For anyone interested, I am currently working on an Advanced Squad Leader to Conflict of Heroes conversion of the Guards Counterattack scenario. It is pretty much done, just tweaking it a bit so it can be played from either side, German or Soviet.
Another delay is that after entering Scenario Text and then going back to loading to play is causing load failures. Not sure it's an odd character such as : or something else. Efforts to narrow it down have failed thus far.
My playtesting so far has caused me to reduce the # of game turns to 4 instead of the 5 turns for the regular ASL scenario. This should still give enough turns for the Russians to do what they need although it instills a greater sense of urgency as they cannot afford to get complacent. ASL has multi-hex buildings, something that CoH does not, so I have had to adjust the Victory Hexes to be for each hex and not a group of hexes.
Basically, for each building hex captured as well as for each unit destroyed is worth 1 point to both sides. It's a matter of holding the most turf at the end of the game AND grinding down your opponent's forces more than he does yours.
And by COH do you mean Conflict of Heroes? If so....I look forward to this very much. Thanks.
This is awesome DD. CoH is a great game engine.
Quote from: Rayfer on August 23, 2012, 06:54:58 PM
And by COH do you mean Conflict of Heroes? If so....I look forward to this very much. Thanks.
Yea, sorry about that, been playing ASL so long the acronym's just come out sometimes. :) It's an Advanced Squad Leader scenario to Conflict of Heroes PC conversion.
Sounds awesome DD.
And its good to see you around the forums.
OK, its done. Its the 1st one of what I would like to be many. Any feedback is appreciated.
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THE GUARDS COUNTERATTACK - ASL #A
German vs Russian
Stalingrad, Russia
October 6, 1942
Turns: 4
Scenario Size: Small
INTRODUCTION:
This scenario is a conversion of the Advanced Squad Leader boardgame Scenario A (The Guards Counterattack) included as part of Multi-Man Publishing's "Classic Scenario Pack".
SITUATION:
Germans forces defend the perimeter of the Dzerhezinsky Tractor Works from Russian attempts to break through and reinforce their forces trapped inside.
GERMAN FORCES:
Company H, 389th Infantry Regiment.
RUSSIAN FORCES:
Elements of the 308th Rifle Division and 2nd Battalion, 37th Guards Division.
FILE LOCATIONS (Unzip the s_DD-ASL_A-The_Guards_Counterattack-CoH_PC.zip file and place the following files in the designated CoH directory)
DIRECTORY: ..\..\Conflict of Heroes Awakening the Bear\Data\Scenarios\AwakeningTheBear\
* The_Guards_Counterattack.scenario
* The_Guards_Counterattack.xml
DIRECTORY:..\..\Conflict of Heroes Awakening the Bear\Data\Maps\
* The_Guards_Counterattack.hexmap
* The_Guards_Counterattack.los
* The_Guards_Counterattack_Detail.png
* The_Guards_Counterattack_height.bmp
Followed your instructions and it downloaded without any issues. Didn't have time this morning to play through the entire scenario but I did open it up to make sure it worked ok and it did.....I got through the initial setup of my units and played two turns. All worked well. And, by the way, the Russians were kicking my butt....will have to rethink my initial placement strategy. Nice job!
Nice work. I'm looking forward to giving this a try. Thanks!
Quote from: Rayfer on August 25, 2012, 09:49:53 AM
Followed your instructions and it downloaded without any issues. Didn't have time this morning to play through the entire scenario but I did open it up to make sure it worked ok and it did.....I got through the initial setup of my units and played two turns. All worked well. And, by the way, the Russians were kicking my butt....will have to rethink my initial placement strategy. Nice job!
Thanks for the feedback.
After I had finished building it, I played the first game as the Germans and was soundly beaten. So I figured, it must be too unbalanced and restarted the game as the Russians. Yet, I was soundly thrashed again. ??? I probably just need more practice.
I really like the AI in this game I just wish the AI scripts you can assign to each unit were a little more detailed. Some are self explanatory, some really, really vague. Overall, the AI seems to be pretty good, at least in the few scenario's I've played. I will have to design another one, with more open terrain and see how well it uses "fire and maneuver" tactics in that environment.
