The vid below is what people, members of our families used to do to take down evil in the world for our benefit. Yet now it seems we aren't willing to stand up and be counted to no only take down the current evil in the world but also protect future generations from them. Imagine if they decided not to get involved as people will get killed and it's best just to chat with them and hopefully they might listen.
A reason why we are in todays predicament isn't because we fought in the mid east but because when we did todays sensibilities and governments being to scared of upsetting the public meant they never did a full proper job and weren't as ruthless as needed to be leaving it open for this to happen. Only total war will finish a war which includes self self sacrifice. You either have to send in troops at full force with no fear of casualties until the jobs done or if you want to save our soldiers lives just use tac nukes..that really is the choice. The consequences for jihads have to be that extreme it just wouldn't be worth it. Exactly how Saddam had ruled..we now know why he ruled the way he did. See the truth of it is Hitler had views more inline with ours (and we had to take his regime out as it was still aboherrent) than these people do and we knew we had to finish Germany and bring her to her knees to make sure the job was done as it hadn't been at the end of WW1 hence we had WW2. Same thing has to happen here.
You see until the day comes where everyone in the world just wants to love everyone else Wars will happen, so that those who do want to love are allowed to and be free and those who don't and hate have to be removed by those who wnat to love so we can have a world where more people are free to love than are enslaved or full of hate. Until the glorious day comes where the whole world just loves.
I'm not a warmonger but a lovemonger and realise sometimes a price has to be paid so we can be lovemongers.
Sorry, I know sometimes I struggle explain things on forums and at times what I write doesn't flow, but I hope it's readable.
You had me until 'Hitler had views similar to ours.'
Quote from: Gusington on December 04, 2015, 08:39:31 AM
You had me until 'Hitler had views similar to ours.'
I said more inline with ours. Meaning more inline when compared to the Jihadies view of the world and what they want. I've made it more clear he was till abhorrent. Was trying to make a point about what we had to do and go through to get rid of him and yet we now have what I feel on on an evil barometer would even top Hitler yet we wont act the way we should do.
Don't apologize if that's what you think. IMHO Hitler and jihadis are two sides of the same horrific coin and have no connection to either true Western or common human values.
Yes both are abhorrent maybe I pushed it here abit but really it was just trying to highlight what we did and now have to do when evil is at the door.
Yeah, the Third Reich openly courted Muslims and even had Persia and other countries in the Middle East on their side, at least until the Russians and British invaded them and squashed those notions. The SS even had a few Muslim formations...can't recall the exact formations offhand. The Luftwaffe, I think, sent a squadron to the area too.
I see the angle you're aiming for though, TW. It makes sense to an extent. Even though I bring up a similarity above, there's no doubt in my mind had Germany won WWII, there wouldn't be much room in the New Order for anyone non-Aryan.
The post is something I wrote to go on facebook and was more aimed at those here in the UK unwilling to act.
Yes if Germany won many would be enslaved and many killed. If Isis took the world there wouldn't even be any hope of life at all even as a slave..just lots and lots of headless bodies and a small blunt knife to look forward to.
Even with Germany losing the war my family was almost wiped out. So now it looks like the Islamofascists want to finish the job.
I don't think a lack of willingness to act is a UK-only situation, unfortunately.
I don't get the Jew hate, to be honest. I need to read up on this. Thing is, during World War II, Antisemitism wasn't just a German thing. There was plenty of it to go around in the UK, US, and elsewhere too. Not to the level the Nazis did of course...but enough that it closed doors where some people might have actually been able to emigrate and avoid that horror.
It's all the rage now as well.
Correct it was only after WW2 antisemitism went from being pretty much global opinion to relegated to the dustbin where it belongs. Many forget how all countries persecuted Jews in one way or other and a blind eye was turned just before the War and prob still at the start because it wasn't the persecution of the Jews why we went to war with Hitler and if it had been only that prob never would have..STalin carried out Jewish genocide and we never did anything there, even carrying out a pogrom after WW2.
