was under the impression that only one other patient rode in that ambulance who is now in isolation and that no health care workers are sick after coming in contact with Duncan. The situation with the ambulance and nurse with Ebola seems to match what happened in Spain where there is also an Ebola patient (a priest returning from W. Africa) who recently died. It was the first reported Ebols incident in Europe and the ambulance used to transport the (later) deceased patient was used on (iirc) 7 more runs before being taken out of service.
^Spoke too soon. Texas Dept of State Health Services just reported one of the folks who cared for patient Duncan has tested positive:
https://www.dshs.state.tx.us/news/releases/20141012.aspx
The nurse in Spain who cared for the priest from West Africa is still in serious condition but showing signs of improvement. Word is that the Spanish Gov't was able to procure a course of the very rare experimental anti-ebola drug ZMapp for her.
Saw that. The CDC says there was a "clear breach of protocol" when he handled the patient.
Problem is, we're a 1st world nation and that was a hospital which knew it was handling a potential case.
Human error, and the fact that some caregivers may not know what they're dealing with until too late is what makes this a huge potential problem.
Quote from: LongBlade on October 12, 2014, 09:55:23 AM
Saw that. The CDC says there was a "clear breach of protocol" when he handled the patient.
Problem is, we're a 1st world nation and that was a hospital which knew it was handling a potential case.
Human error, and the fact that some caregivers may not know what they're dealing with until too late is what makes this a huge potential problem.
I agree. Even if it isn't, it is a practice run for the inevitable future outbreak of something.
Something that is not really being discussed, is the possibility of an ebola virus reservoir being established in some animal species in the US. It is believed that fruit bats are the largest reservoir in Africa; they are just carriers and not affected by the virus (there are five strains of the virus). Primates do carry the virus but do become sick and die. The virus has not been detected in a lot of animals, but has been detected in dogs, pigs and horses according to the information I have seen. So is this something we should worry about?
Quote from: Labbug on October 12, 2014, 03:57:32 PM
Something that is not really being discussed, is the possibility of an ebola virus reservoir being established in some animal species in the US. It is believed that fruit bats are the largest reservoir in Africa; they are just carriers and not affected by the virus (there are five strains of the virus). Primates do carry the virus but do become sick and die. The virus has not been detected in a lot of animals, but has been detected in dogs, pigs and horses according to the information I have seen. So is this something we should worry about?
Yup.
I did hear they euthanized that Spanish nurse's dog. Sad, but probably a good idea.
I've also heard of the danger of pockets developing in 3rd world countries in South America, but hadn't heard the suggestion that it might enter the fauna in these parts. Good call. Bad deal for us.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthechive.files.wordpress.com%2F2014%2F10%2Fdar-today-24.jpg&hash=3fbc8e1b67b2a8149efd316299e42a95c2c914b5)
Not good at all
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/16/us/ebola-outbreak-texas.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=HpSum&module=span-ab-lede-package-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
No... that's very bad in fact.
Who the hell is running things down there? It's not like it's happening the back woods somewhere, this is supposed to be the world's most technologically advance nation and so far that are operating at the same level as West Africa!?! :o
The CDC has written up well defined ways of dealing with viruses and it appears that these guidelines are not being followed. WTF?!?
Nurse has been IDed. She just flew from Ohio to Texas on Monday. CDC is asking everyone on the flight to call in
http://news.yahoo.com/ebola-diagnosed-in-second-dallas-nurse-105542930.html
Quote from: Barthheart on October 15, 2014, 10:48:49 AM
.. this is supposed to be the world's most technologically advance nation
2 of 5 space shuttles exploded after summed up 135 uses ;)
But that's just the point. This isn't rocket science. The only transmission path for ebola is fluid transfer. And that has to be one of the easiest things to protect against in a hospital.
Some people in emergency work don't take PPE seriously, or half-ass it. I never did. One time I transported a patient with chickenpox, and I couldn't recall if I ever had it or not. I chose to err on the side of caution and put on the full protective gear. Didn't get it. I had the varicella vaccine when I was a toddler, but still, it never hurts to be prepared. Many EMTs were VERY anal about bodily fluids (including me), but some just couldn't give two sh!ts about it.
I guarantee there will be a ripple effect throughout the community and healthcare people will change any such lackadaisical attitude damn fast.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fkookiekitsch.com%2FPortals%2F0%2Fproductimages%2F3383_13c8e.jpg&hash=e72dc3ca341da7e3031c5adc42a46b9b46284936)
Ebola is easy to identify ...even has a tag ;-)
Quote from: Barthheart on October 15, 2014, 11:29:16 AM
But that's just the point. This isn't rocket science. The only transmission path for ebola is fluid transfer. And that has to be one of the easiest things to protect against in a hospital.
According to an article I was reading yesterday posted on a science news site (I'll have to go back and dig for the article) there is at least one incident of animals in separate pens (pigs in one, monkeys in another) in which ebola traveled from the monkey pen to the pig enclosure, infecting the pigs. The animals were far enough apart that fluid transfer is considered unlikely. The working theory is that the virus spread via monkey sneezes, remaining airborne long enough to travel to the pig pen and do it's work. The CDC has apparently hemmed and hawed over the possibility of ebola being airborne in any fashion. It's apparently not airbourne in the classic Captain Trips scenario, but the virus itself is said to remain viable and be able to infect for 3-4 hours after being discharged.
Considering our Keystone Kops response to ebola being in America so far, I'm fairly concerned as to how we react going forward here.
Quote from: Steelgrave on October 15, 2014, 12:35:02 PM
Quote from: Barthheart on October 15, 2014, 11:29:16 AM
But that's just the point. This isn't rocket science. The only transmission path for ebola is fluid transfer. And that has to be one of the easiest things to protect against in a hospital.
