Just listened to the latest Three Moves Ahead podcast, and lets just say that everyone seemed pretty underwhelmed by the Hearts of Iron IV Beta they were invited to play at Paradox Studios.
Listen Here:
https://www.idlethumbs.net/3ma
I was thinking about posting a thread about this recently when I viewed an article on RPS about HoI4. I am completely underwhelmed with the info I have seen thus far.
So do what I always do:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aarcentral.com%2Fpics%2Fgame.jpg&hash=58f7826a721477ce60ee18c5d907784f195fb140)
Except I probably won't buy it on sale. :-\
Yeah, but they've delayed to try and get it right. Time will tell; but while waiting a vid is out.
I think it looks fantastic. Not sure why everyone has a bug up their butt. Its not even finished yet. People bitched about I, II and III too.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on June 11, 2015, 10:37:07 AM
I think it looks fantastic. Not sure why everyone has a bug up their butt. Its not even finished yet. People bitched about I, II and III too.
I can pick some dislikes- like the new counters seem little cluttered on zoom out as in where are the troops exactly. But yes, looks like shaping up.
Nice vid Fabius. I like the sounds of both construction and how you can control your armies. I really like that you don't just need manpower to make up for loses, but you need the weapons to arm those replacements with. Should help to add a more real feel to the game. Also should make you plan more.
Hmm, I wonder, if you develop a new tank, and send it to your units, will their old ones go back to the pool.
Quote from: OJsDad on June 11, 2015, 11:54:33 AM
Nice vid Fabius. I like the sounds of both construction and how you can control your armies. I really like that you don't just need manpower to make up for loses, but you need the weapons to arm those replacements with. Should help to add a more real feel to the game. Also should make you plan more.
Hmm, I wonder, if you develop a new tank, and send it to your units, will their old ones go back to the pool.
Yes old stuff to the pool has been stated by the devs I think. But remember so much of the game is still in flux.
Agreed, equipment and more detailed manpower should really be a nice step forward. No so keen that at the moment the trade has no money, just trade civilian factories for raw materials and no ability to stock pile raw materials.
As with all of Paradox's games, I won't understand enough to know that it sucks (if indeed it does suck) anyway. I'll be buying this one.
I haven't seen mention of this but then again, I haven't been paying too much attention. Is it going to be possible to plan and co-ordinate a grand strategy with your AI allies in HOI IV? That's one of the things about HOI III that I felt was sorely missing. I never had any inkling of what my allies were up to or what their future plans were and there was no way to co-ordinate actions with them.
I'm in mid 1943 in my current game as England. I've taken Italy back and I'm holding Japan in check in Thailand (but they've taken 90% of Australia). I'm in a slugging match with the Germans in France and their ground forces are much better than mine so it's only a matter of time until I'm pushed out. I'd love the ability to co-ordinate with allies and set terms like "Invade Sicily in May 1943 with at least 12 brigades." As it stands now, I have no idea what the Yanks are up to. They've landed a few paratroopers in the Sudan (good job guys!) but other than that, they don't seem to be doing much except trading Midway with the Japanese every few months.
I'm hoping with the IVth one, that they finally have made the Pacific War look something like................... the Pacific War.
Quote from: bboyer66 on June 11, 2015, 03:29:32 PM
I'm hoping with the IVth one, that they finally have made the Pacific War look something like................... the Pacific War.
I'd be very surprised.
Boyer, I've heard this comment before, but I'm not sure what exactly is meant by it, can you, or anyone, explain it.
Quote from: OJsDad on June 11, 2015, 08:33:52 PM
Boyer, I've heard this comment before, but I'm not sure what exactly is meant by it, can you, or anyone, explain it.
The AI doesn't conduct amphibious operations, I believe...
