A fool for platoon sized tactical series, and with little time to play overly complicated titles (don't want them to be too easy either :uglystupid2: ), what are you guys thinking about these series?
At first look, it would be an extra bonus both series are basically (or they seem to be) on a same rule set, albeit with tweaks to eras covered. I quite like my WW II titles as well as my Cold War Gone Hot titles, so these look really appealing.
I've just skimmed the WSR living rules book, and it looks these are fast playing games too, which is nice too. I like my games to be able to be finished in a long afternoon, if possible.
So what say you? The Good, the Bad, the Ugly?
Edit Nations at War is the series title, White Star Rising the module
:)
Both are good fun games that play quickly. I think the series does a better job of modeling the command-and-control differences of Western vs Eastern units in the World at War series than the Nations at War series.
Some folks like the larger World War 2 counters better also
There's the age-old complaint of the poor typeface choice for the World at War series. While I think font is evocative of the 80s, for the size of the counters, it is difficult to read.
There are far more options to play in the World War 3 Series since there were more expansions made for that one. Just watch out for the Swedish module, as the Swedes can apparently take on the entire Warsaw Pact with a mere battalion of super Vikings and not even break a sweat.
Fun games that play fast. Not a perfect realistic model of modern combat, but close. And certainly close enough for an afternoon of boardgaming
One note - the is a lot, a LOT, of die rolling. You roll a ton to hit, then roll some more to save, for every unit in every attack. No CRT, just lots and lots of dice. Plan to have at least 12d6 on hand when you play.
Quote from: bayonetbrant on September 03, 2016, 10:21:03 AM
Fun games that play fast. Not a perfect realistic model of modern combat, but close. And certainly close enough for an afternoon of boardgaming
+1 Fun games that are easy to learn and play.
Quote from: mirth on September 03, 2016, 10:42:10 AM
Quote from: bayonetbrant on September 03, 2016, 10:21:03 AM
Fun games that play fast. Not a perfect realistic model of modern combat, but close. And certainly close enough for an afternoon of boardgaming
+1 Fun games that are easy to learn and play.
Thanks, I think I will try them both then. As for dice, something like this perhaps as an app:
http://www.virtualdiceroll.com/6/en/six-dice
I like the system as well. Fan and fun and not too many rules to remember.
I like the bucket of dice combat too. I find it faster than looking up results on a CRT.
Don't think you need an app for that. Just 4-6 D6 will do the trick.
The chit pull activation makes it very solo friendly as well.
Imagre with Brant that the system works better in the WWIII setting but is stil a lot of fun for WWII platoon level gaming.
Some good VASSAL modules out there for both systems as well. ;)
Both Nations at War and World at War seem to be going into their 2nd Ed versions. While the original counters look really nice I must say the new 2nd Ed maps are way superior.
They seem to indicate the new maps are (to become?) available as a separate purchase so that is a must.
Seems NaW White Star Rising and WaW Untold Stories are both on pre-order only so I assume I can safely get into second-hand market as well and get those maps later ?
HERE'S (http://forums.lnlpublishing.com/threads/world-at-war-85-games-and-upgrade-kits.2697) the LnL article on upgrade kits. The new game titles will be awesome though.
Found the games at 20 euros WSR and 29 bucks Blood and Bridges from BGG so I'll give them a spin. If I don't like them at that price I can always sell them on :smitten:
I like them, but I'm biased. O0
Quote from: Crossroads on September 03, 2016, 09:54:04 PM
Found the games at 20 euros WSR and 29 bucks Blood and Bridges from BGG so I'll give them a spin. If I don't like them at that price I can always sell them on :smitten:
A parcel with WSR inside it arrived today. That's a lot of game for one twenty note! :smitten:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matrixgames.com%2Fforums%2Fupfiles%2F32195%2FB121F330758B4335B895473FF9F61072.jpg&hash=44fd52a1d78b33eca8d347abf2ba9e4d7643b494)
It was a German edition, but alas, the 2.0 living rules are available as a download, and the chaos table and terrain effect charts were available as a picture at BGG.
