In addition to the mobile version, you can soon grab it for PC/Mac on Steam. Coming in "February":
http://store.steampowered.com/app/420440/ (http://store.steampowered.com/app/420440/)
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
I have this for my iPad and it's a fun time waster....
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 24, 2016, 01:50:34 PM
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
looks very nice - moist interest
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 24, 2016, 01:50:34 PM
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
This game is not a deep as Great Naval Battles... much lighter fare....
Quote from: Barthheart on February 24, 2016, 02:08:05 PM
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 24, 2016, 01:50:34 PM
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
This game is not a deep as Great Naval Battles... much lighter fare....
Bingo.
Looks a lot nicer on those PC screenies/vid than on my iPad though...
I played it on iPhone.
Quote from: Barthheart on February 24, 2016, 02:08:05 PM
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 24, 2016, 01:50:34 PM
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
This game is not a deep as Great Naval Battles... much lighter fare....
:(
Yeah sorry to burst yer bubble but I wanted to make sure you knew what you are getting... :(
Released: http://store.steampowered.com/app/420440/ (http://store.steampowered.com/app/420440/)
I'm definitely looking at it even though it is lighter fare, but it interests me.
It is fun, and this version looks real pretty.... I'll probably get it too. O0
Is there a damage/repair feature at least? GNBNA had a great one.
Quote from: bbmike on February 25, 2016, 11:43:01 AM
Is there a damage/repair feature at least? GNBNA had a great one.
From the game's manual:5) Subsystem Damage Report
Subsystems of a ship may be knocked out for several turns or destroyed. Damage control crews automatically attempt to repair each damaged subsystem each turn. However
some specific subsystems as well as destroyed subsystems cannot be repaired.
Gray No damage
Yellow Light damaged
Orange Moderate Damaged
Red Destroyed
In Battle of the Atlantic game mode, destroyed subsystems as well as overall ship damage and flooding are permanent and can only be repaired by visiting a port
Ports:2) Ships currently being repaired and rearmed
Status indicates the number of turns until work on the ship is complete. Once complete the ship becomes active and is released back into the zone. Bombing raids by enemy air forces can cause
delays to ships undergoing repairs/rearming. Number of turns required to repair/rearm based on ship size and damage amount.
Yes.... damage is fairly detailed in that damage gets allocated to specific ship components. You can for instance target the enemy ship's turrets to knock them out or target the stern to slow them down etc.
Repairs can be made to some systems during a battle not most have to wait until you can get to a port. Then the ship is laid up for a number of turns depending on how bad the damage is.
Also the enemy can bomb your ports, as random events, and thus slow down repairs. There are random events that have your forces bomb their ports as well.
Thanks, guys. This is starting to look more interesting...
sold
The damage is visual as well. If you take out a turret, all it's gun barrels will be pointing a skew downward. You can start fires that can set off secondary explosions.
Ships have main and secondary guns you can fire, but only one set a turn, ie some/all main guns OR some/all secondary guns. Some ships have torps you can fire. You can call in land based air strikes and all the ships nearby will fire flak at the plane.
Aircraft carriers have airstrikes that can be launched. You can damage the deck of a CV and delay air strikes until it's repaired.
Subs can attack with torps or deck guns. You can stalk a convoy at periscope depth before you attack. Escorts will hunt you with sonar and depth charges as you maneuver and dive trying to get away.
There's night battles where your sight is shortened and you need to rely on surface radar.... or fire star shells that help to correct your firing solutions.
It's is a fun game but it's not overly groggy.
I just bought it and I'm just starting up the tutorial. Graphics look very good coming from an iOS port.
I think they "upped" the graphics since the port over to PC... those sample pics look way better than the stuff on my iPad...
Looks like a real deal at $11 Cdn.
For that price, it seems to be worth it for me at least.
Just finished the third training mission and sunk three German freighters with the HMS Queen Elizabeth. I like how the gunnery range is roughly estimated at first and then narrows down slowly to more accurate numbers. It led to my first couple of shots being off at 19,000 yards and then started straddling the target on the third shot.
I too played Great Naval Battles and thought that was a great game.
I had a go at Victory at Sea but it didn't really grab me. Might have been the real-time aspect although I like WoW and that is as real time as you can get.
Are crews visible on deck?
I see little figures on the deck beside the guns and on the open bridges of the destroyers, but the figures do not move if I remember correctly.
Quote from: WallysWorld on February 25, 2016, 01:02:54 PM
For that price, it seems to be worth it for me at least.
Just finished the third training mission and sunk three German freighters with the HMS Queen Elizabeth. I like how the gunnery range is roughly estimated at first and then narrows down slowly to more accurate numbers. It led to my first couple of shots being off at 19,000 yards and then started straddling the target on the third shot.
I too played Great Naval Battles and thought that was a great game.
For 10 bucks USA, it is a strangely satisfying game and all I've done is the sink freighters training missions. Nice to see tribal class DDs!
Thanks Wally...so little static stick figure crews...that works for me.
Anti-aircraft fire is definitely deadly as I had three "Stringbags" shot down by German freighters during one of the training missions.
