Dang, the USA just can't catch a break this week. (Well, stopping the Ricin dot letter to the President counts as a break I guess.)
Fertilizer Plant == Fuel-Air Explosive == Small Nuke. Registered as a 2.5 Richter scale earthquake.
In somewhat related news, a couple of local high school kids and their college-age buddy decided it would be fun to order 10 lbs of plastic explosives (somehow) and detonate an old truck in the swamps several miles east of my house (in West Tennessee) a couple of weeks ago. Apparently the goal was to put it on YouTube; what actually happened was that they shifted the nearest house off its foundation. It not only shook my house but the ground under my house, too! The police seem to have protected those clowns from a Homeland Security investigation and prosecution; but with the recent explosive/attack weirdness going on, those kids might find themselves back under scrutiny. >:(
Anyway, new thread for West Texas tragedy. Post links, news, discussion below.
QuotePolice say between five to fifteen people were killed and more than 160 were injured in a massive explosion at a fertilizer plant near Waco, Texas, late Wednesday.
The explosion at West Fertilizer in downtown West — a community of roughly 2,600 residents about 20 miles north of Waco — happened around 8 p.m. and could be heard as far away as Waxahachie, a town located 45 miles north. It sent flames spiraling high into the evening sky and rained burning embers, shrapnel and debris down on frightened residents.
A member of the city council, Al Vanek, said a four-block area around the explosion was "totally decimated." Other witnesses compared the scene to that of the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing and authorities said the plant made materials similar to that used to fuel the bomb that tore apart that city's Murrah Federal Building.
The USGS reported that the blast registered a 2.1 on the Richter scale.
"They are still getting injured folks out and they are evacuating people from their homes," Waco Police Department Sgt. W. Patrick Swanton said early Thursday. "At this point, we don't know a number that have been killed ... I think we will see those fatalities increase as we get toward the morning."
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/04/18/numerous-injuries-reported-in-large-explosion-at-texas-fertilizer-plant/#ixzz2QolufdES
It sounds like they are expecting the casualty count to rise. This is very sad news. It also sounds like alot of residential areas were damaged/destroy including part of a nursing home. :(
Here is a video of the explosion
Yep, I was just about to post that.
Note: the fire at the beginning? That isn't after the explosion...
Sheesh. The mayor said on an interview that property has been leveled for five miles. Maybe he means damaged?
The plant had a few ostensibly minor safety issues. Methinks that someone might revisit those reports.
I keep hearing the word "leveled", too. As in "50 houses leveled", one an apartment building. Or "leveled in a four block radius".
More realistic sounding is "badly damaging or destroying" 75 houses, the 50-unit apartment complex, a middle school and a nursing home.
Obviously it didn't "level" that truck, or the boy wouldn't have been pleading to get away, but it sure knocked that truck around.
Here's a slightly expanded version (compared to others I've seen) of the Associated Press article which has been making the rounds:
http://dailycaller.com/2013/04/18/massive-explosion-rocks-texas-town/
Jesus. My prayers for the wounded, homeless, and the families of those who perished in the blast.
Quote from: TheCommandTent on April 18, 2013, 07:38:42 AM
Here is a video of the explosion
Holy crap. That's terrifyingly huge.
Literally an explosion the size of the factory. (Rushing at that truck...)
What the Hell is wrong with that guy? Seriously? "Oh, a giant plant full of ammonia is on fire, let's grab the kids and head over to film it!"
Idiot aside, what a horrific event. There really isn't anything else to say.
Quote from: Arctic Blast on April 18, 2013, 04:58:58 PM
What the Hell is wrong with that guy? Seriously? "Oh, a giant plant full of ammonia is on fire, let's grab the kids and head over to film it!"
Idiot aside, what a horrific event. There really isn't anything else to say.
Agreed.
In his defense, it's a small town and they probably don't have too much excitement.
That said, he's lucky he's not a candidate for the Darwin Award.
Somehow I think he may have learned his lesson.
Things are bigger in Texas.
That kid is smarter than his dad and is probably familiar with the term 'secondary explosions'- 'Please lets get out of here!' is a much better response to that cataclysm than sitting there repeating 'Holy Shit?!?'.
Do people think it's just a bad coincidence that this falls on the April 18/19th Branch Davidians siege or is this something more sinister?
Con
Quote from: Con on April 18, 2013, 06:27:47 PM
Do people think it's just a bad coincidence that this falls on the April 18/19th Branch Davidians siege or is this something more sinister?
Con
Nah.
That plant reportedly had a history of some safety issues. I'd give the odds a much greater chance that the plant either cut corners and/or bribed an inspector than it being some kind of nut job type of thing.
Still, that should not be ignored... especially if there are indications of arson.
I agree, but in the end I think this will come down to plain old human bumbling or avarice.
