Yesterday on my office PC and today on my gaming machine, I "inadvertently" upgraded to Windows 10. I was getting popups everday but thought I was carefully closing the popups. Today I was playing DC 3 Barbarossa when, I swear, it happened on its own, right in the middle of my turn.
This happen to anyone else? I am really upset by it.
Yes it happened to me a few days ago. However when I got to the install screen I was able to hit 'decline legalese' and it actually worked...did not install. It did not offer you a last chance to decline their terms and abort the install?
No Gus. I didn't get to the legal until it had already installed, about an hour into it. I agreed to the legal stuff at that point thinking it was already done.
^Oh crap. Can you go to a previous install point on your HD?
Don't know. Not sure I want to mess with it either. What is in it for Microsoft to "force" you to "upgrade?"
Microsoft has been installing updates for a couple years now to allow them to do this to you. On my Win7 machine I have identified 7 updates so far that are part of it. You can decline installing them or even uninstall them (control panel/programs and features; select 'view installed updates' in upper left).
KB3068708
KB3022345
KB3075249
KB3080149
KB2952664
KB3035583
KB3138612
I'm sure there will be more. So far they have always been buried in the updates that aren't listed as a security update.
Quote from: Johnnie on May 21, 2016, 05:09:25 PM
Don't know. Not sure I want to mess with it either. What is in it for Microsoft to "force" you to "upgrade?"
My memory is that Microsoft buried into win10 the ability to force you to accept updates and to allow for subscription option for windows. This will allow them to force you to pay a yearly subscription to keep your PC functioning. Media and user backlash made them disable those features but I'm sure they can be turned back on.
They claim the reason is to reduce costs by not having to support older operating systems (not untrue).
It's to give them more control over your PC and, by extension, you. The built-in spyware is a revenue stream for them too.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 21, 2016, 05:19:31 PM
It's to give them more control over your PC and, by extension, you. The built-in spyware is a revenue stream for them too.
Bingo. Built-in spyware and adware.
Johnnie, there is a lengthy ongoing discussion about Windows 10 in this thread. Including folk's battles to keep Win 10 off their systems.
http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=13776.250
The settings on their pop-up windows changed a few weeks back, and it got a lot easier for folks to inadventently approve installation. They switched to an "opt out" model as opposed to an "opt in" model.
That said, the "free upgrade" window is coming to a close (for those who plan to ever install it) on (I think) June 30th. I don't have all the reservations that many do in the referenced thread and went ahead and took the plunge. It was the easiest upgrade I've done yet, but still had a pothole or two.
The fact that I've only hit one or two potholes almost a week in is annoying, but a good sign compared to previous upgrades. Once you do the upgrade, you can then reinstall from scratch with a clean build, should you so desire.
I set up my Windows 7 Updates to notify me of any updates, but not to download. That way I check each and every update for stuff like this Windows 10 upgrade thing.
The behavior from Microsoft is at least 20 years old. Anybody who still uses windows for anything important gets what they deserve.
You can disable the windows update service. I honestly don't think this carries a huge amount of risk if you are behind a hardware, software firewall + adblock. Wait until the plebs have tested out the updates, and update every few months or so. That has been my MO for years without issue. Small sample size and all...
Quote from: WallysWorld on May 21, 2016, 09:03:42 PM
I set up my Windows 7 Updates to notify me of any updates, but not to download. That way I check each and every update for stuff like these Windows 10 upgrade thing.
This.
I've been setting this option, on all my personal Windows installs, for years.
No sudden surprises.
Are some of my Windows features susceptible to some vague back door security issue? Perhaps. But I guarantee they still exist on the fully updated ones too. :P
Yes. It eventually installed 10 on my machine too. So far so good but that was annoying.
It's a bit faster than 8 but it messed up my start screen.
I have avoided it so far. Do you have to reinstall everything after the update?
Quote from: Anguille on May 22, 2016, 03:42:22 AM
I have avoided it so far. Do you have to reinstall everything after the update?
No, the only thing left to install is Windows 7.
Last week I did a mid-life upgrade on my PC as I was running low on RAM and HD space. It had been 5 years, so also time to refresh the OS. I decided to stick with Win7 for all of the above reasons. I like to run a pair of HDs with RAID-0 which provides a single logical drive but with the combined throughput of two. The Win7 install media lacks some of the drivers needed for the RAID config and for the life of me I could not remember all of the steps/software I'd used to get the original install working. I ended up with a half-baked Win7 install with all sorts of issues, so I decided to apply the Win10 upgrade for shits and giggles. The upgrade went fine, everything working as it should, and I must say that I'm quite pleased with the results. I find the UI to be more intuitive than with Win8. The desktop graphics I find to be more streamlined/minimalized, which is a new trend for MS. System performance also seems snappy. Overall I must admit to being unexpectedly impressed.
That said, my computer is basically a dedicated gaming/surfing PC. If that were not the case I'm not sure I would have even considered the Win10 upgrade given all the spyware and crap going on behind the scenes.
My Wife did the upgrade on her laptop awhile ago and loved it till this " "Critical Error - Start menu and Cortana aren't working. We'll try to fix it the next time you sign in."
Even if you do the "safe mode" boot half ass reset, it crashes every 2 to 3 days. >:(
What I find really screwed up about this error is that a complete year later and MS can't figure out why it happens or fix it :tickedoff:
I recently used Never10 on my Win7 computer at work to prevent the Win10 installation. Seemed to work just fine and the program will even delete 7 GB of Win10 files hiding on your hard drive.
http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/never_10.html (http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/never_10.html)
I actually did end up upgrading the bookshelf PC I use for my 3D printers and it is way better than Win8 for regular use but what I don't like is that a lot of the settings to tweak stuff are hard to find. Luckily I have an iMac for regular online computing because I would never use Win10 for web browsing (besides 3d forums related to printing, such as Thingiverse) or any kind of online banking or shopping. Same goes for any thing private such as researching medical questions or such. Ditto for email.
Quote from: Shelldrake on May 22, 2016, 08:21:44 AM
I recently used Never10 on my Win7 computer at work to prevent the Win10 installation. Seemed to work just fine and the program will even delete 7 GB of Win10 files hiding on your hard drive.
http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/never_10.html (http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/never_10.html)
I've used a similar tool to remove the Win10 nagware
It's the GWX removal tool found here -
http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/ (http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/)
Quote from: Richie61 on May 22, 2016, 07:49:46 AM
My Wife did the upgrade on her laptop awhile ago and loved it till this " "Critical Error - Start menu and Cortana aren't working. We'll try to fix it the next time you sign in."
Even if you do the "safe mode" boot half ass reset, it crashes every 2 to 3 days. >:(
What I find really screwed up about this error is that a complete year later and MS can't figure out why it happens or fix it :tickedoff:
Same thing happened to my wife.. It's funny I have an ID on her laptop that is fine. Only solution is to make a 'new' ID I found. Her desktop was covered 3 times over with icons, I wonder if that had something to do with it.
Quote from: Tuna on May 22, 2016, 09:09:53 AM
Quote from: Richie61 on May 22, 2016, 07:49:46 AM
My Wife did the upgrade on her laptop awhile ago and loved it till this " "Critical Error - Start menu and Cortana aren't working. We'll try to fix it the next time you sign in."
Even if you do the "safe mode" boot half ass reset, it crashes every 2 to 3 days. >:(
What I find really screwed up about this error is that a complete year later and MS can't figure out why it happens or fix it :tickedoff:
Same thing happened to my wife.. It's funny I have an ID on her laptop that is fine. Only solution is to make a 'new' ID I found. Her desktop was covered 3 times over with icons, I wonder if that had something to do with it.
I need to try something other that the safe boot deal. I think I will try a new ID too. Best part is that she is pissed about this and wants a new LT.
I will gladly take her 19" Toshiba Satellite LT that is 3 years old ;D
Quote from: Johnnie on May 21, 2016, 04:48:46 PM
Yesterday on my office PC and today on my gaming machine, I "inadvertently" upgraded to Windows 10. I was getting popups everday but thought I was carefully closing the popups. Today I was playing DC 3 Barbarossa when, I swear, it happened on its own, right in the middle of my turn.
This happen to anyone else? I am really upset by it.
Google: windows 10 rollback
Thanks for those never10 links guys! I was doing int manually but nice and easy to use these now.