Yes it's deadly. Try to pick an approach angle that gets away form other ships. And try not to hold on too long... Kinda like playing chicken. ^-^
Can you save mid-mission?
I don't think you can save mid-mission. That's the one big thing that's really missing.
Quote from: Barthheart on February 24, 2016, 02:08:05 PM
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 24, 2016, 01:50:34 PM
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
This game is not a deep as Great Naval Battles... much lighter fare....
It does seem light, but so far the battles are somewhat convincing. After failing to sink the Bismarck with the North Carolina, I began to wonder if the thing was working at all. The (hypothetical) Lion sank the Graf Spee in about a minute so that seemed to be working. The next test battle was more interesting: the Graf Spee took most of two broadsides from the Devonshire, disappeared into a lot of smoke and blew up a few turns later. I think what happened was that a very lucky hit from Devonshire in the first exchange of frontal battery fire happened to hit the director (spotter in game terms). The Graf Spee went on tracking fire on Devonshire's original closing rate while the Heavy Cruiser turned away slightly as it came to broadside. I'm not entirely sure since I have turned target damage viewing off so I see hits and damage, but not system reports. Anyway, Graff Spee scored no hits and Devonshire scored about a dozen. Seems plausible. Certainly more plausible than North Carolina not sinking the Bismarck.
Quote from: MengJiao on February 26, 2016, 09:50:56 AM
Quote from: Barthheart on February 24, 2016, 02:08:05 PM
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 24, 2016, 01:50:34 PM
That looks really nice. I have wanted a successor to Great Naval Battles of the North Atlantic for a long time - hope this one fills the bill.
This game is not a deep as Great Naval Battles... much lighter fare....
It does seem light, but so far the battles are somewhat convincing. After failing to sink the Bismarck with the North Carolina, I began to wonder if the thing was working at all. The (hypothetical) Lion sank the Graf Spee in about a minute so that seemed to be working. The next test battle was more interesting: the Graf Spee took most of two broadsides from the Devonshire, disappeared into a lot of smoke and blew up a few turns later. I think what happened was that a very lucky hit from Devonshire in the first exchange of frontal battery fire happened to hit the director (spotter in game terms). The Graf Spee went on tracking fire on Devonshire's original closing rate while the Heavy Cruiser turned away slightly as it came to broadside. I'm not entirely sure since I have turned target damage viewing off so I see hits and damage, but not system reports. Anyway, Graff Spee scored no hits and Devonshire scored about a dozen. Seems plausible. Certainly more plausible than North Carolina not sinking the Bismarck.
The Bismark was an exceptional ship
The developer posted this on the Steam forum about damage handling:
"The ships are all made up of individual compartments with subsystems assigned to them which take damage depending on where a shell hits. Waterline or plunging fire will generally damage compartments causing flooding, and hits along the superstructure will tend to damage 'soft' equipment. Compartments that catch on fire may suffer secondary explosions that damage adjacent compartments or even cook off magazines. The hit decals are placed where the hits actually occur," according to Killerfish co-founder Nils Ducker.
"The ships all sink dynamically because the compartments will always flood differently depending on where you hit them. So there are no hitpoints or canned animations here. Since we already had this basic system since Pacific Fleet and we wanted to add better submarine combat an underwater camera was must-have since pretty much day one. The underwater effects themselves went through several iterations before ending up what you see in the game," he said.
Not mentioned here is that shell impact angles against belt or deck armour are also factored into the damage model."
Quote from: WallysWorld on February 26, 2016, 10:26:52 AM
The developer posted this on the Steam forum about damage handling:
"The ships are all made up of individual compartments with subsystems assigned to them which take damage depending on where a shell hits. Waterline or plunging fire will generally damage compartments causing flooding, and hits along the superstructure will tend to damage 'soft' equipment. Compartments that catch on fire may suffer secondary explosions that damage adjacent compartments or even cook off magazines. The hit decals are placed where the hits actually occur," according to Killerfish co-founder Nils Ducker.
"The ships all sink dynamically because the compartments will always flood differently depending on where you hit them. So there are no hitpoints or canned animations here. Since we already had this basic system since Pacific Fleet and we wanted to add better submarine combat an underwater camera was must-have since pretty much day one. The underwater effects themselves went through several iterations before ending up what you see in the game," he said.
Not mentioned here is that shell impact angles against belt or deck armour are also factored into the damage model."
The damage seems pretty high. I guess the hits always hit something (which is different from reality, where lots of hits don't do much). I guess that is better than the usual solution to hits: most hits are nominal -- a few are critical. In this game any hit is a critical of sorts with potential to do more damage. So the Graf Spee has blown up after 2 16-inch hits (very fast) and after about 10 8-inch hits (six turns later).
One thing that always annoyed me in the original GNB was that destroyers could take a lot of 13-15" hits and kept on coming. I remember hitting some destroyers with up 8-10 15" hits and still they kept charging at me except for a small decrease in speed.
I just finished the River Platte scenario as Graf Spee and managed to sink Achilles and Ajax and drove off Exeter which withdrew under a smoke screen. I took some damage and had a fire raging for a while that finally went out and my secondary guns were damaged.
