GrogHeads Forum

So, after the Xbox One event yesterday and all the specific info showing up all over the internet about Microsoft's plans and ideas with their new flagship, what do you Consoleros think?

I am an Xboxer (started with Xbox 1 and am now playing on the Xbox 360) and I am a happy Xbox Gamer. I love the machine (it's my second, the first one got the RRoD but rather late), I really love Xbox Live and all the great games (most looking better than on the PS3). I really like the controller it just seems to merge with my hands and gives me absolute control in games (only have short experience with a PS1 controller and that thing was terrible - too small, the sticks far too loose, didn't work for me). That said, there was no reason to think about a platform switch, I supposed that the gamerscore and gamertag would carry over to the new system and that seems to be the case. All fine...

The Sony press conference was a bit lame for my taste, there was no real excitement, the console was not shown, but at least the specs were given, the new controller was shown, but it was just one dude holding it in his hands while talking without pause. The Sony presentation had nothing that made me think "Wow! I have to get a PS4!". Too much talk about social features, developer stuff, whatever, the Killzone game demo was nothing that blew me away either.

Then the Microsoft event yesterday, certainly much better in terms of excitement, much better presentation, the console was there sitting on a table, with the controller, the box and the new Kinect thingy and then also presented in a stylish way on the screen. Fine, that was a good start I thought. But then the one hour event was 45 minutes about how I can wave at the Xbox One (silly name btw) and talk to my Xbox One and that I can have access to my TV and the TV Guide via the Xbox One (I doubt that will work here in Germany), that I can have dudes showing up with the implemented Skype app on my screen while I play a game (why would I want that? If I want to play or watch a movie I don't want that) waving and talking to me, using my Smartphone to move things on my screen and all kinds of entertainment stuff happening around me...then some games were shown, too. Mostly EA Sports games, I don't care about (and I don't like EA after what they did to my beloved Battlefield 3 with their silly 'rent a server-we want more money' decision) and the new Call of Duty from Infinity Ward - "Ghosts". That looked sexy and got me me curious about the next CoD game in the series, but then it was over. As a gamer I was disappointed and had the same missing thought I had after the Sony event - no "I need an Xbox One!"

Then all the information came up all over the internet about internet connection required and Kinect central to the new console experience (I don't need this nonsense, my 360 works fine without this silly thing) and the truth behind EA's decision to stop their Online Pass policy. I thought it was fishy when i read that a few days ago, I mean it's EA, they don't give up ways to make more money because the gamers don't like it.

And here's why they simply don't need any Online Pass anymore:

QuoteConcerning used games, Wired reported earlier that game installation to the HDD would be mandatory and that the disc would be tied to a single Xbox Live account. Any additional accounts using the same disc would have to pay a fee. A Microsoft representative speaking to Polygon has issued a statement to say used games would be supported by the Xbox One.

"Xbox One's support for used games and these other scenarios may not look like they have on previous console generations, and that's what we'll be explaining as soon as we're able," Microsoft tells Polygon.

Phil Harrison of Microsoft, speaking to Kotaku, got a little more specific by explaining that each game would require a one time activation code to install, included when you purchase an Xbox One game. Once the game is installed via a code, which is tied directly to an XBL account using the internet,  the game can be played on that account as well as other users on the same console. A game will not have to be purchased multiple times within a family. "It sits on your harddrive and you have permission to play that game as long as you'd like," Phil Harrison states.

The kicker here is that if you want to play that game disc on your friend's Xbox One, a fee will be required. That fee will cost you the same price of the game itself. "Think of it like a new game," says Phil Harrison. "The bits that are on that disc, you can give it to your friend and they can install it on an Xbox One. They would then have to purchase the right to play that game through Xbox Live."

So if a game needs a one time activation code and has to sit on your HDD, how is that going to work with players who like to trade their games in?

"We will have a solution — we're not talking about it today — for you to be able to trade your previously-played games online," Harrison says.