Quote from: Banzai_Cat on December 04, 2015, 08:54:45 AM
I don't get the Jew hate, to be honest. I need to read up on this. Thing is, during World War II, Antisemitism wasn't just a German thing. There was plenty of it to go around in the UK, US, and elsewhere too. Not to the level the Nazis did of course...but enough that it closed doors where some people might have actually been able to emigrate and avoid that horror.
I'm with you there. I've never understood the animosity expressed towards Jews over the centuries. And yeah, if the Nazi's had won, our forum would be missing some key friends.
I'm currently watching "The Man in the High Tower". A passing remark to Death Camps in Cincinnatti caught my attention and made me think of how different life would be had that evil prevailed. And now it's knocking at our door again, dressed in different garb this time but with the same goals: the destruction of our way of life and the elimination of "undesirables" as they define it. I can only hope our generation rises up to meet the challenge as our grandfather's did.
There was a rather poignant moment in the first episode of The Man in the High Tower, when the cop pulled the truck driver over and they casually explained away the flakes floating in the air to insinuate it was a crematorium burning bodies. :-\
Quote from: Gusington on December 04, 2015, 08:45:44 AM
Don't apologize if that's what you think. IMHO Hitler and jihadis are two sides of the same horrific coin and have no connection to either true Western or common human values.
In World War II we fought fascists.
Now we're fighting theofacists.
I get where you're coming from TW and thank you for that post.
Unfortunately the way I see things playing out is that the 'bad guys' are going to be free to continue their atrocities because the 'good guys' are not willing or not able to combat this evil properly. It will get to the point where there will be all out war the way you mention but it will be forced upon us and not by our terms but theirs.
Meanwhile CNN et al continue to report on the 'selfies of the week' and what the Kardashians are wearing these days. :idiot2:
Quote from: W8taminute on December 04, 2015, 05:08:01 PM
Unfortunately the way I see things playing out is that the 'bad guys' are going to be free to continue their atrocities because the 'good guys' are not willing or not able to combat this evil properly. It will get to the point where there will be all out war the way you mention but it will be forced upon us and not by our terms but theirs.
Meanwhile CNN et al continue to report on the 'selfies of the week' and what the Kardashians are wearing these days. :idiot2:
The problem is the cancer of so called "Political Correctness" that the Greenish/Left had forced into the western world
We live in a time were the life of a Taliban/IS-fighter has a higher value then the life of the soldier we send out to
get arrest or better only
talk it out him to win his heart and mind, where our guys have to take the risk with downright ridiculous ROEs
America was willing to sacrifice 100 000 civilians in one Tokyo fire bombing night raid (not to speak about some German cities) to weaken the Japanese military and industry assets, and the public saw its as 'good progress'
Nowadays if a small Hellfire warhead takes out a single hut with a Taliban leader gathering with his lieutenants and a couple of relatives, who idiotically sit a the same campfire get caught in the blast... then half the public and 90% of the media go apeshit
Some media even cry out
its not a fair fight because no pilot was send into harms way and it was done with only a remote plane... well, war is like the Olympics sport event right,? No it isn't! its WAR
72 years ago a 36-plane group formation of B17s would have obliterated the whole village to get that hut with a 30% likelihood the leader had already moved on, killing everything including poor goats, dogs and cattle... and the public opinion would have been 'In your face suckers ...911 never forget'
the actual war get lost at the home front!
@MikeGer...exactly what I was getting at when I said governments where to scared of public opinion. Blimey the UK lost around 400 soldiers over god knows how many years in Afgan and it was seen as horrific. I see it like this. If your not willing to go into combat and possibly die then don't sign up. Simple. People's reactions just confused meat the time. It's like these where civilians who didn't know what could happen to them and they'd been forced to fight and die. 400 KIA is extremely light casualty figure for that period of time in combat. So yes the pacifist movement is nullifying what we can do and in the long run detrimental.
@W8minute..I agree with you too.
