Heroes of Normandie -- An Animadversion

[Cyrano]

I've been gunning around in this for a bit now, finished the first campaign (1/2 tutorial, but I like the fact that you get a unit "unlock" for completing it), started a couple skirmishes, and have started a PBEM with Barth.

I've a lot of thoughts about it (most of them good), not the least of which that this is the best implementation of a board wargame that I can recall.  But there's this one thing that really struck me that I referred to in another thread, viz.:

Much of the time sink in board wargaming is the logistics of play: set-up, rule reading, piece moving, rule referencing, arguments following rule referencing, modifier calculating, die rolling, grousing about die rolls, &c.  This game strips all that away into a rather lovely UI while keeping the game, as far as I've been able to determine, 100% consistent with its source material.

This, at least for me, has had a weird, clarifying effect which I've paralleled in my mind to removing the dross from metal.  A boardgame this carefully designed and tested is going to have an all together different texture when played face-to-face with all the detritus of "real" boardgaming than when played in the digital space.  Put more simply, preparing a turn to send to Vance is currently taking me well less than five minutes.  I honestly think that if Slitherine/Matrix hadn't insisted on their DRM PBEM++ nonsense and let people play head-to-head entire scenarios could be knocked out in less than 15 minutes.  I am going to be very curious to see whether the mechanics of the system hold up well without all that extra business that someone raised playing paper games such as myself is used to.

Again, this is a golden age for groggy games and even grog-lite games like this one...

Best,

Jim
"Cyrano"
:/7)

[Greybriar]

Not for PC. *sigh*

[Barthheart]

Not for PC. *sigh*

But it is for PC too... that's how Jim and I are playing the Beta release...

http://store.steampowered.com/app/365890/

[Cyrano]

Numquam desperare!

http://www.slitherine.com/games/hon_pc

[Greybriar]

Thanks for clearing that up.  O0

[Apocalypse 31]

.  I honestly think that if Slitherine/Matrix hadn't insisted on their DRM PBEM++ nonsense and let people play head-to-head entire scenarios could be knocked out in less than 15 minutes.

Agreed. I have Battle Academy games that have taken weeks to complete, which is fine but sometimes I wish Slitherine would have some kind of live system where players entered a game together.

[Tamas]

On the other hand, in Heroes of Normandie, if you leave your multiplayer game open, it will refresh automatically with your opponent's move once that is uploaded to the server, so there is no need to go back to the lobby for that. :)

We have found that is a nice compromise between utilising the features of the PBEM server and keeping things moving in what is indeed a fairly fast-paced game.

[Nefaro]

On the other hand, in Heroes of Normandie, if you leave your multiplayer game open, it will refresh automatically with your opponent's move once that is uploaded to the server, so there is no need to go back to the lobby for that. :)

We have found that is a nice compromise between utilising the features of the PBEM server and keeping things moving in what is indeed a fairly fast-paced game.

Looks like problem solved.  :)

[Cyrano]

1:  I very much appreciate the response and attention to the community evidenced here...notable.

2:  It doesn't really solve the problem, though, although it takes a step in that direction.  Turns in the game are VERY short and there is no reason not to build RT functionality that I can discern.  I want to play one game at a time not many and Vance and I could likely have knocked out two games in the time it's taken to play four turns because of the async play.  I'm one feller talking for hisself but this game had the potential to be a perfect short sit-and-play for a manageable 1/2 hour session -- and may yet prove to be that -- but I can't see the PBEM++ business as anything other than unnecessary kludge.

And that leaves aside the lack of LAN play which I realize is something that Slitherine seems to have no interest in...

[PipFromSlitherine]

1:  I very much appreciate the response and attention to the community evidenced here...notable.

2:  It doesn't really solve the problem, though, although it takes a step in that direction.  Turns in the game are VERY short and there is no reason not to build RT functionality that I can discern.  I want to play one game at a time not many and Vance and I could likely have knocked out two games in the time it's taken to play four turns because of the async play.  I'm one feller talking for hisself but this game had the potential to be a perfect short sit-and-play for a manageable 1/2 hour session -- and may yet prove to be that -- but I can't see the PBEM++ business as anything other than unnecessary kludge.

And that leaves aside the lack of LAN play which I realize is something that Slitherine seems to have no interest in...

What Tamas is describing works almost exactly like realtime play.  But it also allows you to securely stop and continue games seamlessly.  So you can play in both ways.  The PBEM++ approach has allowed 100x more MP games than we ever saw with games that required realtime play only.

LAN play is such a vanishingly small % of players that it's really not worth supporting with additional network development and testing (as well as the piracy issues).

Cheers

Pip