Quote from: Centurion40 on April 19, 2013, 07:47:38 AM
Still, that should not be ignored... especially if there are indications of arson.
Especially since this is the same area (near Waco).
Not that we should prejudge before expert investigations. But a factory with safety problems, while perfectly sufficient as an explanation in itself, is also more handy as a target.
Having said that, if this was intended as a response to the Branch Davidian assault, the perps would be trying to take credit for it in order to draw the link explicitly, I would think.
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 19, 2013, 10:09:26 AM
Quote from: Centurion40 on April 19, 2013, 07:47:38 AM
Still, that should not be ignored... especially if there are indications of arson.
Especially since this is the same area (near Waco).
Not that we should prejudge before expert investigations. But a factory with safety problems, while perfectly sufficient as an explanation in itself, is also more handy as a target.
My thinking exactly.
That said, odds are its purely a tragic accident.
Quote from: JasonPratt on April 19, 2013, 10:09:26 AM
Having said that, if this was intended as a response to the Branch Davidian assault, the perps would be trying to take credit for it in order to draw the link explicitly, I would think.
I was under the impression that they were all extinct.
Damn, 12 bodies recovered, but 60 people still unaccounted for (http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/19/17825505-60-people-still-missing-after-texas-blast-kills-12?lite). Terrible tragedy...
OMG that's terrible.
It is terrible. Not a surprise the toll will rise. That was a big explosion.
Mom has been scoping out photos of the destruction and says that "leveled" really does describe a lot of it.
Looks like this plant hadn't even been inspected since 1985 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/18/texas-fertilizer-plant-ha_n_3113117.html).
QuoteThe Occupational Safety and Health Administration most recently inspected the Texas fertilizer plant that exploded Wednesday night in 1985.
Records reviewed by The Associated Press show that OSHA issued the West Chemical & Fertilizer Co., as the plant was called at the time, a $30 fine for a serious violation for storage of anhydrous ammonia.
OSHA cited the plant for four other serious violations of respiratory protection standards but did not issue fines. The maximum fine for a serious violation was $1,000.
It is not unusual for companies to negotiate lower fines.
The explosion near Waco, Texas, killed as many as 15 and injured more than 160 others.
OSHA has jurisdiction over more than 7 million workplaces. It's not uncommon for some companies to go years without inspection.
This is a really terrible tragedy. Before we had more info out of Boston, I worried they were connected as Domestic terrorism (tax day, patriot's day, OK bombing anniversary). But is seems that is was more an industrial accident (possibly from a lack of rigorous inspections).
The poor town looks almost gone. I really feel for those people in West, Texas and I wish them the best.
Texas fertilizer company didn't heed disclosure rules before blast
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/04/20/us-usa-explosion-regulation-idUSBRE93J09N20130420 (http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/04/20/us-usa-explosion-regulation-idUSBRE93J09N20130420)
The second issue in the article is that the stuff they did do was not followed up on.
"A separate EPA program, known as Tier II, requires reporting of ammonium nitrate and other hazardous chemicals stored above certain quantities. Tier II reports are submitted to local fire departments and emergency planning and response groups to help them plan for and respond to chemical disasters. In Texas, the reports are collected by the Department of State Health Services. Over the last seven years, according to reports West Fertilizer filed, 2012 was the only time the company stored ammonium nitrate at the facility.It reported having 270 tons on site."That's just a god awful amount of ammonium nitrate," said Bryan Haywood, the owner of a hazardous chemical consulting firm in Milford, Ohio. "If they were doing that, I would hope they would have gotten outside help."In response to a request from Reuters, Haywood, who has been a safety engineer for 17 years, reviewed West Fertilizer's Tier II sheets from the last six years. He said he found several items that should have triggered the attention of local emergency planning authorities - most notably the sudden appearance of a large amount of ammonium nitrate in 2012."As a former HAZMAT coordinator, that would have been a red flag for me," said Haywood, referring to hazardous materials."
This seems to me the same issue as the financial meltdown from Greenspan. He simply did not believe in regulatory oversight even though he took the job to do it. He was in fact a spoiler. Whoever these guys dealt with also seem to have a total free market bias.
don't need no gub'mint to pass no regulations... regulations are communist, unfettered capitalism is the answer to everything
NOT!!!!
rhetoric from the right and left is just that, it protects no one
Quote from: Windigo on April 22, 2013, 04:06:08 PM
don't need no gub'mint to pass no regulations... regulations are communist, unfettered capitalism is the answer to everything
NOT!!!!
rhetoric from the right and left is just that, it protects no one
Strawman much?
had to backtrack from the initial statement and my typical poke at the far right ....
I thought my last comment was kinda stating the obvious....
like "middle-aged men should avoid eating chilie without having an exit strategy"
Chilie has it's own exit strategy. ;)
<snicker>
Truer words were never spoken. ;)