It may be light compared to GNB, but I'm definitely having fun with it and for that price.
OK, sorry to be that guy again, but have they intimated any notion of MP?
It looks better than VoS which would up a large disappointment for me and, as has been said, the price is certainly right.
Quote from: Cyrano on February 26, 2016, 02:56:37 PM
OK, sorry to be that guy again, but have they intimated any notion of MP?
It looks better than VoS which would up a large disappointment for me and, as has been said, the price is certainly right.
There is no MP you broken record of a man.
The developer has posted that MP and mid-mission saves could be added in a future patch. He will gather ideas from the Steam forum and consider them.
He's also working on a new naval game, but no details.
@Wally -- Thanks
@RogueMounty -- Hey, look, soooooome people prefer playing with others than, well, you know...and I know you know...
Quote from: Cyrano on February 26, 2016, 03:14:53 PM
@Wally -- Thanks
@RogueMounty -- Hey, look, soooooome people prefer playing with others than, well, you know...and I know you know...
Ha! Just 'cause yer the same size as Napoleon and want to be Napoleon doesn't mean you have to combat other people like Napoleon... and, you know, lose in front of the entire civilized world.... sometimes the AIs are enough.
Quote from: WallysWorld on February 26, 2016, 02:59:24 PM
The developer has posted that MP and mid-mission saves could be added in a future patch. He will gather ideas from the Steam forum and consider them.
He's also working on a new naval game, but no details.
Thanks for this info.
After investigating this game further, it does look like a lot of fun. At ten dollars, it's an easy purchase too.
Was originally a bit perplexed that they would create a game about the whole range of WW2 warships, but then proceed to base it on the Battle of the Atlantic instead of the Pacific War. Made sense after seeing mention that this is a sequel and the original was actually based on the Pacific.
So I hope that his next release is an updated & fancier Pacific one again, for more direct warship vs warship confrontation as opposed to mostly convoy tinkering. I'd never complain about an 80s era WW3 naval war setting with this type of easy-to-learn engine, either. Curious to see what it turns out to be.
Played a couple scenarios.
Torpedoed Bismarck with Swordfish. Hit her with seven of eight torpedoes (the last torpedo bomber was shot down). Wasn't sure if she was gonna go down, despite having two turret citadels blown out and numerous fires raging and listing heavily to starboard. Had been peppering her with AP from the shadowing cruiser Sheffield's 6" guns, but obviously they weren't doing much of anything despite plunging fire into the deck & superstructure. I think the fire finally spread to a magazine, because a huge explosion & shockwave eventually sent her slowly to the bottom.
Damn is this addictive!
Best ten dollars I've spent on a game in awhile.
Looking forward to devoting plenty of time on the open-ended campaign, purchasing & moving ships about. I'd prefer to do it from the Allied side, but dunno if my ASW practice is up to par. My Hedgehog hit attempts have failed thus far.
How does this compare to Victory at Sea updated to 1.4? I actually like VoS, but I am intrigued by the turn-based nature. Just not sure that making a tactical naval game lends itself to turn-based gaminess.
Quote from: RyanE on February 27, 2016, 12:54:49 PM
How does this compare to Victory at Sea updated to 1.4? I actually like VoS, but I am intrigued by the turn-based nature. Just not sure that making a tactical naval game lends itself to turn-based gaminess.
I wasn't too enthralled by the gameplay vids of VoS I had seen, so I never picked it up. Looked too tablet-y and historically detached (along with the other similar one).
Did like the idea of turn-based, if it was done well enough.
I dunno. This one just seems more relevant to the subject matter, despite typical abstractions present in all games based on history. The fire adjustment & targeting is reasonable and the damage model seems to be pretty good for what it is. Extremely good, actually, for what it is - a $10 tablet port. I'm surprised with how good it is.
There's one of those stupid threads on Steam with people belly-aching about the altered German flags that the game uses.
Has anyone who owns this game looked inside of it to figure out what kind of textures are used for the flags?
I don't own the game at the moment because I'm waiting for it to go on sale (and I realize that I may have to wait a long time).
But while I'm waiting, could someone tell me if the flags are static images like Bitmaps, PNG's, or DDS files that I know how to manipulate, or some kind of dynamic file like a GIF that I haven't learned to play around with yet.
From the clips the flag on the ships needs to be replaced (which may or may not pose a problem, depending on how much it waves in the wind), and the flag on at least one of the posters needs to be changed. The poster flag (which was a very creative solution on their part) should be relatively easy to fix.
The game is reviewed favourably in this week's Flare Path on Rock Paper Shotgun
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/02/26/the-flare-path-dovetail-games-flight-school-interview-atlantic-fleet-review/ (https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/02/26/the-flare-path-dovetail-games-flight-school-interview-atlantic-fleet-review/)
He calls it the 'perfect beginner's wargame'
Quote from: Philippe on February 27, 2016, 01:49:35 PM
But while I'm waiting, could someone tell me if the flags are static images like Bitmaps, PNG's, or DDS files that I know how to manipulate, or some kind of dynamic file like a GIF that I haven't learned to play around with yet.