Although, playing a WW2 game with player aid charts in German is definitively a bonus. Not to mention the scenario introductions. Panzer Marsch! :knuppel2:
Yes, that's an unpunched game. A belgian gentleman had gone to an expo and got out with two of them :smitten:
Quote from: Crossroads on September 16, 2016, 10:30:27 AM
Yes, that's an unpunched game. A belgian gentleman had gone to an expo and got out with two of them :smitten:
Unpunched no more O:-)
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matrixgames.com%2Fforums%2Fupfiles%2F32195%2F0B0CF293EF6441B19038E4E7563A307A.jpg&hash=6aaf70fbb7251ea70aa9ff019c7e0c62946fedf2)
Quote from: Crossroads on September 16, 2016, 10:29:35 AM
It was a German edition, but alas, the 2.0 living rules are available as a download, and the chaos table and terrain effect charts were available as a picture at BGG.
Although, playing a WW2 game with player aid charts in German is definitively a bonus. Not to mention the scenario introductions. Panzer Marsch! :knuppel2:
Alas, if a kind sould who has this game could scan and email me the scenario pages from an English WSR manual that would be greatly appreciated. I can manage auf Deutsch as well, but just barely :buck2:
Edit: sorted, thank you!
Ordered the WSR: Airborne 2nd Ed from LnL store, looks like a set of uber kool scenarios, and with new version map boards as well :smitten:
I have the World at War:Blood and Bridges game and I have to say, like other games from LnL, I found the rule book poorly laid out and difficult to understand in places. I don't think there was an example play through either.
I love the map. I love the counters. I love the mechanics - I just couldn't understand the rules. I think I done an AAR around here somewhere...or started one and you can see my confusion.
Caveat - I do tend to overthink rules sometimes, resulting in questions that perhaps others either don't think of (because they aren't really issues - I made them up) or my bad memory gets in the way.
In fact - here it is
http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=8072.0
Quote from: JudgeDredd on September 19, 2016, 02:08:02 AM
I have the World at War:Blood and Bridges game and I have to say, like other games from LnL, I found the rule book poorly laid out and difficult to understand in places. I don't think there was an example play through either.
I love the map. I love the counters. I love the mechanics - I just couldn't understand the rules. I think I done an AAR around here somewhere...or started one and you can see my confusion.
Caveat - I do tend to overthink rules sometimes, resulting in questions that perhaps others either don't think of (because they aren't really issues - I made them up) or my bad memory gets in the way.
In fact - here it is
http://grogheads.com/forums/index.php?topic=8072.0
Thanks!
I am quite easy on the rules, I play it often with a there-or-thereabouts attitude, and of course the more you play one system the better you learn it. I'll let you know how our game went, once we played it! I expect lots of wrecks and mayhem all around :knuppel2: :smitten:
Yeah - I should've probably stuck with it. Trouble is, like anything you want to enjoy, if it's fighting you, you find something else (to relieve the frustration...borne from the game or yourself) and move one...sometimes never to go back.
I've still got thew map in a perspex frame...so I haven't given up on it totally. I liked the idea of the long range stuff and modern warfare
Just finished a Thursday Wargaming session against Tinkershuffle playing "Angels of Death", from Blood and Bridges. Was a proper mayhem, with wreck markers left right and middle :knuppel2:
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matrixgames.com%2Fforums%2Fupfiles%2F32195%2F5EC2FA1866DC4D42B5CDE6E3451FD3C3.jpg&hash=f4ef5cc7b625edfe70e5edabfe2f9e4778ef5381)
What looks like an innocent looking map corner will soon turn to a burial site for Soviet armor. Here's my first lambs to the slaughter!
I believe we managed 97% of the rules, some odd details like if a disrupted unit retreats from minefield to another mine hex and receives another disruption, should it take a step loss? We'll continue with the series for another scenario some coming thursday. I'll see if I have the time to put a little AAR here, to clarify (and perhaps ask) some rule issues.
What's the rule set you guys use with the series, which one is the latest? I don't believe there is a living ruleset available as of yet?
Hi Guys,
Here is the new v2.0 rules edition for the Nations At War series. I have included the PDF here and a link for you to download.
http://forums.lnlpublishing.com/resources/nations-at-war-living-rules-final-edition.134/
I will post some of the Beta v2.0 Rules at a later date once we have them better put together.