If you do the rollback in the first month of instal you can just go to 'settings' and use the restore option. When I got to the office this morning and turned on the workhorse PC it immediately started to install Win 10. I'm almost certain that on Thursday or Friday my co-worker accidentally allowed the Win10 scheduler to set an install time over the weekend. I waited until the install was done, verified that Win 10 would not work with a key piece of serial tech, and then proceeded to throw Da Bum out. Easy-Peasy.
I did speak to the fabrication lab for whom we need the serial equipment and they just had a conference with some equipment manufacturers who warned them that the switch-over was almost certainly inevitable and not far off at all. Apparently it is a very poorly-kept secret that Windows as we know it will disappear and in it's place will come a constantly self-updating organism much like Google's Chrome OS, except not free. You will have to fork over some cash every so often for it to keep working.
Quote from: Staggerwing on May 23, 2016, 06:20:28 PM
If you do the rollback in the first month of instal you can just go to 'settings' and use the restore option. When I got to the office this morning and turned on the workhorse PC it immediately started to install Win 10. I'm almost certain that on Thursday or Friday my co-worker accidentally allowed the Win10 scheduler to set an install time over the weekend. I waited until the install was done, verified that Win 10 would not work with a key piece of serial tech, and then proceeded to throw Da Bum out. Easy-Peasy.
I did speak to the fabrication lab for whom we need the serial equipment and they just had a conference with some equipment manufacturers who warned them that the switch-over was almost certainly inevitable and not far off at all. Apparently it is a very poorly-kept secret that Windows as we know it will disappear and in it's place will come a constantly self-updating organism much like Google's Chrome OS, except not free. You will have to fork over some cash every so often for it to keep working.
The notion that you will be pushed into some sort of subscription scheme if you upgrade to Windows 10 is just not based on facts. There is an intense hate-fueled rumor mill that sees the worst in every MS action. I am not here to defend MS, but simply to reject the rumor mill. If you upgrade to Windows 10 while its free, you can use it and get updates for free (likely for many years). That much is clear. What is not clear is what will happen after Windows 10, several years down the road. Maybe the next version of "Windows" will be subscription based, nobody really knows except the people at MS.
If you are worried about your privacy, do some research and you can minimize the spying through various settings.
Quote from: Swatter on May 25, 2016, 03:03:05 PM
If you are worried about your privacy, do some research and you can minimize the spying through various settings.
You really shouldn't have to research to keep your OS from spying on you. MS has made it unnecessarily difficult for ordinary users to avoid the spyware built into Win 10. The presumption is that users have opted in unless they jump through hoops to opt out.
You won't be able to avoid the spying anyway. Anyone who thinks Microsoft respects privacy settings is incredibly naive.
Anytime you click that "agree" button on the legalese page you are giving away all of your rights, because they most certainly throw the kitchen sink in every agreement as a matter of course. Unless you like living in a hole, your actions will be observed, evaluated, and tabulated. I am not worried about corporations, their motivations are out in the open. What I am worried about for the future is government observing your personal data for political activity. Once that happens, we are all screwed then. I can see in the near future the government spying on you about your carbon footprint.
I installed Windows 10 at the first opportunity, and I think it's the best version of Windows by miles and miles.
Quote from: Swatter on May 25, 2016, 07:37:51 PM
Anytime you click that "agree" button on the legalese page you are giving away all of your rights, because they most certainly throw the kitchen sink in every agreement as a matter of course. Unless you like living in a hole, your actions will be observed, evaluated, and tabulated. I am not worried about corporations, their motivations are out in the open. What I am worried about for the future is government observing your personal data for political activity. Once that happens, we are all screwed then. I can see in the near future the government spying on you about your carbon footprint.
:idiot2:
Thanks for your valuable contribution to the discussion.
Windows users get what they deserve.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 25, 2016, 03:45:03 PM
You won't be able to avoid the spying anyway. Anyone who thinks Microsoft respects privacy settings is incredibly naive.
I'm willing to bet they do respect privacy settings. The problem is they make the proper use of the privacy settings extremely difficult, time-consuming, and unintuitive, not unlike the privacy settings on facebook, or other similar platforms.
If Microsoft was caught blatantly ignoring their own privacy settings and rules, that would constitute an unprecedented fraud that would could have drastic ramifications, both civil and criminal.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:41:24 AM
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 25, 2016, 03:45:03 PM
You won't be able to avoid the spying anyway. Anyone who thinks Microsoft respects privacy settings is incredibly naive.