Non of these file types appear. This is what I have in my directories :
Directory of C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Atlantic Fleet\AtlanticFleet_Data\
Managed <DIR>
Mono <DIR>
Resources <DIR>
mainData 27/02/2016
resources.assets 27/02/2016
resources.resource 27/02/2016
ScreenSelector.bmp 27/02/2016
sharedassets0.assets 27/02/2016
sharedassets0.resource 27/02/2016
Directory of C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Atlantic Fleet\AtlanticFleet_Data\Managed\
Assembly-CSharp.dll 27/02/2016
Assembly-CSharp-firstpass.dll 27/02/2016
Assembly-UnityScript-firstpass.dll 27/02/2016
Boo.Lang.dll 27/02/2016
Mono.Security.dll 27/02/2016
mscorlib.dll 27/02/2016
System.Core.dll 27/02/2016
System.dll 27/02/2016
UnityEngine.dll 27/02/2016
UnityEngine.Networking.dll 27/02/2016
UnityEngine.UI.dll 27/02/2016
UnityEngine.xml 27/02/2016
Directory of C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Atlantic Fleet\AtlanticFleet_Data\Resources\
unity default resources 27/02/2016
unity_builtin_extra 27/02/2016
2 file(s)
Total filesize 2939 KB
2 folder(s)
303,17 GB free
One Steam reviewer opined that the designer seems to have used elements from Silent Hunter 3.
I noticed there were several replies to that thread; and while no one has addressed that question yet, the dev himself addressed another point about a quirk of the aiming process:
QuoteThe last shell of a salvo (which the camera follows) is always exactly accurate and with some practice can be used to consistently snipe at turrets, magazines, engines etc.
Wow, and this game is not even quite 129 MB! :o
Quote from: JasonPratt on February 27, 2016, 11:03:41 PM
Wow, and this game is not even quite 129 MB! :o
All it takes is smart programming. Think of all the games that ran on the Commodore 64 with a whopping 64KB of memory!
Quote from: Shelldrake on February 28, 2016, 08:40:34 AM
Quote from: JasonPratt on February 27, 2016, 11:03:41 PM
Wow, and this game is not even quite 129 MB! :o
All it takes is smart programming. Think of all the games that ran on the Commodore 64 with a whopping 64KB of memory!
Project Space Station! :smitten:
Quote from: JasonPratt on February 27, 2016, 10:59:48 PM
One Steam reviewer opined that the designer seems to have used elements from Silent Hunter 3.
Only thing I've noticed that looks similar is the campaign map. The colors of it look just like the one in SH3, but in small scale. The rest of it? Not really.
Quote
I noticed there were several replies to that thread; and while no one has addressed that question yet, the dev himself addressed another point about a quirk of the aiming process:
QuoteThe last shell of a salvo (which the camera follows) is always exactly accurate and with some practice can be used to consistently snipe at turrets, magazines, engines etc.
As long as you've adjusted your gun elevation well since your previous shots. ;)
The pair of vids in which I watched other players firing their guns didn't end up with them grasping the concept too well. Nor did they use the shot history on the map screen for help doing so. There is still some dead reckoning in there, but all the available tools (two different shell history trackers, radar & visual range estimation) are there to be pretty consistent in getting at least one shell hit, after the first salvo or two.
Unlike some of the other similar games, the way it's portrayed in
Atlantic Fleet seems to be themed a bit closer to actual gun direction in WW2. Simplified, of course.
I'm guessing the PC version will be more fleshed out than the iPad version ?
Quote from: Skoop on February 28, 2016, 11:51:50 AM
I'm guessing the PC version will be more fleshed out than the iPad version ?
There are better graphical settings in it. Still not going to win any awards, but it's sufficient enough to enjoy.
Not sure if there were any extras added to the gameplay, over the iOS version.
Quote from: Skoop on February 28, 2016, 11:51:50 AM
I'm guessing the PC version will be more fleshed out than the iPad version ?
I have both versions and can't see any game play or content difference. Just looks so much better on the PC when you crank up the graphics.
I didn't notice secondary guns being used in the videos of the game. Are they not included? Or maybe range-limited?
The big ships have secondary guns for sure as I have stepped through their selection to see what's available. I don't use them much because 1) they are range limited 2) they are smaller caliber = less damage.
I guess you would switch to those if you got in really close and your main guns can't depress enough, or maybe your mains are knocked out.
You can't fire your mains and secondarys in the same turn.... which seems odd but maybe for simplification. It would make a nice addition to the game however. as presently you can only fire one type of weapon system per turn.
That is a little odd.
Quote from: Barthheart on February 29, 2016, 11:01:51 AM
The big ships have secondary guns for sure as I have stepped through their selection to see what's available. I don't use them much because 1) they are range limited 2) they are smaller caliber = less damage.
I guess you would switch to those if you got in really close and your main guns can't depress enough, or maybe your mains are knocked out.
You can't fire your mains and secondarys in the same turn.... which seems odd but maybe for simplification. It would make a nice addition to the game however. as presently you can only fire one type of weapon system per turn.
I've only used the secondaries to conserve main gun ammo on campaign.