According to an article I was reading yesterday posted on a science news site (I'll have to go back and dig for the article) there is at least one incident of animals in separate pens (pigs in one, monkeys in another) in which ebola traveled from the monkey pen to the pig enclosure, infecting the pigs. The animals were far enough apart that fluid transfer is considered unlikely. The working theory is that the virus spread via monkey sneezes, remaining airborne long enough to travel to the pig pen and do it's work. The CDC has apparently hemmed and hawed over the possibility of ebola being airborne in any fashion. It's apparently not airbourne in the classic Captain Trips scenario, but the virus itself is said to remain viable and be able to infect for 3-4 hours after being discharged.
Considering our Keystone Kops response to ebola being in America so far, I'm fairly concerned as to how we react going forward here.
I, for one, am heartened that we have a huge database recording every electronic communication made by every American. We've never been safer from terrorism ::)
An employee here heard on the news last night that the CDC now estimates up to ten thousand new Ebola cases a week in the US by December.
That isn't exactly flu level, but flu doesn't have a 60% chance of killing you despite treatment (and a near 100% without treatment).
Quote from: JasonPratt on October 15, 2014, 03:42:18 PM
An employee here heard on the news last night that the CDC now estimates up to ten thousand new Ebola cases a week in the US by December.
That isn't exactly flu level, but flu doesn't have a 60% chance of killing you despite treatment (and a near 100% without treatment).
Wow, thats how bad rumours get started.
That figure is for Africa, NOT!!!!!, the US of A.
Chicken pox almost killed me when I was sixteen...it. was no joke.
I read in The Economist and in Time that by January there could be 1m plus cases of Ebola in W. Africa.
It is so serious that The Wife has given me the ok to purchase a firearm...seriously.
Quote from: Gusington on October 15, 2014, 06:23:49 PM
It is so serious that The Wife has given me the ok to purchase a firearm...seriously.
Being in New York that means you can get one of these:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gazettenet.com%2Fcsp%2Fmediapool%2Fsites%2Fdt.common.streams.StreamServer.cls%3FSTREAMOID%3Dw8lNKH6l5lmP9oWysl5m5M%24daE2N3K4ZzOUsqbU5sYuF67sl_oigWlYov0dEoPstWCsjLu883Ygn4B49Lvm9bPe2QeMKQdVeZmXF%249l%244uCZ8QDXhaHEp3rvzXRJFdy0KqPHLoMevcTLo3h8xh70Y6N_U_CryOsw6FTOdKL_jpQ-%26amp%3BCONTENTTYPE%3Dimage%2Fjpeg&hash=61c79bde17e63d87fa208b89b017fc9b1cd7f43b)
Nothing a little Naval Jelly won't fix...
Quote from: mirth on October 15, 2014, 11:20:53 AM
Nurse has been IDed. She just flew from Ohio to Texas on Monday. CDC is asking everyone on the flight to call in
http://news.yahoo.com/ebola-diagnosed-in-second-dallas-nurse-105542930.html
I would think getting on a plane after treating an ebola patient, knowing you got a fever, is potential mass murder. Actually, just being in the airport puts you in contact with enough people that it is a problem.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 15, 2014, 09:50:57 PM
Quote from: mirth on October 15, 2014, 11:20:53 AM
Nurse has been IDed. She just flew from Ohio to Texas on Monday. CDC is asking everyone on the flight to call in
http://news.yahoo.com/ebola-diagnosed-in-second-dallas-nurse-105542930.html
I would think getting on a plane after treating an ebola patient, knowing you got a fever, is potential mass murder. Actually, just being in the airport puts you in contact with enough people that it is a problem.
Strike that first line. I just saw a report from earlier to night that she did have a low-grade fever on the plane.
According to the news reports I have seen she was symptom free on the plane.After she landed she had several hours where she was symptom free.
Within 90 minutes of showing signs (mild fever) she was hospitalized and quarantined.
The CDC has since issued guidelines advising caregivers potentially exposed to the virus to not fly.
Just arrived in DC yesterday for sightseeing. Watching this stuff on the news while in DC with my wife this morning. Glad Im not flying anywhere at the moment. Driving back to NYC tomorrow and back to Montreal the weekend.
Quote from: Gusington on October 15, 2014, 06:23:49 PM
....by January there could be 1m plus cases of Ebola in W. Africa.
It is so serious that The Wife has given me the ok to purchase a firearm...seriously.
...that is just making use of the exponential function.
the math is very simple, the number of cases (in Libera, Sierra Leone and Guinea) are doubling every 3 to 4 weeks
12 Oct 9000 cases 4500 victims
Mike's prediction on cases (people who actual have and summed up those who have had Ebola)
12 Nov 18000
12 Dec 36000
12 Jan 72000
...
the intersting fact: its mostly contained to those three countries above and didn't spread into the neighbouring countries, so if we are not so stupid to fly Ebola patients all around the world in every country ..it will stay there and fizzle after some time.
Gus, get the guns(s) before your OKW retake the order ;)
Quote from: MikeGER on October 16, 2014, 03:27:18 AM
the intersting fact: its mostly contained to those three countries above and didn't spread into the neighbouring countries, so if we are not so stupid to fly Ebola patients all around the world in every country ..it will stay there and fizzle after some time.
This reminds me of a forest fire and the fire line.
Firefighters create a no-burn-zone called a fire line over which a fire cannot jump.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jrtc-polk.army.mil%2Fenvironmental_compliance%2FForestry%2FPatrollingFireline.jpg&hash=197f48c09979c8b3167a4ed4b3c4439d65a41f98)
Except...fires jump fire lines.
The infected nurse on that plane potentially exposed not only the passengers (and crew) on her immediate flight, but also passengers who subsequently boarded the plane until it was cleaned.
I'm hoping that she didn't spread it further. But this is how it spreads out of control.
Humans have a strange way of not doing the predictable.