Quote from: TacticalWargames on December 07, 2015, 06:53:20 AM
@MikeGer...exactly what I was getting at when I said governments where to scared of public opinion. Blimey the UK lost around 400 soldiers over god knows how many years in Afgan and it was seen as horrific. I see it like this. If your not willing to go into combat and possibly die then don't sign up. Simple. People's reactions just confused meat the time. It's like these where civilians who didn't know what could happen to them and they'd been forced to fight and die. 400 KIA is extremely light casualty figure for that period of time in combat. So yes the pacifist movement is nullifying what we can do and in the long run detrimental.
@W8minute..I agree with you too.
You're right. And you're right to that in the wider context of history 400 KIA, is a very low loss rate especially for modern warfare. If you go to war you should do it properly to achieve a win, not by airstrikes only. It needs boots on the ground and an ROE that allows troops to have every chance on the battlefield. I do truly feel for innocent civilians caught in the crossfire, but that is war, and the sooner you can get it over with the better. Better to go in hard and win by doing whatever you have to do to destroy your enemy, than have a smouldering indecisive war that drags on forever, with no future for the civilians who have no stake in it.
Exactly. Soldiers in the UK forces are not conscripts, they choose to do that job. IF your not willing to put your life in danger then don't join up. If someone does join up and they are killed in the line of duty they where doing the job that they are paid to do. No one forced them and the general public need to except that a soldiers duty may end with their death and that's what they are paid and trained for. If no one is willing to except that then what's the point of having an Army\Navy\Airforce in the first place. Honestly the reaction to what was an extremely light casualty figure really did baffle me. I also think it had an effect on how effective our forces where in Afgan.
It's easy to say 'don't join up' but when I joined the state guard, one of the attractive features was 'no deployment outside of New York.' Three years ago that had me feel safer, as well as being part of a strictly humanitarian, disaster relief centered unit.
But for the last few months I have pulled a lot of guard/traffic duty, out in the public eye, and in light of recent events the battlefield is everywhere. Me going out there with a radio only for protection makes me a little uneasy on post.
Permission to be armed while in uniform and on duty would go a long way in easing nerves, for my unit and organization anyway.
Right now I feel a bit like a sitting duck. But it's in the hands of politicians, once again.
Quote from: Gusington on December 10, 2015, 10:04:53 AM
But it's in the hands of politicians, once again.
No its in the hand of the citizens and the NG members to fight for it and force the politicians by public opinion and polls,
when a large group of NG members, better the whole unit or even serveral units say: "Either we can carry a M9 sidearm if offical terror threat warning level in area of operation is i above number x, or we all quit" and start a campaign in the media it should work out.
I wish t were that cut and dry and not so strangled by red tape.
Quote from: Gusington on December 10, 2015, 11:08:49 AM
I wish t were that cut and dry and not so strangled by red tape.
This would be one (out of thousands) of examples where a union mindset could be helpful. Refuse work based on the employer not providing the required equipment to conduct duties as safely as possible. I know, it is far from being that cut & dry; but the right chat with the right reporter could bring the issue to the public's attention- which could bring the issue to the Governor's attention.
Well technically we are volunteers until we are deployed so I am not sure how that would work either.
Quote from: Gusington on December 10, 2015, 10:04:53 AM
It's easy to say 'don't join up' but when I joined the state guard, one of the attractive features was 'no deployment outside of New York.' Three years ago that had me feel safer, as well as being part of a strictly humanitarian, disaster relief centered unit.
But for the last few months I have pulled a lot of guard/traffic duty, out in the public eye, and in light of recent events the battlefield is everywhere. Me going out there with a radio only for protection makes me a little uneasy on post.
Permission to be armed while in uniform and on duty would go a long way in easing nerves, for my unit and organization anyway.
Right now I feel a bit like a sitting duck. But it's in the hands of politicians, once again.
I totally agree. If you're on active duty, and there is a chance you "could" be targeted (which these days could be anywhere - remember Drummer Rigsby in the UK, killed in the street), you should at least be allowed your side arms as a matter of security. It seems obvious to me, but perhaps the government want to have a death to point to before they make sensible decisions. It's not as though you're irresponsible, or an untrained firearms handler. :idiot2: