Matrix Games, Whatever Are You Thinking?

[Huw the Poo]

Indeed - why would you buy the rights to something and then allow other people to sell it at a lower price. ?

Because you'll still get a cut of sales whilst reaching a wider audience.  Overall, it's probably a net gain.

[JudgeDredd]

That was not meant to be personal, sorry if you thought it was.

But if you look at the posts on this subject you do seem to be the main protagonist for the defence against a majority of similar minded responses.

Well - to play devils advocate - just because he's posting as a minority on this thread (against the grain of the thread) doesn't make his posts any less valid. He still has the right to air his views...whether they're for or against

[JudgeDredd]

I'll try and be concise. I guess I haven't been in my previous posts and just waffling on...so I'll try and answer your points specifically.

I suppose this is the bit of this argument I just dont get. Seems most of the people taking issue with Matrix are the very ones who jump all over them if they dont act like a proper business with regard to support / quality etc but seem the first to take issue when they actually act like a proper business . You see "No longer permitting other merchants to carry product and price it as they deem fit" is just sound business practice. Indeed - why would you buy the rights to something and then allow other people to sell it at a lower price. ?

I think it's disingenuous of any company to do this and then try and make themselves out to be "for the boys". Specifically "trust us" and "we're the good guys" whilst simultaneously taking away peoples options to buy the game elsewhere. I hate monopolies. Sure - as a company they're MAGIC. But as a consumer - they're just wrong. It removes choice.

So - again - and I have said this on the thread - my beef is what they are doing and what they are saying - they are contradictory. I have also said PoN is worth the money they are asking and I've also said I don't have a problem with their pricing strategy per se - especially for new games. My particular issues with that company at this time are what they have done (closing consumer options) and spinning it as "we're the good guys" and "trust us" - and those are quotes

The other half of the argument simply seems to be a lot of people on the matrix boards who dont run a computer strategy game company telling matrix they know best how to run a computer strategy game company. Thats without any numbers, sales data and yet the entire thrust of their argument is simply based on what they believe would happen rather than matrix who know what has happened.

This is likely a result of people NOT being privy to such information. I'm not saying Matrix should provide it...but why can't they. Why can't they show sales of a product (no numbers - just a graph) on release and over the years. What would happen if they did drop the price. Look at their sales at Christmas...they are up I would guess, right? Meaning, surely, that reducing the price of their old catalogue DOES shift units out the door...the only difference is people wouldn't wait for Christmas...I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

there also seems to be a third camp who argue that pricing brings in new wargamers - again without evidence - but the point is maybe matrix as a business arent that interested in that. If they are running a business model that works why experiment with it based on the heresay of others and for reasons that lie outside of them making more money. Maybe Mcneil isnt that interested in what happens to wargaming as a whole - just what happens to his company - why is it a problem if thats the case ?

I am the evidence. I did post this earlier. I'm not saying that's it - cut and shut, change your business model because apparently Billy Riley says reducing the price of a game brought him into the genre...but I AM PROOF that that worked. To what scale, I have no idea...but to disregard it as nonsense is nonsense in itself.

I suppose what I dont see is what peoples issue is. So if matrix dont want to reduce the price of their older games and the reason for that is primarily because of the data they have they dont see that as beneficial to them - and if people accept they are a business then what exactly is it that people are complaining about - beyond the fact they simply want something for less money. I'd like a ferrari - but I guess they arent going to reduce the price.

If Matrix (and their like) keep this niche with their pricing strategy - then games will always cost more for us than they need to. More than that - the likelihood is that the customer base could well drop. So I guess (and it's certainly my view) my worry is that if they have got this wrong - or if they are just being self indulging with the pricing (i.e. for their business and NOT for the genre) then we are likely to pay higher and higher prices over time as the customer base drops. That's my concern. That's what I'm worried about.

Let me finish by saying - again - that I really like Matrix Games and I do not disagree with their pricing strategy. But I do think they are working "for the company" and not "for the people" or "for the genre". So no...when Iain McNeil turns round and tells us all he's closing all outlets selling a game so they can sell it at their new inflated price, then ask us to trust them because they're the good guys - then I have a little bit of sick in my mouth.

[Tuna]

I don't think the high prices are the issue..

It's when they buy a game that is already out (not owned by them) and then they raise the price when they grab the game and shut down all other low pricing. That is totally their right, but feels like a low blow to the consumer.

or

It's when they charge a high price (premium - what you would pay for a 'new' game elsewhere) and no longer support it...

