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Digital Gaming => Computer Gaming => Topic started by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 10:32:58 AM

Title: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 10:32:58 AM
Yesterday, I was in one of those moods where nothing on my hard drive looked good (there actually isn't too much on the drive).  So, I decided to reload something from my file server archive.

I reloaded Ghost Recon.  I have to say I love this game.  No preparation to play.  Instantly exciting.  It has the attraction of playing Combat Mission, but being in the thick of it.

Here is why I archived it years ago and what I saw as the problem yesterday.  I love this game.  But I develop WASD left hand syndrome.  Which if played enough is going to lead to repetitive stress injuries.  I don't know what to do.  I really love Ghost Recon, but never had the chance to explore it deeply.  I would probably like other realistic shooters too, but I don't seen how I can play them.

Does anyone else suffer from this problem?  (as it seems many of you guys are older war gamers)  Is there a solution other than to just stick with slower paced and less tense strategy style games?

Thanks.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MengJiao on June 27, 2012, 11:15:08 AM
Quote from: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 10:32:58 AM
Yesterday, I was in one of those moods where nothing on my hard drive looked good (there actually isn't too much on the drive).  So, I decided to reload something from my file server archive.

I reloaded Ghost Recon.  I have to say I love this game.  No preparation to play.  Instantly exciting.  It has the attraction of playing Combat Mission, but being in the thick of it.

Here is why I archived it years ago and what I saw as the problem yesterday.  I love this game.  But I develop WASD left hand syndrome.  Which if played enough is going to lead to repetitive stress injuries.  I don't know what to do.  I really love Ghost Recon, but never had the chance to explore it deeply.  I would probably like other realistic shooters too, but I don't seen how I can play them.

Does anyone else suffer from this problem?  (as it seems many of you guys are older war gamers)  Is there a solution other than to just stick with slower paced and less tense strategy style games?

Thanks.

I used to be right handed but In 1996 or early 1997 (when I was in my early 40s), I played Diablo so much that my right hand was hurting so
I now use my left for the mouse and the right for the WSAD.  Somehow this has cut back on the pain.  Not sure why.

Maybe getting away from Diablo was it.

I think I do tend to play slightly slower shooters like ARMA-0-2 or the Original Red Orchestra and if possible I prefer to run over
my enemies since this doesn't require hitting any small buttons usually.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: mirth on June 27, 2012, 11:29:19 AM
I had the same problem when I played Diablo. I played almost non-stop for a week. One night at about 3am, my right arm stopped working entirely. Seemed like a stopping point.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 11:59:31 AM
Around 2000, I used to race and fly.  But I had too many problems.  I thought if I went through it long enough that I would get adjusted.  But I didn't.  Finally, I gave up with it.  It's no fun or point to play a game if you are going to be in pain to do so.

It is sad to love something and not be able to play.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: W8taminute on June 27, 2012, 12:22:39 PM
I seem to have the opposite problem.  You see I'm left handed so WASD is awesome for me!  My problem is my right index finger and right wrist are shot due to the twitching of the mouse during combat.  My aim has suffered as well as my weapon reaction times.  Ghost Recon is the perfect type game for me as one actually has the time to setup shots even at close range where as Call of Duty type games are survival of the youngest with the best reflexes. 
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Toonces on June 27, 2012, 12:49:13 PM
Have you tried using a gamepad-type controller?
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: W8taminute on June 27, 2012, 12:51:47 PM
Yes I have one for my PC.  Unfortunately that didn't help because the gamepad controller I'm using is patterned after the Sony PS3 controller which I have trouble with.  I need to find a PC gamepad controller that has the same specifications as the Xbox 360 controller.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 12:57:15 PM
I looked at game pad controllers, but read that they do poorly for PC FPS like the original Ghost Recon.

It seems the console games have aiming aids built-in to compensate for the lack of game pad precision.  However, PC FPS are designed with a mouse in mind which is a much more precise input device.

