"Chewie...We're Home."

[Staggerwing]

They weren't before?  :))

[SirAndrewD]

They're really going for that Nuremburg rally circa 1939 look, aren't they?

Well, they ARE the "First Order".  Smacks of the Third Reich. 

I think that's the directions the Force Awakens is going.  The Empire has broken apart, and whatever that is rising to take its place has threads of Nazi Germany replacing Imperial Germany woven in. 

Even the First Order's Leader, "Supreme Leader" Snoke.  They're absolutely drawing parallels to the chaos following WW1 and the resulting situation that led to WW2.   

[Gusington]

The red banners in the new image lift it up and above the look from the older movies, I think, in terms of the fascist look.

And I dunno - I always thought of the British Empire before Nazi Germany when looking at the the 'old Empire.' Maybe it was the accents and huge navy :)

[SirAndrewD]

The red banners in the new image lift it up and above the look from the older movies, I think, in terms of the fascist look.

And I dunno - I always thought of the British Empire before Nazi Germany when looking at the the 'old Empire.' Maybe it was the accents and huge navy :)

I would agree about shades of the British Empire. 

But I think Abrams and Kasdan are going in a different direction.  The Empire, the one we saw in the Original Trilogy, was in some ways tragic.  It was a legitimate government that was usurped, without its knowledge by the Sith.  Likely there were many a loyal Imperial that never knew or understood the ideological concepts behind the "religion" of their ruler and his heir apparent. 

Now we get the "First Order".  What is the First Order?  Perhaps it refers to the Sith.  This is a leaner, cleaner Empire that is made up of the hardcores that survived the death of the Empire.  They follow a "Supreme Leader" who has as his second a clearly Sith inspired enforcer.  These are soldiers and men that are fully understanding of what they're following. Perhaps the First Order is the Sith, a more pure use of the force, without the silly, monastic controls of the corrupt Jedi.  It's a Third Reich, a faction that is willing to sell its soul to achieve the glory it once had. 

Of course that's just my theory.  I'm probably wrong and overthinking it. 

[bayonetbrant]

They weren't before?  :))

yeah, right?!

[BanzaiCat]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[besilarius]

That terrible Starship Troopers also promoted fascist displays and values.
Theater copies itself endlessly.

[BanzaiCat]

The Starship Troopers novel goes into a lot more detail (of course) about the society itself.

At first I hated the movie, but then learned to accept it for what it is - essentially a dumbed-down comic-book tongue-in-cheek version of the novel itself. Which for me is borderline blasphemy, as ST is one of my favorite novels.

[bayonetbrant]

At first I hated the movie, but then learned to accept it for what it is - essentially a dumbed-down comic-book tongue-in-cheek version of the novel itself. Which for me is borderline blasphemy, as ST is one of my favorite novels.

you do know that the movie was pretty much completely written, and partially filmed, when they realized that the ST rights were available, and they bought the rights and slapped them on an already-existing movie, right?  They just changed some of the character names and tweaked a few scenes to get Buenos Aries in there, and then called it an ST movie.  Several of the team on that movie (writers, producers, etc) even openly admitted to having never read the book, or heard of it before they got the rights to the title.

[BanzaiCat]

Yeah, I know all that. I didn't know all that when it was at the theaters, though, and neither did the friends I went to see it with. They were all, "WTH" as much as I was.

[mirth]

https://www.yahoo.com/movies/new-star-wars-the-force-awakens-revelations-126507891242.html

[SirAndrewD]

At first I hated the movie, but then learned to accept it for what it is - essentially a dumbed-down comic-book tongue-in-cheek version of the novel itself. Which for me is borderline blasphemy, as ST is one of my favorite novels.

you do know that the movie was pretty much completely written, and partially filmed, when they realized that the ST rights were available, and they bought the rights and slapped them on an already-existing movie, right?  They just changed some of the character names and tweaked a few scenes to get Buenos Aries in there, and then called it an ST movie.  Several of the team on that movie (writers, producers, etc) even openly admitted to having never read the book, or heard of it before they got the rights to the title.

It was also directed by Paul Verhoeven, who was familiar with the source material and hated it.  Verhoeven grew up in occupied Europe near a V1-V2 site, and endured constant bombings.  He despised the Nazis and considered the novel an endorsement of Fascisim.  It was Verhoeven that wove in the German like uniforms and over the top, satirical tone.  He also was responsible for the undertones that the humans were actually the aggressors. 

A quote from Verhoeven from a conversation he had while casting Michael Ironside ""If I tell the world that a right-wing, fascist way of doing things doesn't work, no one will listen to me. So I'm going to make a perfect fascist world: everyone is beautiful, everything is shiny, everything has big guns and fancy ships, but it's only good for killing f'ing bugs!"

Verhoeven set out to make exactly the movie that was produced.  A bombastic satire of space war movies that is as intentionally insulting to the source material as it can be.  He's been pretty candid and open about this.  He did the same thing with Robocop, satirizing 80's Reagan America and Capitalism. 

If you view it on those terms, it becomes a more interesting film.  I've actually got a buddy that's a film Professor at FSU that teaches an entire class on Verhoeven.

[mirth]

I like Verhoeven's satirical style and I liked his take on Starship Troopers. It's a very funny movie (so was Robocop). I didn't go into it expecting a faithful recreation of the novel.

[BanzaiCat]

I like Verhoeven's satirical style and I liked his take on Starship Troopers. It's a very funny movie (so was Robocop). I didn't go into it expecting a faithful recreation of the novel.

That was the mistake I (and my friends at the time) made going into that flick. Like I said, I learned to appreciate it for what it was later.

It would be nice to see a movie more faithful to the book, though. I mean, personal nuclear wrist-launchers...

[mirth]

I have to admit, I wasn't a huge fan of the book. Not that I disliked it, but I enjoyed some of Heinlein's other works more.