Don't these folks play the Plauge game? The fastest way to spread a killer virus is air travel. Ships would be a distance second. If you have an epidemic like this you need to stop all air travel out of the hot zone. Fly in supplies, meds, doctors, etc., but nobody leaves without a 21 day quarantine. Not rocket science. :tickedoff:
Quote from: Windigo on October 15, 2014, 04:11:25 PM
Wow, thats how bad rumours get started. That figure is for Africa, NOT!!!!!, the US of A.
Oh, good, whew... though I thought that figure was already up to that point in Africa as a whole.
Also, why does your kitten avatar gif not work anymore? Because that one was adorable. :) Edit: never mind, my computer apparently caught up.
Quote from: LongBlade on October 15, 2014, 09:54:13 PM
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 15, 2014, 09:50:57 PM
Quote from: mirth on October 15, 2014, 11:20:53 AM
Nurse has been IDed. She just flew from Ohio to Texas on Monday. CDC is asking everyone on the flight to call in
http://news.yahoo.com/ebola-diagnosed-in-second-dallas-nurse-105542930.html
I would think getting on a plane after treating an ebola patient, knowing you got a fever, is potential mass murder. Actually, just being in the airport puts you in contact with enough people that it is a problem.
Strike that first line. I just saw a report from earlier to night that she did have a low-grade fever on the plane.
According to the news reports I have seen she was symptom free on the plane.
After she landed she had several hours where she was symptom free.
Within 90 minutes of showing signs (mild fever) she was hospitalized and quarantined.
The CDC has since issued guidelines advising caregivers potentially exposed to the virus to not fly.
Per Mom (a more reliable reporter of the news than the guys at work yesterday ;) ), the CDC admitted this morning that the nurse called in reporting the low grade fever asking whether she ought to stay or if it was okay to go, and someone at the CDC said, sure go ahead, no problem, board the plane and fly.
:uglystupid2:
YOU HAD ONE JOB, CDC,
ONE JOB!
Whomever allowed her to fly should be brought up on charges of reckless endangerment.
Quote from: Capn Darwin on October 16, 2014, 07:19:37 AM
Don't these folks play the Plauge game? The fastest way to spread a killer virus is air travel. Ships would be a distance second. If you have an epidemic like this you need to stop all air travel out of the hot zone. Fly in supplies, meds, doctors, etc., but nobody leaves without a 21 day quarantine. Not rocket science. :tickedoff:
+1
there is a jet as we speak sat at madrid airport with 180 french people on board, Spanish authorities wont let them get off due to suspect passenger - my only doubts are, surely in four hours thats going to be 180 suspect passengers
Quote from: undercovergeek on October 16, 2014, 09:23:20 AM
Quote from: Capn Darwin on October 16, 2014, 07:19:37 AM
Don't these folks play the Plauge game? The fastest way to spread a killer virus is air travel. Ships would be a distance second. If you have an epidemic like this you need to stop all air travel out of the hot zone. Fly in supplies, meds, doctors, etc., but nobody leaves without a 21 day quarantine. Not rocket science. :tickedoff:
+1
there is a jet as we speak sat at madrid airport with 180 french people on board, Spanish authorities wont let them get off due to suspect passenger - my only doubts are, surely in four hours thats going to be 180 suspect passengers
Only if the suspect goes around kissing or licking or sneezing on everyone in the plane. Lock the suspect in the bathroom. Still not rocket science..... :tickedoff:
Quote from: Barthheart on October 16, 2014, 09:46:15 AM
Only if the suspect goes around kissing or licking or sneezing on everyone in the plane. Lock the suspect in the bathroom. Still not rocket science..... :tickedoff:
theres a film in there somewhere, and Star would be the director
Well, this isn't exactly reassuring.
QuoteBut perhaps the most chilling notion came from Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Martin Dempsey, who said on Wednesday that he is concerned the virus could become airborne.
"If you bring two doctors who happen to have that specialty into a room, one will say, 'No, there is no way it will ever become airborne, but it could mutate so it could be harder to discover,'" he told CNN.
"Then it will be an extraordinarily serious problem," he said. "I don't know who is right. I don't want to take that chance, so I am taking it very seriously."
source: http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2014/10/15/whether_there_s_an_ebola_outbreak_in_the_us_depends_on_the_definition_of_outbreak?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_term=*Situation%20Report&utm_campaign=SitRep1016
A friend of mine on Facebook, who is a doctor in NYC, just posted this to FB:
QuoteQUESTIONS TO ASK YOUR LOCAL CDC REPRESENTATIVE
1. Will there be representatives from the CDC on-site to instruct the ancillary staff in proper personal protection equipment use?
2. How many approved isolation rooms are at this hospital?
3. Are there sufficient supplies to provide supportive care for twenty-five Ebola admissions? Fifty? A hundred?
4. Is there any on-site Brincidofovir? Is there any on-site ZMapp?
5. What are the criteria for initiating transfer to Emory, Nebraska, the NIH or Montana?
6. What are the means for transferring those patients? Are there equpped transports? Are the EMS and paramedics trained in personal protection protocols? What's the protocol for cleaning the transports afterwards? What's the protocol for cleaning the rooms, furniture and bedding afterwards?
7. What are the protocols for quarantining the families, neighbors and caregivers of the ill? If there isn't one, why isn't there one?
8. More to the point: are there hard, committed and detailed plans for the containment, care, and transfer of those we are suspected to be ill and their close contacts? Has this plan been explained to those people who need to recognize when conditions warrant those plans being initiated? Has this plan been explained to those people who must perform critical actions within those plans and who hold roles within them? Has the presence of adequate supplies for the enactment of these plans been assured? Has the ability to secure additional supplies on short notice been established?
9. Are you maybe starting to take seriously the idea of Ebola in the United States, you incompetent mealymouthed professionally placating fucking sons of bitches?
#4 "Brincidofovir" sounds like a Tolkien character.
#9 He should watch his language. That isn't nearly harsh enough.
