Sale seems pretty deep for this one. What is the big difference between this and WITE, the Air war?
I think that's the most notable difference. WitW is a great game and I preferred it over the East game - but that's mainly my western bias. The Italian campaigns are enjoyable and manageable. I particularly like the way invasions are managed. They take time to build up, so can't be made on a whim.
I think my issue is, I bought WITE when it came out, and really did not get that heavily into it. I liked the smaller campaigns but they were too fast. I couldn't see myself getting into the slugfest of the main campaign. So I'm guess I'm wondering if this has like medium level campaigns that don't take up all your time, but still give you a good amount of fun to make it worth it.
Great game. War in the East 2 will be much more linear in the West, especially the air war.
As you know, it's not a game for the faint of heart. But there are some smaller scenarios like Rommel Attacks, OP Husky, OP Dragoon, the Bulge. These run from 5-12 turns, while some of the medium-sized ones are 25-36 turns, such as Breaching the Gothic Line, Torch to Tunisia, the 1945 campaign, etc. Then there are the main campaigns like D-Day (62 turns) and Battleground Italy (95 turns), etc. So there is a mix of small, medium and large scenarios.
I prefer war in the west. I love planning and executing the amphibious landing operations and managing air operations. In WitE, I felt like I was just moving chits. In WitW, I feel like I'm actually planning major operations. Just seems to be more to it
Thanks for this. I'm looking at WitW too with the discount... but not sure I have the brain power or the attention span for monster games anymore... :(
add this to my sad list.....forgot last year i won this by winning the matrix fantasy football league and have never fired it up......guess i ought to give it a try:)
I started playing after watching some tutorials :
WITW
https://www.youtube.com/user/Pewpewchewchew/search?query=battleground+italy
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbSx_b5pOYvElvtb3F-OykvgOlE76SqGW
WITE
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLZWHrzhtcONqzJ7i-DLpcpXjJGG1UNnKg
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbSx_b5pOYvGY05onlVWfbBLZaxD4WZBq
I found the air model in WITW to be incredibly tedious. Also the A.I. is awful.
This might help in your decision
http://thestrategygamer.com/2017/01/13/war-west-operation-husky-husky/
I ended up going with three other games instead Project Zomboid, Endless Space 2 and Flashpoint Campaigns.
Quote from: Tuna on November 29, 2017, 05:56:37 AM
I ended up going with three other games instead Project Zomboid, Endless Space 2 and Flashpoint Campaigns.
Haven't played ES2, but the others games I'll vouch for. Just started a pbem game with FPC after not playing for a year, sometimes it's nice to not have to move a bunch of counters and just give orders. PZ, let's see how long you live ;D.....don't get greedy.........don't forget to turn the lights off, and check out the workshop for mods.
ahh didn't realize I need to leave the lights off.. do zombies break in when you're sleeping if you don't?.. So far I've done two runs.. died at 4 days on the first one.. I'm still alive on my fourth day on the 2nd one.
Yeah, I bought Strategic Command recently as well, but since I'm playing that one, I figured it wasn't time to take a WITW plunge, even though it was a heck of a big discount in Matrix terms.. Maybe they've changed their ways.
Was Project Zomboid the one with the really bad user interface?
Quote from: bbmike on November 29, 2017, 06:53:46 AM
Was Project Zomboid the one with the really bad user interface?
Yeah, I had a horrible time with the demo last year. But I really liked the concept so took the plunge. I'm not having as hard a time now, so maybe they smoothed out the reactions to the controls. Also it looks like you can re-map the keys (haven't ventured there yet)..
LOL I should re-map the Q key for (Shout).. it's too close to WASD, and you end up inadvertently shouting while trying to sneak by Zombies!
Quote from: Tuna on November 29, 2017, 07:27:20 AM
[...]
LOL I should re-map the Q key for (Shout).. it's too close to WASD, and you end up inadvertently shouting while trying to sneak by Zombies!
haha! :))
...which reminds me, my first play of DayZ mod - i died of hunger and thirst because i wouldn't go into that house... i was waiting in the tall grass and watched the zombies flop around until i just died! :DD
(haven't played anything zombie to that day except minecraft - btw, i was shocked of mc, too...)
