"Not A Wargame," I know, but for some reason I trust the opinions of this community ;)
As title says - curious if anyone has jumped on board with this and is enjoying it. I'm fighting a strange compulsion to buy this even though (A) I suck at hack & slash (B) I avoid horror-themed titles (C) I bought Witcher III on sale and have put all of an hour into it (discovering quickly that I suck at combat in that game too).
Musings, opinions, thoughts welcome....
I've tried to get into these games and I just don't see what the draw is. The big boss battles where you have to find the "trick" to winning does nothing for me. Furthermore, the guaranteed fact of dying repeatedly and having to advance through trial and error has no appeal for me.
I'll probably pick this up when it is steeply discounted. But for $60, I know I'm just not going to play.
Yeah, that's pretty much my thinking as well. I should resist the urge to pony up $60 for a game that I"m highly likely to play for an hour and then drop because the enemies are too hard. (Exactly what I did with Witcher III).
The thing that's drawing me though is the game's aesthetic. There's something undeniably cool about the game's 'doomy' atmosphere. The landscapes and cities, ruined castles etc. look amazing. Also, I'm a sucker for games with cool loot. Finding a kick-ass sword or something after defeating a hard enemy has a strong appeal to me.
Quote from: sandman2575 on April 13, 2016, 08:49:05 AM
Yeah, that's pretty much my thinking as well. I should resist the urge to pony up $60 for a game that I"m highly likely to play for an hour and then drop because the enemies are too hard. (Exactly what I did with Witcher III).
The thing that's drawing me though is the game's aesthetic. There's something undeniably cool about the game's 'doomy' atmosphere. The landscapes and cities, ruined castles etc. look amazing. Also, I'm a sucker for games with cool loot. Finding a kick-ass sword or something after defeating a hard enemy has a strong appeal to me.
I agree. That's the draw for me too. The armor and weapons and all the cool loot. But the gameplay just doesn't suit my tastes...at least in the first two games. I was very frustrated by it all.
Im a big Dark Souls fan. Picked it up today and played until i got to the second bonfire at the highwall.
You have to have good muscle memory, pattern recognition and knowledge of japanese gaming tropes deisgned to screw you to be good at this game.
I beat both of the previous ones, and now i will beat dark souls l33t
I picked it up too, also at the second highwall bonfire and really enjoying it so far.
I hadn't played one of the Souls games since Demon's Souls on PS3 many years ago, which I had tried to play but found too hard, with no obvious path, and anxiety inducing at the time.
I picked up DS2 a few weeks ago in a sale and did a bit of research about how to play these games and it really clicked with me now that I know they aren't just a horror hack and slash game. The series is incredibly deep and is more about being patient in how you engage the enemies and being really tactical in the combat. You can't just play it as a twitch game mashing the attack button and do well, you have to be smart and watch how the various enemies attack, then dodge or block and wait to strike them when they miss or make the wrong move, if all else fails and you die, it's no big deal, you're undead so you come back at the last bonfire and can try again. Once I understood those basic aspects, I found the combat really rewarding compared to most first person RPGs which are more of a twitch hack and slash game.
DS2 is good and really enjoyable but the textures still look like a console port. DS3 is a new engine with more detailed textures and on my system (i5-2500k/GTX970) it looks and feels great, besides the great game play I'm really enjoying the incredibly detailed artwork and settings.
I took a couple of screenshots to use as wallpaper, and it's really amazing how well it looks:
http://imgur.com/a/9yIvu
Kludger - agreed. Dark Souls is much more than a simple hack and slash. I'd go so far as to call the first one a masterpiece (I haven't played the other two). It's an absolutely stunning world and there's much, much more depth to the gameplay than at first appears and there's plenty of RPG to it, too. The enemies are interesting, loot/crafting really satisfying, battles are significantly more interesting than in general hack and slash, and it's just beautiful. Dark Souls is nothing less than a work of art in my opinion. I suck at it, but I'm awed by it nevertheless. :)
QuoteI was very frustrated by it all.
Then this game series is not for you :coolsmiley:
Seriously, it demands a high tolerance level for this kind of gameplay and not everybody has it. For those who do have it this series is a blast to play - even if you die you usually don't because of the game but because of a bad move or lacking focus in combat, trying to rush etc..
Although I could not play it with kb/m combo, that's for sure O:-)
BTW one great improvement in DS3 compared to DS2 for non-twitch gamers like me who die alot (and I mean ALOT), is when you die in DS3, your max HP no longer goes down with each death.
That was something that made DS2 hard to learn, since you got weaker with each death up to a point.
Thankfully DS3 no longer has that, if you die, no big deal, you come back good as new health wise, you just drop the souls you had harvested.
