I played the beta tutorials and 2 MP matches so far ...and took the plunge
... sigh, i needed to give me a treat today (felt a little depressed) and giving in to a bad case of Warhammer40k games collecting addiction is a good cure ^-^ ....well, not for the wallet so :-[
The pace is not as fast as i had feared in the MP matches i just did.
and i plan to play the 17 scenario campaign (all 3 races alternate, where 1 scenario needs about 45min to 60 min ...so the reports) and mostly skirmishes vs AI anyway.
Negative Point: the cam angle is fixed. you can zoon in and out but no pan and tilt yet
(i guess that may change to some degree with editing some ini-file later)
How is the evaluation on DOW III by the fellow Grogheads ?
I have it on preorder. Did not participate in the beta since I really have no interest in MP.
I'm shocked there is no pan or tilt...are you SURE about that?
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on April 24, 2017, 11:03:17 AM
I'm shocked there is no pan or tilt...are you SURE about that?
Yes ...german reviewers talked about it, and i also saw a twitch stream (life) where those game-mag journalists were asked about it in the chat and did a double check on their life streaming preview copy while playing the first campaign missions (i watched that stream to make my mind up about the campaign scenarios) that game-mag-journalist had talked to the devs and was invited to special events where the journalists where allowed to play 5h and had spend a lot of time with the campaign alone before he went on twitch for the preview demonstration
Not possible in the beta and not in the preview copy.
That is a really peculiar design decision. I wonder if it is a factor of the scale of the game, or the use of the "titan" size super vehicles...
I played the BETA and it was shiney enough, but yes I noticed that not only could you not zoom in enough you could not pan either. Camera angle seemed fixed.
In addition their are more unit types at the expense of unit customisation. For instance DOW1 had a tactical squad able to upgrade to one of four weapons. In this game their are only two and no commanders to upgrade to at all. Same with dreadnaughts, they seem to be close combat only. I did not notice unit experience or cover values but may be wrong about that.
Everything looked great but the game played like blob wars. I was not a fan of the shields that are map features and seem to dominate it. These shields created lulls it seems and the other things that people seemed to wait for was for their hero magical warp ins (yes titans are insta fielded via beam down) to recharge before taking the offensive again. There are also magical hiding plates in the map I played.
There are some units missing from the game,,, aspect warriors I think for instance?
I loved the vehicle scale.. vehicles are large compared to men as it should be.
Army Customisation and painting however was pretty good. Liked that a lot.
I did not mind it, but it was more of the same really. Maybe a little more starcrafty, especially graphics wise.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2865/33404067644_7dc0c28792_z.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2811/34245202585_d9c7f0c2bb_z.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2835/33404065564_467e7efa70_z.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4171/33404064364_992ecb8cc5_z.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2853/33404063264_561d251a36_z.jpg)
First day purchase for me.
I recall the original Dawn Of War's camera only have a a little zoom in/out, but not enough zoom OUT.
Looks like they're using the same camera philosophy in #3.
Ofc there was a camera mod for the old DOW that allowed you to zoom out further.
I really waited for this but apparently the devs have removed cover and suppression mechanics and all the other things that have made Relic's RTS games stand out. Think I'll pass.
I did not notice suppression either... wierd. It really is starcraft.
DOW2 Retribution zoomed in
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2864/34126161821_82dc0509c1_z.jpg)
Yes will have to pass on this unfortunately. Loved both 1 and 2. As a single player campaigner, tremendously disappointed. Seems like an afterthought from the reviews. Lack of cover, suppress mechanics, for example, turns this into a blob fest....
Erm....no information? That doesn't bode well :hide:
Yeah, I'm going to give this one a pass.
Too many design decisions that take it away from what I loved about the previous game. Seems they're catering to the e-sports guys. Not sure that's going to do well for them.
Call it by another name then expectations are different.
Its too early for me to say anything definitive. I've only played the single player tutorials.
I see why people are saying it "feels" like a MOBA, and the feeling is definitely a little disconcerting. However, I'm willing to give the game a chance and see how it matures. I'm glad they have tried to combine DOWI and DOWII, but sad that they seem to have left some of the best features of each out. That being said, I'm happy there is base building, resource collection and Heroes.
Will post more impressions as I move through the campaign.
Jar. I will still get it when it is cheap. I don't hate it. But it sure aspires to be a game, rather than an experience, shall we say.
Quote from: Destraex on April 27, 2017, 08:04:08 PM
Jar. I will still get it when it is cheap. I don't hate it. But it sure aspires to be a game, rather than an experience, shall we say.
That's a really good way of describing the MOBA "feel"...
i tried my first short skirmish vs A! yesterday (aborted, RL interferences )
...and was shocked the cam-angle is not only fixed to the side your are playing (as expected) ...it seems fixed to the map at all !
you cant switch behind your home team, when you start 'in the up-right corner'
so i suddenly found me playing my side from looking 'into the units faces' and seeing my back staggering area and base and not looking over the shoulder of my forces as usual and looking at the enemy approaching lances
i didn't found a key to swap the viewpoint?
today at least i found a setting when generating the skirmish that i play 'from left below to right above'
because the maps (arena) designs are symmetric you have a choices (in your own setup battles) to play with using your favorite 'normal' viewpoint without strategic malus.
about the skirmish itself ... i won as Black Templers ;) on easy against the AI Orks ...how i wish there would be a bullet time like in SD44.
the game was getting kind of hectic in the last escalation phase the Orcs almost overwhelmed me because i was still concentrating on 'normal' units and tactical placements , i spammed tanks (both sorts) and Cyborgs and won.
Soooooooooooo....if I was going to pick up a DoW game...which would it be? DoW or DoW II?