David
Quote from: Thrawn on September 22, 2016, 02:31:11 PM
Hi Guys,
Here is the new v2.0 rules edition for the Nations At War series. I have included the PDF here and a link for you to download.
http://forums.lnlpublishing.com/resources/nations-at-war-living-rules-final-edition.134/
I will post some of the Beta v2.0 Rules at a later date once we have them better put together.
David
Thanks David! Do you mean with the bolded quote you'll post WaW Beta rules? That would be appreciated, more than happy to give them a go and provide some feedback :)
Meanwhile, LnL sells Battles within Battles (https://store.lnlpublishing.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=69&product_id=60) as a digital download, does that come with a latest ruleset, or what's the deal there?
The whole series is getting a MAJOR reboot. The will be no more made up places or unit formations, the story and the battle areas will be more historical. Of course, this is (thank God) a war that didn't happen so there will be some creative things we will do. As many of you know, the maps are getting a redo and well as the counters. The counter size will NOT be changing, but the font will be MUCH easier to read. I will post the new counters sometime next week.
If you interested in trying out the new rules please post inthe LnLP forums in the World At War 85 section for Keith to add you to our list.
David
Here's the A-10 Warthog playing his part of "Angels of Death".
My MANPAD team was Ops Completed for the turn, as it had attacked (and missed) one the US Gunship flights earlier this turn. I had my Shilka in vicinity, of course I did, but it duly missed in turn now.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matrixgames.com%2Fforums%2Fupfiles%2F32195%2F5E5578A047774F7C8A9A5BAC25F5C98F.jpg&hash=7eed23b536ae620067c825ebe890feb5961337ca)
So, at the end of turn 6 it was time to call the attack off.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matrixgames.com%2Fforums%2Fupfiles%2F32195%2F7AFED8C7598E4CA994565A318F8E2E22.jpg&hash=0d7410345b45ecd150032048b90fc2119778d159)
Some of the formation impulses could have gone more my way I guess, but first I did get west of river, and did cause some dents in US armor as well.
:)
Quote from: Thrawn on September 22, 2016, 03:21:21 PM
The whole series is getting a MAJOR reboot. The will be no more made up places or unit formations, the story and the battle areas will be more historical. Of course, this is (thank God) a war that didn't happen so there will be some creative things we will do. As many of you know, the maps are getting a redo and well as the counters. The counter size will NOT be changing, but the font will be MUCH easier to read. I will post the new counters sometime next week.
If you interested in trying out the new rules please post inthe LnLP forums in the World At War 85 section for Keith to add you to our list.
David
Thanks, did that! I've preordered The (new) Untold Stories, so any news yet if it will be of the new format, or the original? I am good either way btw :)
Oh, quite happy the counters remaining the same size. Good call! O0
A lot of gamers felt it was too small, so we are also going to provide playing cards of the formations for those who eyes are not as good as they use to be. We will also be providing formation cards so gamers can use those instead of the activation chits but we will be providing the chits as well. Any pre-orders will, of course, be for the new game.
I also included a bigger map samples.
David
I quite like those maps!
The whole Nations At War series is currently at the printers and here is a look at the new counters and maps. I already posted the new core rules a few post back.
David
Quote from: Thrawn on September 22, 2016, 07:58:45 PM
The whole Nations At War series is currently at the printers and here is a look at the new counters and maps. I already posted the new core rules a few post back.
David
David, getting back to World at War;
Quote from: Crossroads on September 22, 2016, 02:33:37 PM
Meanwhile, LnL sells Battles within Battles (https://store.lnlpublishing.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=69&product_id=60) as a digital download, does that come with a latest ruleset, or what's the deal there?
Does Battle within Battles come with a full ruleset, or is it only for that battle pack? More than happy to buy it should it have the latest official ruleset.
Hello,
No , Battles within Battles does not come with a complete rule set it is an expansion. The latest rule set is not available yet and will be a free download. There will also be a printed edition you can purchase as well. The full rule book will also be included in the new games.
David
Quote from: Thrawn on September 23, 2016, 02:41:54 PM
Hello,
No , Battles within Battles does not come with a complete rule set it is an expansion. The latest rule set is not available yet and will be a free download. There will also be a printed edition you can purchase as well. The full rule book will also be included in the new games.
David
Gotcha, thanks! Looking forward towards the new editions as well :)
The new map art looks impressive, well done. :) Is the Strike Force Africa based on historical battles between South African Forces and FAPLA?