Quote from: LongBlade on October 16, 2014, 10:30:48 AM
#4 "Brincidofovir" sounds like a Tolkien character.
It's much worse - it's an experimental drug used against a number of diseases, including Ebola.
Quote from: LongBlade on October 16, 2014, 10:30:48 AM
#9 He should watch his language. That isn't nearly harsh enough.
True, but he's absolutely correct. People are way too f@cking PC and will remain so until it is far too late.
The republican candidate for Governor here in NY was talking about how PC-ness will help Ebola spread and attacked our Governor Cuomo for being to PC to block travel from West Africa.
The problem in west Africa needs to be put under control. If not, sooner or later, somehow the virus can get transported to another country that does not have the resources or infrastructure to deal with Ebola, and then those countries could be overloaded and people would flee. A bad case for The Western Hemisphere would be Haiti.
Quote from: endfire79 on October 16, 2014, 08:03:12 PM
The problem in west Africa needs to be put under control. If not, sooner or later, somehow the virus can get transported to another country that does not have the resources or infrastructure to deal with Ebola, and then those countries could be overloaded and people would attempt to flee to neighbouring countries. A bad case for The Western Hemisphere would be Haiti.
Or Cairo for the Middle East.
I'm going to Vegas in a couple of weeks and am NOT looking forward to flying there now with this sh!t going down.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on October 16, 2014, 08:25:16 PM
I'm going to Vegas in a couple of weeks and am NOT looking forward to flying there now with this sh!t going down.
Maybe the appropriate jungle medicine would be to make a voodoo doll of yourself, then was it in disinfectant when you arrive. Then again when you get home.
Quote from: endfire79 on October 16, 2014, 08:03:12 PM
The problem in west Africa needs to be put under control. If not, sooner or later, somehow the virus can get transported to another country that does not have the resources or infrastructure to deal with Ebola, and then those countries could be overloaded and people would flee. A bad case for The Western Hemisphere would be Haiti.
Good point. Unless all travel out of those countries is blocked, it inevitably will spread.
^Thus the PC issue.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 16, 2014, 08:56:03 PM
Quote from: endfire79 on October 16, 2014, 08:03:12 PM
The problem in west Africa needs to be put under control. If not, sooner or later, somehow the virus can get transported to another country that does not have the resources or infrastructure to deal with Ebola, and then those countries could be overloaded and people would flee. A bad case for The Western Hemisphere would be Haiti.
Good point. Unless all travel out of those countries is blocked, it inevitably will spread.
One of the guys from the CDC made a faux pas today.
He indicated that US borders should remain open so we can track immigrants.
Implied in that is the fact that if they slip through the Mexican border (or Canadian for that matter) we'll never be able to track them.
Seems like gaining control of our borders would make sense...to everyone but the administration. :uglystupid2:
^There's that pesky PC issue again. Maybe this will be the start of the pendulum swinging back to sanity?
Quote from: endfire79 on October 16, 2014, 08:03:12 PM
The problem in west Africa needs to be put under control.
I really only have one go to, sure fire tool for all really bad things and places:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstream1.gifsoup.com%2Fview5%2F4082083%2Ftrident-missile-launch-o.gif&hash=2cd12e96a1e0d9140e03bed191e88ddf60769fc3)
and screw the pc sheep.
US Navy FTW! 8)
guy at work found this
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/1022085-ebola-caused-by-red-cross-shots-more-conspiracy-theories-emerge/
Quote from: undercovergeek on October 17, 2014, 03:35:47 AM
guy at work found this
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/1022085-ebola-caused-by-red-cross-shots-more-conspiracy-theories-emerge/
Ummmm.... yeah..... sure.... :uglystupid2:
^ That WOULD solve this issue. Though it would create new ones.
I worry about some of my company's projects out there...we have lots of power projects across Africa. Not good for the guys working there, nor for the business in general.
Ignorance combined with poverty is always the biggest killer. I saw this on Reuters today from Monrovia Liberia. People lack electricity and this newspaper gets its biggest draw from chalkboards. That's not holding back their little disinformation campaigns however...
A long article on hazmat suits.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/abby-norman/im-a-hazmat-trained-hospi_b_5998486.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592
(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10712765_861507393909391_4745802329745189757_n.jpg?oh=84fa101042290fc6e5ff4caa3ffcf83c&oe=54BE47F2)
That Huffington Post article is really good.
This article in The Economist is pretty good, and frightening.
http://www.economist.com/news/international/21625813-ebola-epidemic-west-africa-poses-catastrophic-threat-region-and-could-yet
I'm kind of having an Ebola education night.
This is a very interesting piece. The video is extremely depressing.
http://news.yahoo.com/fighting-ebola-street-by-street-video-154723494.html
Im having ebola cereal.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi0.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Fnewsfeed%2F000%2F808%2F132%2F0c6.jpg&hash=0185f2e010fe9742ec845fd2b52dc7aba7002772)
^HAHAHA
Quote from: Toonces on October 19, 2014, 01:11:50 AM
This article in The Economist is pretty good, and frightening.
http://www.economist.com/news/international/21625813-ebola-epidemic-west-africa-poses-catastrophic-threat-region-and-could-yet
Agree.
Where the heck is Con? I'd like to get his take on this.
I think he was mid way through a post when Mrs con noticed the jiggly boobs and gave him the pan treatment Bob knows so well
Quote from: Toonces on October 19, 2014, 01:11:50 AM
This article in The Economist is pretty good, and frightening.
http://www.economist.com/news/international/21625813-ebola-epidemic-west-africa-poses-catastrophic-threat-region-and-could-yet
Good article. Thanks for posting Toonces.
This Forbes article puts the Ebola threat in perspective...and remember to get your flu shot, flu kills many more people than Ebola every year!
http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertszczerba/2014/10/22/fear-and-fiction-more-dangerous-than-ebola/ (http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertszczerba/2014/10/22/fear-and-fiction-more-dangerous-than-ebola/)
B-b-but...but...the MEDIA says it's dangerous!!!
