Hello
So, I've been trying to find the "perfect" wargame for WW2 and I'm now realizing there is no such thing. I was trying to use Men of War Assault Squad 2 because of the editor (want the ability to make my own battles) and all the mods (every nation involved in WW2 and almost every tank and gun used by each country)...but, I don't like the "arcade" feel to is and quite frankly, the GEM editor is touchy and seldom works properly.
So, here I am with a quandry. I want to come up with a game list for the following time frames of WW2.
Germany vs Poland/Low Countries
North Africa 1940-1943
German invasion of Russia 41-43
Russian counter offensives to Berlin 43-45
Pacific Theater 1942-1945
Allied Invasion of Sicily/Italy
D-Day to Berlin
If I could find games that cover these area that would awesome, but I don't have the knowledge of this gaming genre like most of you have. I'm an old school RPG'er/MMO'er who has a love offair with WW2 and I'm moving on from RPG to WW2.
For a point of reference to what I'm looking for in a game I really like the looks of Achtung Panzer Operation Star
I'd also like the Close Combat series of games. They seem historical accurate.
Anyways, if anyone would care to chime in and present some example games that might fit into the above theaters, you have my deepest thanks!
I will say I do want games that have editors where I can create my own battles. If a game is just pre-built scenarios/campaigns, I would pass on those.
Again, thank you so much for reading this and helping me out.
Have you looked into the Combat Mission series? First one that pops into mind.
You have titles spanning from Normandy, Italy, Market Garden and Eastern Front.
For tactical, get Combat Mission Beyond Overlord, Combat Mission Beyond Berlin and Combat Mission Afrika Korps. Those are the original generation of the Combat Mission series and they can be had for cheap, don't have the drm crap, has 1000's of scenarios that you can download from my websites at www.the-proving-grounds.com or www.the-scenario-depot.com. If you're an eye candy type, then get the newer Combat Mission but you'll pay quite a bit for it, having to deal with their drm crap and will only get a very limited amount of scenarios. EITHER though would be my choice.
For strategic or operational, get The Operational Art of War III from Matrix games. A gazillion scenarios covering most all battles of WWII. Best bang for your buck deal there.
Of course if you *really* want to be a WWII wargamer, scroll down to the board wargaming section. :smitten: :coolsmiley:
I've tried the Combat Mission games. WAAAAAY too technical for me, but thank you for the suggestion.
I guess Advanced Squad Leader and Advanced Third Reich would be out of the question then. :buck2:
Battlefield Academy might be more your speed then. It looks too cartoonish for me but they say that there's a good tactical game underneath that fluff.
Which scale? Turn Based or Real Time?
Steel Panthers World at War (SPWAW) or Steel Panthers World War 2 (SPWW2) cover all these scenarios. Plus the game is free and still has active communities at spwaw depot and spww2 at shrapnel
Quote from: jomni on September 29, 2015, 05:14:07 PM
Which scale? Turn Based or Real Time?
I'd prefer turn based. More company sized battles
Steel Panthers might be the best all-in-one game and as much as eye candy isn't my #1 requirement, that game looks soooo old.
I think I'd rather play the older Close Combat 3 game. It looks like it has tons of mods cover North Africa/Pacific theater.
Quote from: acctingman on September 29, 2015, 06:44:58 PM
Quote from: jomni on September 29, 2015, 05:14:07 PM
Which scale? Turn Based or Real Time?
I'd prefer turn based. More company sized battles
Steel Panthers might be the best all-in-one game and as much as eye candy isn't my #1 requirement, that game looks soooo old.
I think I'd rather play the older Close Combat 3 game. It looks like it has tons of mods cover North Africa/Pacific theater.
Close Combat is a favorite of mine, but yeah, nothing really beats Steel Panthers for me. I never could get much into the Combat Mission games, including the new ones.
You could also look at Panzer Command Ostfront.
Quote from: Bison on September 29, 2015, 06:56:47 PM
You could also look at Panzer Command Ostfront.
Good stuff, that PC:O.
Quote from: Staggerwing on September 29, 2015, 07:27:38 PM
Quote from: Bison on September 29, 2015, 06:56:47 PM
You could also look at Panzer Command Ostfront.