For example, using them to take out merchants or maybe enemy DDs with a Battleship.
Hmmm... good idea... though I've never come close to using all the main gun ammo in a campaign.....
Quote from: IronX on February 24, 2016, 01:00:44 PM
In addition to the mobile version, you can soon grab it for PC/Mac on Steam. Coming in "February":
http://store.steampowered.com/app/420440/ (http://store.steampowered.com/app/420440/)
I don't buy games anymore when the screenshots don't show the UI.
I can make pretty paintings myself.
Quote from: Nefaro on February 28, 2016, 11:41:39 AM
Unlike some of the other similar games, the way it's portrayed in Atlantic Fleet seems to be themed a bit closer to actual gun direction in WW2. Simplified, of course.
I'm still at the stage where the game seems pretty solid, if limited. I really like how the fighting plays out. You just really don't know what might happen. Fore example in one scenario, Hipper jumps a convoy in bad weather. Hipper hits a mechant ship and the two RN cruisers (on light and one heavy) promptly get hits on the Hipper since the range is close. Hipper makes smoke and runs for it. Not really what I was expecting, but still interesting.
My only real gripe is that there's not more -- for example, US cruisers and DDs...or the French and Italians!
Quote from: MengJiao on February 29, 2016, 02:40:59 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on February 28, 2016, 11:41:39 AM
Unlike some of the other similar games, the way it's portrayed in Atlantic Fleet seems to be themed a bit closer to actual gun direction in WW2. Simplified, of course.
I'm still at the stage where the game seems pretty solid, if limited. I really like how the fighting plays out. You just really don't know what might happen. Fore example in one scenario, Hipper jumps a convoy in bad weather. Hipper hits a mechant ship and the two RN cruisers (on light and one heavy) promptly get hits on the Hipper since the range is close. Hipper makes smoke and runs for it. Not really what I was expecting, but still interesting.
My only real gripe is that there's not more -- for example, US cruisers and DDs...or the French and Italians!
Italians in the Atlantic!!!! They barely left port
I have just sunk a freighter in the tutorial using one of my grandfathers ships the HMS Jervis, we are truly blessed with some of the games we are getting now.
I watched the freighter go down and I have to say I really like this game and i haven't even left the tutorial yet.
I'm not going to purchase this game until they give me the option of fighting a German ship crewed by Nazi dinosaurs...
^-^
Quote from: FarAway Sooner on February 29, 2016, 04:29:49 PM
I'm not going to purchase this game until they give me the option of fighting a German ship crewed by Nazi dinosaurs...
^-^
"I always thought I'd die of alcohol poisoning." ;D
Was that from the Oscars last night? Which one was Chris Rock?
Wow.
Quote from: FlickJax on February 29, 2016, 03:04:05 PM
Quote from: MengJiao on February 29, 2016, 02:40:59 PM
Quote from: Nefaro on February 28, 2016, 11:41:39 AM
Unlike some of the other similar games, the way it's portrayed in Atlantic Fleet seems to be themed a bit closer to actual gun direction in WW2. Simplified, of course.
I'm still at the stage where the game seems pretty solid, if limited. I really like how the fighting plays out. You just really don't know what might happen. Fore example in one scenario, Hipper jumps a convoy in bad weather. Hipper hits a mechant ship and the two RN cruisers (on light and one heavy) promptly get hits on the Hipper since the range is close. Hipper makes smoke and runs for it. Not really what I was expecting, but still interesting.
My only real gripe is that there's not more -- for example, US cruisers and DDs...or the French and Italians!
Italians in the Atlantic!!!! They barely left port
Yeah, but you can sink the Roma with 2 different kinds of glide bombs (already in the game!).
Plus, its always nice to see the two French pocket-battleship-killers try to do their job!
The most screwy part is where subs start by default in the campaign.
When they run into each other, my U-boats have all begun the battle already lined up for good torpedo spreads at passing convoys/groups.
I mean... 1st turn and you're spraying high probably hits, with enemy escorts having no prior chance of detecting any of them before the firing starts.
Had a scenario last night with six Type VII U-boats attacking a convoy of ~12 freighters, a BB, a BC, and two DDs along for the ride. Launched all fish on first turn, right at the start. Easy shots. Ended up being able to easily sink the battleship Warspite on turn 2, when the torpedoes arrived & before they even had time to react, despite it having destroyers in front & behind. Also got three freighters.
Then all I had to do in order to escape was spend the 3 turns it takes to dive to deepest possible sub depth and press the withdraw button. DDs didn't even have time to reach my boats before they disappeared from the battle.
There is a "+20% start distance" option I may try, to see if it helps. But I think the big problem is the location of the battle spawn for the subs. They should probably be placed ahead of the convoy, and everyone be given time to maneuver into position & escorts to possibly detect them.
Considering subs are a huge part of this game, it's just another reason I think a new Pacific version would be far superior. Despite cries from the "All Nazis, All The Time" bunch who complain about any WW2 game in which they cannot play them. ::)
TL;DR:
Battles with submarines have a set-up flaw in the open campaign. Makes it far too easy to get insta-kills and escape. OP.