I'm finding the beginning of DS3 as a Knight much less difficult than in DS2.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on April 13, 2016, 10:28:23 AM
Kludger - agreed. Dark Souls is much more than a simple hack and slash. I'd go so far as to call the first one a masterpiece (I haven't played the other two). It's an absolutely stunning world and there's much, much more depth to the gameplay than at first appears and there's plenty of RPG to it, too. The enemies are interesting, loot/crafting really satisfying, battles are significantly more interesting than in general hack and slash, and it's just beautiful. Dark Souls is nothing less than a work of art in my opinion. I suck at it, but I'm awed by it nevertheless. :)
Yeah I agree Huw, once I got past the idea that sometimes I will have die to learn enough about that situation to get past it on my next try, then I stopped being frustrated and could enjoy the great beauty and depth which keeps me coming back for more.
We are so used to playing games these days, where dying is a rare and mostly avoidable thing (especially RPGs), so this core concept of dying as part of the gameplay really shocks our playing sensibilities at first until you understand that this is just a normal part of the game.
In a way it's like when playing a wargame, some units are going to die in order to win the battle.
Quote from: Grimnirsson on April 13, 2016, 10:47:04 AM
even if you die you usually don't because of the game but because of a bad move or lacking focus in combat, trying to rush etc..
I forgot to mention this, yeah. You very rarely die due to bad luck. All of the "grunts" you meet in the game are
in theory easy to kill, but it only takes one bad move and you're skewered. You will only have yourself to blame for it!
Quote from: Huw the Poo on April 13, 2016, 11:20:44 AM
Quote from: Grimnirsson on April 13, 2016, 10:47:04 AM
even if you die you usually don't because of the game but because of a bad move or lacking focus in combat, trying to rush etc..
I forgot to mention this, yeah. You very rarely die due to bad luck. All of the "grunts" you meet in the game are in theory easy to kill, but it only takes one bad move and you're skewered. You will only have yourself to blame for it!
Yep, for me it's always when I get greedy, i.e when I try to get in an extra attack instead of backing off and preparing for the next counter.
cant you call other players in to help you out? risk of being killed unless you trust them, right??
I am a huge fan of Souls games. :smitten:
And yes, I do get frustrated often and need to take a break. >:D
But regardless I am firmly in Huw's camp; I think the Souls games are a true work of art and are much more than the common 'these games are hard as hell'.
The way they tell the story, not directly via cutscenes, but via NPC conversations, plaques you come across in the word and item descriptions in your inventory.
If you are open to it, finding out the story, what happened to its key players and such becomes a game in itself. A grand puzzle of mystery and amazement.
The dark, bleak and sad narrative really strikes a chord with me and adds to my curiosity to wanting to find out what the deal is in the world of DS.
The devs expertly weaved the plot of the three games into eachother to deliver one great magnus opus.
Then the precise and sharp combat mechanics! Oh my!
Button mashing will get you killed more often than is neccessary. To play DS well, you will need to practise pressing buttons at the right time. Look at your enemy and only lash out when his defense is down, or -if you have a defense breaker- land that blow to break his guard and follow up with a swift thrust or two.
No more though, because the enemy will recover and have a riposte of his own if you're still stuck in your thrust animation.
This true dance with your enemies is something I've never found in other games.
It makes for a slower experience than your typical ARPG game, because rushing will be punished severely. But I like it very much!
The enemies are a great bunch too. The game really manages to make you wonder wether it will be wise to move forward or not. There are no health bars visible up front, nor level indicators or such.
You just have to decide wether you think you can take on an enemy from looking at it. Does it look slow and lumbering, quick and nimble, etc.
Even non-boss encounters sometimes feature HUGE enemies, really making you feel tiny as a human, but oh so GREAT when you kick their ass!
This constant dread, glory, frustration and wonder is what makes these games so great, IMO.
You died!
Are there no difficulty settings?
QuoteAre there no difficulty settings?
:2funny:
Or in other words...no O:-)
Quote from: Grimnirsson on April 14, 2016, 11:37:23 AM
QuoteAre there no difficulty settings?
:2funny:
Or in other words...no O:-)
Sure there is. die, or quit. Plenty of choices ;)
So I couldn't resist and picked this up... only to quickly confirm that, indeed, the Dark Souls universe is beyond me.
The first boss fight -- who you encounter like only 20 minutes into the game, if that -- just decimated me. I'm hopelessly outmatched.
I was also like, "So, where's the menu / button that opens the Map?" (I can hear your Dark Souls veterans laughing from here...)
Will be submitting for a refund later today...
I tried with Dark Souls II but felt that I had enough punishment in other areas of my life that I didn't need it this bad in a game.
Sorry it didn't work out for you...
I am clearly the type of player Dark Souls intends to weed out -- slow reflexes, terrible situational awareness, easily rattled, lacking in perseverance...
The atmosphere is definitely cool, but I'm not hard-core enough to stick this one out.