Kotaku speculates that how this system will work is that players will be able to trade in their activation code online, thereby deactivating the game from their console for some type of credit like MS Points. It sounds pretty confusing and not very consumer friendly, and I'm sure GameStop will not be happy if this is what Microsoft is proposing concerning the future of the now lucrative used/trading games industry.

http://www.gametrailers.com/side-mission/52620/will-used-games-work-on-xbox-one-backwards-compatibility-more-questions-answered (http://www.gametrailers.com/side-mission/52620/will-used-games-work-on-xbox-one-backwards-compatibility-more-questions-answered)

Wow! If you wanna have an example for a definitive deal breaker, then this is one. My wife and I are playing a bunch of games, some we buy together to play them coop on the same screen, some we buy both to play them online (her house is 3 minutes from mine) together or with friends, some we buy to play them as a single player experience. The latter ones we usually exchange when we are through them so we both can play them. And now MS comes and says "Sure you can do that, but if you want to play the game your wife wants to give you, you have to pay the full price again to be allowed to do so!"

Are they out of their mind? What about books? I'm through with one novel and will give it to her and then she has to pay again to be allowed to read it?

So...after being an Xboxer for such a long time and having had no intentions to switch my gaming platform, this was a slap right into the face that left me stunned because of the level of impudence shown here. And that means (given Sony does not the same thing regarding used games) for me as a gamer the PS4 is now on my radar.

What about your thoughts about this new generation of consoles?

Too early to say. Neither showed off any games, really...that'll happen at E3 in a few weeks.

Whatever happened to the good old days when it was all about the hardware specs and the quality of the games?  Quite frankly I'm not interested in either of the new consoles and that does not sit well with me.  As a gamer, who by the way is a family man, I hate social network junk on my console.  I hate watching movies on my console.  I read another gamers post in a thread on another site and he was lauding the fact that the XBOX One is the perfect family 'entertainment console'.  Sorry dude, but no.  No way.  A console is supposed to be about one thing and one thing only...gaming.  It's daddy's new man cave where he can get away from it all for a couple of hours.  Now I'm supposed to watch tv, play a game, skype, and surf the internet all at the same time?

I cannot justify paying 600 or more for a console that I'm only going to use 25% of it's functionality.  Is MS and Sony trying to lure unsuspecting non gamers into buying a next generation console in the hope of expanding their market base?  Good luck with that boys but you lost a customer here.  I hope they gain more than they lose but as for me I plan on buying a second 'backup' XBOX 360 on XBOX One's launch day.   :P


Ok my rant is off now.  Let's get calm and game on.  In the back of my mind I'm thinking that a wait and see attitude is in order.  Let's just see what the E3 presentations will bring.  Maybe this new console revolution has something to it, after all why would they spend so much investment in something that is destined to fail?  But for now I'm very skeptical with the new consoles. 

I don't have a problem with them talking about non-game features, and some of it actually is pretty handy. From the sound of things, a new XBox can also be a PVR right out of the box, it's your cable box, your Netflix supplier, your DVD/Blu-Ray player and your media hub. If you don't have all of that stuff already, you're potentially saving some serious cash by using it to fill those roles.

They just went WAAAYYYYYY too far with it. 90% of the reveal was non-game related stuff. It was way too much.

I suppose you have too search long for folks who don't already have a Blu Ray player, a DVD Player, a cable box, a satellite receiver etc.. and think "hey, cool never had such stuff in my house and now the Xbox One can all do that! Let's get one!" We are living in the multimedia era MS, you are too late...seriously, that can't be what they are thinking. And it's completely targeted at the US market, as usual all these new features won't work here in Germany/Europe or Japan. So we again end up paying more and getting less...complete fail.

Here's a recording of a MS employee talking to a concerned gamer :P

http://i.minus.com/iBzvb2JSpQNRM.gif (http://i.minus.com/iBzvb2JSpQNRM.gif)

Awesome video.  Gotta show that to my friend.

Kinnect must be connected at all times in order to play?  Internet connection not required to play however must be connected to internet at least once per 24 hour time period? 

If that does not scream privacy intrusion and monitoring of what you watch, play, and talk to then I don't know what does.  This is the deal breaker for me and I assume the PS4 is the same thing.  I don't have anything to hide but I resent this kind of spying on my personal life, even if it is meant only to understand what kind of products I like and then advertise them to my on my console.  (which I don't believe anyway)

QuoteIf that does not scream privacy intrusion and monitoring of what you watch, play, and talk to then I don't know what does.

Yeah, I don't know how data security is handled in the US but in Europe I suppose that could be a problem, people are quite sensitive to these things around here. And a cam watching you all the time, with audio sensors listening to what people say in the room while being connected to the internet sounds problematic at least.

QuoteKinnect must be connected at all times in order to play?