Quote from: bbmike on November 29, 2017, 06:53:46 AM
Was Project Zomboid the one with the really bad user interface?
I had a terrible time with the demo years ago, its better now, you get used to it. Back then you couldn't remap keys.
If your playing on normal food and water aren't really an issue right from the start. Wait until the power grid goes down, it tends to get worse as you go along ;) . Find a place to base up and start putting curtains up and boarding up while scavenging to stock up on food and water. Start making long term plans for food, water and surviving the elements. Not going to say too much the fun of the game is figuring out the " how to's" .
Between this and 7 Days to die i get my zombie fix.
Quote from: Blucher on November 29, 2017, 12:58:47 AM
I found the air model in WITW to be incredibly tedious. Also the A.I. is awful.
Maybe not exactly speaking to your criticism, but I find the whole 'setting air directives' mechanic incredibly confusing. In theory I like the added sophistication over WitE, but in truth I find WitE much easier to play and enjoy than WitW exactly because of my confusion over how to use airpower in WitW.
...also finding TOAW IV incredibly hard to fathom right now. Must be getting old and addled.... ???
Geez, guys...ALL these links and nobody posted the review for this title...from GrogHeads?
http://grogheads.com/review/7491
(Of course I only know of this review because I wrote it...)
You did indeed wrote it and I wread it!
We do reviews here? Where would I find them?
I used to know....now let me think ???
Quote from: bbmike on November 30, 2017, 04:54:26 PM
We do reviews here? Where would I find them?
Front page
du du duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
We have a front page?
Quote from: bbmike on November 30, 2017, 06:32:01 PM
We have a front page?
This really should be Grogheads.com's official motto. Placed on the front page.
We have a Front Page yes, but do we have a 'Last Page'? Or is this it?
Quote from: sandman2575 on November 30, 2017, 06:56:39 PM
Quote from: bbmike on November 30, 2017, 06:32:01 PM
We have a front page?
This really should be Grogheads.com's official motto. Placed on the front page.
I don't like that front page thing, it doesn't look like our site, not familiar like here!
This whole 'where TF is the front page' thing is like Fonzie jumping the shark, except more amusing and topical.
Quote from: sandman2575 on November 29, 2017, 08:30:49 PM
Quote from: Blucher on November 29, 2017, 12:58:47 AM
I found the air model in WITW to be incredibly tedious. Also the A.I. is awful.
Maybe not exactly speaking to your criticism, but I find the whole 'setting air directives' mechanic incredibly confusing. In theory I like the added sophistication over WitE, but in truth I find WitE much easier to play and enjoy than WitW exactly because of my confusion over how to use airpower in WitW.
...also finding TOAW IV incredibly hard to fathom right now. Must be getting old and addled.... ???
The air system is incredibly confusing. Last time I was playing the game I managed to finally figure it out. And it is easier then the WITE system for assigning the massive amounts of Allied planes but I liked the WITE system better. It was easy to use and didn't feel as clunky. Also WITW just is lacking something maybe it's because the Germans are on the defensive the entire game it just doesn't have the drama I guess of the Eastern Front. Speaking on the AI One thing I can't stand about both titles is that the AI will just abandon good positions and fall back. It will set up a new position but with a limited amount of units threatening it it will fall back again and again. I found it incredibly frustrating and turned me off of both titles as WITE also suffers from this. Look I am not a good player and most AI's will give me a run for my money but this AI is some of the worst. Ultimately I got bored of WITW and moved on to other games. I know people always say so play PBEM but with two young kids my gaming time is limited and as of now I can't invest the amount of time required for a PBEM.
Quote from: Blucher on December 01, 2017, 05:31:31 AM
Quote from: sandman2575 on November 29, 2017, 08:30:49 PM
Quote from: Blucher on November 29, 2017, 12:58:47 AM
I found the air model in WITW to be incredibly tedious. Also the A.I. is awful.