You are talking about early war fights?
As the war progresses the convoys start to use "newer" tactics... more and better ASW escorts, zig-zag movements right from the start that won't let you fire and forget...etc.
Also not all sub placements are great. I've gotten lots with a 6 sub pack where 2 are ahead of the convoy one on either side about center and 2 at the rear. The rear ones almost never get any kills just too slow at periscope depth and surfacing is death.
A favourite tactic of mine is to only fire torps from one side of the convoy. Any kills will make the convoy veer in the other direction directly away from the attack.... directly into the other subs.
And always try to take out the escorts first then you can surface and gun the transports to save torps.
Quote from: Barthheart on March 01, 2016, 01:53:30 PM
You are talking about early war fights?
I haven't done the campaign, but the individual battles can be pretty spectacular. Why only a few days ago, Ramilles blew up both the Scharnhorst and the Gneisenau. Apparently, 15-inch hits at 16,000 yrds on the forward magazines are instant death for those two. Sounds plausible to me!
Excellent recommendation everyone. Just bought.
Stunned how good this is for so little.
Want MP rather badly now...
Word of mouth and sensible pricing actually do make a difference.
Given the enthusiasm in general for this game, and the low price point, buying this was a no-brainer. Installing now!
Quote from: Toonces on March 05, 2016, 03:31:53 PM
Word of mouth and sensible pricing actually do make a difference.
Given the enthusiasm in general for this game, and the low price point, buying this was a no-brainer. Installing now!
Ditto.
On my wish list. Bastards.
Quote from: Cyrano on March 05, 2016, 02:50:18 PM
Stunned how good this is for so little.
Want MP rather badly now...
It's good as far as it goes. You can think of lots of things to fix or add (rate of fire for example, US DDs and cruisers, MP), but for what it does it is a gem.
Love the battles pace wise, larger start ranges would be nice and a strategic layer would be bloody marvellous:)
I thought there is a strategic layer...no?
Quote from: Gusington on March 07, 2016, 05:48:03 PM
I thought there is a strategic layer...no?
There certainly is. Called "Battle Of The Atlantic". There are two types of campaigns, and this is the one where you move, plan & purchase on the campaign map.
It also has a +20% start range option on the Options screen (with a few other extras) although I've not tried it out to see if it hits the sweet spot.
I thought that. Ok then.
Of course I'm Cato the Elder on this point, but, until it has MP, its true merits will not be tested and revealed...
Quote from: Nefaro on March 07, 2016, 09:55:05 PM
Quote from: Gusington on March 07, 2016, 05:48:03 PM
I thought there is a strategic layer...no?
There certainly is. Called "Battle Of The Atlantic". There are two types of campaigns, and this is the one where you move, plan & purchase on the campaign map.
It also has a +20% start range option on the Options screen (with a few other extras) although I've not tried it out to see if it hits the sweet spot.
oops not tried that yet, sorry Gus
I really love the gunnery duels, but so far the ASW (since I've been playing the RN, I've only fought against subs and not with one so far) warfare is undistinguished.
I almost always have the sub spotted on the first turn. Always at periscope depth.
It just sits there (or maybe moves slowly, I can't tell) at periscope depth until you hit it or nearly hit it with gunnery. Then it dives.
It will almost always fire torpedos right away and hit my biggest ship, which has no chance to escape, even if it hits all back and hard over on the first turn. It never misses with a down the throat torpedo shot.
Upshot is I don't really the missions that involve subs, and I think this part needs some work.
But ship to ship combat is really great.
No problem FJ, I thought I read that it had that strategy component above.
I really like the game as well. However, it's not perfect.
Getting a freeze now and then.
still havent touched the proper campaign ::) but am still loving the battles some last ages. Not sure about how some of the enemy ships seem to go straight into reverse some times though!!
Quote from: FlickJax on March 09, 2016, 08:24:38 AM
still havent touched the proper campaign ::) but am still loving the battles some last ages. Not sure about how some of the enemy ships seem to go straight into reverse some times though!!
That usually only occurs if they collide/about to collide... However
MY ships won't do that and some fairly interesting damage can result from collisions..... :tickedoff:
Quote from: glen55 on March 08, 2016, 11:14:29 AM
I really love the gunnery duels, but so far the ASW (since I've been playing the RN, I've only fought against subs and not with one so far) warfare is undistinguished.
I almost always have the sub spotted on the first turn. Always at periscope depth.
It just sits there (or maybe moves slowly, I can't tell) at periscope depth until you hit it or nearly hit it with gunnery. Then it dives.
It will almost always fire torpedos right away and hit my biggest ship, which has no chance to escape, even if it hits all back and hard over on the first turn. It never misses with a down the throat torpedo shot.
Upshot is I don't really the missions that involve subs, and I think this part needs some work.
But ship to ship combat is really great.
