The Future of the F-35 Italy cuts back

[GDS_Starfury]

the F-94 is most definetly an updated F-80.  the F-87 follows the same idea.  the F-86 is a completely different beast.  so while you are technically correct due to service date they are all in the same time frame give or take a few months.  next I expect youll use the naval variant as an example.  my point still stands.  bubble canopies were the exception not the rule.  theres still no century series fighter that had one.  nor did any NATO or Warsaw Pact fighter.

You made a big show of asking for one example between the F-86 and F-14 and I've already given you three. The F-94 was a further development of the F-80. The F-89 and the F-9 were not based on the F-80. The F-89 may have a similar looking airframe, but it was a common design of the era.

did I say F-86... I ment post war supersonic fighters since the F-86   ;)  and no the F-100 nor the F-11 are bubble topped fighters.

and yes good examples you have and my foot tastes good.

[mirth]

You have a point about bubble canopies not being as common as I made them out to be. However I'd argue that the F-101 had a bubble canopy at least as much as the F-14 can be thought of as one. And I do recognize that there is a major difference between the canopies of the F-86 and F-16 and other so-called bubble canopies.

[GDS_Starfury]

thats kinda the reason I didnt include the 14 in my original list.  and to be fair I think we can both agree that no fighter before the F-5/16/18 group had that 'on top of the plane visibility.  all of the examples we brought up have the pilot well inside the frame of the aircraft.  having said that they did figure out a way to get the F-22 RCS down while keeping the pilot up and out.  the problem here is that one F-35 variant with the lift engine right behind the cockpit. 

[mirth]

thats kinda the reason I didnt include the 14 in my original list.  and to be fair I think we can both agree that no fighter before the F-5/16/18 group had that 'on top of the plane visibility.  all of the examples we brought up have the pilot well inside the frame of the aircraft.  having said that they did figure out a way to get the F-22 RCS down while keeping the pilot up and out.  the problem here is that one F-35 variant with the lift engine right behind the cockpit. 

I do agree with all of those points. And I did pick up on the engine issue with the F-35 Marine variant. That's the problem with trying to make it be all things to all the branches.

[MIGMaster]

I suspect the USMC Harriers will be in service a long time yet !

[GDS_Starfury]

as will A-10s.  thank God!

[mirth]

I suspect the USMC Harriers will be in service a long time yet !

Unfortunately there aren't all that many left.

[GDS_Starfury]

7 active USMC squadrons plus 1 training squadron.

[mirth]

Yep that's about 80 Harriers. There was that attack last year in Afghanistan on a base that took out 6 Harriers and that was a very big deal. It was 6-7% of the total USMC force.

We did have the foresight to buy up a bunch of them that the RAF retired, but I think that was just for spares. I don't think we're flying any of them.

[GDS_Starfury]

Inventory: 7 squadrons with 20 aircraft each and 1 training squadron with 20 AV-8B and 15 TAV-8B aircraft for a total 175 aircraft.

[mirth]

Inventory: 7 squadrons with 20 aircraft each and 1 training squadron with 20 AV-8B and 15 TAV-8B aircraft for a total 175 aircraft.

I thought Harrier squadrons were about 10 aircraft each? You probably know better than I do though.

[mirth]

The good news is that with the spares purchased from the RAF the current Harrier force could be kept flying until 2030.

http://defensetech.org/2012/04/16/usmcs-harriers-could-fly-until-2030/

[GDS_Starfury]

Inventory: 7 squadrons with 20 aircraft each and 1 training squadron with 20 AV-8B and 15 TAV-8B aircraft for a total 175 aircraft.

I thought Harrier squadrons were about 10 aircraft each? You probably know better than I do though.

I had to goggle to make sure.  I would have thought 12 to 16 airframes.  after the bubbletop fiasco Im not letting you get smug on me.   ;)

[mirth]

Inventory: 7 squadrons with 20 aircraft each and 1 training squadron with 20 AV-8B and 15 TAV-8B aircraft for a total 175 aircraft.

I thought Harrier squadrons were about 10 aircraft each? You probably know better than I do though.

I had to goggle to make sure.  I would have thought 12 to 16 airframes.  after the bubbletop fiasco Im not letting you get smug on me.   ;)

lol! Don't worry, you know this stuff better than I do. I'm just somewhat more knowledgeable  than the average guy on the street. 20 years ago I was big into military aviation stuff and kept up on it a lot more. I just recently forced myself to jettison of all my old copies of Air & Space Magazine, Air Forces Monthly and others.

As an aside, I have a friend who works at Bath Iron Works and I get to talk naval stuff with him each Friday night. He's actively involved in the production of the DDG-1000 and he knows his stuff. He's the only friend I have who knows what ASW, CIWS, etc means. All my other friends just nod politely and think I'm nuts (totally true of course).

[GDS_Starfury]

oh, I could pick his brain about things!