Depends how much you like base-building as a concept, I guess? Dawn of War 1 is my favourite but admittedly I never really played DoW2. Was a different kind of game.
Not sure how well DoW1 has aged graphically either, but it's got some cracking expansions.
Quote from: WargamerJoe on April 28, 2017, 07:11:02 AM
Depends how much you like base-building as a concept, I guess? Dawn of War 1 is my favourite but admittedly I never really played DoW2. Was a different kind of game.
Not sure how well DoW1 has aged graphically either, but it's got some cracking expansions.
DOW 1 plays like Company of Heores. Which is a good thing. There is an expansion that adds a dynamic campaign a-la Total War in addition to the story campaigns.
DoW1 and its immediate sequels (Winter Assault which is a direct expansion, Dark Crusade which is a standalone, Soulstorm which is a standalone), is very much a real-time strategy game and part of the renaissance in RTS which took place around then (along with Battle for Middle-Earth and Kohan: Kings of War, which itself followed the real leader of the new design style Kohan: Immortal Sovereigns). The missions in DoW1 and Winter Assault are more story-based than DC or SS, but those campaigns have their own charm. For competitive RTS play, it's hard to beat DoW1 fully upgraded. Today, the fan mod known as Ultimate Apocalypse may be the best way to play competitive skirmish or mp. There are nine rather different teams (or 10 if you get an extra mod for UA), and good base-building mechanics. In single-player orders can be queued up while paused. As noted, the engine was eventually used for the Company of Heroes series and the mechanics are quite similar.
DoW2, its expansion Chaos Rising, and its sequel Retribution, is much more oriented to being a real-time hero/squad management RPG. The storyline and map/mission design is quite good, and by the final game it ties up the roughly-developing story that started back in DoW1's campaign. The campaign basically ignores base-building, and the skim/mp certainly has less than DoW1. There are also fewer factions (six I think?), but the effects are somewhat better. I enjoy both game systems in their campaigns, but for skirm/mp I stick with DoW1:SS (and, recently, the UA mod).
DoW2:Ret also includes a game mode called "Last Stand" which is a single player or co-op MOBA of sorts: players pick a faction leader (ones from DoW1 have been added in recent years, filling out the roster mostly), and level him or her up with wargear and abilities by engaging them in fights with never-ending waves of mobs (thus the "last stand"). I seem to recall an earlier version of this game mode was included in Dow2: CR, but Ret's version is definitely the one to play (if you're into that sort of thing).
Regarding the dynamic campaigns of Dark Crusade and Soulstorm: each features a map with a bunch of discreet territories connected in various ways to other territories (SS's being more disjointed since the map is spread over several planets and moons). You pick a faction at the start, and basically play as its leader in the story, usually (but not always) down on the field during fights. Only the leader can move a warband around attacking or defending territories, but you can spend income to build up some nominal defenses in areas under threat (or cash them back in at a reduced cost when not needed.) Every faction starts off with a large base territory and a few others nearby. Each turn the leaders move around the map trying to assault other territories (or moving into position to do so next time). Each territory is a game map which can be played separately in skirm or mp, but in the campaign they can have some odd properties to them and the faction base maps typically have a lot of scripting to them. (Partly to keep the AI from ganging up everyone in a rush on your starting forces when invading!) In the Dark Crusade campaign, any base you build in a territory will persist for defense in future missions (unless built within a radius of where the enemy starts); in Soulstorm, quite annoyingly, you have to rebuild any bases during defense (aside from buildings bought on the strategy map which will be plopped around rather randomly in your starting area). Territories will always provide special buffs, or else elite squad members whom you can buy as an honor guard for your leader. Each faction also has its own special strategic ability which anyone conquering their base-territory will gain instead.
Re DoW3, based on reviews and reports I won't be buying it any time soon. It just doesn't sound like a game type I want to play. But to be fair, I said the same about DoW2, and eventually bought the set on sale, and enjoyed it thoroughly. O:-)
Thank you.
Despite my very cautious optimism, I found myself enjoying the first campaign mission. Yes, its not DOW I and its not DOW II, but I think if you are a 40K nut like I am, you will still appreciate this game. I see the potential it has to be much larger in scale and scope than the prior games in the series. I presume this is why elements like cover and extreme customization for squads have been removed or streamlined, ultimately in game you will just be dealing with too many squads.
Anyway, I'm really going to give this a chance and try to appreciate it for what it is, as opposed to what it is not, or what it could have been.
I think based on history. One should not expect Dawn of War to play the same for all iterations unlike other games. The core game play actually changes.
I dunno, guys...I'm really enjoying the campaign play. I really like the Space Marines and Eldar. They are both strong and diverse forces where a combined arms approach really pays off. The elite units are also cool, adding unique flavor to your army. With elites, you can even further customize your force with "doctrines" to suit your play style. I do wish that the campaigns were dedicated to each race, rather than a rotation since I don't really care for the orks. They are diverse in their own right, but I just never cared for the comic relief they tend to offer in an otherwise dark and serious world.
Anyway, the army painter is cool and I look forward to this being modded eventually along table top lines with expansive army OOBs like what they have in FOK for DoW I. Seriously, if You've never looked at the beauty that is the army list in that mod, I highly recommend.
So, my initial assessment holds strong. If you're a 40k guy like me, you'll be pleased and will most likely not regret the purchase.
There's an army painter, eh?
Look closely at my screenshot:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2865/33404067644_7dc0c28792_z.jpg)
DoW3 is 40% off on GMG for a limited time:
https://www.greenmangaming.com/games/warhammer-40000-dawn-of-war-iii/?utm_source=neolane&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2017-05-12_BI_136_V20_CivVI_USD
I got a Steam coupon for 50% off DoW III...is it worth picking up for 29.99? I enjoyed the earlier games.