Problem I see with this is, the thing is a hightech sensor and all, it has to sit there in front of your TV. I suppose my cat would love to play with it in the night when I'm sleeping. Then after waking up I see my Kinect on the floor, put it back to where it belongs and realize something is wrong with it. I start the console, want to play a game and a message appears "Your Kinect is not working. Please fix this, or get another one - until then you can not play any games. Sincerely Your Personal Microsoft Assistant (btw you could wave at me if the Kinect would work right now, but no worries - I can still hear you)"

QuoteThis is the deal breaker for me and I assume the PS4 is the same thing.

According to what Sony officials said so far, no...

QuoteDoes the PlayStation 4 always need to be connected to the internet, I asked?

"You can play offline, but you may want to keep it connected," he suggested. "The system has the low-power mode - I don't know the official term - that the main system is shut down but the subsystem is awake. Downloading or updating or you can wake it up using either the tablet, smartphone or PS Vita."

Are all of those things optional, though? For people who have broadband data limits, for example? They can customise everything?

"Oh yes, yes, you can go offline totally. Social is big for us, but we understand there are some people who are anti-social! So if you don't want to connect to anyone else, you can do that."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-02-21-playstation-4-does-not-require-an-internet-connection (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-02-21-playstation-4-does-not-require-an-internet-connection)

QuoteAwesome video.  Gotta show that to my friend.

Here's more for you and your friend :)

http://de.ign.com/feature/18980/gehasst-verlacht-verspottet-die-besten-memes-zur-xbox-one (http://de.ign.com/feature/18980/gehasst-verlacht-verspottet-die-besten-memes-zur-xbox-one)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOxdMQhDMIU&feature=player_embedded (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOxdMQhDMIU&feature=player_embedded)

Sony is talking in a complete different language compared to MS and it's a language I can understand as a gamer.

http://www.edge-online.com/features/something-about-japan-shuhei-yoshida-on-the-war-for-the-living-room/ (http://www.edge-online.com/features/something-about-japan-shuhei-yoshida-on-the-war-for-the-living-room/)

And when I read what Sony Worldwide Studios president Shuhei Yoshida says here, I do understand him :)

QuoteYoshida's own desire to make videos easy to share was a result of his addiction to Dark Souls, clips of which he would seek out on Japanese video-sharing site Niconico Douga. "I wanted to play Dark Souls all day long, but I couldn't do that because I was too busy. So instead I would watch people playing it live on Niconico whenever I had some spare time. By doing that, you can find other ways to play the game and read comments by other users. I felt that sharing videos is a really important part of enjoying games.

Awesome awesome and more awesome!  Now see I don't have a problem being able to watch fellow gamers playing games.  That is much better entertainment than the crap that is on tv these days anyways.  And I didn't realize Yoshida-san enjoyed playing Dark Souls.  He obviously has good taste in console games!


I still feel that a part of me has died hearing the news about the new XBOX.  I've been thinking about it some more and unless someone comes up with a hack to maintain privacy I'm not going to buy an XBOX One. 

At the moment I don't see any reason to stay in the Xbox camp and this is even more disappointing because I had no intention to leave...I am a happy customer and 360 player. But based on their reveal event this doesn't seem to be my dealer of choice anymore for my gaming fix...as I said on XBL, paying a damn fee when I want to play a game that just happens to sit on Hiimori's shelf and not on mine? No way...currently I look much more for PS4 news than for anything related to the Xbox One and such a complete lack of interest in the new installment of the Xbox series, that for sure is a bad feeling and disappointment because it was caused by MS, shifting from games to 'entertainment' and becoming the footman of game publishers (it's no accident that EA first said innocently they drop their Online Pass policy, then MS and EA announced a very close partnership and then suddenly the new Xbox has a fee for playing used games...of course they don't need any Online Pass anymore and still let the used games market dry out and make more money).

I feel cheated and will not support that and since this new direction of theirs will not change, I am out no matter what games they show at the E3. Besides that, the exclusive games that I loved to play Halo and Gears are pretty worn out - neither Halo 4 nor GoWJ is what these games used to be. Thinking about a switch to Sony actually gives me that little thrill and excitement back I expected from the reveal of the new Xbox generation, because I never played any PS exclusive title and I hear they do have many great games. So the excitement is there, but just not from the direction I was expecting it. And online gaming is free (and probably will also be free for the PS4) and even if you are a paying member of the Playstation Network, then you get tons of games for that - for free! Again, if I have two sheets of blank paper in front of me and I write the Pros for both consoles down I don't know what to write in favor for the Xbox One...congrats MS!