I'm willing to bet they do respect privacy settings. The problem is they make the proper use of the privacy settings extremely difficult, time-consuming, and unintuitive, not unlike the privacy settings on facebook, or other similar platforms.
If Microsoft was caught blatantly ignoring their own privacy settings and rules, that would constitute an unprecedented fraud that would could have drastic ramifications, both civil and criminal.
Oh, I'm sure senior management already had an SOP in place to blame some "rogue programmer" to deflect blame and liability.
And I consider myself not to be one of the tin foil hat wearing cleg, I just have an utter disdain for the elitist upper class / ruling party / senior management who feel they are above the law whether it is legal, moral or general decency. IE the guys who say to company needs to sacrifice in the form of layoffs while still collecting 10MM bonuses.
Accountability starts at the top.
Its really wild to me just how much cynicism is out there.
Perhaps this is just another symptom of why Western civilization and capitalist ideals are on the decline. The belief that all corporations are motivated solely by greed and taking advantage of the masses...but I digress.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:56:42 AM
Its really wild to me just how much cynicism is out there.
Perhaps this is just another symptom of why Western civilization and capitalist ideals are on the decline. The belief that all corporations are motivated solely by greed and taking advantage of the masses...but I digress.
Not corporations JH, people.
People are fallible. When checks and balances to control human excess are no longer on place you get a breakdown of ethical choices.
Of course when the general population cares more about what happens with the reality star of the day rather than who their leaders are and what they are doing does not leave me with warm and fuzzies for our society.
Sorry for the rants, mods please feel free to delete if my post two posts are to political or off subject
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:38:45 AM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
That is really the crux of the issue. Ok. I like Linux and I'm willing to try it but I can tell you right now it is not a panacea for the woes of Windows. The Linux community does not help itself by being a bit on the elitist side and not working to make Linux EASIER TO USE than Windows. Let me install basic stuff like Juniper VPN without jumping through hoops and we'll talk. Like it or not Windows has a pretty standard install process for any and all software to be installed. I have yet to see that in Linux.
And at the end of the day there are still way too many games I want to play that are not supported in Linux. And I don't have the patience to muck about with Wine and such.
The real goal would be to make Linux as easy to use as a Mac.
Personally, I don't think all corporations are evil, profit driven steamrollers but there are too many examples of companies knowingly putting out an unsafe item, calculating that the payoffs to survivors and family members will cost less than fixing the item in the first place. All too often, corporations, like politicians, have earned our cynicism. I definitely have good feelings toward a number of companies and those are the guys I do business with, but it's hard to ignore the bad actors, especially in a near-monopoly situation.
But yeah, I don't see using anything other than Windows. They annoy me at times, but I can say the same of my wife ::)
Quote from: DoctorQuest on May 26, 2016, 10:40:19 AM
Like it or not Windows has a pretty standard install process for any and all software to be installed. I have yet to see that in Linux.
Uh....open package manager, find program you want, click install.
Open what? Click where?!
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:38:45 AM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
Bullshit. It's games, plain and simple. Everything else is no problem anymore. People still using a pedestrian non-online version of word or excel don't have their heads screwed on correctly.
People need to get used to the fact that a dedicated windows gaming box is the way to go, so that you can protect your non-gaming computers from both Microsoft and all those that exploit Microsoft's mistakes 24/7.
Oh and fsck people who want Linux to get "simpler". No thanks. The Linux community doesn't owe you anything and they get no benefit at all from more dummies who are unable to contribute anything technical.
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 26, 2016, 12:23:14 PM
Quote from: DoctorQuest on May 26, 2016, 10:40:19 AM
Like it or not Windows has a pretty standard install process for any and all software to be installed. I have yet to see that in Linux.
Uh....open package manager, find program you want, click install.
must agree. Linux is super easy to install these days. Has been for a long time really. Package managers for installing software are a standard feature. The only thing lacking imo is games.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 08:50:40 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:38:45 AM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
Bullshit. It's games, plain and simple. Everything else is no problem anymore. People still using a pedestrian non-online version of word or excel don't have their heads screwed on correctly.
People need to get used to the fact that a dedicated windows gaming box is the way to go, so that you can protect your non-gaming computers from both Microsoft and all those that exploit Microsoft's mistakes 24/7.
Oh and fsck people who want Linux to get "simpler". No thanks. The Linux community doesn't owe you anything and they get no benefit at all from more dummies who are unable to contribute anything technical.