The AI will do amphibious operations but they don't seem to do anything to exploit them once they're done. If you watch AI controlled Japan and the US fight it out in the Pacific, you'll see that Wake, Midway, and a few other islands are constantly changing hands. One side will invade with one or two divisions and then just leave them there to be wiped out a few months later. It seems to me that the AI for both sides is coded to prioritize taking control of certain islands in the Pacific so they both just end up pissing about for the entire game. I think part of the problem is the rather haphazard way in which naval spotting, pursuit & intercept, and engagement rules are handled. The fleets just bounce around from zone to zone and most battles seem to happen more by luck than anything else. If you do manage to damage but not destroy an enemy fleet, the rest will retreat. That's fine but the chances of a successful pursuit seem far too low and most times, the retreating fleet will escape even when you try to attack them with air assets.
From the vid, the game looks fantastic. I'm on board with nearly everything I've seen so far except trading for resources with 'Factories' seems a bit non-immersive and Japan puppeting China in a year. That unrealistic behaviour is in previous versions of the game and ruins immersion. It needs to be fixed.
I want to see NATO counters.
Thanks SDR. Now that you say it, I've played China, and have successfully blocked Japan from breaking out of Manchuria. Japan never makes any amphibious assaults to flank me, which, given the fact that I had to strip every other area to make the initial stops, would be a disaster for me.
Johan outlines where they are with it:
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/hearts-of-iron-iv-16th-development-diary-12th-of-june-2015.862164/
For better or worse HOI III is my most played game ever on steam - I'm looking forward to this very much and reconquering Southern Europe with Italy
Paradox has always overreached with HOI. They end up creating a game that could be hugely awesome, but the game is so complicated from the standpoint of what the AI must manage that the game just falls flat. Playing HOI3 I loved how all the tools are there, but the AI can't possibly control air, land, and sea forces for entire nations in a sensible and realistic manner. I will also mention that they at times make weird design designs (like all land units are at full strength all the time until manpower runs low) and they have serious bugs in other systems. It took them a long time to get their weather system to even to produce mildly plausible results. In addition to the naval war aspects of these games have always had problems with.
They are just moving around the deck chairs, the game will still be crippled with the same flaws.
I still like it and think it does a good job of bringing that era of history alive. I'm having a great time managing my strategic bomber forces as I send them over to bomb German cities even though it involves a lot of micro-management. The fight with the Japanese along the Irrawaddy river was satisfyingly tense as was my invasion of the Italian mainland (after I tried in Greece and had to Dunkirk it back to the boats.) It's got flaws, but for me they aren't glaring enough to ruin the game.
I was a latecomer to HOI but I now play it far more than I do Vicky II or EU IV (I actually haven't even gone beyond the tutorials in EU IV.)
Quote from: Swatter on June 12, 2015, 12:39:06 PM
They are just moving around the deck chairs, the game will still be crippled with the same flaws.
I am hopeful that they may get it right this time. I think the HOI series has done wonderful things....despite the sometimes brain dead strategic AI.
Quote from: Swatter on June 12, 2015, 12:39:06 PM
Paradox has always overreached with HOI. They end up creating a game that could be hugely awesome, but the game is so complicated from the standpoint of what the AI must manage that the game just falls flat. Playing HOI3 I loved how all the tools are there, but the AI can't possibly control air, land, and sea forces for entire nations in a sensible and realistic manner. I will also mention that they at times make weird design designs (like all land units are at full strength all the time until manpower runs low) and they have serious bugs in other systems. It took them a long time to get their weather system to even to produce mildly plausible results. In addition to the naval war aspects of these games have always had problems with.
They are just moving around the deck chairs, the game will still be crippled with the same flaws.
That's one of the core design guidance that they haves stated several times with HoI4.
Partly why they have gone with a battle planner system- they want the AI to be better able with the game mechanics.
Plus they have a new AI guy since HoI3..... time will tell....
I was a huge fan of II, but not so much III. As I'm not a naval warfare guy at all, the lack of appreciable AI competency in said area is neither noticed nor missed.