I did look at the G13 Logitech Game Board which is similar in principle to WASD, but maybe more ergonomic:

http://www.logitech.com/en-us/gaming/mice-keyboard-combos/g13-advanced-gameboard

Of course, I am not inclined to acquire anything new prior to relocating.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Barthheart on June 27, 2012, 12:59:46 PM
Quote from: W8taminute on June 27, 2012, 12:51:47 PM
Yes I have one for my PC.  Unfortunately that didn't help because the gamepad controller I'm using is patterned after the Sony PS3 controller which I have trouble with.  I need to find a PC gamepad controller that has the same specifications as the Xbox 360 controller.

Can't you just plug a wired 360 controller into yer PC USB? I thought all you needed was a driver to make this work....?
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 01:00:38 PM
But I am not sure that will help.  You still have long periods of pressed keys with finger contortions.  The difference between this and strategy games is that you are talking about quick key presses as opposed to long periods of hold downs.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 01:03:51 PM
It's a shame.  I want some low thought deeply engaging games.  But how do you get that without a lot keyboard/mouse action?

I did take a quick look at iPad FPS, but I think it is sad to play an FPS on a 10" display when you have a 21" at your disposal.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: W8taminute on June 27, 2012, 01:37:39 PM
Quote from: Barthheart on June 27, 2012, 12:59:46 PM
Quote from: W8taminute on June 27, 2012, 12:51:47 PM
Yes I have one for my PC.  Unfortunately that didn't help because the gamepad controller I'm using is patterned after the Sony PS3 controller which I have trouble with.  I need to find a PC gamepad controller that has the same specifications as the Xbox 360 controller.

Can't you just plug a wired 360 controller into yer PC USB? I thought all you needed was a driver to make this work....?

I think you're right, but I haven't looked into this option yet.  Too busy playing my Xbox vs. playing on my PC these days.  :D
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Kushan on June 27, 2012, 02:06:19 PM
I bought a Razer Nostromo game pad a few years back. Its helped the pain I was having in my left wrist, to the point were it has just about gone away. I have more pain in my right wrist these days, mainly to having to use a mouse a lot at work, then going home and gaming on my PC.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 02:27:58 PM
Well, at least, I found out that I am not the only one.  But I guess, you folks are more hardcore than me, since you play through your pain/aging.  I am a pathetic wimp, since I simply switched genres!
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Nefaro on June 27, 2012, 03:45:08 PM
Yeah.. confirmed carpal tunnel getting increasingly worse.  I managed data entry for a few years, and worked on computers many more, besides all that gaming.  Between all the typing and mouse use, it'll eventually happen to anyone and is becoming quite common in this day & tech age.  You just gotta find the right peripherals that ease the pain for you.. and get your supergeek wrist braces.  :P

They can do some pretty simple surgery for it, when it becomes unbearable. 
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Major Defect on June 27, 2012, 03:56:45 PM
Um, can't you pick up Ghost Recon pretty cheaply on the Xbox? Could that be a compromise?
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 05:39:27 PM
I've never tried a console.  (maybe one day)

I cannot imagine being so tied to computer gaming that I would suffer pain and one day require surgery.  Studies show that 1/3 of all deaths in the USA are the result of medical errors.  Over 100,000/year die of hospital infections.  It basically would take a heart attack to get me into a hospital (which I have had).
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Nefaro on June 27, 2012, 08:30:58 PM
Quote from: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 05:39:27 PM

I cannot imagine being so tied to computer gaming that I would suffer pain and one day require surgery.  Studies show that 1/3 of all deaths in the USA are the result of medical errors.  Over 100,000/year die of hospital infections.  It basically would take a heart attack to get me into a hospital (which I have had).

Using a mouse isn't necessarily the big (or sole) reason for carpal tunnel.  Hell, you can get it if you are in the habit of sleeping with your hand curled against the side of your head. 

It takes surprisingly little to screw up some stuff in your hand or arm.  I gotta Ulnar Neuropathy at the age of 35.. no obvious cause other than a random guess that I banged my elbow (that's the "funny bone" nerve) pretty bad or something.. which I don't recall every happening.   Left me with some permanent nerve damage and half-lame ring & pinky fingers on my left hand (can't type properly anymore - doah!).  Wasn't ever a real answer as to why. *shrug* 

Watch yo back!!   :P
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: James Sterrett on June 27, 2012, 10:12:27 PM
Like W8aminute, I am left-handed, and thus get the issues in my right hand.