This is funny. You sound like the king of dorks. An arrogant computer geek. Good for you.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:55:53 PM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 08:50:40 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:38:45 AM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
Bullshit. It's games, plain and simple. Everything else is no problem anymore. People still using a pedestrian non-online version of word or excel don't have their heads screwed on correctly.
People need to get used to the fact that a dedicated windows gaming box is the way to go, so that you can protect your non-gaming computers from both Microsoft and all those that exploit Microsoft's mistakes 24/7.
Oh and fsck people who want Linux to get "simpler". No thanks. The Linux community doesn't owe you anything and they get no benefit at all from more dummies who are unable to contribute anything technical.
This is funny. You sound like the king of dorks. An arrogant computer geek. Good for you.
Just fed up with people complaining about the problems they paid money to get into. Too many people who spent 20 years going from one Windows version to the next because "I know how to operate it", never actually learning to actually operate a computer and spending all the potentially useful learning time on memorizing where Microsoft has randomly moved menu items.
If people had used the same time to learn how a computer works, and don't use an OS that requires useless re-learning every version, they would have no problem operating a more transparent OS now.
I'll never understand the hatred Windows/MS brings out in some people. It works fine for my needs and I am happy, but I feel no need to convert people. On the other hand, once you take on Linux, its like becoming vegan or switching political parties. When someone releases an OS that fixes Windows problems and is widely supported by game developers and graphics card manufacturers I'll gladly switch over. Its just an OS, not a way of life or a religion. If spying is a person's primary concern, you need to pack up and go live in a forest eating bugs and twigs. You can be vegan and a Linux user at the same time!
Btw, you can count on in coming decades the government spying on you about your carbon use.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 08:50:40 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:38:45 AM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
Bullshit. It's games, plain and simple. Everything else is no problem anymore. People still using a pedestrian non-online version of word or excel don't have their heads screwed on correctly.
People need to get used to the fact that a dedicated windows gaming box is the way to go, so that you can protect your non-gaming computers from both Microsoft and all those that exploit Microsoft's mistakes 24/7.
Oh and fsck people who want Linux to get "simpler". No thanks. The Linux community doesn't owe you anything and they get no benefit at all from more dummies who are unable to contribute anything technical.
:o Ok. Whatever, dude. I'll stay as far away from your little clubhouse as I can.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 08:59:36 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:55:53 PM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 08:50:40 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 26, 2016, 08:38:45 AM
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 07:52:20 AM
Windows users get what they deserve.
That's a little harsh, don't you think?
What do you expect the majority of people using computers in the free world to do? Until software developers start making their products compatible with other platforms and OS's, there is simply no basis to attack the consumer who is clearly at the mercy of the industry.
Bullshit. It's games, plain and simple. Everything else is no problem anymore. People still using a pedestrian non-online version of word or excel don't have their heads screwed on correctly.
People need to get used to the fact that a dedicated windows gaming box is the way to go, so that you can protect your non-gaming computers from both Microsoft and all those that exploit Microsoft's mistakes 24/7.
Oh and fsck people who want Linux to get "simpler". No thanks. The Linux community doesn't owe you anything and they get no benefit at all from more dummies who are unable to contribute anything technical.
This is funny. You sound like the king of dorks. An arrogant computer geek. Good for you.
Just fed up with people complaining about the problems they paid money to get into. Too many people who spent 20 years going from one Windows version to the next because "I know how to operate it", never actually learning to actually operate a computer and spending all the potentially useful learning time on memorizing where Microsoft has randomly moved menu items.
If people had used the same time to learn how a computer works, and don't use an OS that requires useless re-learning every version, they would have no problem operating a more transparent OS now.
I don't know you, so I hate to start out this way, but this is just nonsense. Its silly to expect the average joe to have a deep understanding of operating systems. They might have 150 things to do in a day more important than worry about which OS they use. Its kind of the way the world works. Some people do brain surgery and others are computer experts. Your a computer geek, good for you. Other people just want access to technology without knowing exactly how it works.
I can build computers and program software, but I never feel the need to look down on others who have other interests. In fact, I enjoy being helpful and solving problems for people who ask nicely. Why does everything have to be so tribal?
