https://www.ign.com/articles/gamers-are-becoming-less-interested-in-games-with-deep-strategy-study-finds
:undecided: :embarrassed: :tongue: :buck2:
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Quote from: glen55 on May 22, 2024, 02:06:45 PMhttps://www.ign.com/articles/gamers-are-becoming-less-interested-in-games-with-deep-strategy-study-finds
:undecided: :embarrassed: :tongue: :buck2:
:beermug[1]: :beermug[1]: :beermug[1]: :beermug[1]:
It is too bad that they only give fluffy numbers.
I would be interested to know whether the absolute number of gamers with an interest in strategy stayed the same, and this groups lower percentage is caused by casual gamers joining the gaming market.
Sad
Makes perfect sense. As the population gets dumber with less attention span and more entitled to being instantly gratified, so too shall the quality of recreation and entertainment diminish. :uglystupid2:
Totally non surprising to me, believe strategy players always have been in the minority compared to the other genres.....
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 22, 2024, 04:53:39 PMMakes perfect sense. As the population gets dumber with less attention span and more entitled to being instantly gratified, so too shall the quality of recreation and entertainment diminish. :uglystupid2:
I was going to comment on the general "dumbing down" of the populace, especially in the US.
Talking to my grandchildren about their subjects in school makes me want to cry. They don't
even teach cursive writing anymore. When did this happen? Very depressing in general.
Waiting for the big screen release of "Ass"
(For you Idiocracy fans)
You know, I like creamy peanut butter best. Crunchy peanut butter just seems so...ummm...busy and complicated.
Quote from: jamus34 on May 22, 2024, 06:18:42 PMWaiting for the big screen release of "Ass"
(For you Idiocracy fans)
With the way the 2024 election is going, I wouldn't be surprised if 2028 election will put the Terry Crews idiocracy character in the White House.
Strategy's been on the decline since the late 90's, I'd say. Wargames, flight sims with 100+ page manuals, and Civ type games were the norm until Windows 95 came out. Once PCs became easier to use (no more DOS 6.22 boot disk fiddling to free up memory), the hobby became more accessible and you got less nerdy types entering in. Eventually, they dwarfed the numbers of us hard-core nerds and game developers followed the market.
Once console games took off and cross platform ports became the norm, it was all over. I don't know if we hard-core enthusiasts are staying at the same numbers or declining as we grey out of the hobby, but we're definitely a niche market. (Even worse in the boardgaming community these days. Wargamers are a niche within a niche).
I still remember living in Japan and getting my hands on a copy of PC Gamer. They were raving about Worms, Warcraft II, and Homeworld.
I eagerly bought a copy of Homeworld from the import store. Installed it, played it for about 2 hours, decided it was just an RTS click fest with green HP bars, and deleted it in disgust. Sold it for a loss the next week.
I realized that I was no longer the target audience for gaming media like PC Gamer and I'd have to stick to niche developers.
Interesting that Homeworld and Warcraft are now remembered as deep strategy titles as I can still recall grogs railing against them (me included) for being dumbed down click-fests.
^Very interesting and thought-provoking perspective.
Intriguing to think that "our" numbers have not really changed.
What about viewing the changes within the industry from the developer perspective? If "our" numbers have remained relatively constant, why wouldn't developers continue to make the same kinds of complex games to appeal to the traditional crowd. In other words, following the logic from your post, wouldn't the influx of new gamers with different tastes simply result in more developers making games to suit those tastes, rather than a sum total decline in the kind of complex strategy games we love from the Golden Age?
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2024, 03:01:34 PM^Very interesting and thought-provoking perspective.
Intriguing to think that "our" numbers have not really changed.
What about viewing the changes within the industry from the developer perspective? If "our" numbers have remained relatively constant, why wouldn't developers continue to make the same kinds of complex games to appeal to the traditional crowd. In other words, following the logic from your post, wouldn't the influx of new gamers with different tastes simply result in more developers making games to suit those tastes, rather than a sum total decline in the kind of complex strategy games we love from the Golden Age?
It may be just that developers themselves are following the same trend. Less interest in actually designing and developing strategy games. They design/develop the games that THEY want to play.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2024, 03:01:34 PM^Very interesting and thought-provoking perspective.
Intriguing to think that "our" numbers have not really changed.
What about viewing the changes within the industry from the developer perspective? If "our" numbers have remained relatively constant, why wouldn't developers continue to make the same kinds of complex games to appeal to the traditional crowd. In other words, following the logic from your post, wouldn't the influx of new gamers with different tastes simply result in more developers making games to suit those tastes, rather than a sum total decline in the kind of complex strategy games we love from the Golden Age?
My guess is that it costs a lot more to produce bigger games with high end graphics, sound, voice acting, etc now than it did in 1995. If the market size hadn't appreciably increased, you can't make a profit. I recall that was the reason Microprose fave when they stopped making flight sims. I guess that's why only Russian companies still develop them. Their production costs are low enough yo warrant it.
We still have companies making wargames, but compared with AAA titles, the gfx and interfaces seem remarkably dated. John Tiller games look pretty much the same today as wargames from SSI did in '97.
Quote from: ArizonaTank on May 23, 2024, 03:18:06 PMQuote from: Jarhead0331 on May 23, 2024, 03:01:34 PM^Very interesting and thought-provoking perspective.
Intriguing to think that "our" numbers have not really changed.