WITP AE, they put out a resolution fix... WITP, why did they not do the same if they are going to charge over 50 bucks! (I own both these games)

SPWAW does not work out of the box in W7... If you're going to charge an above premium price for an 'expansion set' (because SPWAW is free), at least update your installer so that it will install the W7 fix a long with it..

Now they have many games that still get support either from a great developers (like Vic, and now AGEOD) or from the community itself.
That kins of support from those developers one of Matrix's strengths... They have many strengths, and they have a lot of fans.. Last thing you want to do is turn fans against you. I always buy from Matrix and not Slitherine, and that's not a lump against Slitherine, just a loyal gesture towards Matrix.

Now Slitherine on the other hand, usually has more reasonable starting prices on their games, so that is a plus for them. So maybe the old prices staying high is just a leftover from Matrix solo times.

[FlickJax]

That was not meant to be personal, sorry if you thought it was.

But if you look at the posts on this subject you do seem to be the main protagonist for the defence against a majority of similar minded responses.

Well - to play devils advocate - just because he's posting as a minority on this thread (against the grain of the thread) doesn't make his posts any less valid. He still has the right to air his views...whether they're for or against

I do agree; had an op on my forehead in the weak and face all swollen and on lots of pain killers so probably bringing out my ruder self.

[Tuna]

Maybe they look at their xmas sale and say.. jeez we really don't get that many purchase of our 'older' products during these sales, so lowering the prices doesn't work...

Well maybe that's because they're still over priced during the Xmas sale!  :P

[undercovergeek]

I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

i have just contacted matrix for my old serial numbers/download links for WitP & WitP AE - when and if i get them JD you can have it for free

[Ashcloud]

I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

i have just contacted matrix for my old serial numbers/download links for WitP & WitP AE - when and if i get them JD you can have it for free

If anyone else wants to give away WitP & WitP AE - I would be most grateful. Yes, please for me.

[JudgeDredd]

I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

i have just contacted matrix for my old serial numbers/download links for WitP & WitP AE - when and if i get them JD you can have it for free

That's very generous UCG - though I think I should point out I'm likely to not invest any time in it because I got it for nothing...Matrix says so.

But...seriously, I don't have much time to invest in that beast at the moment...so perhaps you know a more deserving soul?

[Tuna]

The scenarios are very 'involved' but do not take the time commitment of a grand campaign.. and it is very good!.. I'm like you with the gaming ADD, and not sure I would get into a grand campaign ever, but again, even the scenarios can be a blast, once you learn what's going on.. If you don't want to get into as much detail, vanilla is probably better, if you want the detail than AE (plus the higher screen resolution).

I bought WITP I think on a Xmas sale.. then boughtt AE from Ebay (Lost money to Matrix due to high price- have yet to play that, besides firing it up to admire the resolution)!

[undercovergeek]

I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

i have just contacted matrix for my old serial numbers/download links for WitP & WitP AE - when and if i get them JD you can have it for free

That's very generous UCG - though I think I should point out I'm likely to not invest any time in it because I got it for nothing...Matrix says so.

But...seriously, I don't have much time to invest in that beast at the moment...so perhaps you know a more deserving soul?

wow that was quick, top marks for the customer service at least - i have zip files for both games i can drop into a drop box - im not letting you degenerates near my member account and all the secrets therein

JD - offer is still open, if you dont think itll get the time it deserves say so and then ill let them go to the next 2 to ask

[Nefaro]

I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

i have just contacted matrix for my old serial numbers/download links for WitP & WitP AE - when and if i get them JD you can have it for free

That's very generous UCG - though I think I should point out I'm likely to not invest any time in it because I got it for nothing...Matrix says so.

LOL!!

Nice one.

[FlickJax]

I'd like to give WiTP another go, did have uncommon valour could never afford its big brother.

[Ashcloud]

I'd buy WitP tomorrow if I could get it for £20.

i have just contacted matrix for my old serial numbers/download links for WitP & WitP AE - when and if i get them JD you can have it for free

That's very generous UCG - though I think I should point out I'm likely to not invest any time in it because I got it for nothing...Matrix says so.

But...seriously, I don't have much time to invest in that beast at the moment...so perhaps you know a more deserving soul?

I am a more deserving soul, send it to me please :)

[Staggerwing]

And so humble to boot!  :D