Very good statements Grimnirsson and I agree with them all.

QuoteI am a happy customer and 360 player.

I am a happy 360 player and although I also own a PS3 I hardly ever game with it anymore.  The 360 took over my life due to the achievement system and the stable of great console exclusives such as Halo and GOW.  All that love just thrown away like it never existed after the Reveal.

Quote(it's no accident that EA first said innocently they drop their Online Pass policy, then MS and EA announced a very close partnership and then suddenly the new Xbox has a fee for playing used games...of course they don't need any Online Pass anymore and still let the used games market dry out and make more money).

You and I have been around long enough to have been able to figure out something was wrong.  I myself did not put two and two together.  Shame on me.  We got totally blindsided during the XBOX One Reveal.   >:(

QuoteI feel cheated and will not support that and since this new direction of theirs will not change, I am out no matter what games they show at the E3.

I know the feeling.


The good thing about the PS3 was that it was region free meaning I could import games that are not released in my region.  I don't know much about the PS4 but I'm hoping Sony continues to make it's consoles region free. 

The only thing (and the only point I would write on that blank sheet of paper I mentioned) is I feel really comfortable with the 360 style controller. I don't know how the DS is but that the analog sticks are side by side looks uncomfortable to me - I will see...but since you have both consoles, could you compare them to me from a practical POV? :)

I can definitely compare the two controllers to you.  I have been a big Sony man since PS2 and have a lot of experience gaming with their style controller.  When I knew of nothing else, those controllers felt fine to me.  Because the sticks are close to each other and my hands are not super large it is not that difficult to position your thumbs over the sticks and move them around.  Sony's sticks are a lot more loose in feel and in certain games like Dynasty Warriors or Red Dead Redemption it feels like I must move the sticks with a bit more force and speed in order to control my character quickly.  In car racing games it is the opposite.  The sticks are too sensitive and the slightest movement causes your car to turn too much. 

The Sony controller itself is smaller in size than the XBOX controller.  For me that is no problem, my hands are medium sized and I'm quite comfortable holding the Sony controller.

Button placement and the L1/L2 R1/R2 feel the same as they do on the XBOX controller.  Speaking of which, when I bought my XBOX 360 I immediately noticed a huge improvement in the controls.  First of all the XBOX controller is larger and the position of the hand grips feel more natural than Sony's controller.  When I grip the XBOX controller I am using mostly the palms of my hand and the inside of my fingers just below the finger tips.  When I grip the Sony controller I am applying pressure with mostly the base of my thumbs and forefinger.  If I lower my hands a bit in order to grip the Sony controller with more of my palms I must reach up further in order to hit the buttons. 

You know how the left thumb stick on the XBOX controller is offset a bit higher than the right thumbstick?  It feels so much more natural and easier to control first person shooters this way then on the Sony controller with the thumbsticks on the same level.  I suck badly at Call of Duty Black Ops on the PS3 controller but when I play BF3 on XBOX I kick some ass.  This alone makes me prefer the XBOX controller over the PS3. 

In conclusion the XBOX controller is the best in terms of grip, thumbstick placement, and control.  I am very familiar with Sony's setup but I prefer the XBOX layout much better. 


P.S. forgot to mention:  When I play car racing games on the PS3 I prefer to use the d-pad to steer the car.  On the XBOX I prefer to use the left thumbstick to steer the car. 

Thanks, that's what I thought. Seems if I get a PS4 someday I will have to adapt ;)

Unsure bundling the Kinnect is a good idea.  Lot of people don't want that type of tech in the living room.

http://www.consoledeals.co.uk/blog/exclusive-xbox-one-second-hand-game-licenses-are-30-each-2201 (http://www.consoledeals.co.uk/blog/exclusive-xbox-one-second-hand-game-licenses-are-30-each-2201)

Up yours, M$!!!

And even better:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/05/24/xbox-one-will-kinect-2-use-visual-drm (http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/05/24/xbox-one-will-kinect-2-use-visual-drm)

...

Disturbing articles but they do confirm my conviction to stay away from XBOX One.  Sony must be laughing their pants off because MS in their greed has crossed a dangerous line IMO.  Personal privacy gone.  Can't buy used games for cheap or sell or give them to others.  The XBOX must be connected at least once every 24hrs.  This is slavery!!!