Good stuff, that PC:O.
Now see, that game confused me. Maybe it's because I've played Combat Mission for so many years.
And for
acctingman, I remember the very first few times that I played CM (when it was very first released). I hated it. It just did not appeal to me at all and I sat it aside for a year at least before being convinced to try it again. I'm so glad that I did. It sounds like you've tinkered around with it, maybe with the demo. Try finding the demo from Combat Mission Beyond Berlin and see if works any better for you. I'm very much in the minority but I prefer the original titles to the newer ones personally (much more intuitive to me).
Unity of Command is a serious winner, if you're just interested in playing the Eastern Front. It's got the "turn limit time pressure" factor, but innovates in many ways over other titles that look very similar. It's received some of the most critical acclaim of any TBS WW II title in a long time, and it's pretty accessible (although the AI is quite good if you get at all sloppy).
GJK's suggestion of Battle Academy is a good one in this case.
It's graphics may look comic-ish but uses has a very enjoyable, yet accessible, turn-based system at the vehicle/squad level. The graphic style didn't bother me at all once I got into it.
Too bad this topic didn't come up a couple days earlier. Battle Academy 2 (the improved sequel on the East Front) was on a Matrix weekend sale at 30% off. :( I only have the original BA, and planned to get BA2 sometime, but my spending has been way over budget recently so I'll wait for the Xmas sale.
I do think BA2 has some very nice feature additions compared to the original, and I generally enjoy the east front stuff more these days (the rare times I get a WW2 game) but there is a big different in price between the two...
http://www.matrixgames.com/products/387/details/Battle.Academy
http://www.matrixgames.com/products/541/details/Battle.Academy.2:.Eastern.Front
Note that you can create a Matrix "Members" account, and register your Matrix serial number in order to also get a Steam key for these. That would give you both a downloaded practically DRM-free installer and a Steam version, as opposed to just the latter, so it's worth going that route if you don't mind the extra effort.
I really enjoyed HighWay to the Rieche, from matrixgames, but I think its been absorbed into command ops , HTTR was better looking I think it was Market Garden .
First two recommendations cover everything under the WW2 sun.
1) Norm Korger's The Operational Art of War 3 (covers everything until modern era in one package)
2) John Tiller's Campaign Series (covers everything WW2 in one package)
3) John Tiller's Panzer Campaigns (separate games, does not cover Pacific)
4) Gary Grigsby's War in the East (monster game)
5) Gary Grigsby's War in the West (monster game)
6) Gary Grigsby's War in the Pacific (mother of all monster games)
7) Decisive Campaigns Warsaw to Paris (this game is a gem and covers a seldom gamed time period)
8 ) Decisive Campaigns Case Blue
9) Panzer Command Ostfront (East Front turn-based tacitcal like old school Combat Mission and not the modern Combat Mission)
10) John Tiller's Squad Battles (covers a lot of theatres, separate games, same scale as Squad Leader)
Quote from: jomni on September 30, 2015, 08:13:56 AM
7) Decisive Campaigns Warsaw to Paris (this game is a gem and covers a seldom gamed time period)
Very much agree -- the Decisive Campaigns games are excellent. I'd start with Warsaw to Paris however; Case Blue is pretty gargantuan.
I have a soft spot for Panzer Command Kharkov / Ostfront -- spent many enjoyable hours on this one. But I never went back to it after getting sucked into the Combat Mission x2 universe. Panzer Command just feels too primitive by comparison, especially regarding its handling of infantry combat. Still, a very solid game -- Ostfront comes with a *lot* of content in scenarios and campaigns --
Unity of Command and its expansions can be had for wonderfully cheap on Steam from time to time, so while it doesn't scratch your all around WW2 itch, it does do the Eastern Front in an easy to digest sort of format (i.e. its not as complex as War in the East by a long, long shot); something to keep in mind, I'd say.
Otherwise, I'm a Tiller fanboy, so I say go for the Campaign Series.
Ooooooh stuff I love to discuss...
I'll keep it simple:
I. Tactical Level
A: Simple: Heroes of Normandie (cutesy but an hoot)...