Does the CoH PC game Provide the Germans the use of smoke and a FT that is vital in the ASL scenario? Are the Russians conscript or 2nd line troops? That is a tough scenario for the Germans to win in ASL, I'll have to download and see how it plays in CoH but I'll say that I have my doubts that it's a close representation of the ASL scenario. I do appreciate the efforts so don't misunderstand me, I just think its a lack of features in the PC game and CoH game engine.
Quote from: GJK on August 25, 2012, 03:52:44 PM
Does the CoH PC game Provide the Germans the use of smoke and a FT that is vital in the ASL scenario? Are the Russians conscript or 2nd line troops? That is a tough scenario for the Germans to win in ASL, I'll have to download and see how it plays in CoH but I'll say that I have my doubts that it's a close representation of the ASL scenario. I do appreciate the efforts so don't misunderstand me, I just think its a lack of features in the PC game and CoH game engine.
I don't see a FT in that scenario, do you mean the The Tractor Works scenario, the factory one? You can designate individual unit quality during design, the exact levels escape me but I believe that there are 5 of them, but depending on your game difficulty settings the system may adjust them. I do not know if you can "lock" these in the scenario. There are no separate leader counters in CoH and the base game is missing what should be standard units though. For example there is no German MMG or armored cars and there is no inherent smoke capability as far as I have found so far.
Honestly, I haven't read the rulebook or any of the included materials yet. I just did the design using my SL scenario card, the A1 map and trial and error in the CoH editor. That and reading what little information is available on the CoH related forums on how to do things. I. mo not a fan of reading rulebooks in electronic format so I will probably have to wait to get my printed copy to really understand what the game includes and can/can't do.
Ah yes, the Tractor Works scenario from the original SL. I haven't played the ASL conversion but that was a fun scenario. The first ASL Starter Kit has a similar scenario, "War of the Rats". Having to dash across a street is very tricky in ASL with some cover (or a dash!). I'm sure its the same in CoH, I just haven't played it enough to fully appreciate it I'm sure. I may give your scenario a try and see how it plays vs the ASL version.
OK, so I went back and actually read through the rules and created a little playtest scenario. 8) Regular German Rifle Squads do not get smoke but the Pioneer Squads do. 50mm Mortars cannot fire smoke but 81mm Mortars can. Also, for the Russians, there are no Engineer Squads and they do not have LMG's or HMG's (just Maxim MMG's). Also, no StuG's either.
Supposedly they are already working on the Storms of Steel Module for PC (mainly covers Kursk > 1943) so hopefully many more toys will be added. This game is really lacking as far as units included but the engine appears to be solid with little if any bugs. I have not see many forum complaints and have not really encountered any myself, mostly just user headspace and timing issues from not reading the manual first.
I have rebuilt the entire ASL Board 01 for the next project. Not to bad looking even without multi-hex buildings although it is missing a set of trees that I forgot to add until after this screenshot was taken. :(
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Double Deuce, congrats on your work and especially your dedication to the ASL to CoH project 8)
i will surly try your stuff when i find a way to squeeze into my f#*%ing timetable :'( ...at the latest when late summer turns into Indian summer and worse, outdoor activities will fade away... and my rich harvest of all kind of already collected wargaming-material old an new will spring to live :)
Yeah, it looks great. I tried it last night along with Jamm's work as well. I've forgotten about the scenario from ASL days so I wasn't quite sure how to setup and got my butt kicked. Also, remember one reason the AI does well is that it gets unit bonuses on everything higher than easy so you may need to finetune the number of units for that impact if you want it to be balanced on anything above easy.
| Germans | ASL | COH (with each SW as a full team) | COH (with leaders as a squad) |
| Squads | 13 | 21 | 26 |
| Soviets | ASL | COH (with each SW as a full team) | COH (with leaders as a squad) |
| Squads | 21 | 22 | 25 |
It's interesting to note that if leaders are counted as full squads in the COH, conversion, the Germans actually have more "squads" than the Russians!
So the Russians actually are close in squad count to what ASL has them at. You have quite a bit more Germans than what ASL gives, yet from at least two of the playtests, the Germans have a hard time (even against a Russian AI).
Let's compare the OB's from the ASL scenario. In it, both the Germans and Russians have 1st Line squads. The Germans have a great 9-2 leader and the Russians have the mighty 10-2 leader. The Russians have 3 leaders with a total negative DRM of -3. The Germans have 5 leaders with a total DRM of -5. Edge to the Germans, especially when you compare #Leaders per squad ratio (Russian .14 leaders/squad to Germany's .38 leaders/squad).