As long as the PS4 doesn't follow this model I believe Sony will be the big winner in the next gen console war. 

It's insane....it seems that they don't care anymore about their reputation and just think "Think what you want, do what you want - we are gonna conquer this market anyway and you WILL play to our rules". Makes sense after joining with EA that got the title 'worst company' two times in a row:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/04/09/ea-named-worst-company-in-america-again

The next voting will be not as clear i suppose since M$ is so eager to do everything to get it this time...

(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fpikigeek.com%2Ffiles%2F2012%2F03%2FUnlocked_thumb.png&hash=ff8672abe9a8c51eed2303183a8686cd5fa6606c)

I'm stunned with all the new info about possible plans of M$ popping up everywhere...like if they opened the Box of Pandora for our gaming hobby...

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/news/news-15015-Microsoft-Patents-Achievements-for-Watching-Television.html (http://www.xbox360achievements.org/news/news-15015-Microsoft-Patents-Achievements-for-Watching-Television.html)

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/news/news-14984-Xbox-One-s-Internal-Hard-Drive-Can-t-Be-Replaced.html

You can't replace the hard drive?  It keeps getting worse and worse doesn't it?



Achievements for watching tv?  Think about it, they want to control the masses and make them watch certain video content by rewarding them with an achievement.  What are we, animals to be experimented on?

Well, the too small non-replaceable HDD is the least of the problems the Xbox One has since you can use an external HDD. I suppose if the internal HDD dies the system is dead for good anyway.

QuoteThink about it, they want to control the masses and make them watch certain video content by rewarding them with an achievement

That's the plan apparently.

Since it's the weekend will post this now.  Caution NSFW language.

(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.minus.com%2FiBzvb2JSpQNRM.gif&hash=5a29a6385da27892be1a3e1f10f17da7f25f0d68)

I was faster, look at reply #4 :P

QuoteThe Xbox One is not only aimed at core gamers, though this group remains "incredibly important" for the next-generation platform, Microsoft has said.

Hear it from the M$ officials:

EDIT - Double post.....  :-[

Barth,

hm, isn't this the video from the post above yours? :P

Quote from: Grimnirsson on May 27, 2013, 10:08:47 AM
Barth,

hm, isn't this the video from the post above yours? :P

OOPS! Yep.... serves me right fer not watching yours first.
:-[

Double posting the video actually is needed to match the madness that is Xbox One...

Looks like MS says you no longer need Kinnect plugged in and on in order to use XBONE.  Does this change things for anyone?

http://www.trueachievements.com/n14262/xbox-one-kinect-use-clarified.htm

Not for me...all this silly turn around, and around and then around again is clearly showing that M$ has no vision, no real idea what they want to achieve. It's much worse than before because to me they are big liars now in addition to being greedy bastards. First they come up with these massive restrictions and that Kinect is central to the new console and all and now everything is taken back...I mean either it was necessary to have all this for their new console concept as they said or it was not. Now it seems they just tried to maximize profit and to restrict the freedom of the gamers, just to see how far they could go, because none of the points they brought on the table is now needed anymore...I will play on the 360 and next year will play on the PS4 no matter what M$ is doing, showing, changing etc.. because I don't trust them anymore, not one bit.

Quote from: Grimnirsson.. because I don't trust them anymore, not one bit.

Yes.  For a millisecond I considered the possibility of getting the XBONE but then I thought as you do.  No more MS for me.  I pray our 360's will live long enough to serve our hobbies until we get the PS4.

Hits the nail right on the head... XBOX 180 would be a more appropriate name!

Pretty simple for me (if I end up getting one) : Which has more of the games that I want to play?

I don't think that the question 'which console has the most games I want to play' is applicable in this day and age.  All the hit titles are pretty much on both of today's systems with the exception of a handful of games.  As for the niche market if you want JRPGs or other Japanese type games get the Playstation.  If you want Minecraft (yay  ::) ) get the XBOX. 


I didn't know until watching the video posted above that the PS4 is out pre-ordering the XBONE by 4:1.  Me, I think I'm getting the PS4 but not on launch day.  I'll wait until first quarter 2014 when the mad rush is over.  I've got a big backlog of XBOX 360 games waiting for me and I've got my eye on a few other titles for that console that I'll probably get. 

Hardcore players drive the business.  MS failed and it remains to be seen if they succeed with their new console. 