White Star Rising: Airborne - Dancing at Dawn (Noville, 20 Dec 1944)Quote from: Crossroads on September 19, 2016, 01:28:50 AM
Ordered the WSR: Airborne 2nd Ed from LnL store, looks like a set of uber kool scenarios, and with new version map boards as well :smitten:
Finished a session today vs von Tinkershuffle's Panzer Armee on White Star Rising: Airborne 2d ed.
The scenario we played was Dancing at Dawn, depicting the 2d Pz Div's attack on on Noville on 20th Dec 1944.
I played the mercans, with elements of the 507th PIR set up in the woods outside Neville, and elements of CCA set up on Neville itself. Each unit had one formation chit for their impulse. In addition to these units I had two Arty HE missions, 2 IPs and 2 Fate Points.
Von Tinkershuffle commanded two formations as well, KG Beck setup on hills outside the forested patch, and 107th Bn set up on forest outside road to Neville. KG Beck needed to be setup outside LOS to any US unit. Both formations with one formation chit, so we were even steven with chit draws. In addition he had three Arty HE missions and three Fate Points so a small advantage there.
Fate Points were new to me, with one FP you could buy for instance one re-roll of die or +1 added to one die, or with 2 FP for instance you can opt to remove one Op Completed, for the same unit perform twice within one activation. Small things, but were fun to use. I used my two FP when I did the Arty missions, for a little extra effect, while Tinkershuffle chose to use 2FP for one of his Infantry platoon first move then assault my positions within one activation. The remaining point he used to improve his die roll on one of his attacks.
[spoiler=Opening Turn](https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fgrogheads.com%2Fforums%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D17784.0%3Battach%3D9451%3Bimage&hash=83f25dadbb2ca1ed36470000a2eccefd9e989261)[/spoiler]
The victory conditions dictated Germans had to occupy all city hexes on board C (where the action was), for a Decisive Win, all other results would be US victories.
As seen in the above screenshot, I set up accordingly, trying to have plenty of troops outside enemy LOS, as German armor with two MkIV platoons, a PzV platoon and a StuG platoon had a decisive edge over my Sherman 75mm and Easy Eight 76mm platoons. Yet, I had the Easy Eights at town edge, enjoying the TEM +2 for action against the advancing enemy armor.
They held magnificently, for a while, I believe they managed to cause a step loss on one MkIV platoon and destroying the StuG platoon, before they were wiped out. I had the Easy Eight stacked with the HQ for the extra effect.
Soon, things heated up though. 107th Bn was quick on their approach to Noville, first clearing the woods next to it, where I had some of the CCA infantry positioned. At the same time, the leading KG Beck was advancing on my Paras, meeting with my forward Platoon who had a HMG assigned to them.
[spoiler=107th on attack](https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fgrogheads.com%2Fforums%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D17784.0%3Battach%3D9453%3Bimage&hash=d73df9ad7d61736c47bbf1df5443f7ff4b97707e)[/spoiler]
By turn six, I had lost, regained, and lost again the outer skirt of Neville, and the Germans were decisively entering the town. I used my two Arty HE missions on 107th Bns fist wave, buying some time, so it was not until turn six the second wave by KG Beck was giving the US troops griefs. CCA had fought valiantly, yielding ground little by little, and now the Paras were joining in, retreating from their forward positions in the woods to town proper.
I had now lost my two Sherman platoons, but had a M18 platoon entering. As all I needed was to hold to some city hexes, I positioned it in a shoot-and-scoot position behind the last city hex on the map. It was starting to look good at this stage, my troops had weathered the three German Arty missions within Noville quite well, with some lucky dice. Funny enough, only my Paras had Bazookas given to them, so I was glad to see them now reinforcing Noville at this stage.
I had one of my IPs in the Noville center, manned by a 57mm ATG and a CCA Mech Infantry platoon. Proved to be quite a touch nut to crack as it proved out, they were finally retreated out of the hex on turn 7 after sone determined German Tanks direct firing and Infantry assaulting it.
[spoiler=CCA stands tall](https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fgrogheads.com%2Fforums%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D17784.0%3Battach%3D9455%3Bimage&hash=0da9665f6083676e4fb811c5e3e365000bc11d7e)[/spoiler]
And so it ended. We called it a day after turn 7, with one turn remaining. It was now obvious Germans had run out of time to reach all hexes, and given the 507th PIR now joining CCA in defence, they called a retreat.