Maybe not exactly speaking to your criticism, but I find the whole 'setting air directives' mechanic incredibly confusing. In theory I like the added sophistication over WitE, but in truth I find WitE much easier to play and enjoy than WitW exactly because of my confusion over how to use airpower in WitW.
...also finding TOAW IV incredibly hard to fathom right now. Must be getting old and addled.... ???
The air system is incredibly confusing. Last time I was playing the game I managed to finally figure it out. And it is easier then the WITE system for assigning the massive amounts of Allied planes but I liked the WITE system better. It was easy to use and didn't feel as clunky.......
I agree that at first the air system is hard to figure out. But once I got it, I really grew to appreciate it. WitW air war reminds me of a sports management game when you play in the owner mode. You are just setting the directives for the next week, but rarely micro-managing the actual execution (the great thing is that you can micro-manage when you want to). The Western Front and Eastern Front air wars were so different, and IMHO GG has adjusted the game play in WitW well.
I think a better contrast is GG's own "Bombing the Reich", that has a much more traditional approach to the Western Front's air war. But it is so detailed and in-depth, it becomes a way of life and not a game....I could play it for the next 10 years and never finish. WitW's air war can actually be finished in a reasonable timeframe.
As far as the other issues you raise...I am just grateful that the AI is minimally competent. I play a monster game like WitW to "get into history" and not so much as a game. For that purpose, the AI is good enough for me.
Quote from: ArizonaTank on December 01, 2017, 11:51:33 AM
Quote from: Blucher on December 01, 2017, 05:31:31 AM
Quote from: sandman2575 on November 29, 2017, 08:30:49 PM
Quote from: Blucher on November 29, 2017, 12:58:47 AM
I found the air model in WITW to be incredibly tedious. Also the A.I. is awful.
Maybe not exactly speaking to your criticism, but I find the whole 'setting air directives' mechanic incredibly confusing. In theory I like the added sophistication over WitE, but in truth I find WitE much easier to play and enjoy than WitW exactly because of my confusion over how to use airpower in WitW.
...also finding TOAW IV incredibly hard to fathom right now. Must be getting old and addled.... ???
The air system is incredibly confusing. Last time I was playing the game I managed to finally figure it out. And it is easier then the WITE system for assigning the massive amounts of Allied planes but I liked the WITE system better. It was easy to use and didn't feel as clunky.......
I agree that at first the air system is hard to figure out. But once I got it, I really grew to appreciate it. WitW air war reminds me of a sports management game when you play in the owner mode. You are just setting the directives for the next week, but rarely micro-managing the actual execution (the great thing is that you can micro-manage when you want to). The Western Front and Eastern Front air wars were so different, and IMHO GG has adjusted the game play in WitW well.
I think a better contrast is GG's own "Bombing the Reich", that has a much more traditional approach to the Western Front's air war. But it is so detailed and in-depth, it becomes a way of life and not a game....I could play it for the next 10 years and never finish. WitW's air war can actually be finished in a reasonable timeframe.
As far as the other issues you raise...I am just grateful that the AI is minimally competent. I play a monster game like WitW to "get into history" and not so much as a game. For that purpose, the AI is good enough for me.
It reminds me a little of Distant Worlds in that you can drill down as deep as you want into micro-management, from basically letting the AI do most the work all the way to doing it entirely on your own, and of course everything in between. It really is accessible to those who love to micro-manage everything as well as those who don't.
I'm still learning the game / system but I've found you can let the AI set up the initial plan then tweak it to your hearts content.
To reply to the OP - yes.
My caveat would be one that I've mentioned before about this game - it's best to accept that learning the game is part of the entertainment you're paying for.
"it's best to accept that learning the game is part of the entertainment you're paying for"
That is incredibly insightful. I see forums for complex games like Command, Steel Beasts, DCS, WITX, etc. where people buy the game and don't want to put any effort into actually learning the game. They want to jump right into the largest most complex scenario then when they can't figure it out, barrage a forum and the devs with basic questions.