Maybe I'll finally get around to buying an XBOX360 after the XBONE's release knocks the former's price down a bit more. What version of the 360 was/is the most reliable?

AFA the PS4 goes, I'll probably wait until I find out if it will let me play Skyrim.

QuoteWhat version of the 360 was/is the most reliable?

If you buy a new Xbox 360 you'll have a reliable one...the new ones don't have any issues anymore, no RRoD etc.. Get one with a big HDD and/or a good bundle with a game you want to play anyway.

Quote from: W8taminute on August 15, 2013, 06:21:10 PM


Hardcore players drive the business.  MS failed and it remains to be seen if they succeed with their new console.

I really don't get how they failed. Yep, they're talking up other services beyond gaming...so is Sony. Hell, half of Sony's E3 show had absolutely nothing to do with games.

And while the initial MS plan was a mess, they actually amended it. Now the two platforms are so close together in terms of what's being offered that there really isn't a huge difference. Sure, I could hold a grudge about the initial plan, but what's the point of that? They listened, they changed, and that's a good thing.

I'll see which one is doing better 6-12 months after launch and choose accordingly.

I think where MS went wrong is with a few of the tech specs.  DDR3 vs. Sony's DDR4 memory for one.  Although yes they amended some of their initial policies they still left a bad taste.  Like Grimnirsson said, I can't trust them anymore. 

But I have to agree with you on waiting 6-12 months and seeing how things line up with the new consoles.  That's one of the big reason's I'm not rushing in like I did with the previous generation.  I bought one of the early PS3s when they first came out and was very closed minded with the 360.  About a year and a half ago I was convinced by a friend to open up my horizons and get a 360.  When I did that I never played my PS3 again.  The strong love I have for the 360 was strongly crushed with the seemingly evil policies MS took with the XBONE.  That is why I have been so emotional about hating MS.  It's like when the girl you've been loving so much suddenly plunges a dagger into your heart then 2 months later says she's sorry.  How can one ever recover from a blow like that?

Personally, the lack of backward compatibility kills the PS4 for me, and I would otherwise have chosen it over the XB1 anyway for legacy purposes: because I have a ton of PS3 and PS2 games I still like. (PS1 is not so much an issue, but they have or had backcompat for it. I made sure to buy a PS3 back when it was still possible to get a new PS2 compat.)

If I have to start over from absolute scratch, the question comes down to reliability and performance. In which case I already have a monster PC with access to high performance (eventually) less expensive games.

So not surprisingly, I've found myself migrating back to PC for games I would have previously supported on PS3 due to relative ease of use. I really only lack an XB controller (or two) to make the transition complete. If Sony abandons me, I feel no loyalty to them in return by exactly the same proportion.

Having said that, I'd feel even more ticced at Microsoft, since they've revealed how much they were previously trying to screw their own audience and yet have shown very little sign (other than recanting when forced to by market pressure) that they've learned their lesson and will resolve to act better in the future.

Fortunately I've never invested in XB. But I feel great sympathy for those who feel burned and betrayed; it has to be worse than how I feel about Sony. :(

I hear you brother on the PS1-PS2-PS3 transition.  I've got loads of PS2 games that I still love and an early PS3 to play them on.  Funny thing is though, I still hookup my PS2 when I want to play them.  I really want to extend the life of my PS3 as much as possible.  But I've liquidated quite a few of my PS3 library so if PS4 is not backward compatible it doesn't hurt me as much as it does you.  Btw have you looked into getting a refurb PS2 from GameStop?  I have been toying with that idea for a while but since I only play my old games once in a blue moon I think I should be ok.

Last night my XB360 shut itself down.  I was shocked to say the least.  When I checked on it's power brick plugged into the wall I noticed a red light was on.  I unplugged the cord and replugged it in and the red light turned green.  My 360 then powered back up.  I need to buy a backup 360 soon but bleepin MS won't drop the price yet.

I picked up a slightly used PS2 (which had been packed away) from an Amazon reseller earlier this year when my old PS3 finally died. I've been too distracted by other things to play with it; and to be honest I feel like I'll only be disappointed, because man that PS3 was good at upscaling old PS2 games. :(

So Sony has already burned me once on backcompat. ;)

I'd want to know what kind of warranties a refurb'd PS2 had from Gamestop.


If I had a 360 with a goofy power brick, I'd either try finding a new power brick (in case that's the problem -- transformers do wear out sometimes) or else play on my PC until 360 prices dropped.