B: Medium: Tiller's Squad Battles
C: Hard: CMx2
2. That thing between Tactical and Operational: Tiller's Campaign Series -- nothing comes even close for value-for-the-dollar. I am shame-faced to admit that I am not yet sold on Tiller's Panzer Battles, although the West Front is calling me...
3: Operational: Decisive Campaigns or PzC. I can't and won't choose. If you like WWII gaming at this level, there's no reason not to have them both.
So much great gaming...
Quote from: Cyrano on September 30, 2015, 11:15:31 AM
Ooooooh stuff I love to discuss...
I'll keep it simple:
I. Tactical Level
A: Simple: Heroes of Normandie (cutesy but an hoot)...
B: Medium: Tiller's Squad Battles
C: Hard: CMx2
2. That thing between Tactical and Operational: Tiller's Campaign Series -- nothing comes even close for value-for-the-dollar. I am shame-faced to admit that I am not yet sold on Tiller's Panzer Battles, although the West Front is calling me...
3: Operational: Decisive Campaigns or PzC. I can't and won't choose. If you like WWII gaming at this level, there's no reason not to have them both.
So much great gaming...
Does the Tiller series have an editor where you can create your own what if scenarios?
Does the game keep track of losses after each battle?....maybe a screen showing the losses from each side?
Thanks
I was thinking you all missed the editor part.
Tiller does have an editor feature, but I'm not sure how easy it is to use. There are a couple of folks here who have worked with it and could give a better answer. Tiller does have a campaign mode but it's really a linking of individual battles and not a carry over of forces from one engagement to another. So losses don't matter from battle to battle since the OOB is fresh for each new battle in the campaign. But there is a screen that shows loses at the end of each battle.
I've watched a few videos of the Tiller Campaign (and a couple reviews). I think it's a bid too tedious for my tastes. I find myself wanting more eye candy than the super complex games offer (not a fan of "counters"), so, with that being said I think I'm going to stick to CC The Longest Day (played a demo and enjoyed it), The Darkest Hour and Men of War 2 AS2. Although the editor in MoW:AS2 is kinda of buggy it gives the look and feel I'm desiring. CC:TLD has a nice skirmish feel and there are quite a few mods for it. The Darkest Hour will scratch that grand strategic itch.
Thanks for all the information and suggestions. I didn't realize there are so many good WW2 games out there.
@Bison: All but PC on my list have an editor of some type...some stronger than others...
To the OT: If you're going to CC, make sure you look at Gateway to Caen which, by my own lights, is the best of the series, is often available quite reasonably through various outlets, and does have a lot of what you're looking for. Not my own cup of tea, but this is always, ultimately, about personal tastes.
I am glad we have so many to choose from.
Best,
Jim
I know but I think the ease of use is a major factor when it comes to editors. Frankly if you don't REALLY love the engine you are going to use the editor especially if it's is not user friendly. I've never really been under the impression that Tiller games are "easy" to edit in terms of creating your own scenarios.
I know CMX2 has an editor to create your own battles, which is easy to use but whether the battles are balanced or the AI can use the assets is another question.
And I have no idea about that other new fangeled game you mentioned...
NOW GET OFF MY LAWN! :)
ALL HAIL THE HYPNO-TOAD!!
Quote from: acctingman on September 30, 2015, 01:02:42 PM
Quote from: Cyrano on September 30, 2015, 11:15:31 AM
Ooooooh stuff I love to discuss...
I'll keep it simple:
I. Tactical Level
A: Simple: Heroes of Normandie (cutesy but an hoot)...
B: Medium: Tiller's Squad Battles
C: Hard: CMx2
2. That thing between Tactical and Operational: Tiller's Campaign Series -- nothing comes even close for value-for-the-dollar. I am shame-faced to admit that I am not yet sold on Tiller's Panzer Battles, although the West Front is calling me...
3: Operational: Decisive Campaigns or PzC. I can't and won't choose. If you like WWII gaming at this level, there's no reason not to have them both.
So much great gaming...
Does the Tiller series have an editor where you can create your own what if scenarios?
Does the game keep track of losses after each battle?....maybe a screen showing the losses from each side?
Thanks
1st Q: Yes
2nd Q: Tiller's Campaign Series, yes.
Tiller's Squad Battles and Panzer Campaigns, No.