In SW's, the Germans get the brutal HMG that has a higher output of Firepower than a full squad (in ASL) as well as a MMG and 4 LMG's. The Russians have a lone MMG. MG Firepower comparison: Germany's 30 FP's to Russia's 4. Heavily favored to the Germans here as well.
How about squad FP?Russia has more than 1/3'rd more troops than the Germans. Russian total FP for squads: 108 to German's 52. More than twice as much firepower which is what you'd expect for a scenario where the defender is emplaced or in heavy terrain and the attacker has to completely reveal themselves to get to the defender.
Total FP output for Russians: 112
Total FP output for Germans: 82
Those MG's make it very tough for the Russians in the ASL scenario. The only way for the Russians to win is how they did it historically; overwhelm with far greater numbers. Coincidentally, that's what the AI seems to do in the COH scenario.
So does it work (converting ASL to COH)?It was pretty fun. Not sitting across a table from a human opponent playing ASL fun. . . but it was fun. ;)
I would be curious to see how the numbers stack up in the conversion as compared to the ASL scenario.
Edit: I just confirmed that the leaders in ASL are not getting their own squad counter in the COH conversion. So, there's 21 German squads to 22 Russian... Almost the same! Does this prove that:
a) COH models MG's weaker than does ASL?
b) The attacker has advantages that they don't have in ASL?
c) ???
Just played again. It was interesting how many times the Soviets would move into the street and I would shoot with a unit from a stone building and miss and they would counter attack and eliminate my squad(s) (more than one at a time multiple times!).
My HMG would fire at a Soviet moving across the open street at a range of 3 hexes and miss - and miss - and miss and then maybe damage the unit. Run into the open in front of a HMG in ASL and see what happens! You get a dreaded 6 -2 shot at the minimum, 8 -4 (!) if it's using a squad and the 9-2 leader for the shot.
Fire back at the defenders in the stone building in ASL? +3 DRM on the shot and if you moved, your FP is halved. If you moved that MMG (Soviet player), then you can't fire it in the Advancing Fire Phase. In COH, seems you can move and shoot as long as you have points to spend with little or no penalty.
I just don't know COH very well. I got it when it first came out. Uwe Eckert is a very nice guy. I did the first Zun Tzu gamebox for COH and Ewe would call me on the phone telling me what he wanted in the module. He sent me the hi-rez graphics that were used for the printers for the gamebox. He then shipped me a free copy of the game! I played it a few times with my (then) 8 or 9 yr old. He's now 13 and plays ASL with me. :)
Bottom-line though - the scenario is still fun to play and it's a challenge as the Germans which is what you want when playing against the AI. I'm sure that as I learn COH and the AI's tendancies, this will be a cakewalk to win but for now it's an entertaining 30-40 minutes.
Learning to use group move and fire, managing CAPs, have both been hard for me. Grasp that and get some lucky cards and rolls and you just might get a win.
Quote from: GJK on August 27, 2012, 09:33:27 PMEdit: I just confirmed that the leaders in ASL are not getting their own squad counter in the COH conversion. So, there's 21 German squads to 22 Russian... Almost the same! Does this prove that:
a) COH models MG's weaker than does ASL?
b) The attacker has advantages that they don't have in ASL?
a) It looks that way in my testing at least so far.
b) See reply for a). ;)
I am currently trying to work up a consistent conversion formula that can be used as the basis for porting ASL scenarios into CoH. Will it be as accurate as I would like? Not sure, but I think if I can come up with something solid enough it will give the feel that the scenario's are balanced and most importantly, enjoyable to play from either side vs the AI as well as PvP online.
Next up and the one I will put my conversion formula to the test . . . Pavlov's House.
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Your board 1 conversion looks good. The roads are very good and appear to be accurate. As you mentioned, the limitation of COH is the lack of multihex buildings which is a shame. Do the woods block LOS in COH? I think that they do.
Again, I couldn't get over the numerous times of shooting at a moving squad in the street only to miss and then have a counterattack KIA not just one, but two squads in adjacent hexes that were in a stone building. I think I'd of done better if I waited until they entered my stone building before I shot at them! :)