Maybe I should try to actually put some time into Witcher III now instead.....
I would love to know of an RPG with a similar world with a more forgiving philosophy if there is one.
I hate that I'm agreeing with Jarhead so much lately, but once again I am firmly in his camp on this one. I simply cannot get into these games, and frankly, I just don't need this kind of stress in my life. The idea of playing a fight over and over to find the "trick" does nothing for me and that seems to be a recurring theme.
Which is too bad because I really want to play these games, but I simply do not have the ability to do this kind of stuff anymore- if I ever could.
Now then, if there was a sissy mode I'd be all over this, something where mashing the button could win a fight. I really want to enjoy the story.
I guess it's gonna have to be a Youtube walkthrough for me...I'll watch someone else beat the game and live vicariously through them.
Quote from: Toonces on April 14, 2016, 09:41:48 PM
I guess it's gonna have to be a Youtube walkthrough for me...I'll watch someone else beat the game and live vicariously through them.
That's a good idea, this Youtube playthrough has been pretty good to watch:
I've only watched up to the point I've got through in my game so far, his insights on the lore and the fights have been pretty interesting and helpful for a newbie like me.
QuoteSo I couldn't resist and picked this up... only to quickly confirm that, indeed, the Dark Souls universe is beyond me.
The first boss fight -- who you encounter like only 20 minutes into the game, if that -- just decimated me. I'm hopelessly outmatched.
I was also like, "So, where's the menu / button that opens the Map?" (I can hear your Dark Souls veterans laughing from here...)
Will be submitting for a refund later today...
Well if you buy a Souls game and you never played a game of the series before, then it's not surprising that you will have to face something new and beyond your normal game experiences. What I mean is, you surely have to give yourself more time than 20 minutes...the game is demanding and rewarding - because it's more demanding than what you usually play these days. You can not let the combat procedures sink in in 20 minutes...and you don't need a map for that. So no I'm not laughing but rather shaking my head... ::)
Quote from: Grimnirsson on April 15, 2016, 08:39:23 AM
Well if you buy a Souls game and you never played a game of the series before, then it's not surprising that you will have to face something new and beyond your normal game experiences. What I mean is, you surely have to give yourself more time than 20 minutes...the game is demanding and rewarding - because it's more demanding than what you usually play these days. You can not let the combat procedures sink in in 20 minutes...and you don't need a map for that. So no I'm not laughing but rather shaking my head... ::)
Always appreciate being condescended to -- thanks man.
Anyway, the game wasn't for me. End of story.
I've never been a fan of the Try This, Die; Try That, Die genre.
Quote from: sandman2575 on April 15, 2016, 09:11:30 AMAlways appreciate being condescended to -- thanks man.
You are welcome. Seriously, you don't have to be so peevish about it. First you say you trust the opinion of the community on this game and then you are in the sulks when someone is not understanding that you seemed to expect to master a game in 20 minutes that you have no experience with although you heard about the fact it is a bit more demanding than the casual stuff? ???
Whatever, try Bloodborne, much easier than the Souls games but similar spooky setting...
Safe to say I'm not the one coming across as peevish in this little exchange, which in any event isn't really worth pursuing further.
were is the reward again
THX but no THX O0
^hahaha! :2funny:
Haha ;D
This one was good too:
Haha, that was excellent Kludger!
Damn you, MikeGER. I just lost like an hour of my life watching those videos! :knuppel2:
Seriously, though, those Dark Souls games look so fantastic. I have the first one, but gave up on it at the first boss fight. Maybe I'll give it another try. I sure do wish there was a sissy hack, because I love the look and idea behind the games, but I simply don't have the button-reflexes to play them.
^Get in line!
Quote from: Toonces on April 15, 2016, 08:31:51 PM
Damn you, MikeGER. I just lost like an hour of my life watching those videos! :knuppel2:
well, the one I posted had only 4:19 minutes ...and that had all you needed to know ^-^
and saved you 60bucks and a month off ever trying to die-slash-die your way through just the tutorial of that console titles ;D
if you want to study the graphics - from a comtemporary modern art point of view, the art design ideas of the developer, or follow the "story" (if there is one?) to the end just watch a Let's play series on YT with a exceptional good scotch in your hand then a plastic controller.
(if you can find any where the high pitched pubertal comments of the juvenile presenter from the off are acceptable for a grown-up man, who did carrier landings in RL once, dives with sharks, and casually even met a SealTeam on training when he paddled so far far out on the deep blue ocean while waiting for the perfect wave to roll in... You and most of us repudiators are beyond any school-yard-pride DarkSoulsIII achievement and rewards )or just start/restart Witcher III ...there may be some new DLCs?
Welp. The abyss watchers is a stupid fight. I didnt realize i would to face a fume knight copy paste...goddamnit.