Quote from: Swatter on May 26, 2016, 09:40:51 PM
I don't know you, so I hate to start out this way, but this is just nonsense. Its silly to expect the average joe to have a deep understanding of operating systems. They might have 150 things to do in a day more important than worry about which OS they use. Its kind of the way the world works. Some people do brain surgery and others are computer experts. Your a computer geek, good for you. Other people just want access to technology without knowing exactly how it works.
I can build computers and program software, but I never feel the need to look down on others who have other interests. In fact, I enjoy being helpful and solving problems for people who ask nicely. Why does everything have to be so tribal?
People have invested large amounts of time and energy into Windows-specific problems (drivers, random library messes from every application overwriting system libs, malware, supposed anti-malware, messy updates) or adapting to needless changes between Windows versions. If they had invested the same resources into something more useful they could have a clue about computers by now, or learned something else useful they could have chosen.
And now they wining is right back because oh boo-hoo Microsoft does a couple wacky things (win10 forced update, upcoming advertising etc).
Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed?
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 09:51:31 PM
Quote from: Swatter on May 26, 2016, 09:40:51 PM
I don't know you, so I hate to start out this way, but this is just nonsense. Its silly to expect the average joe to have a deep understanding of operating systems. They might have 150 things to do in a day more important than worry about which OS they use. Its kind of the way the world works. Some people do brain surgery and others are computer experts. Your a computer geek, good for you. Other people just want access to technology without knowing exactly how it works.
I can build computers and program software, but I never feel the need to look down on others who have other interests. In fact, I enjoy being helpful and solving problems for people who ask nicely. Why does everything have to be so tribal?
People have invested large amounts of time and energy into Windows-specific problems (drivers, random library messes from every application overwriting system libs, malware, supposed anti-malware, messy updates) or adapting to needless changes between Windows versions. If they had invested the same resources into something more useful they could have a clue about computers by now, or learned something else useful they could have chosen.
And now they wining is right back because oh boo-hoo Microsoft does a couple wacky things (win10 forced update, upcoming advertising etc).
Mod hat on: Ok, now you're just being a dick. Let's stop with the attitude and play nice.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 26, 2016, 09:51:31 PM
People have invested large amounts of time and energy into Windows-specific problems (drivers, random library messes from every application overwriting system libs, malware, supposed anti-malware, messy updates) or adapting to needless changes between Windows versions. If they had invested the same resources into something more useful they could have a clue about computers by now, or learned something else useful they could have chosen.
And now they wining is right back because oh boo-hoo Microsoft does a couple wacky things (win10 forced update, upcoming advertising etc).
Mate, instead of being hostile, do what I do: use the Windows 10 tech support thread (http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=13776.0) to patiently answer questions about Linux from people who show an interest... (and only very
occasionally taking the piss. ;) )
Grogheads: Home of the Angriest Nerds on the Interwebz
Quote from: Steelgrave on May 26, 2016, 10:41:22 AM
Personally, I don't think all corporations are evil, profit driven steamrollers but there are too many examples of companies knowingly putting out an unsafe item, calculating that the payoffs to survivors and family members will cost less than fixing the item in the first place. All too often, corporations, like politicians, have earned our cynicism. I definitely have good feelings toward a number of companies and those are the guys I do business with, but it's hard to ignore the bad actors, especially in a near-monopoly situation.
+1
From where I sit, the real challenge has been the decline in social (not economic) obligations from senior management to customers and employees. Running a big company is a hard thing, but I see all sorts of signs that senior executives too easily align their own self-interest with business solutions that put other's self-interest at risk.
It's not an evil thing or even an intentional thing. They're just willing to cross more lines than their predecessors were 30 or 40 years ago and that opens the door for rationalizing shady decisions. And it's not a universal thing, but it's common enough that you can only trust the handful of companies you've dealt with for a long time. And even then, you need to remain wary.
Firms that dedicate too many resources to doing the right thing (long-term) by their customers and employees are at greater risk for takeover. That's the nature of for-profit enterprise in a capitalist system. I'm not saying there's a better system out there, but this one has its warts too.
Does this one belong in Current Events?
Quote from: FarAway Sooner on May 27, 2016, 09:04:40 AM
Does this one belong in Current Events?
The way it's been trending, it probably belongs in RP&FW :P
Quote from: mirth on May 27, 2016, 09:19:18 AM
Quote from: FarAway Sooner on May 27, 2016, 09:04:40 AM
Does this one belong in Current Events?
