Alternatives to the Supercarrier

[mirth]

I found this article interesting although most of the proposed alternatives have been suggested in the past and never panned out. Rumors of the demise of the supercarrier are greatly exaggerated.

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2013/03/replacing-aircraft-carriers/all/

[TheCommandTent]

Very interesting article.

[LongBlade]

Thanks, Mirth. Good stuff.

[GDS_Starfury]

I think the author is missing some rather important points.
first the DF-21 hasnt been proven to work yet but our ABMs on escorts have and were going to have energy weapons before to long.
second is the fact that the US way of war IS overwhelming firepower.  hes seems to have forgotten this after a decade of insurgency warfare in 3rd world countries.
one of the best ways to deliver that precision firepower are aircraft.  at this point Ive read far to many accounts of Naval aviation saving some grunts ass.
our carriers are not that vulnerable.  they were designed to head into the North Sea and play with the Soviet Navy.  China is far away from providing that kind of
threat enviornment.  DF-21s.....  try scores of Backfires each carrying 2 or 3 supersonic ASM.  carriers are a great power projector, force multiplier, big stick and
humanitarian aid platform.

[mirth]

I recommend reading the full study, if you haven't already. Not that I agree with all the points, but the author gives much more detailed support of his positions than what is stated in the Wired article.

http://www.cnas.org/files/documents/publications/CNAS%20Carrier_Hendrix_FINAL.pdf

And it has a cool cover  ;)

[Longdan]

I am not arguing any points at this time but the brash overconfidence in a finite asset just gives me the creeps.
It is not like the people who would like to neutralise them are playing Angry Birds all the whole day long.
How many times does the same lesson has to be learnt?  Systems evolve over time and eventually one gives
way to another, usually in some Agincourt WTF? type of disaster.  Battleship admirals are no more.  They did not
think they were out evolved but they were.  Warfare is becoming more and more an "if you can find it you can kill it"
situation.

[mirth]

Warfare is becoming more and more an "if you can find it you can kill it" situation.

If it came to a shooting war, it could well be a difficult proposition for the Chinese to find a CVBG. It's not like we'd just leave their satellite's alone to provide targeting for the DF-21s (presuming they work as advertised to begin with). As Star noted, the US Navy has decades of planning on how to defend CVBGs from mass missile attacks.

[GDS_Starfury]

no Dan, no one is standing still and lettting grass grow around there feet.  and yes a carrier CVBG is a very expensive thing.  thats why its protected so well.

[Longdan]

I'm not saying it is hopeless or silly or obsolescent but the guy with the incredibly fancy club was surprised when he got shot by an arrow.
It is not like we haven't been caught with our pants down a time or two.  "It won't happen this time" is thinking like a drunk.
Nobody thought airliners could make good cruise missiles.  I was working that day and it was not pretty.  It was chaos.

[Longdan]

I would feel more comfortable to hear people who claim to be in the know say something like "We are very concerned about these threats and realise
that we have to be flexible in our response and are therefore not putting all the eggs in one basket."
Instead of fanbois yelling,  "Yahoo! Here we come!! Eat Neutrons MotherHumpers!!"  shortly followed by "What was that?"
When was the last time things worked out right?  The unexpected is, after all, unexpected.  That is all.

[GDS_Starfury]

I dont discount possible threats due to ego.  its made me a rather effective wargamer.  nor do I discount the growing threat of the PLA Navy.  there are however certain facts that most people that write such articles just dont seem to know about or care to research.  we've been operating a serious blue water nave since WW1.  we have 2 wars and a 50 year Cold War of anti submarine/ anti-asm operations under our belt.  not theory but actual combat ops.  the western Pacific is just as carpeted with SOSUS nets as the Atlantic.  our submarine operations are focused on the Pacific and Indian oceans.  while all of our subs are nuclear all of our allies have very capable SSKs.  I expect that in a full up war with China we would, at some point, lose a carrier.  the Chinese would lose their whole navy.  thats not hubris.

[mirth]

People's Liberation Army Navy. That still cracks me up.

[GDS_Starfury]

so does the idea of a PLAN blue water navy.

for now.

[Longdan]

Pretty funny.  I do not discount your arguments Star and I said as much.  I have had first hand experience with what happened
the the North Am Air defense and Air traffic system, the very best in the world, when some guys with boxcutters pulled a fast one.

[GDS_Starfury]

I would however very much like to see a resurgance of the frigate.  our Perry class were very effective for what they were.  and while the Burke class simply badass I sometimes think its to many eggs in one basket.