I've been dealing with RSI since 1994.  I haven't stopped gaming - including sims, FPS, etc.

There are two terribly mundane secrets:

1) Stretching periodically.  I learned how from my physiotherapist after being diagnosed.  I reflexively, pre-emptively, stretch my wrists.

2) Control your work environment.  Pay attention to the ergonomics of your keyboard (I have been using Microsoft split ergonomic keyboards since 1994 - they make a difference for me), mouse, seat, monitor, and how their locations interact.

And, added to that:

* If it hurts, I stop and stretch.  If I think it necessary I apply heat (hot bean bag) and/or ibuprofen to calm things back down.

* Changing what my hands are doing helps too.  Thus mouse time doesn't seem to compete with stick time.

* I tried several versions of braces to wear and found that they rarely helped and, when put on incorrectly (a definition which sometimes shifts over a timespan of tens of minutes), can make the problem worse.

So far, though - nearly 20 years (!) - this has kept it controlled.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 11:02:17 PM
Maybe I should change the title of this thread to "Personal sacrifices made in the name of gaming?".
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Major Defect on June 28, 2012, 12:05:58 AM
Quote from: MarkShot on June 27, 2012, 05:39:27 PM
I've never tried a console.  (maybe one day)


Ah right oh, sorry, missed that. I must confess for all these type games I have now become a middle aged console convert. No system conflicts/graphics/sound card etc etc issues, most (not all) content available to download. Does my FPS itch a power of good. You don't get all the mod stuff - but for me I hardly ever end up playing the stuff I download anyway. Occasionally get "thumb cramp" etc. In which case, as you say, I stop!
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: jomni on June 28, 2012, 12:33:34 AM
Im my case my PS3 is only for FPS.  Other genres will be in the PC.  Exception is ARMA2 which is permanently resides in my PC HDD.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MengJiao on June 28, 2012, 08:46:08 AM
Quote from: James Sterrett on June 27, 2012, 10:12:27 PM
Like W8aminute, I am left-handed, and thus get the issues in my right hand.

Well for me the trick seems to have been to stay right-handed, but mouse with the left.  And I stopped playing Diablo
and I think I tend to play slower FPS games.

Plus I'm playing a lot more board games and I play them on the floor so I assume unusual postures.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on June 29, 2012, 07:19:11 PM
I was thinking about the Logitech G13 Gameboard. Does anyone have a G13 or similar? Is it more ergonomic than using a standard keyboard?

Thanks.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: bob48 on June 30, 2012, 07:24:43 AM
^ The wife uses a Logitech gaming keyboard and programable mouse (mainly for Diablo and WoW) and loves them. She is 50% disabled in her left wrist / arm, and the Logitech stuff really eases the strain.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Huw the Poo on June 30, 2012, 09:52:26 AM
I only have a problem when I play MMORPGs.  It's the constant switching between WASD and the number keys along the top.  It doesn't help that I have really small hands, so I can just about stretch to 5 while keeping my hand in the WASD area.  An intense PvP session - only about 10 minutes is sufficient - can really make my hand ache.

I guess I should look into getting one of those stupidly huge mice with buttons all over them.  If I only had to press WASD with my left hand I'd be OK.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: MarkShot on July 03, 2012, 09:19:26 PM
Evacuated after severe storms Friday.  Back.  Didn't think at all about FPS in the sweltering 100 degree heat and no electricity.  Mother Nature sure helps you get your mind right.  :)
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Staggerwing on July 03, 2012, 09:21:55 PM
Glad to hear all is well. I actually thought you'd gone overseas already.
Title: Re: FPS Syndrome?
Post by: Slick Wilhelm on July 04, 2012, 09:06:54 AM
My carpal tunnel prevention solution has been a combination of good posture, stretching and quality wrist/thumb braces.

Diablo 2 just about pushed me over the edge into carpal tunnel, so I have since given up on such "clicky" games.

I switched to using a Logitech Marble Man mouse at work, so I'm only using my right thumb instead of my whole wrist to mouse. At home during gaming, I use a high quality wrist brace with a couple of metal braces inside to keep the wrist straight.

At 46 yrs old, so far no carpal tunnel. Hope to keep it that way.