The way it's been trending, it probably belongs in RP&FW :P
I know, right? Linux is kind of the AGW of the PC world around here.
This is why I don't trust MS. They've been hell bent on forcing Win10 on users. I have actively had to fight to keep it off my PC. It is too the point that I do not accept anything but security updates from MS and I very carefully read each of those before I install them.
http://www.infoworld.com/article/3075480/microsoft-windows/microsofts-get-windows-10-app-kb-3035583-re-appears-for-no-reason.html
These attempts to sneak Win 10 on to user's machines creates distrust and undermines the update process.
I am perfectly happy with Win 7 for the time being. I do not welcome Microsoft's attempts to force me to upgrade (nor do I welcome the attempts to install Win 10 style spyware on my Win 7 machine). In fact, it has been so pernicious that I do not plan to use any another Microsoft OS in the future. They've converted me from a satisfied customer to a future Linux user.
(https://67.media.tumblr.com/b3c02aabfa0532d6345017edb9aa404e/tumblr_njbo3eKC0O1sfmyv8o1_500.gif)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.relatably.com%2Fm%2Fimg%2Ffunny-ignorant-memes%2F85aecf4ce65da1d00a96a12df1e2994f0559e71edd6c2ac7099de81248e1d15d.jpg&hash=545ed03029625cdbe44d6e346f14a26a6a7d929f)
Well that was fun.
Sorry if I went a bit far.
I expressed with maybe a little less than full grace that I feel that too many people wasted too many computer learning hours on gaining knowledge that cannot be reused long-term, and I blame MS for it.
Are we good?
All good by me, dude. This thread has given me some chuckles.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 27, 2016, 01:38:57 PM
Well that was fun.
Sorry if I went a bit far.
I expressed with maybe a little less than full grace that I feel that too many people wasted too many computer learning hours on gaining knowledge that cannot be reused long-term, and I blame MS for it.
Are we good?
Officially, we are good. Thanks.
Hugs?
Yeah, I know.
That's what I love about this place. The interplay of nerd rage and homoerotic innuendo. Magical.
Alway glad to add spice to the place :-)
Now, if you want some fireworks ask me about mobile devices haha.
Let's keep things PG-13.
I don't mind a new OS on a new machine, i just don't like to try them on older hardware and having to find drivers. That and games that may be incompatible. Also the fact that's nothing i really need in the new OS and the old ones are still good.
Quote from: mirth on May 27, 2016, 02:46:50 PM
Let's keep things PG-13.
trying something new? ;)
Quote from: Redwolf on May 27, 2016, 01:38:57 PM
Well that was fun.
Sorry if I went a bit far.
I expressed with maybe a little less than full grace that I feel that too many people wasted too many computer learning hours on gaining knowledge that cannot be reused long-term, and I blame MS for it.
Are we good?
Absolutely.
Should we bring back OS/2 Warp?
Or NeXT?
I still have 6.22 around here somewhere...
Quote from: mirth on May 27, 2016, 06:20:26 PM
Quote from: Staggerwing on May 27, 2016, 05:54:15 PM
Or NeXT?
DOS
DOS was fun back in the day, crafting just the right boot-floppy to get a particular game to play with the most free RAM. Nowadays, just thinking of all the repeated editing of autoexec.bat and config.sys and each reboot after each edit just makes me think 'I'm too uckingfay old for this'.
HiMemSyS, baby.
Love the bat files
Quote from: mirth on May 27, 2016, 11:21:08 AM
This is why I don't trust MS. They've been hell bent on forcing Win10 on users. I have actively had to fight to keep it off my PC. It is too the point that I do not accept anything but security updates from MS and I very carefully read each of those before I install them.
http://www.infoworld.com/article/3075480/microsoft-windows/microsofts-get-windows-10-app-kb-3035583-re-appears-for-no-reason.html
These attempts to sneak Win 10 on to user's machines creates distrust and undermines the update process.
I am perfectly happy with Win 7 for the time being. I do not welcome Microsoft's attempts to force me to upgrade (nor do I welcome the attempts to install Win 10 style spyware on my Win 7 machine). In fact, it has been so pernicious that I do not plan to use any another Microsoft OS in the future. They've converted me from a satisfied customer to a future Linux user.
Sort of agree.