::)
More people probably die of food poisoning just in the USA each year than have died of Ebola world wide so far.
So far...
If you're traveling to West Africa, check your insurance policy:
QuoteAs fear of Ebola infections spreads to developed economies, U.S. and British insurance companies have begun writing Ebola exclusions into standard policies to cover hospitals, event organizers and other businesses vulnerable to local disruptions.
As a result, new policies and renewals will become costlier for companies opting to insure business travel to West Africa or to cover the risk of losses from quarantine shutdowns at home, industry officials told Reuters.
"What underwriters are doing at the moment is they're generally providing quotes either excluding or including Ebola - and it's much more expensive if Ebola is included," said Gary Flynn, an event cancellation broker at Jardine Lloyd Thompson Group Plc in London.
source: https://news.yahoo.com/virus-spreads-insurers-exclude-ebola-policies-163302758--finance.html;_ylt=AwrTWf3Z3kdUXjIAZv3QtDMD
Quote from: Staggerwing on October 23, 2014, 06:19:49 AM
More people probably die of food poisoning just in the USA each year than have died of Ebola world wide so far.
So far...
Actually, more people have died due to death than everyone that has died due to Ebola.
Comforting thought. :smitten:
Quote from: Toonces on October 23, 2014, 01:01:51 AM
Where the heck is Con? I'd like to get his take on this.
I know for a fact that BBCode can use Tag commands... I wonder if they're activated here.
[Tag]Toonces[/Tag]
Hmm, apparently not, unless I got your forum name slightly wrong?
Ebola in New York City....what could possibly go wrong???
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ebola-virus-outbreak/doctor-tests-positive-ebola-new-york-city-n232801 (http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ebola-virus-outbreak/doctor-tests-positive-ebola-new-york-city-n232801)
No panic allowed. I will go shotgun shopping though.
Quote from: Gusington on October 23, 2014, 08:50:23 PM
No panic allowed. I will go shotgun shopping though.
You should probably have a rifle, shotgun, and pistol.
Each has its own strengths and weaknesses.
Lots of guys recommend buck shot, but #2 duck shot should do quite well, too.
Mossberg Marine Gus.
Quote from: Shelldrake on October 23, 2014, 06:05:29 AM
Quote from: Toonces on October 19, 2014, 01:11:50 AM
This article in The Economist is pretty good, and frightening.
http://www.economist.com/news/international/21625813-ebola-epidemic-west-africa-poses-catastrophic-threat-region-and-could-yet
Good article. Thanks for posting Toonces.
This Forbes article puts the Ebola threat in perspective...and remember to get your flu shot, flu kills many more people than Ebola every year!
http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertszczerba/2014/10/22/fear-and-fiction-more-dangerous-than-ebola/ (http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertszczerba/2014/10/22/fear-and-fiction-more-dangerous-than-ebola/)
This is a true enough article (yes, flu is going to kill more Americans than Ebola this year) but it ignores the long view. Americans are too focused on the threat of Ebola actually coming to America and killing them. The threat to America is how this disease can completely destabilize the globe/global economy by killing millions of people in Africa and other parts of the world.
The threat isn't just getting the disease. It's the bigger ramifications it has for us and our security.
Ok its too late for a long explanation but the bottom line is this
You have to work really hard at catching Ebola. Those who have gotten it in the US are almost all health care workers who were around the worst aspects of the victims (copious blood, diarrhea, sputum etc.) Here is what makes the government get nervous - Ebola once the patient is truly contagious debilitates them and without intervention kills them quick. This means that it is much more easily contained. Flu on the other hand is airborne (little known fact those surgical masks do absolutely nothing to prevent you catching the flu) and has evolved to be a real efficient human killer. The last part is that you can be a carrier for the flu and be asymptomatic (not even know you have it) and be a carrier (some reports that as many as 70% of the population in a typical flu season are asymptomatic carriers).
Lastly since the H1N1 flu in 09 the US has really stepped up vaccine particularly cell based flu vaccine manufacturing in the US (prior to this we had almost 0% manufacturing capability it was almost 100% outsourced). My company which is one of the largest suppliers to the drug an vaccine manufacturing industries alongside with our competitors are now regulated with a mandatory pandemic response and manufacturing readiness plan. This is not being implemented for Ebola because all the science and data shows that while it is a deadly disease it will not reach pandemic proportions.
1918 Spanish Flu killed roughly 600,000 in the Us alone or about 0.5% of the population. IMO it would be much deadlier nowadays due to rapid travel but if we assume same mortality we are looking at about ~2M dead.
So relax until you see a lot of birds and then pigs dying in Asia because that is the major warning sign of a flu pandemic. Ebola is bad but three cases does not make a pandemic.
Here is some information on the new flu pandemic manufacturing sites in the US. I have been to the Holly Springs one and it is running at less than 3% capacity (always the problem with pandemics you dont need it until you do and then you need it by the boatload very hard to run a business that way which is why it needs so much government underwriting)
http://www.fiercepharmamanufacturing.com/story/fda-approves-novartis-us-vaccine-plant-it-trying-sell/2014-06-16
Con
Damn!
I was so looking forward to our dystopian Groghead fortress. >:(
Hey Con,
Try reading that Economist article (back a page and also quoted by Shelldrake above on this page) and let me know what you think.
the fast travel options to those countries has to be stopped!
including the goody two-shoes 'catastrophe tourism' of the NGOs workers
(...latly at the hipster cafe: i am sooo cool, i spend last week in Africa to help with Ebola with my NGO ...aren't i am sponge-worthy now 'Elaine (of today)' )
But we won't stop the flights. Our 'leadership' is so far up the PC bunghole that if a pandemic did occur, this would be the gateway for it.
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on October 24, 2014, 12:51:21 AM
Damn!