The sub combat is the weak spot. The instant launch position at start is the most notable issue.
yeah, ive had that, if the AI starts with the initiative and theres subs - a ship is going down - can this be fixed with the longer starting range option ticked?
also ive never had an enemy sub do nothing but shoot at me and wait to be hedgehogged or depth charged, no evasive maneouvers or diving deep and breaking contact - i think maybe the AI routines for subs are the same as the surface ships - trade shots until one sinks
I was fighting the bismark yesterday and sank its escort first, I had 2 BBs and it tried to run it was a stormy engagement and it only turned once i had managed to get it in range and hit a few times. It did run for quite a few turns though as my gunners were struggling.
Atlantic Fleet version 1.01 is now available.
Additions:
- all sliders can now be used via key commands
- keys for 0.1 degree elevation change
- full keyboard support for tactical map
- ship telegraph now responds to each setting individually
- ship speed can also be set by keys 1-6
- mouse wheel zoom for tactical map and binoculars
- hide combat interface toggle for screenshots, F9 Key
- submarine depth now displayed
- keys for selecting carrier wings and load out
Fixes/Improvements:
- fixed a bug that *might* involve AI movement hanging the turn
- holding mouse button on a slider when firing no longer hangs the turn
- improved graphics/shader compatibility
- distant smoke no longer blocks closer ships
- player hedgehogs no longer cause sonar disruption
- added missing AA guns to Courageous class
- improved pilot graphics on some aircraft
- decreased shell graphic size
- music in combat set to on by default
Quote from: FlickJax on March 10, 2016, 07:49:19 AM
I was fighting the bismark yesterday and sank its escort first, I had 2 BBs and it tried to run it was a stormy engagement and it only turned once i had managed to get it in range and hit a few times. It did run for quite a few turns though as my gunners were struggling.
i think the Bismark probably thinks 'im just going to sit here and pound you!'
I've never had a problem with the enemy subs, or mine for that matter, starting so close and getting the first easy kills. I take this to represent the effort they spent to get to that point and my forces being surprised. Subs were really a very scary weapon in WWII. That's the point. You usually didn't know they were in your midst until the first ship was struck/sunk.
Quote from: undercovergeek on March 10, 2016, 08:13:04 AM
Atlantic Fleet version 1.01 is now available.
Additions:
- keys for 0.1 degree elevation change
O0 Just picked up AF the other day...and trying to adjust the elevation with the mouse was a real PITA.
Quote from: undercovergeek on March 10, 2016, 08:13:42 AM
Quote from: FlickJax on March 10, 2016, 07:49:19 AM
I was fighting the bismark yesterday and sank its escort first, I had 2 BBs and it tried to run it was a stormy engagement and it only turned once i had managed to get it in range and hit a few times. It did run for quite a few turns though as my gunners were struggling.
i think the Bismark probably thinks 'im just going to sit here and pound you!'
And it's usually right!
Last night I had an encounter with the Rodney! It was protecting a single transport and I had 2 of the smaller battleships, 2 pocket battleships, a light cruiser and 2 destroyers.
Well, the Rodney stood her ground well and sank the Graf Spee with just 2salvos while my ships were still ranging in. More back and forth pounding and the Scharnhorst goes down and finally the Rodney is on fire. She turns to run. My light cruiser starts chasing the transport when suddenly the Rodney turns back and blows the CL out of the water with one salvo! But by turning back my other ship were able to land enough hit to slow the Rodney.
Next salvo from the Rodney is aimed at the last BB and clips it but also nails a DD that was passing astern and it goes down. Last DD is finally close enough to the Rodeny to put 3 troops into her and send her to the bottom.
Great battle but bloody expensive on my side....
Quote from: steve58 on March 10, 2016, 08:20:17 AM
Quote from: undercovergeek on March 10, 2016, 08:13:04 AM
Atlantic Fleet version 1.01 is now available.
Additions:
- keys for 0.1 degree elevation change
O0 Just picked up AF the other day...and trying to adjust the elevation with the mouse was a real PITA.
There is a small box just above the horizontal slider that looks like [< >]. If you click on the then both sliders will move very slowly for large movements of the mouse. Kind of a fine adjust.
Quote from: steve58 on March 10, 2016, 08:20:17 AM
Quote from: undercovergeek on March 10, 2016, 08:13:04 AM
Atlantic Fleet version 1.01 is now available.
Additions:
- keys for 0.1 degree elevation change
O0 Just picked up AF the other day...and trying to adjust the elevation with the mouse was a real PITA.
the definition of frustration was struggling for 20 minutes to scroll that 0.1, firing and overshooting by the .1 you just fought with!
^this!
Thx for the elevation tip Barth.
Quote from: undercovergeek on March 10, 2016, 08:13:04 AM
Atlantic Fleet version 1.01 is now available.
Additions:
- all sliders can now be used via key commands
- keys for 0.1 degree elevation change
- full keyboard support for tactical map
- ship telegraph now responds to each setting individually
- ship speed can also be set by keys 1-6
- mouse wheel zoom for tactical map and binoculars
- hide combat interface toggle for screenshots, F9 Key
- submarine depth now displayed
- keys for selecting carrier wings and load out
Fixes/Improvements:
- fixed a bug that *might* involve AI movement hanging the turn
- holding mouse button on a slider when firing no longer hangs the turn
- improved graphics/shader compatibility
- distant smoke no longer blocks closer ships
- player hedgehogs no longer cause sonar disruption
- added missing AA guns to Courageous class
- improved pilot graphics on some aircraft
- decreased shell graphic size
- music in combat set to on by default
Sounds good! Especially the key for the .1 range or azimuth adjustments!