What about viewing the changes within the industry from the developer perspective? If "our" numbers have remained relatively constant, why wouldn't developers continue to make the same kinds of complex games to appeal to the traditional crowd. In other words, following the logic from your post, wouldn't the influx of new gamers with different tastes simply result in more developers making games to suit those tastes, rather than a sum total decline in the kind of complex strategy games we love from the Golden Age?
It may be just that developers themselves are following the same trend. Less interest in actually designing and developing strategy games. They design/develop the games that THEY want to play.
Ah-ha! So the developers are getting dumber!
There is still enough good stuff out there to keep me busy. Command Modern Operations, Campaign Series Vietnam, some of the SGS titles, the Tiller games. Also Microsoft Flight Sim for some real
time sink.
It may be niche but there's more good stuff that I don't have time to play than ever.
Quote from: Old TImer on May 23, 2024, 04:31:11 PMIt may be niche but there's more good stuff that I don't have time to play than ever.
Groggiest post for the week!
I think another issue is that many strategy game designers conflate complexity with depth of gameplay.
I personally don't find the new Europa Universalis games significantly "deeper" (ie: genuinely challenging to your powers of reason rather than memory, or innovative in some way) than the original, they're just a lot more complex. Same goes for Total War games.
I guess its easier to add another two hundred lines to a spreadsheet than it is to develop better gameplay. Lots more buildings in a game or a plethora of different units type doesn't make a game better IMO.
That's why I've stopped buying.
This little nugget about the exception to the downward trend among strategy players is in the Chinese market has me just a little concerned for reasons that have nothing to do with gaming.....
"But across its 1.7 million surveys, Quantic Foundry found that two thirds of strategy fans worldwide (except China, where gamers "have a very different gaming motivation profile") have lost interest in this element of video games. "67% of gamers today care less about strategic thinking and planning when playing games than the average gamer back in June 2015," the report reads."
https://www.ign.com/articles/gamers-are-becoming-less-interested-in-games-with-deep-strategy-study-finds#:~:text=But%20across%20its,the%20report%20reads.
^I thumbed up that comment but it's actually terrible...or maybe not. Haven't we all here been a different breed of gamer, forever? :beermug[1]:
I dunno.
I'm pretty sure I'm at least 67% more 'tarded now than I was in 2015.
:Dreamer:
Quote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on May 24, 2024, 03:26:07 PMI dunno.
I'm pretty sure I'm at least 67% more 'tarded now than I was in 2015.
Amen, Brother!
Quote from: Skoop on May 23, 2024, 10:55:44 AMQuote from: jamus34 on May 22, 2024, 06:18:42 PMWaiting for the big screen release of "Ass"
(For you Idiocracy fans)
With the way the 2024 election is going, I wouldn't be surprised if 2028 election will put the Terry Crews idiocracy character in the White House.
Funny, I was thinking the 2024 is starting to look like it might save us from that same fate under your team. :ROFL:
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on May 22, 2024, 04:53:39 PMMakes perfect sense. As the population gets dumber with less attention span and more entitled to being instantly gratified, so too shall the quality of recreation and entertainment diminish. :uglystupid2:
I wonder if within the next 5 years consumers will be able to subscribe to entertainment services that specialize in AI generated content personalized and customized according to the made-to-order directions of individual consumers. You will be able to tell an AI to program a FPS, a RPG, a wargame, a grand strategy game, or whatever genre you want that combines elements of Helldivers, ARMA, Star Trek, GTA, Civilization, and War in the Pacific. The AI will deliver what you want to play after a few hours of processing.
After you tire of playing your customized, personalized game, you'll be able to tell the AI to create a movie or TV series or cartoon based on your game or whatever theme you can imagine. Within about 30 minutes your video stream will be ready just in time for you to watch while you enjoy your Grub Hub delivery.
The tech layoffs of this past year and those yet to come are market adjustments similar to those of 100 years ago when the demand for wagon wheels and horse shoes dramatically dropped off as more Americans began driving automobiles. Similarly, employees and entrepreneurs who excel at managing AI services are becoming the new engineers, mechanics, and service station attendants of the 21st century AI driven entertainment highways.
Quote from: Dammit Carl! on May 24, 2024, 11:08:03 PMQuote from: Silent Disapproval Robot on May 24, 2024, 03:26:07 PMI dunno.
I'm pretty sure I'm at least 67% more 'tarded now than I was in 2015.
Amen, Brother!
Preach! I love my boardgames to be complex, but I'm finding it more and more difficult to get into deep PC games.
Quote from: Redwolf on May 22, 2024, 03:26:47 PMQuote from: glen55 on May 22, 2024, 02:06:45 PMhttps://www.ign.com/articles/gamers-are-becoming-less-interested-in-games-with-deep-strategy-study-finds
:undecided: :embarrassed: :tongue: :buck2:
:beermug[1]: :beermug[1]: :beermug[1]: :beermug[1]:
I would guess the population of all gamers has expanded AND more of the expansion is in less strategy-oriented
gaming.
But that's just a guess.
It is too bad that they only give fluffy numbers.
I would be interested to know whether the absolute number of gamers with an interest in strategy stayed the same, and this groups lower percentage is caused by casual gamers joining the gaming market.
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on May 22, 2024, 05:00:48 PMTotally non surprising to me, believe strategy players always have been in the minority compared to the other genres.....
Exactly. It's always been this way. Yet we have more strategy games to choose from than ever before...