I was so looking forward to our dystopian Groghead fortress. >:(
Well, our current world is hardly utopia. I think the odds are good that we'd qualify for dystopia right now.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on October 24, 2014, 08:39:45 AM
But we won't stop the flights. Our 'leadership' is so far up the PC bunghole that if a pandemic did occur, this would be the gateway for it.
Let's start a petition on the white house petition page to have their staff be the greeters for all these flights coming from west Africa. Maybe that will put things in perspective.
Granted, it's not so much OUR blocking of the flights. I doubt we have many direct flights to that part of the world except in the major hubs like ORD, JFK, ATL, etcetera. Airlines like Air France and Lufthansa, however, have many more flights to the US, and they have many flights to West Africa. We'd have to essentially quarantine the continent.
Though it would be far wiser to just screen passports and if someone's been to an affected area, they're denied entry, or put through testing, or whatever works best.
what is EBowlaing ? ...well you knwo you got a strike when you start to feel sick (and remeber you have visited a certain arena in NYC :o )
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on October 24, 2014, 09:16:46 AM
Though it would be far wiser to just screen passports and if someone's been to an affected area, they're denied entry, or put through testing, or whatever works best.
all passengers booked on route to the USA (also with layover, etc ) are long before stored in the computers and visible to Homeland Security /Immigration office (or who is in charge),
It would be easy to just deny them boarding the plane starting from Europe when they have been listed as coming from West Africa even days before (all passengers lists entries are visible to the NSA at the moment of citizens booking a flight anywere.... i guess they even know the likability someone plans about traveling to a place before the person know it itself just from the vacation spots add and wiki searches he did on the internet)
^ Even better.
Time to reopen Ellis Island.
Let's put a little facts to this rampant fear mongering
http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/why-an-ebola-flight-ban-wouldnt-work/
Bottom line unless you want to halt ALL air travel then limiting flights will do absolutely nothing
Con
Quote from: Con on October 24, 2014, 02:59:25 PM
Let's put a little facts to this rampant fear mongering
http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/why-an-ebola-flight-ban-wouldnt-work/ (http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/why-an-ebola-flight-ban-wouldnt-work/)
Bottom line unless you want to halt ALL air travel then limiting flights will do absolutely nothing
Con
You mean halt all air travel from the region. As stated it implies all air travel world wide.
All air travel since there is no way to enforce a specific regional air travel ban on all airline/private planes especially with countries which have porous borders like these.
Con
Clearly it would be even harder to enforce a complete travel ban worldwide!
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 24, 2014, 06:49:03 PM
Clearly it would be even harder to enforce a complete travel ban worldwide!
We can't keep drug smugglers from sneaking across the border. Asking us to do anything more complicated seems naive.
Quote from: Con on October 24, 2014, 05:22:21 PM
All air travel since there is no way to enforce a specific regional air travel ban on all airline/private planes especially with countries which have porous borders like these.
Con
that is not a black and white situation ...its grey, its analog
a reduction by just caneling all flights from the 3 most affected countires reduce the risk, not eliminate the risk for a spread to other continents, which buys us the time to invent, test, and mass-prodcue a vaccine
forcing travelers from those 3 countries to take the land route to the next international airport in the neighbouring country, if those are even allowed to pass over the border (otherwise even have to take more time to sneak over that porous borders) give the necessary delay that those who may carry the virus start throwing symptoms, and are not able to travel or don't make it through fever screenings on the airports.
of course still someone dedicate to the task and with the luck of a prolonged time until symptoms show up, still has a chance to do a several days overland journey through 'half of Africa' to board a plane unscreened ...maybe in Egypt or South Africa and with a stopover in some European air-cross even make it to the USA and elsewhere finally but the numbers will be extremely slim compared to whats possible now.
in a few week, when
the exponential function does its thing, and the shit really hit the fan, everybody from that area with the pocketmoney will flee the region...
100s of US troops going to Liberia?
http://www.reuters.com/video/2014/10/26/thousands-more-us-troops-to-join-liberia?videoId=346701015&videoChannel=1
That kind of creeps me out. They are going to return at some point, many to big cities. So I have to say WTF?
That seems like a mission for Red Cross, Doctors without Borders, etc. NATO troops have enough on their hands without being thrown into that mess.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 26, 2014, 01:02:17 AM
100s of US troops going to Liberia?
http://www.reuters.com/video/2014/10/26/thousands-more-us-troops-to-join-liberia?videoId=346701015&videoChannel=1
That kind of creeps me out. They are going to return at some point, many to big cities. So I have to say WTF?
That seems like a mission for Red Cross, Doctors without Borders, etc. NATO troops have enough on their hands without being thrown into that mess.
In theory the US military should have world class troops able to operate in a bio-weapon environment. This is great training for the real deal. Hopefully nobody will get hurt.
Quote from: Gusington on October 23, 2014, 08:50:23 PM
No panic allowed. I will go shotgun shopping though.
Some advice, so long as you're looking: http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/14/home-defense-shotgun-myths-and-reality/
Quote from: LongBlade on October 26, 2014, 08:53:48 AM
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 26, 2014, 01:02:17 AM
1000s of US troops going to Liberia?
http://www.reuters.com/video/2014/10/26/thousands-more-us-troops-to-join-liberia?videoId=346701015&videoChannel=1
That kind of creeps me out. They are going to return at some point, many to big cities. So I have to say WTF?
That seems like a mission for Red Cross, Doctors without Borders, etc. NATO troops have enough on their hands without being thrown into that mess.
In theory the US military should have world class troops able to operate in a bio-weapon environment. This is great training for the real deal. Hopefully nobody will get hurt.
Its unnecessary to take the risk for training. They could setup a controlled test with a mild cold or flu. It strikes me that this can go badly wrong for an area with no strategic value.
What is the accountability if they come back to get 1000s of civilians infected? "It seemed like a good idea at the time." is not going to cut it.