At the risk of seeming dense, which key do you hit for the 0.1 elevation adjustments ?
Quote from: Philippe on March 10, 2016, 02:05:33 PM
At the risk of seeming dense, which key do you hit for the 0.1 elevation adjustments ?
something like U I 2 8 and or X X 9 7 (its in the options where you can get the keys assignments IIRC)
I just sank the Bismarck with the North Carolina, but didn't use the keys all that much.
I finally got to spend some time with this today. This is a gem of a game- highly recommended!
Lite, but still quite a bit of fun. O0
Quote from: Barthheart on March 10, 2016, 08:15:53 AM
I've never had a problem with the enemy subs, or mine for that matter, starting so close and getting the first easy kills. I take this to represent the effort they spent to get to that point and my forces being surprised. Subs were really a very scary weapon in WWII. That's the point. You usually didn't know they were in your midst until the first ship was struck/sunk.
One big problem with the initial set-up conditions involving wolf packs has been where the convoy escorts are located. They start lined up as part of the box formation of the convoy. They may be on the outside line but they are close-in and, therefore, pretty much useless as a convoy screen. Those DDs should be further out, forcing subs to approach from further out & ahead.
Hell, my large wolfpack attack example started with two British DDs lined up on the same side of the convoy, just as cargo vessels would be. Which is just wrong. The BB was also out ahead of the rest by one space.
I've been an avid sub simmer for decades. This sub vs convoy attack setup doesn't jive well with me, it's presumptions causing issues. Escorts also have insanely accurate sonar, which makes the ASW further problematic. The subs are also automatically detected from the very beginning. It boils down to the subs taking their free & easy shots on the first turn, then diving to maximum depth to automatically leave the battle. Because the AI escorts will sail straight to them & kill them on the first DC run if they haven't.
The simplification in the surface warfare part is fine, and works well enough to be a nice "Lite" & enjoyable portrayal. But the sub warfare is too simplified in numerous ways. So the ASW part of the game hasn't been a good representation in my few experiences. Unfortunately, this is the Atlantic war so it has tons of ASW in the campaign.
I still think a sequel in the Pacific would be far superior, playing to the game's surface warfare strength and having less ASW focus. This is a great game with a great price and I've enjoyed it thus far. I just hope this series progresses further, and that this facet gets much needed refinement along the way. :)
How does it compare to Victory at Sea? It looks like it's very entertaining even if there are issues with it, but at least the Dev seems to be patching. Anyway, I'm in from what you guys are saying. O0
Quote from: Nefaro on March 13, 2016, 11:15:05 PM
I still think a sequel in the Pacific would be far superior, playing to the game's surface warfare strength and having less ASW focus. This is a great game with a great price and I've enjoyed it thus far. I just hope this series progresses further, and that this facet gets much needed refinement along the way. :)
Actually, I believe Atlantic Fleet is the sequel. The series started with Pacific Fleet and Pacific Fleet 2. They are only available on the ios though.
Just downloaded and played the Graf Spee scenario. I lost all my ships but the GS was so damaged it got scuttled. What a great little game. It seems a cross between Battlefleet 2 for the mechanics and Victory at Sea for the 3d modelling. I think the ship modelling in AF is sharper than VAS, and you get far better zoom.
I was profoundly disappointed in VaS, a game I'd liked a great deal on the tabletop.
And it's funny, Charles, that you mention the zoom. Drove me absolutely mad in VaS.
This is a very, very good game that would, for me, become irreplaceable if it had MP.
@Cyrano :)
I think it does have multiplayer. I haven't explored it much, but the scenario's allow for another human player because you can turn that off/on in the scenario menu. I admit, I have no idea whether it works online, or how you would send your turns, but there is definitely the suggestion of multiplayer. I'll send you a screen from the conversation I've had with Sauron about multiplayer.
Quote from: Boggit on March 22, 2016, 09:14:18 PM
@Cyrano :)
I think it does have multiplayer. I haven't explored it much, but the scenario's allow for another human player because you can turn that off/on in the scenario menu. I admit, I have no idea whether it works online, or how you would send your turns, but there is definitely the suggestion of multiplayer. I'll send you a screen from the conversation I've had with Sauron about multiplayer.
I thought it was just hotseat capable?
@Nefaro :)
Oh you might be right there. I saw the opportunity to have a second player, and 2+2=5 so thinking multiplayer. Like I said it was just a first impression, and didn't look very far into it.
Quote from: Boggit on March 24, 2016, 10:01:58 PM
@Nefaro :)
Oh you might be right there. I saw the opportunity to have a second player, and 2+2=5 so thinking multiplayer. Like I said it was just a first impression, and didn't look very far into it.
Should add multi via IP to the Want List for the next version.
I saw a dev post, regarding just such a request, that they were considering another series release in the future with multi-player and some other stuff. Whether that happens... I dunno.
It would be a very neat feature. O0