Really enjoyed the scenario, was very tough for both sides. Germans had to cross open country to get close and personal, while US troops just needed to stay the course. This one went for the Good Guys, helped by my cautious tactics and lucky chit pulls and die rolls. I would have given my left arm (it's only a game right) for one more Artillery mission, but as it turned out just lasted without one. Artillery hits the barrage hex and the six adjacent hexes, and it is especially nasty if caught in the open as Germans did.
As for the WSR: Airborne (2d Ed) module, for 29.99 there was a sturdy manual printed on thick glossy paper in color, and three map sheets with winter terrain on one side and summer terrain on other side. Original WSR had thick mounted maps, so these were different, but did the job very well.
Having played the World at War series first, with mid 1980s weapon systems, this game was refreshingly different albeit most rules were same for easy access. It took a while to get used to Bazookas though, with their 1 hex range. Quite a step down from Milans and Dragons! ;)
[spoiler=Nuts!](https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fgrogheads.com%2Fforums%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D17784.0%3Battach%3D9459%3Bimage&hash=2a0b19a7ea09eebbbd11000c4daa17f32a72ccdc)[/spoiler]
Thanks to Tinkershuffle for the fun game! And for letting me win, for once.
Next time we'll likely take the Putin Strikes board game out for a ride. :smitten:
Whoa, your AAR was ready almost before we managed to get the game back in the box, well done and well played!
The remaining World at War titles are on sale at LnL store (https://store.lnlpublishing.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=69), with some nice discounts. Unfortunately, the add-ons are designed in such manner it is next to impossible to use any of them unless one owns almost all the base games.
As such I will give them a pass I think. I continue to keep an eye on second hand Untold Stories box, but seems there aren't any out there, and the one or two that are have ridiculous pricing.
On the positive, the new World at War´85 titles are now mentioned in the store as being In The Works. Will be nice to see them coming out. :bd:
Nations at War titles have been introduced as well (https://store.lnlpublishing.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=68), including a Bulge game Tigers in the Snow. Stalingrad as well. White Star Rising 2d Ed already available for pre-order with 15% off. Looking promising !!
WSR: Operation COBRA (1st Ed stuff) is half price at USD12.99 :smitten:
D@mn USPS international rates though, add USD 22.50 for a zip lock letter. Hmm, have to think about that. >:(
Hey LnL folks reading this forum, please look for alternative couriers, Noble Knights Games for instance has quite a few to choose from! Many of us folks abroad would happily trade speed for reduced shipping costs....
Quote from: Crossroads on December 30, 2016, 12:01:52 PM
WSR: Operation COBRA (1st Ed stuff) is half price at USD12.99 :smitten:
D@mn USPS international rates though, add USD 22.50 for a zip lock letter. Hmm, have to think about that. >:(
Beggars can't be choosers I guess. With Canucks, Free French and Poles available to the series, went for it. Happy New Year me! :hug:
Hello,
We are actively working on our international shipping and we will have something in place for our Euro customers.
David
Quote from: Crossroads on December 30, 2016, 12:01:52 PM
Nations at War titles have been introduced as well (https://store.lnlpublishing.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=68), including a Bulge game Tigers in the Snow. Stalingrad as well. White Star Rising 2d Ed already available for pre-order with 15% off. Looking promising !!
WSR: Operation COBRA (1st Ed stuff) is half price at USD12.99 :smitten:
D@mn USPS international rates though, add USD 22.50 for a zip lock letter. Hmm, have to think about that. >:(
Hey LnL folks reading this forum, please look for alternative couriers, Noble Knights Games for instance has quite a few to choose from! Many of us folks abroad would happily trade speed for reduced shipping costs....
Quote from: Thrawn on January 02, 2017, 01:05:23 AM
Hello,
We are actively working on our international shipping and we will have something in place for our Euro customers.
David
Cheers David! I do not mind the boxed game shipping cost USPS quotes at $22.50 - $24.50 as I've often seen, I consider that fair given the parcels sent over the pond and all that. It is rather the ziplock games that suffer for a lack of a cheaper option.
Email sent!