Tests for Ebola are happening rather fast so detection, quarantining and treatment will be much easier with military personnel then civilians where while it can be mandatory there is a good deal of non compliance
Just like in warfare the best defense is a good offense which means stamping out Ebola at the source to protect the homeland
Con
Quote from: Con on October 26, 2014, 10:32:12 AM
Tests for Ebola are happening rather fast so detection, quarantining and treatment will be much easier with military personnel then civilians where while it can be mandatory there is a good deal of non compliance
Just like in warfare the best defense is a good offense which means stamping out Ebola at the source to protect the homeland
Con
I'm with Con here - if we don't use it as training (though I guarantee there will be benefits and lessons learned), then think of it as deploying our very best. If the military can't operate in these conditions, no one can.
There is certainly a lot of merit to Con's position. I still don't see it as a military operation. The military is already straining under it's budget. It has genuine defense uses for the resources that will be diverted. This is to some degree a political operation for the goodwill of the black community.
There is expediency with the use of troops that have to follow orders. There is no real accountability if things go to hell. Maybe we need to think about centralization of power. Many times in America there seems to be distrust of government overreach into areas that they are not tasked for. That often goes out the window when it is a use of troops. Well, we have to support the troops. Maybe it is not required that more power be centralized by calling everything a military operation. These other organizations, many non-profit, that are all about solving this type of issue, get "votes" with dollars. People donate, in a wholesome democratic fashion, to these organizations. When the government takes over these tasks, there is no option. The taxpayer has to pay.
Do we want more coercive use of the economy or a more democratic economy?
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on October 26, 2014, 01:15:55 PM
There is certainly a lot of merit to Con's position. I still don't see it as a military operation. The military is already straining under it's budget. It has genuine defense uses for the resources that will be diverted. This is to some degree a political operation for the goodwill of the black community.
Until the bullets start flying, of course.
And what are the odds of that NOT happening in this situation?
Are they meant to lend security to assets in-country? Maybe the mission is different than the vagury it seems on the surface...
In other news, I have no idea how to make "vague" an adverb. :))
No worries. I gave up on context, grammar and sentence structure years ago. :))
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on October 26, 2014, 02:26:56 PM
I gave up on context, grammar and sentence structure years ago. :))
You forgot sex with a woman.
My wife and some friends remembered the SARS outbreak in China years ago. Also started amongst infected animals that it to markets and spread. Like Ebola I guess SARS could come back if unchecked.
Lots of african nationals in Guangzhou nowadays, I hope ebola carriers don't spread there.
What is the primary mission of the US troops being deployed to Africa?
There's an aviation unit from my last post that's going over to do medical transport.
Some unlucky SOB will have to clean out those transports :/
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2Fa%2Fa9%2FWest_Africa_Ebola_2014_5_cum_case_by_country_lin.png%2F800px-West_Africa_Ebola_2014_5_cum_case_by_country_lin.png&hash=4d13ef718046968bb7cc64204762c0e4fdcf9529)
The response really needs to come from those countries, with assistance from international organizations and other countries. Tin pot dictator X cannot sit back, forcing foreign governments to do his job.
That curve is headed in a bad direction.
half logarithm diagram is better for these mathematical relation
Quote from: Gusington on October 26, 2014, 05:23:52 PM
What is the primary mission of the US troops being deployed to Africa?
Yes, I'd still like to know that, too.
Briefly saw on news this morning while passing through, there's suspicion of Ebola at the White house. The morning blonde announcer was far too chirpy and happy for that rumor to be more than a rumor, though.
How'd her bewbs look? That's my typical bellweather.
(https://scontent-b-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/1653620_10152359138827187_5603135475009334809_n.jpg?oh=e420a607b62cabac9a8233e84855fd11&oe=54E39876)
Ha that's very Windy/Gramps...I like it.
http://www.ijreview.com/2014/10/193216-guys-use-services-lawsuit-happy-ebola-nurse-listening/?fb_action_ids=10152408095848045&fb_action_types=og.shares (http://www.ijreview.com/2014/10/193216-guys-use-services-lawsuit-happy-ebola-nurse-listening/?fb_action_ids=10152408095848045&fb_action_types=og.shares)
Shameless plug for my Army regarding the soldiers returning from Liberia being quarantined.
But...I don't buy this for a second:
QuoteTheir response to being placed under quarantine? Not complaining at all.
;D
If people are complaining, things are ok. When they stop complaining, be worried.
Quote from: Airborne Rifles on October 29, 2014, 06:39:54 PM
If people are complaining, things are ok. When they stop complaining, be worried.
Yup.
(https://scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/1174528_883160785030121_408387568809986548_n.jpg?oh=3ef30126e572936979f85c334e9f3d10&oe=54F5C038)
scroll 4 posts up sunshine. ::)
I still don't get it
Good thing.
Hoo boy.
QuoteAn Ebola survivor has been quarantined in India after his semen tested positive for the virus, health officials there have announced.
The 26-year-old man, an Indian national, traveled to New Delhi from Liberia on November 10, almost two months after he was hospitalized in the West African nation after showing symptoms of the illness, India's health ministry said in a statement.
He was released from the Liberian hospital on September 30 with documents declaring him free of clinical signs linked to Ebola, the ministry added.
As a precautionary measure, Indian authorities carried out tests on his body fluids, which confirmed traces of the virus in his semen, the statement said.
source: http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/19/world/asia/india-ebola-semen/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
Worst Job Ever? -- Ebola Fluid Test Gatherer
Quote from: JasonPratt on November 19, 2014, 02:02:35 PM
Worst Job Ever? -- Ebola Fluid Test Gatherer
Star's already filled that job.
Quote from: LongBlade on November 19, 2014, 08:39:31 AM
Hoo boy.
QuoteAn Ebola survivor has been quarantined in India after his semen tested positive for the virus, health officials there have announced.