Probably the only reason I haven't installed Win 10 is that it seems to be being forced on me, not sure if it is better or worse than my current Win 7 but feel very hesitant to commit to the change.
Any reason I shouldn't upgrade to Win 10?
Quote from: Wolfe1759 on May 27, 2016, 08:25:38 PM
Quote from: mirth on May 27, 2016, 11:21:08 AM
This is why I don't trust MS. They've been hell bent on forcing Win10 on users. I have actively had to fight to keep it off my PC. It is too the point that I do not accept anything but security updates from MS and I very carefully read each of those before I install them.
http://www.infoworld.com/article/3075480/microsoft-windows/microsofts-get-windows-10-app-kb-3035583-re-appears-for-no-reason.html
These attempts to sneak Win 10 on to user's machines creates distrust and undermines the update process.
I am perfectly happy with Win 7 for the time being. I do not welcome Microsoft's attempts to force me to upgrade (nor do I welcome the attempts to install Win 10 style spyware on my Win 7 machine). In fact, it has been so pernicious that I do not plan to use any another Microsoft OS in the future. They've converted me from a satisfied customer to a future Linux user.
Sort of agree.
Probably the only reason I haven't installed Win 10 is that it seems to be being forced on me, not sure if it is better or worse than my current Win 7 but feel very hesitant to commit to the change.
Any reason I shouldn't upgrade to Win 10?
Because security support will stop eventually for 7..
NeXT never died. It is pretty much what became OSX. Well they put in all the hacks to make old Mac apps run.
Quote from: Tuna on May 27, 2016, 08:29:04 PM
Quote from: Wolfe1759 on May 27, 2016, 08:25:38 PM
Quote from: mirth on May 27, 2016, 11:21:08 AM
This is why I don't trust MS. They've been hell bent on forcing Win10 on users. I have actively had to fight to keep it off my PC. It is too the point that I do not accept anything but security updates from MS and I very carefully read each of those before I install them.
http://www.infoworld.com/article/3075480/microsoft-windows/microsofts-get-windows-10-app-kb-3035583-re-appears-for-no-reason.html
These attempts to sneak Win 10 on to user's machines creates distrust and undermines the update process.
I am perfectly happy with Win 7 for the time being. I do not welcome Microsoft's attempts to force me to upgrade (nor do I welcome the attempts to install Win 10 style spyware on my Win 7 machine). In fact, it has been so pernicious that I do not plan to use any another Microsoft OS in the future. They've converted me from a satisfied customer to a future Linux user.
Sort of agree.
Probably the only reason I haven't installed Win 10 is that it seems to be being forced on me, not sure if it is better or worse than my current Win 7 but feel very hesitant to commit to the change.
Any reason I shouldn't upgrade to Win 10?
Because security support will stop eventually for 7..
A few years from now.
I vote BeOS!
Is anybody here running the latest AmigaOS?
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/3f/AmigaOS_4.1_Update_2.png)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmigaOS_4
http://www.amigaos.net
Quote from: bayonetbrant on May 27, 2016, 10:52:45 PM
I vote BeOS!
Anybody remember Token Ring and Zapping Maus!
moving this to Tech Talk - not sure this has ever been a game topic
(https://media.giphy.com/media/ng0vV3BPD3K6s/giphy.gif)
Holy crap, 'Wing wins...everything...with the Amiga post.
Hey, "Space6ghost" (lol). I've tried to keep this out of public view, but since you've declined to accept any PMs from me I will have to say, here, that your posts are vapid, add nothing to the discussion, and show you to be an utter tit. I've seen people banned from other forums for this kind of drivel and I'm mildly surprised and disappointed to see that you're still posting here. Do one, yeah?
Quote from: Huw the Poo on May 28, 2016, 06:08:09 PM
Hey, "Space6ghost" (lol). I've tried to keep this out of public view, but since you've declined to accept any PMs from me I will have to say, here, that your posts are vapid, add nothing to the discussion, and show you to be an utter tit. I've seen people banned from other forums for this kind of drivel and I'm mildly surprised and disappointed to see that you're still posting here. Do one, yeah?
Hey internet tough guy. You mad bro? :smitten:
Yeah, as a matter of fact, I am, because you're being a cunt on my favourite forum. Fuck off.
{MOD HAT ON}
Guys, chill out. Both of you.
Thanks
{/MOD HAT ON}