The 26-year-old man, an Indian national, traveled to New Delhi from Liberia on November 10, almost two months after he was hospitalized in the West African nation after showing symptoms of the illness, India's health ministry said in a statement.
He was released from the Liberian hospital on September 30 with documents declaring him free of clinical signs linked to Ebola, the ministry added.
As a precautionary measure, Indian authorities carried out tests on his body fluids, which confirmed traces of the virus in his semen, the statement said.
source: http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/19/world/asia/india-ebola-semen/index.html?hpt=hp_t2
That's not really new. Earlier reports said they found that ebola could remain viable as an STD as much as 70 days after the incubation period.
Holy crap, so you are saying somebody with the means to pay for a globe trot could spread it to hookers everywhere. I think they call that f*cking pandemonium.
Quote from: Mr. Bigglesworth on November 19, 2014, 07:46:52 PM
Holy crap, so you are saying somebody with the means to pay for a globe trot could spread it to hookers everywhere. I think they call that f*cking pandemonium.
Agreed.
We're relying on people who (mostly) are still trying to learn to use condoms to stem HIV to stop this outbreak? Suddenly it seems like the odds have gotten worse with this thing.
Purchases of shares in condom manufacturer stock will be swelling.
^ Good idea.
Quote from: Staggerwing on November 19, 2014, 07:50:35 PM
Purchases of shares in condom manufacturer stock will be swelling.
I see what you did there.
Quote from: Staggerwing on November 19, 2014, 07:50:35 PM
Purchases of shares in condom manufacturer stock will be swelling.
Which manufacturer will get on top?
:o
Some promising news.
QuoteResearchers say an experimental Ebola vaccine appears safe and has triggered signs of immune protection in the first 20 volunteers to test it.
According to a study in the New England Journal of Medicine, the vaccine is designed to spur the immune system's production of anti-Ebola antibodies. Some of those given the vaccine developed antibodies within four weeks of getting the shots at the National Institutes of Health. Half of the test group received a higher-dose shot, and those people produced more antibodies.
The study also found that some people also developed a different set of virus-fighting immune cells, called T cells. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases director Dr. Anthony Fauci calls both types of immune responses "a promising factor."
source: http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/11/26/ebola-vaccine-seems-safe-in-first-stage-testing-researchers-say/?intcmp=latestnews
Cool. You gotta love science when it does something good. :)
Quote from: Martok on November 27, 2014, 03:01:58 AM
Cool. You gotta love science when it does something good. :)
When does science do bad things? ???
what was that Japanese bio unit in WW2?
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on November 27, 2014, 09:24:48 AM
what was that Japanese bio unit in WW2?
Unit 731.
Otherwise known as "Epidemic Prevention and Water Purification Department of the Kwantung Army."
Quote from: GDS_Starfury on November 27, 2014, 09:24:48 AM
what was that Japanese bio unit in WW2?
There were also those hypothermia death experiments performed by Nazis at one of the camps. The data was captured by the Allies at the end of the war and may have contributed to the survival of downed pilots due to better post-war flight gear but the experiments themselves were just evil.
Some frightening mofos in that unit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731
Some Japanese 'medical experiments' made Nazi docs look like rank amateurs.
QuoteA Liberian woman appears to have contracted Ebola from unprotected sex with a man who survived the virus, health officials said today.
The 44-year-old woman was diagnosed March 20, the first new Ebola case in Liberia in a month. Doctors were perplexed by her case, because she hadn't been to a funeral or had any other contact with current patients, according to a report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
But the woman did have unprotected vaginal intercourse a few weeks earlier, with a 45-year-old Ebola survivor who has been free of the disease for months. The man developed the disease in September and was discharged from a treatment center in early October. That man also had sex with a second woman, who has not tested positive for Ebola, the CDC says.
source: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/05/01/ebola-survivor-sex/26698329/
Wow! They'll be looking closely at this case because it's not supposed to lay dormant like that in humans....
More policy failure:
Empty Ebola Clinics in Liberia Are Seen as Misstep in U.S. Relief Effort
By NORIMITSU ONISHI APRIL 11, 2015
MONROVIA, Liberia — As bodies littered the streets and the sick lay dying in front of overwhelmed clinics last year, President Obama ordered the largest American intervention ever in a global health crisis, hoping to stem the deadliest Ebola epidemic in history.
But after spending hundreds of millions of dollars and deploying nearly 3,000 troops to build Ebola treatment centers, the United States ended up creating facilities that have largely sat empty: Only 28 Ebola patients have been treated at the 11 treatment units built by the United States military, American officials now say.
Nine centers have never had a single Ebola patient.
"My task was to convince the international organizations, 'You don't need any more E.T.U.s,' " said Dr. Hans Rosling, a Swedish public health expert who advised Liberia's health ministry, referring to Ebola treatment units.
"I warned them, 'The only thing you'll show is an empty E.T.U.,' " he added. " 'Don't do it.' "
The American response, it turns out, was outpaced by the fast-moving and unpredictable disease.
.....
continued ---> http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/12/world/africa/idle-ebola-clinics-in-liberia-are-seen-as-misstep-in-us-relief-effort.html?_r=0
Are you trying to tell me politicians waste our money? ;)
They set the bar so low for themselves, you can't expect anyone to be surprised.
Quote from: Gusington on November 28, 2014, 05:40:14 PM
Some frightening mofos in that unit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731
More a right bunch of bastards IMHO, along with the Nazis, and the Soviets who all did the same sort of stuff. Shame on the hypocrisy of the Allies in not charging them with war crimes. >:(
Quote from: Barthheart on May 01, 2015, 08:30:22 PM
Wow! They'll be looking closely at this case because it's not supposed to lay dormant like that in humans....
Not a wow, serious danger. That guy may carry a mutation that many will want to weaponize. It would be best for everyone if it is all incinerated.